So what was the point of Winona again?

[Toros]

2 hours ago, DelroyBM said:

Wilson was the only "no cons, only pros" character, why not another one?

It’s pretty much a stretch to say that Wickerbottom or Wx have cons at all, so Wilson is not unique in this regard.

Per Wicker, non-fresh food is usually better to convert into something else (rot, eggs, using a crockpot and fresh ingredients) for *everyone*.  Sleeping is also possibly the worst way to restore sanity (costs hunger and time whereas fighting shadow monsters gains nightmare fuel which has many uses.

Per Wx, his only downsides are slightly low starting stats (in dst he is ahead after 2-3 gears) and slooowly taking damage in rain (but the sparking provides enough light to prevent charlie).  Everyone suffers from getting wet, and it’s easy to prevent for all characters in a normal fall start.

In theory Wilson and Winona are the only characters who don’t have a downside.  In practice, is it really a downside if you’d take the exact same actions to “manage it” as any character? 100% of the cast wants rain gear in spring, and even in a long fall rain Wx won’t take that much damage.

[cptCalavera]

I do wish winona had some more interesting mechanics to her. but I still enjoy playing as her just because of beeing a new character and I like her personality.

(and the short crafting time is great for streams)

[Sinister_Fang]

17 hours ago, Toros said:

Sleeping is also possibly the worst way to restore sanity (costs hunger and time whereas fighting shadow monsters gains nightmare fuel which has many uses.

With the abundance of food, it's really not that bad if you use a tent or lean-to. It also recovers health as well so it's perfect for preparing for a boss fight and/or exploring the ruins. And fighting shadows only restores sanity up to a certain point. Sometimes it's nice not having to fight shadows every couple of minutes. So there are benefits to recovering sanity, as well as letting it drain.

[Toros]

4 minutes ago, Sinister_Fang said:

With the abundance of food, it's really not that bad if you use a tent or lean-to. It also recovers health as well so it's perfect for preparing for a boss fight and/or exploring the ruins. And fighting shadows only restores sanity up to a certain point. Sometimes it's nice not having to fight shadows every couple of minutes. So there are benefits to recovering sanity, as well as letting it drain.

It's the worst way by a long shot because taffy, jerky, cooked cactus, clothing, and prototyping all provide something besides sanity and don't force you to stay in one spot, you can keep moving and being productive.  I haven't slept on any character in well over 100 hours of playtime because it's an inefficient and unnecessary way to restore sanity.  As an emergency plan, it allows new players to trade one problem (low sanity) for another (low hunger).

[Karmattack]

I think it's natural after how long we've waited for a new character to be a bit disappointed her powers don't stand out more. 

I was kinda hoping she'd have a personal crafting tab with gear related to her background, or that maybe Charlie would take a passive bit of mercy on her and she'd aggro shadow beings less or something. 

[Residays]

16 minutes ago, Karmattack said:

I think it's natural after how long we've waited for a new character to be a bit disappointed her powers don't stand out more. 

I was kinda hoping she'd have a personal crafting tab with gear related to her background, or that maybe Charlie would take a passive bit of mercy on her and she'd aggro shadow beings less or something. 

This would have been a great update if after adding Winona we got an improved adventure mode... But I still dislike how she hasn't been changed at all after being released.

[Atkvin]

On 07/11/2017 at 6:10 AM, Residays said:

But I still dislike how she hasn't been changed at all after being released.

Knowing Klei's heavy policy on DST characters, eg the discussion on buffing weaker characters and nerfing overused characters, I'm not surprised they're remaining obstinate on this topic as well. Winona was probably nerfed in order to balance her in a multiplayer game, and ended up being shoehorned into a newb character for the new console. And I think we can safely put thoughts of Klei changing their mind about that decision anytime soon to rest.

However, if you're really passionate about Winona being buffed or improved in some way, there's always the Steam Workshop to make a mod to tweak her abilities and stats and buff her to your liking. I'm sure it'll be well-received in the community.

[Residays]

17 hours ago, Atkvin said:

However, if you're really passionate about Winona being buffed or improved in some way, there's always the Steam Workshop to make a mod to tweak her abilities and stats and buff her to your liking. I'm sure it'll be well-received in the community.

No because I wouldn't want to add a speed boost or a stat multiplier & increase.

[TheKingofSquirrels]

20 hours ago, Atkvin said:

Knowing Klei's heavy policy on DST characters, eg the discussion on buffing weaker characters and nerfing overused characters

What is this policy? 

[Residays]

53 minutes ago, TheKingofSquirrels said:

What is this policy? 

Klei is really silent when communicating about game work so the closest thing we can get to know about it is check how and when the updates are made.

[Atkvin]

5 hours ago, Residays said:

No because I wouldn't want to add a speed boost or a stat multiplier & increase.

I'm not a modder myself, but would it not be possible to mod her tape to mend armor, try to make a mass-manufacture-a-stack-of-crap function or etc through mods? If so, maybe I give mods too much credit..

As for their policy thing, Joe has spoken up once when the topic was really hot, and tl;dr it was pretty much that Klei keeps the things they are when it comes to characters and balance. Don't quote me on that, I don't remember the post well but it was pretty much reasoning why they wouldn't balance the characters of DST.

[Toros]

44 minutes ago, Atkvin said:

I'm not a modder myself, but would it not be possible to mod her tape to mend armor, try to make a mass-manufacture-a-stack-of-crap function or etc through mods? If so, maybe I give mods too much credit..

As for their policy thing, Joe has spoken up once when the topic was really hot, and tl;dr it was pretty much that Klei keeps the things they are when it comes to characters and balance. Don't quote me on that, I don't remember the post well but it was pretty much reasoning why they wouldn't balance the characters of DST.

That might be their current position but they reworked Woodie, Willow, and Maxwell for DST.  Only one of those was done well (in both my opinion and community consensus) so that might explain why they're pretty gun-shy for making changes to character balance.

As far as modding it would definitely be possible.  With modding a whole lot of things are possible with the main limitations being the modder's skill at programming and their willingness to invest hours getting things to work the way they want them to.  I don't think any good modders were really motivated to buff Winona, so it hasn't happened.

[Lumina]

It could still happen, the character is still "new", and modding could depend of a lot of things.

[Loopy Ouroboros]

Winona's there to serve a very specific niche, but I'd rather chose Wilson, and have a guaranteed source of beard hair over a more reliably craftable sewing kit. The free hit from darkness and the faster build time aren't really anything I would put to good use, but in the case of unexpected hound attacks and broken spears, standing around crafting an emergency weapon like a sitting duck isn't so much of a compromise as it is for everybody else.

Still, I could see a fairly good synergy with her, Wilson, Willow, and her teddy bear, Bernie. Wilson could provide the rare beard hair for additional Bernies, Winona can easily patch up any that get destroyed, and Willow obviously crafts the Bernies herself. Anyone in favor? I'd say the sight of a hundred cuddly teddy bears is a heartwarming sight indeed.

[Toros]

3 hours ago, Commissar Oscar said:

Winona's there to serve a very specific niche, but I'd rather chose Wilson, and have a guaranteed source of beard hair over a more reliably craftable sewing kit. The free hit from darkness and the faster build time aren't really anything I would put to good use, but in the case of unexpected hound attacks and broken spears, standing around crafting an emergency weapon like a sitting duck isn't so much of a compromise as it is for everybody else.

Still, I could see a fairly good synergy with her, Wilson, Willow, and her teddy bear, Bernie. Wilson could provide the rare beard hair for additional Bernies, Winona can easily patch up any that get destroyed, and Willow obviously crafts the Bernies herself. Anyone in favor? I'd say the sight of a hundred cuddly teddy bears is a heartwarming sight indeed.

Wilson's beard is actually a terrible source of beard hair, as if you want his beard to be full grown at the start of winter he only produces 1 beard hair before the end of winter, 35 days in.  That's 4 hours and 40 minutes to produce 10 beard hair, unless he dies in which case he loses his beard.

What exactly is the advantage of mass producing bernies?

[spideswine]

*Attempts to see water in an empty glass intensify*

[Loopy Ouroboros]

14 hours ago, Toros said:

Wilson's beard is actually a terrible source of beard hair, as if you want his beard to be full grown at the start of winter he only produces 1 beard hair before the end of winter, 35 days in.  That's 4 hours and 40 minutes to produce 10 beard hair, unless he dies in which case he loses his beard.

What exactly is the advantage of mass producing bernies?

Wilson's beard may not be the most useful resource in the game, but I still find it more appealing than a cheap sewing kit. Hey, I can stay alive long enough to allow my beard to grow for the most part. Just a matter of playstyle for me.

I didn't say there was any definitive advantage to amassing Bernies, but if meat effigies aren't really for you, what else are you going to do with all that excess beard hair? Merely burning it seems so... Wasteful.

[landromat]

2 hours ago, Commissar Oscar said:

Wilson's beard may not be the most useful resource in the game, but I still find it more appealing than a cheap sewing kit. Hey, I can stay alive long enough to allow my beard to grow for the most part. Just a matter of playstyle for me.

I didn't say there was any definitive advantage to amassing Bernies, but if meat effigies aren't really for you, what else are you going to do with all that excess beard hair? Merely burning it seems so... Wasteful.

Winona's quick craft is OP. There is no beard in universe that can compete with it

Sewing kit and free charlie hit are just little additions

[spideswine]

9 minutes ago, landromat said:

Winona's quick craft is OP. There is no beard in universe that can compete with it

But can it melt steel beams?

[landromat]

1 minute ago, spideswine said:

But can it melt steel beams?

Have you seen the Forge? It's all made from melted metal. Remember Winona's face in the Atrium gates? Who do you think warmed up the forge?

[spideswine]

4 minutes ago, landromat said:

Have you seen the Forge? It's all made from melted metal. Remember Winona's face in the Atrium gates? Who do you think warmed up the forge?

I think we are up to something.

I mean she clearly has no use, she doesn't belong in the game, and yet she is in it.

Clearly there's some secret dark motive to justify her addition to the game, winona joins the survivors, then suddenly the forge catches on fire? I think we can safely assume that winona can in fact melt steel beams.

[landromat]

Just now, spideswine said:

I think we are up to something.

I mean she clearly has no use, she doesn't belong in the game, and yet she is in it.

Clearly something there's some secret dark motive to justify her addition to the game, winona joins the survivors, then suddenly the forge catches on fire? I think we can safely assume that winona can in fact melt steel beams.

and enemy's faces

[spideswine]

1 minute ago, landromat said:

and enemy's faces

No, melting the faces of her enemies would be too obvious, no need to hide something of that sort.

I don't think it's the faces of her enemies she melts.

[Toros]

8 hours ago, Commissar Oscar said:

Wilson's beard may not be the most useful resource in the game, but I still find it more appealing than a cheap sewing kit. Hey, I can stay alive long enough to allow my beard to grow for the most part. Just a matter of playstyle for me.

I didn't say there was any definitive advantage to amassing Bernies, but if meat effigies aren't really for you, what else are you going to do with all that excess beard hair? Merely burning it seems so... Wasteful.

Your subjective preference for one character over another is a completely different topic from the actual mechanical advantages they either have or don't have.  I've already written an essay on why Wilson's beard sucks mechanically, and especially is not likely to be helpful for new players, but if you prefer Wilson (or Wes, or anyone else) over Winona that's fine.  All characters are viable.

But as a newbie character, Winona has some clear advantages and is definitely the one I would recommend for it (and she has some niche value in cave only runs or servers due to being able to fix clothing without hound's teeth).

My personal solution with beard hair is not to farm excess amounts because it has pretty limited uses and I skip telltale hearts and effigies as respawn options straight to amulets.