Biggest change on the coming update.

[Carnis]

Polluted water will have specific heat capacity of water.

This means AETN, wheezeworts & fixed output devices will be the only source of cooling.

No More polluted water boiling / Steam cooling.

All sources of heat are retained.

[Oozinator]

Just now, Carnis said:

No More polluted water boiling / Steam cooling.

That's bad.. again limiting creativity?

 

[BlueLance]

5 minutes ago, Carnis said:

Polluted water will have specific heat capacity of water.

This means AETN, wheezeworts & fixed output devices will be the only source of cooling.

No More polluted water boiling / Steam cooling.

All sources of heat are retained.

You can still ram it into a water seive once it hits 100 degrees, so its not really a big deal if thats what you did originally.

For those who don't use the sieve for that purpose it is gonna be a real kick but I honestly don't see it causing me any problems at all.

Also Wheezeworts are now able to be gathered from space from what I heard

[Carnis]

3 minutes ago, Oozinator said:

That's bad.. again limiting creativity?

 

Think they also removed oil boiling into gas. A really big disappointment versus creative.

[Saturnus]

1 minute ago, SamLogan said:

Or an opportunity to find new solutions and stimulate our creativity. I think you should take a break from ONI, you appear totaly saturated.

I think that's an overly harsh comment to be honest. And I'm not particularly known for being sensitive. Wouldn't it have been more constructive to explain that having different SHC of PW and H2O was a glaring mistake (at least the extremely large discrepancy in the SHC)?

[Carnis]

6 minutes ago, SamLogan said:

By creativity, you mean copy and paste the NG boilers on the forums or in the Youtube video? It's has been a long time that creativity around this setup is go away...

I have My own setup that boils 10kg/s with a single volcano source, a creative build not matched by any YouTube video.

You sound very negative today as well.

Water sources Will Be very scarce for large colonies after this update.

[Saturnus]

25 minutes ago, Carnis said:

Think they also removed oil boiling into gas. A really big disappointment versus creative.

I think they want people to make petroleum cookers instead. More challenging builds, and you use petroleum to power the rockets anyway, so you definitely need a more efficient way than oil refineries to make petroleum in a long term build.

[Sevio]

The outright removal of oil boiling to natural gas may seem a bit harsh considering the complex machinery needed but it shouldn't come as a surprise given the ridiculous increase in energy and output products that it gave.

Petroleum cookers can still be made, they still double the yield from crude oil, return a good amount of water and remove the need for duplicant operation, which is valuable for small colonies.

I just hope we get some new and interesting temperature transitions or chemical reactions to play with down the road that do reward building similar machines out of basic components.

[Grimgaw]

3 minutes ago, Sevio said:

I just hope we get some new and interesting temperature transitions or chemical reactions to play with down the road that do reward building similar machines out of basic components.

I hope so too. We hadn't have anything new (apart of melting regolith) in this department since NG and the road looks finished.

[Sasza22]

One thing stopped working. Time to get creative and find a new solution. Personally i like that now cooking oil produces a waste that needs to be dealt with. Everything that is a straight up upgrade needs some kind of downside. now you need to find a way to get rid of the unwanted gas at least until we get a use for it.

As for the water changes there was a lot of talk about how the game doesn`t respect physics. They seem to start fixing some of it now. The sieve might be the next target. I can only imagine how many 1000+ cycle colonies will implode once the sieve stoppes giving a fixed 40^oC water. Even changing it to 50 would break a lot of designs.

[BlueLance]

3 minutes ago, Sasza22 said:

now you need to find a way to get rid of the unwanted gas at least until we get a use for it.

Vent it into space... But I assume sour gas cannot be used for anything then with what you said?

[Alfons100]

We were given those silly Gas Moos, convert useless Chlorine into Natural Gas. The issue is that they're really hard to aquire as they're *very* lategame stuff. Once you get them, you probably got different solutions.

Maybe we can make Crossbreed Moos to get other fun stuff. A Moo that makes Hydrogen? Perhaps?

[BlueLance]

Chlorine isnt useless, feed it to pufts for free and easy food. other benefit is the blechstone can stay there and either offgas or just pile up.

But giving it another use is definently amazing, the only downside is I honestly do not need ANOTHER source of natural gas XD

[SamLogan]

36 minutes ago, Oozinator said:

Who are you, that you think you can tell me that way?
You would like forum filled with roleplayfanboys only and hyping every bit of change they made?
Blind one obey, consume.

You said ONI is too casual now. But when Klei change it and kill some overpowered mechanics (polluted water was too strong cooler and Crude Oil boiler was an easy infinite way to obtain NG) you cry on the forum without try to find any alternative solutions.

I'm not a fan boy, I criticize the game when it's necessary. But I don't support players that use glitchs or overpowered mechanics which cry when the studio nerf them. When the Water Sieve will be fix, I can't imagine the reactions of certains players...

[BlueLance]

6 minutes ago, SamLogan said:

I can't imagine the reactions of certains players...

There will be casualties XD

[Grimgaw]

15 minutes ago, SamLogan said:

When the Water Sieve will be fix

You're saying it as it's certainty. The devs themselves said it's intended.

[Smuch]

2 hours ago, Oozinator said:

That's bad.. again limiting creativity?

 

I have to disagree.

If anthing it will mean peoples will have to be MORE creative to overcome obstacles rather than relying on what was basicaly a glorified.. exploit, I guess.

I suppose expoit or glitch are not quite the righ term for it since it as left volunterily in the game but I think it was sort of undersood it was a temporary masure that was gong to be eventualy phased out.

[Alfons100]

42 minutes ago, BlueLance said:

Chlorine isnt useless, feed it to pufts for free and easy food. other benefit is the blechstone can stay there and either offgas or just pile up.

But giving it another use is definently amazing, the only downside is I honestly do not need ANOTHER source of natural gas XD

Useless maybe was an exageration, but Pufts give very little food and Bleachstone doesn't have too many uses other than washing your hands quickly

[BlueLance]

18 minutes ago, Grimgaw said:

You're saying it as it's certainty. The devs themselves said it's intended.

For now it is intended, it doesn't mean that during the course of the game these things will not change. The reason they say it's intended is so that people do not keep pointing it out, they know it does that and they are intentionally leaving it like that, either because they have future plans for cooling but until then they have left this as is so players at least have something.

6 minutes ago, Alfons100 said:

Useless maybe was an exageration, but Pufts give very little food and Bleachstone doesn't have too many uses other than washing your hands quickly

If you have enough farms then the eggs + meat is quite a fair amount over time. I have two pens of squeaky pufts....not right now because i just started anew though. i never use the bleachstone though, I just leave it sitting in the room so if i ever have a dry period with chlorine they will off-gas which feeds the pufts haha

[Gurgel]

I think this is a good change. It makes handling a lot of stuff easier and only kills some very specialized, non-intuitive constructs.

[Fraxotic]

 

8 hours ago, Oozinator said:

That's bad.. again limiting creativity?

 

 

6 hours ago, Smuch said:

I have to disagree.

If anthing it will mean peoples will have to be MORE creative to overcome obstacles rather than relying on what was basicaly a glorified.. exploit, I guess.

I suppose expoit or glitch are not quite the righ term for it since it as left volunterily in the game but I think it was sort of undersood it was a temporary masure that was gong to be eventualy phased out.

I agree, true creativity isn't something u can "kill".

[avc15]

IDK now we're on topic of NG boiling but

I still think they're just pushing us make efficient bases.

OR to use steam turbines. Which still nobody has shown a simple way of setting up in a survival game, OR an overall efficient setup that doesn't use doorpumps (that most players won't bother with)

It's out there, I swear. Just nobody has shown it. Except a couple guys doing really complicated wonky things like... using the infinite waterfall exploit as a free water pump.

 

[OmegaFunction]

Does ph20 retain its evaporation and freezing points? If so, it is still useful. It would just cost more electrical energy to cool down same amount of heat energy. It does not seem like too big of a deal to me. So, what am I missing?

Also slush geysers are nerved by this. Considering that they are probably the best geysers in game, as they provide dirt and cooling, this does seem like a reasonable nerf. This does increase difficulty in the end game. Good thing?

9 hours ago, Carnis said:

All sources of heat are retained.

Well, probably not very important, but ph20 vent (the one at 30°C) would be a weaker heat source.

8 hours ago, Sevio said:

The outright removal of oil boiling to natural gas may seem a bit harsh considering the complex machinery needed but it shouldn't come as a surprise given the ridiculous increase in energy and output products that it gave.

Petroleum cookers can still be made, they still double the yield from crude oil, return a good amount of water and remove the need for duplicant operation, which is valuable for small colonies.

So oil will boil to petroleum, but no more to ng, did I understand this correctly? This will definitively impact boiler design. And as long a thermo sensors cannot pick up the temperature at this range, it is necessary to make complicated (exploity?) indirect measurement techniques. "The liquid is gas now" is way easier to measure than "the liquid is hot enough, it must be petroleum now". I think they should rather add additional thermo sensors with different temperature ranges instead of incentivizing the community come up with ever more complicated designs. Currently oil boiling is something that some people enjoy doing while nobody is forced to do it. I think this is good game design. If their concern was balance, it would have been better to reduce the SHC of NG, or increase that of oil and petroleum.

In general, I do not understand, why there are geysers in the game, that require complex solutions to get any use out of them, when they now seem to want to reduce their usefulness so much, that you might as well cap them in insulated abyssalite and ignore their existence. I mean previously a volcano had two uses: Oil boiling and regolith to igneous rock conversion. Oil boiling was reasonably difficult. Depending on your perspective, regolith melting is either extremely advanced oni engineering, an exploit fest or a waste of time.

I currently have an iron volcano on my map. If it wasn't useful for oil boiling, I would have just ignored that brutally hot thing, and limited myself space iron. Why bother cooling that thing down?

7 hours ago, Smuch said:

I have to disagree.

If anthing it will mean peoples will have to be MORE creative to overcome obstacles rather than relying on what was basicaly a glorified.. exploit, I guess..

I generally agree with you here, but I think there is one caveat. If there is only one practical way to overcome an obstacle, it indeed does kill creativity as soon as it is clear, that there is no other way. And I really hope that the practical solution does not include a glaring exploit. I do not like them and would be torn between my personal preference to avoid them and my personal preference to make efficient setups.

5 minutes ago, avc15 said:

IDK now we're on topic of NG boiling but

I still think they're just pushing the community to learn how to make efficient bases.

OR to use steam turbines. Which still nobody has shown a simple way of setting up in a survival game, OR an overall efficient setup that doesn't use doorpumps (that most players won't bother with)

It's out there, I swear. Just nobody has shown it. Except a couple guys doing really complicated wonky things like... using the infinite waterfall exploit as a free water pump.

 

I had a game with a water geyser (95°C) and two slush geysers, so I had more water than I could possible make use of. So instead of just leaving the water unused at the geysers or just venting it into space, I decided to give 

a chance. It really upped my energy production, whereas trying to use the steam vent (500°C) was basically a waste of building resources. In my current game, I haven't even bothered with digging out the steam vent. It is just not worth it, or I don't know how it may be. Both the generated power and the amount of water is negligible. I really would appreciate if Klei was more transparent in their reasoning when they make such decisions.

However, since there were a lot of space related buildings in this update, I am wondering, if solar panels are worth it, or do they still require manual digging orders or mechanized airlocks to get rid of regolith piles.

[Grimgaw]

11 minutes ago, OmegaFunction said:

I really would appreciate if Klei was more transparent in their reasoning when they make such decisions.

Don't we all? Unfortunately they take pride in not communicating. That's OK if you release complete games. That's not OK (imo) in EA process. 

[OmegaFunction]

Just now, Grimgaw said:

Don't we all? Unfortunately they take pride in not communicating. That's OK if you release complete games. That's not OK (imo) in EA process. 

Is this a conjecture or something they actually stated in some form?