Klei should add more in game method to recover from griefers attack.

[X-lem]

22 hours ago, Tranoze said:

Add repair option for burnt structure

Server admins already have this ability.

 

22 hours ago, Tranoze said:

Have you ever ask why none of the griefers target your pinecones chest with 360 pine cones?

Lol, I have never seen this.

[Tranoze]

6 hours ago, Xenna said:

Step 1 : Dig ALL grass tufts and block portal with moonrock wall to kill new player

At the mark 2k days all world only have left 80 grass turf and 80 sapling whole world. To sustain a base the only choice we have left is dig all of them up. Which is one of the reason why i ask grass and sapling turf to be renewable, maybe the method i asked for is not good enough, but for long run public server, any base would use up a part of the world unrenewable grass/sapling turf.
What happened if you join and have join a world with no grass and only twigs? You still cant survive, and we cant just put a chest there with resource because they will be gone when the first player come in. And a lot of crazy story happened after that.
And after that i know block portal is bad, and from that on we have a code on each other to never touch portal biome ever again.

 

6 hours ago, Xenna said:

Step 2 : Block touchstone with fossil so they can't get out and died from starvation

There are around 30 ghost jerk who join and burnt all our grass/sapling turf, hammering base, then leave. Ever wonder why we have to dig all the sapling back on day 2000? We can only revive people who we trust.

 

[MondayNight]

2 hours ago, Tranoze said:

There are around 30 ghost jerk who join and burnt all our grass/sapling turf, hammering base, then leave. Ever wonder why we have to dig all the sapling back on day 2000? We can only revive people who we trust.

No one asked you to "take hostage" a KLei official server - those are for everyone, including "30 ghost jerks"; you and your group took upon yourselves the "noble" task of being flamboyant A-holes in doing so. In almost 10k h of DST, majority of them being KLei pubs, never have I encountered griefers burning en-mass Grass Turfs and Saplings outside of warming up in winter (or accidental Summer fires), for singular plants or small groups of them - since Saplings/Grass Tufts are not rare resources, au contraire. In fact is a sisyphean choir to actually go and burn that many Saplings/Grass Tufts for only "have left 80 grass turf and 80 sapling" in entire world (crass exaggeration), most griefers just want to torch some base and that's that.

For blocked Touchstones with anything - more so as one spawns again from ghost to player vi TS - same mechanic as Spawn Griefer Protection should apply: for around 10-30s player should gain immunity to everything, and be able to pass through all those blocking objects in a radius of ~2-3 tiles around respective Touchstone.

And KLei should root-out those dumb exploits, starting with stacking objects on Z-axis. Gates to Abyss, Glommer Wall-Darts bonanza, etc etc - stuff that can be done on public, official servers, breaking immersion, offering blatant advantages and more.

[Tranoze]

39 minutes ago, x0-VERSUS-1y said:

No one asked you to "take hostage" a KLei official server 

There are like 20 Klei server, if you want to play, you can join the other, no need to complain about people play their favorite server.
If you feel like server hostage is a problem, then ASK klei for more public server, dont complain about people are actually enjoying their world.

[Nullum]

28 minutes ago, Tranoze said:

There are like 20 Klei server, if you want to play, you can join the other, no need to complain about people play their favorite server.
If you feel like server hostage is a problem, then ASK klei for more public server, dont complain about people are actually enjoying their world.

This is just a stupid baseless argument filled with contempt and selfish reasons. Asking for the developers for more servers to play on while not considering the fact that they need to pay up for it. And at the same time to cease complaints of other parties of their concern while to protect you joyful lot of your enjoyment on making of a personal use of a public server that is meant for everyone and anyone is just downright sad and infuriating.

Klei Entertainment made these servers be in Survival Mode and they aren't meant to last, they made their intention, its just up to you "joyful' lot if you want to oppose this

[MondayNight]

1 hour ago, Tranoze said:

There are like 20 Klei server, if you want to play, you can join the other, no need to complain about people play their favorite server.
If you feel like server hostage is a problem, then ASK klei for more public server, dont complain about people are actually enjoying their world.

"..people play their favorite server..people are actually enjoying their world" - how can I put it simply so your lil head can wrap around it like a cozy blanket of realization: is not your server or your world. Is KLei's, meant for anyone to enjoy - that's why is Survival, and public. Not Endless and private - maybe you and your lot should buy your own server and do there whatever shenanigans your lil wicked hearts desire, and rightly so call it your own. In the meantime you and your lot are just griefers for whose counter-measure Spawn Griefer Protection was made by KLei. Now remains for Touchstones and Caves entrances to benefit from same protection and people like you won't be able to "take captive" any public official server to call "their own" when clearly you and your chaps, like the rest of us, are only but guests there.

[Tranoze]

11 minutes ago, x0-VERSUS-1y said:

"..people play their favorite server..people are actually enjoying their world" - how can I put it simply so your lil head can wrap around it like a cozy blanket of realization: is not your server or your world. Is KLei's, meant for anyone to enjoy - that's why is Survival, and public. Not Endless and private - maybe you and your lot should buy your own server and do there whatever shenanigans your lil wicked hearts desire, and rightly so call it your own. In the meantime you and your lot are just griefers for whose counter-measure Spawn Griefer Protection was made by KLei. Now remains for Touchstones and Caves entrances to benefit from same protection and people like you won't be able to "take captive" any public official server to call "their own" when clearly you and your chaps, like the rest of us, are only but guests there.

Bruh this is thread about allowing a base to recover from griefer attack, we both go too far for a world that died 2 years ago. What is your point? Are you sad that you not part of anyworld? Or are you trying to change the subject of this thread?

[MondayNight]

5 minutes ago, Tranoze said:

Bruh this is thread about allowing a base to recover from griefer attack, we both go too far for a world that died 2 years ago. What is your point? Are you sad that you not part of anyworld? Or are you trying to change the subject of this thread?

Point is your proposal is redundant. There are other ways KLei could counter griefers without making resources on default over-abundant and/or convoluted in obtaining. More so as such proposal comes from an actual griefer using scripts in his endeavor of capturing public official servers - aka a very particular micro niche of playing the game.

[Tranoze]

3 minutes ago, x0-VERSUS-1y said:

Point is your proposal is redundant. There are other ways KLei could counter griefers without making resources on default over-abundant and/or convoluted in obtaining. More so as such proposal comes from an actual griefer using scripts in his endeavor of capturing public official servers - aka a very particular micro niche of playing the game.

There are nothing change in particular in resource obtaining. There a limit of how fast one player can pick grass and referterlize them, and the amount of grass turf in world gen default is far more than that. Adding more grass turf or sapling wont directly inrease grass farming output, because they will dig them from the world if they can improve their grass farm anyway.
There are also nothing change in reparing burnt object in term of resources, the burnt base still suffer, but less suffer compared to before, and griefers action have less impact on the game. Griefer can still grief, but atleast, if someone have spent time building their base, they still can fix was left after their base got griefed.

Unless you think burning a base and resources other people built does not count as griefer, but a part of the game, and support that.

[JoeW]

Hi - please keep posts constructive, polite and on-topic. Thank you. 

[MilesUpshore]

Idk why some of you are so against having some resources like reeds be renewable...when said resources are some of the targets that certain griefers will go for. Having these resources be renewable will help prolong servers without forcing players to rollback to reverse damages (when damages are discovered much later) or even regenerate it, especially when most players don't want to regenerate server yet. I do understand wanting some challenges to remain in-game, like not every single resource has to be renewable so that players will take more care and think about the amount that they need. But in public unmoderated servers, some smarter griefers will find ways to end a favourable server session quickly, forcing players to either rollback or even regenerate server. Hence, the idea of suggesting this.

But seeing how the original post about suggesting certain options to counter griefing has led to some veeeeeeeery off-topic stuff, smh...

[MondayNight]

38 minutes ago, MilesUpshore said:

But seeing how the original post about suggesting certain options to counter griefing has led to some veeeeeeeery off-topic stuff, smh...

At least my objection was against Grass Tufts, Saplings and Berry Bushes regeneration in a Survival world. It's survival in the end, not Endless/Wilderness for a reason. OP wants comfy resource regen almost for everything game has in it in, I repeat: a survival setup. It's getting ridiculous by now. We already have for standard 8-players pubs more than enough stuff to get by. Now we even have starting items and resources in inventory when spawning outside of the 10 days startup window in default. Survival vanilla official KLei servers aren't meant to be taken "captive" by the likes of OP and you for 10k days via AFK-botting scripts and blatant game exploits like Z-stack glitch so OP's proposal via a very niche and questionable play-style would hold any water as arguments go. In case of Endless servers, yes regarding Reeds, Lune Trees, Sea Sprouts, Anenemies (not enough traps available, eh?!) etc. Maybe. But is Survival for Pete's sake, is meant to be challenging. Not homey mega-base "terraforming" official pubs shenanigans.

Is quite the funny thing now, when Griefer Spawn Protection prevents you lot from killing/trapping people at gate with ease, you try to find ways of mitigating resource-hoarding - since this is it by current point: not lack of resources, but overkill resource hoarding needed for mega-base building - another niche, particular style of play. On official KLei pubs of all places!

[HowlVoid]

1 hour ago, x0-VERSUS-1y said:

At least my objection was against Grass Tufts, Saplings and Berry Bushes regeneration in a Survival world. It's survival in the end, not Endless/Wilderness for a reason. OP wants comfy resource regen almost for everything game has in it in, I repeat: a survival setup. It's getting ridiculous by now. We already have for standard 8-players pubs more than enough stuff to get by. Now we even have starting items and resources in inventory when spawning outside of the 10 days startup window in default. Survival vanilla official KLei servers aren't meant to be taken "captive" by the likes of OP and you for 10k days via AFK-botting scripts and blatant game exploits like Z-stack glitch so OP's proposal via a very niche and questionable play-style would hold any water as arguments go. In case of Endless servers, yes regarding Reeds, Lune Trees, Sea Sprouts, Anenemies (not enough traps available, eh?!) etc. Maybe. But is Survival for Pete's sake, is meant to be challenging. Not homey mega-base "terraforming" official pubs shenanigans.

So Im not trying to belittle you, but sometimes it can be a slog to read what you write because you tend to repeat the same thing multiple times. How does renewability detract from the games difficulty? As I've said before, one should be able to pay to bring back a any resource as long as the price is right. Especially when a world is thousands of days old and all the catcoon dens in your world are gone. Its fine to punish a player for not taking care of valuable resources in the early game, but in the late game this just becomes a nuisance. We have the terra firma which allows the renewability of biome turf so why not go the extra mile and make other resources craftable too?  It can be after killing fuelweaver; it can be as extreme as one berry bush per fuel weaver kill for all I care. 

C'mon Charlie throw us a bone.

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Is quite the funny thing now, when Griefer Spawn Protection prevents you lot from killing/trapping people at gate with ease, you try to find ways of mitigating resource-hoarding - since this is it by current point: not lack of resources, but overkill resource hoarding needed for mega-base building - another niche, particular style of play. On official KLei pubs of all places!

This is a good point mega basing in a public server just isn't going to work out. That's more of a personal goal to do on a private server. If you're trying to lay claim to the whole world, well, you cant blame people for lashing out/not cooperating. Still, there should be a good amount good faith and trust on all sides.

[RoughCactus69]

On 3/28/2021 at 8:02 PM, Tranoze said:

Same as roll back. Roll back is the real CTRL + Z.

Don't you mean ALT+F4?

 

Sincerely,

Cactus

On 3/29/2021 at 9:09 AM, Viktor234 said:

• During a votekick for the duration of the Votekick (Most players enjoy it to burn a few structures before votekick passes)

I like this. This is a great idea.

Sincerely,

Cactus

On 3/29/2021 at 9:25 AM, SuperMeatGoy said:

Well the niche problem of getting attached to dedicated servers is a you problem. Mods are how these kind of problems are solved, not by making annoying mechanics to bother the majority of players that just play on a private server with friends.

That is a skewered way of thinking. You are saying it his fault for enjoying a big part of the game? Ok? Not everyone wants to use mods, plus you can add mechanics without them being "annoying". You just have to do it right.

 

Sincerely,

Cactus

On 3/29/2021 at 10:01 AM, SuperMeatGoy said:

Thats the risk you take in pubs lol. It has been known since Don't Starve Together came out that not everyone is friendly on their pubs, it's even shown in the trailer.

With one hammer you can get rid of seventy five burnt structures. Getting a hammer wouldn't "increase the griefers cost 10x". All you would need is one hammer and a torch, still incredibly cheap and all their resources would be at the base being destroyed. Even if all they did was burn the base, the damage is still halved and I'm sure 95% of players would still ragequit if their base got burnt. If you have time to burn everything and not get banned you have time to hammer the structures as-well. Your seeds mechanic is not only redundant because of world regrowth but also annoying because people will end up growing saplings or berry bushes in their farm plots when they are trying to get farm crops. The sea chest mechanic would end up diluting the sea chest loot table with items that the loot-receiver would have no purpose for.

Forums like this need pushback or else brain-dead ideas like this get accepted.

He has bad suggestions, I agree. But overall it is a good idea. 

"Forums like this need pushback or else brain-dead ideas like this get accepted." 

That is just wrong.

 

Sincerely,

Cactus

14 hours ago, Tranoze said:

There are like 20 Klei server, if you want to play, you can join the other, no need to complain about people play their favorite server.
If you feel like server hostage is a problem, then ASK klei for more public server, dont complain about people are actually enjoying their world.

I agreed with you at first, but now you are sounding arrogant. You don't "own" the server. It's a PUBLIC server for a reason.

 

Sincerely,

Cactus

[Does]

2 hours ago, MilesUpshore said:

Idk why some of you are so against having some resources like reeds be renewable...when said resources are some of the targets that certain griefers will go for. Having these resources be renewable will help prolong servers without forcing players to rollback to reverse damages (when damages are discovered much later) or even regenerate it, especially when most players don't want to regenerate server yet. I do understand wanting some challenges to remain in-game, like not every single resource has to be renewable so that players will take more care and think about the amount that they need. But in public unmoderated servers, some smarter griefers will find ways to end a favourable server session quickly, forcing players to either rollback or even regenerate server. Hence, the idea of suggesting this.

But seeing how the original post about suggesting certain options to counter griefing has led to some veeeeeeeery off-topic stuff, smh...

I disagree that it will prolong a server because the amount of time necessary to undo the damages is, again, prohibitive. Pubs do not typically last long enough for regrowth mechanics to matter, outside of carrots for late joiners and (in the case of a very, very dedicated griefer) light bulbs. For example, let's say someone torches your stone fruit:

Assume a griefer destroys 29 of your 30 stone fruit bushes. They're renewable through the last one, so everything's "good". The issue is, though, that getting a sprout from your fruit is a 1% chance. Assuming you pick every 3 days on average, that's 1 fruit / day.

It takes 67 days (1-(.99^67)) for the odds to be BARELY more likely than not (~51% chance) that you get a sprout at that point, which is virtually a full year of constant farming to get a SINGLE extra bush. Assuming it's 67 days / additional fruit and it's just the same for every tree to shortcut some calcs, it takes 5 cycles to get 32 bushes and thus takes ~335 days as a rough estimate with these favorable conditions. The number of public servers that go on that long are virtually nil, and you're ignoring the fact that the griefer already WON by inconveniencing you with less food and exponential bush growth throughout this entire time. Your favorable server session is ruined by default.

Reeds are a special situation because they're nonrenewable and can't be transported, while being important for a lot of early base-building and character-specific stuff. Technically they can't go extinct from griefers because of them being on lunar island, but realistically that's too inconvenient to access to consistently farm (even for a Woodie). Which leads to the main issue:

Griefing isn't about making something impossible. It's about being annoying. The amount of damage done and annoyance caused isn't going to be lessened unless undoing all the damage is so easy that it's not annoying anymore. If someone torches all the main island reeds and you're stuck waiting 30 days for them to regrow, they already succeeded and these changes aren't solving the issue and preventing a rollback or regeneration. No Wurt or Wicker is going to stick around and play.

x0's being a bit blunt but he's not wrong. These changes don't really help Survival; they're only really good for Endless. If a public Survival world only really lasts long when someone's using bot scripts to ensure it survives, these changes are moot for grief protection for a majority of players.

26 minutes ago, HowlVoid said:

How does renewability detract from the games difficulty? As I've said before, one should be able to pay to bring back a any resource as long as the price is right. Especially when a world is thousands of days old and all the catcoon dens in your world are gone. Its fine to punish a player for not taking care of valuable resources in the early game, but in the late game this just becomes a nuisance. We have the terra firma which allows the renewability of biome turf so why not go the extra mile and make other resources craftable too?  It can be after killing fuelweaver; it can be as extreme as one berry bush per fuel weaver kill for all I care. 

C'mon Charlie throw us a bone.

Renewability makes the game easier by virtue of being less punishing, to say little of the additional resources it gives the player at a given time. Biggest example is carrots, love them to bits since it makes joining late a lot easier but it's a big change versus base Don't Starve where you have to think about when you want to pick them to avoid using up a nonrenewable food source instead. You don't second-guess as much over being wasteful and treat what you have available differently. Shortcuts have little weight if you can undo the damage done down the line. For example, burning the berry bush or tuft or sapling in the wild for winter warmth versus losing the health and heading on to find something less expensive to burn isn't as big of a trade-off when you think that it's not a permanent resource loss anymore. Craftable catcoon stumps, for example, would turn them from little critters into little critters that are mainly just another source of food to be farmed.

I'm not opposed to changes like these for Endless since they undeniably have value there, but acting like it's a fix for griefing instead of being good QoL for older worlds is silly. The majority of times changes like these would have an impact would be when things get destroyed not from malicious acts but by dozens of people cutting corners to survive over the course of several in-game years.

[HowlVoid]

34 minutes ago, Does said:

Renewability makes the game easier by virtue of being less punishing, to say little of the additional resources it gives the player at a given time. Biggest example is carrots, love them to bits since it makes joining late a lot easier but it's a big change versus base Don't Starve where you have to think about when you want to pick them to avoid using up a nonrenewable food source instead. You don't second-guess as much over being wasteful and treat what you have available differently. Shortcuts have little weight if you can undo the damage done down the line.

This isnt the kind of renewability Im talking about. I was referring to non-renewable structures and spawn points. Also, I did mention placing renewability behind a late game wall. This will not affect the early game nor new players. No one is going to kill fuel weaver and have a food shortage problem.

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For example, burning the berry bush or tuft or sapling in the wild for winter warmth versus losing the health and heading on to find something less expensive to burn isn't as big of a trade-off when you think that it's not a permanent resource loss anymore.

Who does this other than a new player? A new player isnt going to kill fuel weaver and then go burn a berry bush for warmth.

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Craftable catcoon stumps, for example, would turn them from little critters into little critters that are mainly just another source of food to be farmed.

Food is not a problem in this game. There are sooooo many ways to automate food. If you can kill the Chess pieces, possibly kill bee queen, kill the ancient guardian and prep for fuel weaver and kill it, all while you're struggling to find food, well color me impressed. 

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I'm not opposed to changes like these for Endless since they undeniably have value there, but acting like it's a fix for griefing instead of being good QoL for older worlds is silly.

So you think the terra firma is silly? Renewable ruins are silly? Renewing gems is far more powerful than renewing a berry bush. Not to mention renewing the ruins can invalidate some bosses completely. Why kill toadstool or dragonfly ever again when you can multiply their materials with a single green gem?.

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The majority of times changes like these would have an impact would be when things get destroyed not from malicious acts but by dozens of people cutting corners to survive over the course of several in-game years.

Making a berry bush renewable is cutting corners? What? Have you not seen the new update Reap what you sow? Food is not an issue here. Every veggy in the game is more renewable than ever.

[Aeglefire]

To avoid players intentionally torching and hammering your base, rollback and kicking are already great tools implemented by Klei to revert the damage. There was a time when these options weren't available in DST, and it was still fun to play in public worlds, though not as fun as today.

From what I've read so far, I think some sort of karma system seems like the next best way to recognize players who intentionally grief, or those who intetionally grief frequently, if Klei wants to take it to the next level. The karma system would also reward players who survive well, or cooperate well with other players.

[Does]

53 minutes ago, HowlVoid said:

This isnt the kind of renewability Im talking about. I was referring to non-renewable structures and spawn points. Also, I did mention placing renewability behind a late game wall. This will not affect the early game nor new players. No one is going to kill fuel weaver and have a food shortage problem.

Who does this other than a new player? A new player isnt going to kill fuel weaver and then go burn a berry bush for warmth.

Food is not a problem in this game. There are sooooo many ways to automate food. If you can kill the Chess pieces, possibly kill bee queen, kill the ancient guardian and prep for fuel weaver and kill it, all while you're struggling to find food, well color me impressed. 

So you think the terra firma is silly? Renewable ruins are silly? Renewing gems is far more powerful than renewing a berry bush. Not to mention renewing the ruins can invalidate some bosses completely. Why kill toadstool or dragonfly ever again when you can multiply their materials with a single green gem?.

Making a berry bush renewable is cutting corners? What? Have you not seen the new update Reap what you sow? Food is not an issue here. Every veggy in the game is more renewable than ever.

Food is always an issue on a public server when you're playing with noobs that sit in base and do nothing, especially if you join late and don't have as much time / resources to prep for winter or simply rather do other things than babysit (which slows down your base's growth). Spring especially is pretty nasty too since it's easy for people to go insane if they don't know how to handle rain, and your average Joe is going to hop into the closest tent and spend hunger when that happens. While sure, you can easily survive on your own with food to spare, it gets boring. A lot of the fun of multiplayer is the chaos and added challenge of other people for me, and I love playing with people new to the game.

A player is going to join in winter, be given earmuffs and two torches worth of resources, and cut loose. The only real way to survive is to burn a lot of stuff while travelling and either happen on a built base or build a rudimentary one and claw your way to a half-decent spot. I always hesitate to burn resources vs trees since it's a permanent loss, even if a single tuft / bush / sapling doesn't really matter when I join in winter.

The Terra Firma makes sense for aesthetics. I think renewable ruins are rather silly compared to how sacred those resources were in singleplayer honestly. I get the reasoning behind it and it makes sense with the context of multiplayer, but it's still rather wack considering the roots of the game. I kinda have the same feelings about Reap What You Sow, too, honestly, but I might be getting off topic there.

The cutting corners thing was specifically for Catcoons and other critters like them, ie getting the extra mushroom but destroying the spawn, hammering the stump for a morsel, digging up rabbit dens, making basic mistakes like trying to dig up an unfertilized bush. If the damage is insignificant people don't learn to not do those things. Because food is less significant, the only real weight that losing those resources has imo is not being able to get them back. Maybe I have too much of the old game in me, I dunno.

35 minutes ago, Aeglefire said:

To avoid players intentionally torching and hammering your base, rollback and kicking are already great tools implemented by Klei to revert the damage. There was a time when these options weren't available in DST, and it was still fun to play in public worlds, though not as fun as today.

From what I've read so far, I think some sort of karma system seems like the next best way to recognize players who intentionally grief, or those who intetionally grief frequently, if Klei wants to take it to the next level. The karma system would also reward players who survive well, or cooperate well with other players.

Karma systems sound nice but I feel like it would be hard to make it abuseproof, and abusive behavior with it would be 10x worse than traditional griefing to me. Not sure how I'd feel about social credit governing DST interactions.

 

[Tranoze]

2 hours ago, RoughCactus69 said:

I agreed with you at first, but now you are sounding arrogant. You don't "own" the server. It's a PUBLIC server for a reason.

Sorry i lost my temper. But still we can ask klei for more public server if we really want it in local area, example klei did add Germany server due to a request from player.

[RoughCactus69]

1 minute ago, Tranoze said:

Sorry i lost my temper. But still we can ask klei for more public server if we really want it in local area, example klei did add Germany server due to a request from player.

It happens, don't worry. Even happened to me...... 

 

But, I play PS4 so we don't have official servers. We have the weird Klei Hosted ones that last no longer than 20 days except a few occasions. They shut down once there are no players on them. Truly sad.

 

Sincerely,

Cactus

[HowlVoid]

2 hours ago, Does said:

Food is always an issue on a public server when you're playing with noobs that sit in base and do nothing,

I cant debate you on every possibility of what a random is or isn't going to do. There far too many factors to consider, not to mention Id have to get off topic. All I can say on this matter is that, again, if renewability is behind a major boss it will not affect the early game. Burn to your hearts content. since if the server is struggling that hard, it may not get that far anyways.

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especially if you join late and don't have as much time / resources to prep for winter or simply rather do other things than babysit (which slows down your base's growth). Spring especially is pretty nasty too since it's easy for people to go insane if they don't know how to handle rain, and your average Joe is going to hop into the closest tent and spend hunger when that happens.

You might be starting to get a little off topic. Were talking about renewing non-renewable resources. Difficulty in the early game is a little irrelevant, especially if the renewable methods arent going to be readily available. That varies from player to player and I don't think its fair to balance the game off a few possible scenarios. 

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While sure, you can easily survive on your own with food to spare, it gets boring. A lot of the fun of multiplayer is the chaos and added challenge of other people for me, and I love playing with people new to the game.

Subjective.

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A player is going to join in winter, be given earmuffs and two torches worth of resources, and cut loose.

Off topic.

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The only real way to survive is to burn a lot of stuff while travelling and either happen on a built base or build a rudimentary one and claw your way to a half-decent spot.

This hypothetical person you keep bringing up, that keeps burning everything to get warm, isnt going to kill fuelweaver. 

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I always hesitate to burn resources vs trees since it's a permanent loss, even if a single tuft / bush / sapling doesn't really matter when I join in winter.

You've made this point very clear to me by now. It wont affect the early game.

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The Terra Firma makes sense for aesthetics.

Fair.

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I think renewable ruins are rather silly compared to how sacred those resources were in singleplayer honestly. I get the reasoning behind it and it makes sense with the context of multiplayer, but it's still rather wack considering the roots of the game. I kinda have the same feelings about Reap What You Sow, too, honestly, but I might be getting off topic there.

No, if anything this is the main topic, renewability. Something already present in the game in a few forms, the ruins being one of them. I've also heard that the lunar island renews itself very slowly. So its something already present in the game, its just not consistent. 

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The cutting corners thing was specifically for Catcoons and other critters like them, ie getting the extra mushroom but destroying the spawn, hammering the stump for a morsel, digging up rabbit dens, making basic mistakes like trying to dig up an unfertilized bush. If the damage is insignificant people don't learn to not do those things.

These examples hold merit but only in the early game. Some people say that adding renewability for a public server will affect their games but I see it as an opposite problem. I want renewability for the very late game which may have an impact on public servers; what we are discussing now essentially. 

Here is the main issue as I see it, renewability is already present in the game but it isn't consistent. What is the difference between a beefalo and a tall bird? Grieffing aside, there really isnt much of a difference outside of one being renewable but not the other. They are kited with similar difficulty, beefalos drop more loot,  befalos repopulate and can be moved. Why cant we take care of a tall bird to have produce another nest? When a herd will repopulate without any help? No one struggling to survive will painstakingly raise a tall bird for a one egg and two meat respawn point, when things like a spiders nest spawns spiders nightly. 

Quote

Maybe I have too much of the old game in me, I dunno.

I think the problem is we are looking for easy solutions. I love how hamlet has its wilderness almost try and overtake the world. There is no reason why a renewing mechanic cant be dangerous. 

[ZombieDupe]

I agree. Repairing just speeds up the process generally with less resource cost. You still lose resources, but don't have to go through the process of gathering even more resources, hammering burnt stuff, clearing the area. Most burn problems come from desperate players, stupid accidents and griefing, which makes it a chore. This doesn't make fire not a threat or a loss, you would still be encouraged to secure areas from fire with ice flingomatics, just not something you have to stress out over like a lunatic. It just makes it a much more reasonable of a threat, so you could potentially use it as one in more places. You obviously could still hammer things and replace them. You really wouldn't want to, but that is still an option.

[MilesUpshore]

16 hours ago, x0-VERSUS-1y said:

At least my objection was against Grass Tufts, Saplings and Berry Bushes regeneration in a Survival world. It's survival in the end, not Endless/Wilderness for a reason. OP wants comfy resource regen almost for everything game has in it in, I repeat: a survival setup. It's getting ridiculous by now. We already have for standard 8-players pubs more than enough stuff to get by. Now we even have starting items and resources in inventory when spawning outside of the 10 days startup window in default. Survival vanilla official KLei servers aren't meant to be taken "captive" by the likes of OP and you for 10k days via AFK-botting scripts and blatant game exploits like Z-stack glitch so OP's proposal via a very niche and questionable play-style would hold any water as arguments go. In case of Endless servers, yes regarding Reeds, Lune Trees, Sea Sprouts, Anenemies (not enough traps available, eh?!) etc. Maybe. But is Survival for Pete's sake, is meant to be challenging. Not homey mega-base "terraforming" official pubs shenanigans.

Is quite the funny thing now, when Griefer Spawn Protection prevents you lot from killing/trapping people at gate with ease, you try to find ways of mitigating resource-hoarding - since this is it by current point: not lack of resources, but overkill resource hoarding needed for mega-base building - another niche, particular style of play. On official KLei pubs of all places!

Hey, I would appreciate if you can stop being aggressive and group me with OP in the off-topic drama that's really derailing the thread, like this type of stuff is best settled in DMs instead of duking it all out on the forums. After all, this is still just a video game, and we are ultimately talking about video game suggestions, so don't do that.

Secondly, I also don't necessary fully agree with the original "every resource must be renewable" idea cos once again: the idea of doing so without eliminating the challenge of surviving with finite resources, and my previous post was thinking more along the lines of suggesting some resources be made renewable, more so in the vein of making reeds be renewable (provided with that probability percentage) and even replantable/transportable. Though, I personally don't see why grass tufts, saplings, even berry bushes can also have some degree of renewability (like maybe 1%?), since these can be destroyed by summer wildfires on the surface especially off-screen over time, but their abundance = renewability percentage must be lowered to maintain that challenge of surviving finite resources if it's implemented.

Anyways, this is my last reply on this matter, so peace out

[BeeClops]

14 hours ago, RoughCactus69 said:

But, I play PS4 so we don't have official servers. We have the weird Klei Hosted ones that last no longer than 20 days except a few occasions. They shut down once there are no players on them. Truly sad.

those are the official servers, they are dedicated and don't reset unless someone dies and resets them. But people do that all the time so yeah generally on console 90% of them last <30 days. But I have been part of day 300+ and 500+ pubs on console, it's a lot rarer than on pc, more noobs and less scripts, but it still happens.

As for better ways to recover from griefing, I think that's a losing battle on pubs in general. Avoid leading people to your base until you somewhat trust them, don't base at portal or in obvious locations, or even worse mark your base with orb, and in general don't get too invested, the world will reset by the next day 90% anyway. From my experience, given enough time these bases will always get griefed, at one point there are just 2 players on the server and there is no way of stopping a griefer.

Honestly I just see griefers as part of the pubs experience, just like you can't turn off wildfires on pubs, you can't turn off griefers either. Gotta adapt. The best thing to say after someone says "X just burned base" is "which one?"

[Xenna]

Just want to say that most of these obscure features wont help the average ordinary players, it only benefits 16 hours/day camping "elites" or 24/7 AFK scripting griefers in Klei servers. The adversity here is these servers are none moderated and there always be toxic situations: ranging from griefers hammer other players' bases to servers being exploited for personal uses to the point of "hostage" for show off and demands in the forum. The off-hand approach is not going to work in long term - the forum will inevitably increase with complains about griefers or push back mechanics unrelated to major players' gameplay. It is generous of them to host free quality Klei official servers for everyone but Klei should fund trusty community group servers with admins instead of keeping wild-west servers with zero profits and constant nagging from players.

 

Short version : This whole thread is basically "Klei pls add xxxx features so I can afk hostage easier" 
If Klei add any of these features they suggested so far into the game it will only benefit this hostage group not average players.