[Archived] Original Mod Collaboration Thread

debugman18 · September 4, 2013

(Tell me if I'm asking about things too much.)What will the terrain gen be like? Will it just be infinite cloud, or with sparse "ocean" scattered around, or a bunch of tiny islands (7x7)onnected with bridges?

It will have biomes and setpeices, similarly to the other worlds.

simplex · September 4, 2013

It will have biomes and setpeices, similarly to the other worlds.

Is having regular ground a plan?And about the static mechanic, which I'm implementing right now, I don't think a Continuous-Time Markov Chain is viable because it'll be waaay to involved to do the (quite CPU-hungry) calculations, based on matrix exponentials (unless we restrict it to 2 states or similarly to a small fixed number, but that'd prevent extensions to the mechanic).So what I'm thinking is: implement it using a discrete Markov Chain, that receives a periodic "tick", being updated. The question is what to do with long updates. I believe the charged state should set the danger flag, preventing the player from sleeping, so they are only a concern when the player reenters the cloud world. I think when the player leaves and reenters the cloud realm it should just go to its uncharged state, do you agree? Edited September 4, 2013 by simplex

debugman18 · September 4, 2013

Is having regular ground a plan?And about the static mechanic, which I'm implementing right now, I don't think a Continuous-Time Markov Chain is viable because it'll be waaay to involved to do the (quite CPU-hungry) calculations, based on matrix exponentials (unless we restrict it to 2 states or similarly to a small fixed number, but that'd prevent extensions to the mechanic).So what I'm thinking is: implement it using a discrete Markov Chain, that receives a periodic "tick", being updated. The question is what to do with long updates. I believe the charged state should set the danger flag, preventing the player from sleeping, so they are only a concern when the player reenters the cloud world. I think when the player leaves and reenters the cloud realm it should just go to its uncharged state, do you agree?

I'm not sure about regular ground. I guess we could put some variant of regular turf around, just to break the monotony of the whiteness of everything. It depends how it looks/feels in-game, I guess.

It should definitely set the danger flag. Last thing we want is some player taking a nap in their tent/whatever and waking up (very) dead.

I think that there should be a short cooldown on the charged state if a player has just gotten there. The charged state of static should not only increase the danger, but increase the rewards as well. I think this also discourages players from turtling, since the risk/reward would be balanced well. What are your thoughts on that?

Oh, and I'm working on trying to make sheep 'bounce' a little bit when they walk. Fun stuff in those stategraphs. Commonstates.lua has a ton of useful reference material, too.

Edit: Having trouble making them bounce up and down, and walk (animation wise, anyways) at the same time, and still move out of the player's way... I'll leave the bounce state out for the moment.

Edited September 4, 2013 by debugman18

simplex · September 4, 2013

@debugman18I don't like the idea of hard cooldowns. I very much prefer having randomness as a base in all cases. And I settled on an implementation (which can, of course, be changed afterwards based on feedback): there will be two configurable parameters in rc.lua, average charged duration and average uncharged duration (as a measure of time, in seconds). An initial cooldown can be simulated through that. Then the code will build a discrete markov change from that and bounce between states accordingly.And about the animation, I don't think you'll be able to achieve that without editing animations.

Edited September 4, 2013 by simplex

simplex · September 4, 2013

Buuut, giving it a second thought, I think my stubbornness might create too many issues along the way. If we can't assume each static state will last a minimum amount of time, handling of the transitions (especially concerning animations) will become painful. So I'll implement a cooldown.And the core functionality of the static mechanic has already been implemented, by the way. There's no visible effect to it yet, but it's there.EDIT: I implemented a basic cooldown. The cooldown is not respected across reloading a save, because I didn't see much need to it. But I'm open to feedback on that.

Edited September 4, 2013 by simplex

simplex · September 4, 2013

I agree. Much more pleasing without the clock. That "Caves are a work in progress" is going to drive me crazy though.

Is that better?

Posted Image

Or would you prefer for me to just remove it?

And oh, since I'll deal with ambient color shortly because of the static mechanic, do you (all) think the default dusk ambient color is ideal for the uncharged state, or would you prefer something else?

Edited September 4, 2013 by simplex

TeoSS69 · September 4, 2013

And oh, since I'll deal with ambient color shortly because of the static mechanic, do you (all) think the default dusk ambient color is ideal for the uncharged state, or would you prefer something else?

I'd think it's better for the charged state since the clouds get darker.

simplex · September 4, 2013

I thought things were getting too easily lost in this thread. So I compiled a list of all links and images posted here.

Sadly, I couldn't post the images as actual images wrapped in spoiler tags, since there's a limit to images per post. :/

ArcticFox789

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debugman18

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lifemare

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simplex

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I attached the Perl script I wrote to compile this information.

thread_parse.zip

Edited September 4, 2013 by simplex

simplex · September 4, 2013

I'd think it's better for the charged state since the clouds get darker.

I was thinking even darker for the charged state. The color can be anything, it's not a choice from a preset. We can make the level pink if we want to.But yeah, I think a bit lighter for the uncharged state would be better. But not much, otherwise things like skyflies will be spoiled.

TeoSS69 · September 4, 2013

I was thinking even darker for the charged state. The color can be anything, it's not a choice from a preset. We can make the level pink if we want to.But yeah, I think a bit lighter for the uncharged state would be better. But not much, otherwise things like skyflies will be spoiled.

I still don't know how we'll explain always being dusk there. Unless the cloud level is inside a big cloud, instead of just being a plain cloud.

Craig_Perry · September 4, 2013

I still don't know how we'll explain always being dusk there. Unless the cloud level is inside a big cloud, instead of just being a plain cloud.

perhaps this is just the first layer within the cloud and (if more layers are added of course) as you go up it slowly becomes lighter

simplex · September 4, 2013

perhaps this is just the first layer within the cloud and (if more layers are added of course) as you go up it slowly becomes lighter

Exactly. And anyway, the clock doesn't show. The only indication of day phase is the brightness, and we can control that.

debugman18 · September 4, 2013

@debugman18
And about the animation, I don't think you'll be able to achieve that without editing animations.

I can give it the walking animation easily by specifying the animation of the sheep. ("walk_pre") ("walk_loop") ("walk_pst") etcetera. But I can't figure out how to make it move left/right while it's doing this, which moves it up:

inst.Physics:SetMotorVel(0,8+math.random()*8,0)

Basically I'm trying to get it to do a small updside down 'U'. A little hop, with the sheep's feet fluttering in the air. But I can't find anything else in the game that currently moves that way.

The second hurdle with that, is that if it is 'bouncing' then it will not move out of the players way. And because the bounce state runs with locomote, it seems to take precedence over near everything else.

Exactly. And anyway, the clock doesn't show. The only indication of day phase is the brightness, and we can control that.

So I think maybe a very slight increase in brightness. On higher levels, like it was said, those can be brighter.

I'm hoping on making some progress on the transformations for the sheep, now that static is implemented.

Edit: Okay, so I need to clean it up a little, but it works for the moment. I won't commit the changes until they work properly. Anyways, I'll let you decide for yourselves what to think of these before and after screenshots of our sheep friends.

Nothing much happening here. Silly sheep:

Posted Image

Oh god, oh my god, run away!

Posted Image

Edited September 4, 2013 by debugman18

lifemare · September 4, 2013

@debugman18 & @simplex:

I was going to remake the cloud crag texs but bumped into this when trying to load the latest git commit:

EDIT: PC HumbleBundle version 83996, no other mods running.

log.txt

Edited September 4, 2013 by lifemare

debugman18 · September 4, 2013

@debugman18 & @simplex:
I was going to remake the cloud crag texs but bumped into this when trying to load the latest git commit:

o.o

The latest commit runs fine for me... I'm currently debugging the sheep. They run in place when they turn into electric sheep. I'm not sure about the inner working of wicker, though. Maybe @simplex will be on soon to sort you out.

lifemare · September 4, 2013

That looks awesome, debugman!

Love that aura around the Rams. The only thing i'd say it's missing is sparks jumping out of them.

Would it be possible to add bright lines fizzing out of the fur sporadically?

Also, has the transformation from sheep to ram been texed already?

Want a hand with that, Willette?

In the eventual case that we add another level, we probably won't use another beanstalk to do it, since the climbable component could be attached to anything.

Definitely! I don't think having a beanstalk growing in the clouds is a good idea. Your monolith could work as levitation gateway (makes sense for a huge stone floating in the sky to have levitation anyway). Alternatively, a pillar of clouds (using the tentapillar atlas) or a small tornado.

You need to take better care of yourself, man! Take a break from coding once in a while and eat a carrot or something :^P

Edited September 4, 2013 by lifemare

TeoSS69 · September 4, 2013

I'm hoping on making some progress on the transformations for the sheep, now that static is implemented.

I specifically required the teen and mature beefalo models for their transformation animation. Have you guys ever seen it? It's like a wool explosion when it happens.

ArcticFox789 · September 4, 2013

I didn't miss much at school then? XD

Also, where can I grab the newest version? Is it on Git or do you keep the forum one updated? And if it is on Git, how the heck do I find it?

Ugh, this thread makes me feel so dumb... :3

TheDanaAddams · September 4, 2013

I thought things were getting too easily lost in this thread. So I compiled a list of all links and images posted here.
...

I attached the Perl script I wrote to compile this information.

It doesn't seem to have grabbed images uploaded direct to the forum.

(The only thing it pulled from me is a silly gif I linked from elsewhere.)

debugman18 · September 4, 2013

I didn't miss much at school then? XD

Also, where can I grab the newest version? Is it on Git or do you keep the forum one updated? And if it is on Git, how the heck do I find it?

Ugh, this thread makes me feel so dumb... :3

The link in the OP is the current Git version. Just download that, and extract its contents into a folder in your mods folder. So like, make an 'UpandAway' folder inside of Mods/ and drop the contents in there. However, changes that we make that aren't committed yet won't show up, so for instance, the sheep transformation isn't there yet. (Since I'm working on it on my local version of the mod.)

ArcticFox789 · September 4, 2013

The link in the OP is the current Git version. Just download that, and extract its contents into a folder in your mods folder. So like, make an 'UpandAway' folder inside of Mods/ and drop the contents in there. However, changes that we make that aren't committed yet won't show up, so for instance, the sheep transformation isn't there yet. (Since I'm working on it on my local version of the mod.)

Thanks. I thought as much.

Rabbitfist · September 4, 2013

man, you are working fast, time to give suggestions for tools and such

ArcticFox789 · September 4, 2013

Get excited.

http://forums.kleientertainment.com/index.php?/topic/27247-new-asset-tools-animations-textures-sounds-and-layouts/

SVGK · September 4, 2013

Get excited.

http://forums.kleientertainment.com/index.php?/topic/27247-new-asset-tools-animations-textures-sounds-and-layouts/

shinezzzzz....

Luggs · September 4, 2013

Get excited. http://forums.kleientertainment.com/index.php?/topic/27247-new-asset-tools-animations-textures-sounds-and-layouts/

Awesome.

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