Safe space too powerful

[DarkMaster13]

While I very much prefer not having to bunker over everything just to use space, I think having no hazards at all is too powerful.  It's really easy in the current version to go up to space and setup solar panels to completely and permanently take care of almost any power needs.  Especially when you can get a lot of free glass from some of the new points of interest.

My suggestion is something like micrometeor damage.  Any buildings exposed to space (with the exception of bunkers) gradually take micrometeor damage which maxes out over the course of 5-10 cycles.  When it maxes, the building takes damage and needs to be repaired.  This way, buildings built in space cost regular maintenance from dupes and enough resources to essentially rebuild them every 20-40 cycles.  Something like solar power is no longer free, you have to spend upkeep in labor and glass on it.  Rockets are a constant drain on resources if you don't build bunker silos for them.

[Steve8]

Another way to nerf solar power is to make the sun way less intense on the starting asteroid. Just say that it is far away from its sun. Other asteroids are closer to the sun, but also have meteoroids. Though with the starting asteroid being in the center of the hex grid that may not be entirely consistent.

[psusi]

Aren't the meteors only disabled for testing?

[Steve8]

22 minutes ago, psusi said:

Aren't the meteors only disabled for testing?

No idea. Either way makes sense. General game balance to make early rocketry easier without building a lot of space infrastructure. Or making just the testing easier so people can quickly try out the new rockets.

[SkunkMaster]

I would prefer if the home planet, and maybe some other planets, are free of meteors, while other asteroids do have meteor showers.. 

[Tsabo]

1 hour ago, psusi said:

Aren't the meteors only disabled for testing?

Well the dev's stated aim is to make the space biome useful even in early game, which would be totally impossible if meteor bombardment is ever coming back.

[psusi]

3 minutes ago, Tsabo said:

Well the dev's stated aim is to make the space biome useful even in early game, which would be totally impossible if meteor bombardment is ever coming back.

I'm not so sure.  I mean, you do get a lot of regolith, but that can easily be crushed into oblivion, though some may consider that an exploit.  The heat isn't such a big deal as long as you don't bring the hot materials back into the base.  Then again, I'm not so sure I like the idea of space really being such an early game thing.  A little earlier sure, but not even being challenging enough to bother with exosuits?  Even long term?

[ghkbrew]

What if regolith meteors came back, but didn't cause damage?

Space is still immediately usable, you just have to dig it out periodically. Solar panels are no longer maintenance free. There's a nice upgrade path that retains much of the original complexity (dupe labor -> mining laser -> cooled mining laser)

Bunker tiles/doors could even be kept relevant by making metal meteors cause damage, but only having them fall on "end game" planetoids.

My only concern would be how to prevent run away regolith build up. Maybe regolith meteors only damage/destroy regolith tiles?

[TheTickingTick]

What if meteors come only after 250 cycles? it would make early game rocketry easier while keep the late game fun as it was.

[chrisbehk]

I agree for the most part with this post, my suggestion is to have shorter days on your main planet, or for you to get less lux from the sun, or both. That seems like a non obtrusive way of nerfing solar panels 

[Carcer_]

2 hours ago, TheTickingTick said:

What if meteors come only after 250 cycles? it would make early game rocketry easier while keep the late game fun as it was.

I like something like that. Maybe once you have a telescope the map would show an incoming shower and how long till it hits. After the first they become more and more regular. The telescope would act as a manual space scanner where you can see when the next one is due until you can get something like the old automated scanners.

[RonEmpire]

No space scanners at moment to detect to close bunker doors. 

 

Currently no renewable source of  metal ore.    Metal volcanoes do not give ore.     Ranching slugs are not viable.   Once you run out   they will die of hunger and go extinct.        Old comets gave some ore. 

[Sasza22]

From watching streams it looks like the entire space biome is missing at the moment. There is background above the top biome but there is just nothing there. For sure they will fill that space with something. I think meteors are likely to come back. I just wonder if they will work the same way. Maybe they will be marked on the space map allowing you to plan ahead and rely on manual closing of bunker doors before you get automation in place.

[QuQuasar]

I'm sure Klei want to try something different with the new space biome(s?) instead of just bringing back meteors, so here's a few idea's to supplement their own...

 

1. Solar flares. Solar panels and wires connected to solar panels take overload damage. Panels must be shaded when an incoming flare is detected to protect the circuits.
 
2. Solar heat. Honestly, it's always been weird that sunlight doesn't provide any heat in ONI. Could be combined with solar flares.
 
3. Dust cloud. The asteroid passes through a cloud of hot Co2 gas, temporarily generating it from all tiles open to space.

4. Minimeteors. Don't leave resources and can't damage any form of solid tile, but can lightly damage buildings.

5. Panspermia. Horrible diseases, FROM SPAAAAAAAAACE.
 
6. Vaccuum irritant debuff. I'm sure being directly exposed to the vacuum of space can't be good for your skin. Or your eardrums.

[Joe Mucchiello]

On 11/26/2020 at 12:08 AM, TheTickingTick said:

What if meteors come only after 250 cycles? it would make early game rocketry easier while keep the late game fun as it was.

For some players cycle 250 is cycle 1000 for other players or cycle 50 for other players. 250 is an arbitrary number that may not serve the most common players.

[Promethien]

3 hours ago, Joe Mucchiello said:

For some players cycle 250 is cycle 1000 for other players or cycle 50 for other players. 250 is an arbitrary number that may not serve the most common players.

Wrong mindset. Part of the fun of games like this is the potential for failure. Learning to do things better. That can also mean faster. If the super pros can swing it in 75 or less (emphasis on the less) then triple that is absolutely not an unreasonable challenge for the average player.

[Alexandr Block]

On 11/26/2020 at 10:25 AM, psusi said:

The heat isn't such a big deal as long as you don't bring the hot materials back into the base.

Don't forget you don't have Atmo Suit.

[Lupbert]

I personally liked the meteor/scanner/solar panel interaction.  What I didn't like was the meteor/scanner rocket interaction.  The first was an interesting way to generate power.  The second meant that I was either constantly micromanaging rockets to open the bunker doors, or I needed a really complicated setup for enough scanners.

 

I don't mind bringing back meteors, but if they are brought back, I hope there is a way I can use rockets without a complicated bunker door setup.

 

I do agree that solar is far too awesome though.

[psusi]

16 hours ago, Alexandr Block said:

Don't forget you don't have Atmo Suit.

You don't need an atomo suit to protect you from heat in a vacuum.

The first time I got to space after they added them, I just used regular tiles to shield from meteors.  Sure, they needed repair, but the sheer volume of reglith you had to dig out of the way was the bigger problem.  I think if they cut the rate of showers in half, it would be completely manageable without bunker tiles or atmo suits.

4 hours ago, Lupbert said:

What I didn't like was the meteor/scanner rocket interaction.  The first was an interesting way to generate power.  The second meant that I was either constantly micromanaging rockets to open the bunker doors, or I needed a really complicated setup for enough scanners.

I've never built bunker doors over my rockets.  They don't take damage from meteors, so you just need bunker tiles for them to sit on, and some jet suits for dupes to go out and service the rockets.  The rocket exhaust also destroys any regolith that builds up, so most of the time you don't even need to dig it up.

[Korbin]

I'm guessing that comets aren't removed from the game and are just turned off like the others have said. If you turn on sandbox mode, you can see there is a new comet: Fullerene Comet. Which might be a clue as to what the devs are thinking on how they will manage rare resources and also encourage mining space which currently doesn't have a large compelling reason in the current game (unless you are raising shove voles for a large colony).