Cave update doesn't tackle problems with caves

[-Variant]

This is absolutely a more rant-y-ish post than I like to do here, and I'll keep it quick.

Firstly, I want to note I think the new content looks utterly SICK. The mobs are so cool!! I'm stoked for them, but to say this update made caves as a whole better would be a lie.

The bridges are nice, but feel like a step that came in super late. I like the idea, but there's a lot more steps needing to be taken.
The repetitive biomes, cruddy overall generation, and a handful of more important issues with caves like lack of variety in most things just didn't get touched up with what all was shown.

It doesn't hurt that a lot of the content is also rift locked. I love rift content, but caves needed SOMETHING outside of rifts.
Aside from the absolutely awesome looking Worm Boss, the only real non-rift content we got to see in the cave update was... a rabbit trader on the surface! 

I'm excited for the new content but I really hope this doesn't mean the team is checking off 'cave update' on the to-do list, there's so many aspects about the caves that need improving upon.

[Keknutui]

1 minute ago, -Variant said:

Это, безусловно, более напыщенный пост, чем мне хотелось бы делать здесь, и я постараюсь сделать его быстрым.

Во-первых, я хочу отметить, что новый контент выглядит совершенно ОТВРАТИТЕЛЬНО. Мобы такие классные!! Я в восторге от них, но сказать, что это обновление сделало caves в целом лучше, было бы ложью.

Мосты хороши, но кажутся шагом, который был сделан слишком поздно. Мне нравится идея, но нужно предпринять еще много шагов.
Повторяющиеся биомы, неряшливое общее поколение и несколько более важных проблем с пещерами, таких как отсутствие разнообразия в большинстве вещей, просто не были затронуты тем, что было показано.

Не мешает, что большая часть контента также заблокирована в rift. Мне нравится контент rift, но caves нужно было ЧТО-ТО помимо rifts.
Помимо потрясающе выглядящего босса-червя, единственным реальным контентом, не относящимся к rift, который мы увидели в обновлении cave, был ... торговец кроликами на поверхности!

Я в восторге от нового контента, но я действительно надеюсь, что это не означает, что команда вычеркивает "обновление cave" из списка дел, в пещерах так много аспектов, которые нуждаются в улучшении.

It takes a beta to understand how they were changed. I hope for a real renovation of the caves in this update.

[BezKa]

At least it's not skill trees and the bridges aren't locked behind a character or something lol

 

[Radicaljoe]

Yeah, I was really disheartened when I saw that none of the lesser biomes were getting anything. Like, Guano biome hasn't been touched in years, could have been cool to add something new to those vast expanses of nothingness between ruins, atrium and bulb biome.

[Evelo]

2 minutes ago, -Variant said:

The repetitive biomes, cruddy overall generation, and a handful of more important issues with caves like lack of variety in most things just didn't get touched up with what all was shown.

Yep 100% this. Was really hoping for more than just 1 thing that separated each biome apart from each other. Other than the ruins, the Red Mushbiome is the only one with real identity given it is an excellent place to find Spilagmites.

Plus still hoping for maybe in the next patch, which I am guessing will be QoL focused with have a TOTAL world generation overhaul that is desperately needed imo.

[Shoe_fish_67]

Just now, BezKa said:

At least it's not skill trees and the bridges aren't locked behind a character or something lol

 

it should be lock behind wilson and only him can use it

[-Variant]

2 minutes ago, Radicaljoe said:

Like, Guano biome

Goodness, the like, 3 bloody MASSIVE poop biomes with... rocks. And poop!

2 minutes ago, Evelo said:

Other than the ruins, the Red Mushbiome is the only one with real identity given it is an excellent place to find Spilagmites.

Yeah, biome specific mobs/items/encounters. Something to make the many, many repeating biomes have something to them!

[Milordo]

1 minute ago, -Variant said:

snip

Agreed agreed. There is so much work to do in general in the game. This game really needs a touch-up of atleast 3 years. Anyway let's hope for the future of these forgotten caves.... 

I will let waters calm down and test but as I said in another post, I think I will suggest to put all the rabbit trader event in caves locked content. The more you think about it, the more it makes sense, the more it gives good pros for the game, caves and everybody!

[xhyom]

Honestly, it's kind of tiring that all the content is always more weapons to interact with the same old content. We have new weapons, but we never have a new place to explore. We have a new way to move around the caves, but why? There's absolutely nothing in 95% of this place. Speaking of which, is the location/how to find the new boss confirmed? If it's not in the caves swamp and is some kind of counterpart to the varglet for the caves, the problem continues and there's no reason to explore 

And that didn't even solve the portal problem either, so I activate the portal and get new problems and new weapons, so what? Wait for part 4 (5?) of the portal arc so it will make more sense? 

[Radicaljoe]

3 minutes ago, xhyom said:

Honestly, it's kind of tiring that all the content is always more weapons to interact with the same old content. We have new weapons, but we never have a new place to explore. We have a new way to move around the caves, but why? There's absolutely nothing in 95% of this place. Speaking of which, is the location/how to find the new boss confirmed? If it's not in the caves swamp and is some kind of counterpart to the varglet for the caves, the problem continues and there's no reason to explore 

And that didn't even solve the portal problem either, so I activate the portal and get new problems and new weapons, so what? Wait for part 4 (5?) of the portal arc so it will make more sense? 

I have bad news. it's "not" a boss. It's the depth worm wave equivalent of a varglet. They had all that empty cave to use and they didn't put the cool boss in it.

[Well-met]

the best update to the caves would be a redesign to the shard system so it doesn't feel like you're taking a gamble just trying to reach 75% of the game's content

[YouKnowWho]

I do hope they can at least take a look at the generation. Surely we could skim off just a little of our precious guano biomes to get an actual monkey village, right?

[xhyom]

4 minutes ago, Radicaljoe said:

I have bad news. it's "not" a boss. It's the depth worm wave equivalent of a varglet. They had all that empty cave to use and they didn't put the cool boss in it.

[Milordo]

14 minutes ago, xhyom said:

Honestly, it's kind of tiring that all the content is always more weapons to interact with the same old content. We have new weapons, but we never have a new place to explore. We have a new way to move around the caves, but why? There's absolutely nothing in 95% of this place. Speaking of which, is the location/how to find the new boss confirmed? If it's not in the caves swamp and is some kind of counterpart to the varglet for the caves, the problem continues and there's no reason to explore 

And that didn't even solve the portal problem either, so I activate the portal and get new problems and new weapons, so what? Wait for part 4 (5?) of the portal arc so it will make more sense? 

1) They confirmed that, strangely, it's not a new boss but a new animal/enemy that comes from depth worms waves. This is...very alarming. Not only because he's in waves and it's a routine (as we know the problems with waves...). Not only because for the potential destruction. But especially because (and I know the forum never think about this particular aspect of the game and I get it why).... m u l t i p l a y e r. What about when you play with a group? This will be hell. Also yeah, all the problems you said.

2) Welcome to the Klei train since 2021-ish or a little before. They're on the fighting band-wagon for so long and I'm always disgusted that I do not care and see the new weapons. I don't care. The game is unbalanced as hell already and they keep doing it instead of fixing and whatch the existing things. Why do you think all fighting things in the game are so hyper-meta in our modern times? And I despise it because this wasn't Don't Starve. It's not the sandbox I grew up.  Fighting is an aspect of Don't Starve, an element. Not ALL the game.

[chirsg]

7 minutes ago, Radicaljoe said:

I have bad news. it's "not" a boss. It's the depth worm wave equivalent of a varglet. They had all that empty cave to use and they didn't put the cool boss in it.

Varglet that wrecks your base with the insult to injury that there is no option to teleport in the caves. Love to see it

[Wormboi]

11 minutes ago, Milordo said:

They confirmed that, strangely, it's not a new boss but a new animal/enemy that comes from depth worms waves. This is...very alarming. Not only because he's in waves and it's a routine (as we know the problems with waves...). Not only because for the potential destruction. But especially because (and I know the forum never think about this particular aspect of the game and I get it why).... m u l t i p l a y e r. What about when you play with a group? This will be hell.

Not only that what if you fighting werepig/toadstool? Are you gonna get jumpscared by Bigwormboi? Or will the timer for that thing gets paused?

[nimzowitsch10]

unfortunately this is the step that klei is taking and no amount of complaint threads will change it. It's sad because every update becomes more qol, less content, and more changes that noone asked for.

[Anthony_L3hr]

It would've been so cool if the new Depth Worm variant could be found patrolling in certain biomes, eating some smaller mobs, maybe even an unfortunate bunnyman being gulped in a single bite. Instead of being a replacement for depth worm waves.

[Milordo]

Just now, Wormboi said:

Not only that what if you fighting werepig/toadstool? Are you gonna get jumpscared by Bigwormboi? Or will the timer for that thing gets pause?

OH MY GOD, I didn't even think about it! How it will interact with these bosses? It is a potential cheese or pure chaos? So many questions and potential dreams/nightmares..?

[xhyom]

Ok let's change it, it's not tiring, it's actually infuriating, even with the ancient trees they did this, they showed us a new idea that seemed to indicate the existence of an ancient/improved/mutated swamp, they create a boss that is literally an evolution of something you expect to find in the swamp and simply throw both ideas in random places because it seems like they can't commit to making something complete, as if each team was doing something separate and aren't communicating and in the end they just add whatever they made in some way. They could choose between putting this boss and the trees in any swamp in the caves, but they preferred to spread the ideas in completely out of place places, seriously? Get chests in the sea for ancient seeds? Was there really nothing more interesting to do with these trees? A MAGMA tree whose fruits are GEMS that are ABUNDANT in the caves. NOTHING? Is there no other idea more interesting than just a tree and that's it?

[WenericMember]

I feel like this update was teased poorly - it isn't a cave update. It's a shadow rift update with a small bit of caves QOL.

The main purpose of the update is to bring the amount of content available from shadow rifts on Par with the offerings of lunar rifts after host of horrors released 9 months ago. I think it was called a cave update to also encompass the non-rift content that got added.In that regard it's an OK update, Shadow rifts spent a long time behind Lunar rifts, but hopefully now that they've both got a decent set of content they'll focus on developing new/old areas to better highlight interactions between the two kinds of rifts.

[Mike23Ua]

Mimic creature should be before wild rifts, it’s such a silly challenge that no one who has actually ever opened rifts will ever be challenged by.

Klei seems to have a “balance problem” with DST Lunar Rifts are the same way..

Deadly Brightshades won’t ever be challenging to someone who kills CK and CC.

But for me? Personally.. it’s easier to get Brightshade Armor then it is fighting Pigmen for Pigskin to make Helmets and Hambats.

(the kiting pattern and A.I. for Pigmen lead you to getting smacked up far more often than a Brightshade vine will ever be challenging.)

That said- I’m extremely disappointed that “Cave Content Update” doesn’t actually add any new interesting biomes to the cave.

[Mysterious box]

42 minutes ago, Milordo said:

2) Welcome to the Klei train since 2021-ish or a little before. They're on the fighting band-wagon for so long and I'm always disgusted that I do not care and see the new weapons. I don't care. The game is unbalanced as hell already and they keep doing it instead of fixing and whatch the existing things. Why do you think all fighting things in the game are so hyper-meta in our modern times? And I despise it because this wasn't Don't Starve. It's not the sandbox I grew up.  Fighting is an aspect of Don't Starve, an element. Not ALL the game.

I know I'm gonna get flack for saying this not from you specifically but probably others and I say this as someone who has enjoyed the skill trees and refreshes quite a bit. The main reason dst is leaning so hard into combat is because characters are being designed in a way that trivializes content outside of combat. We have a character who can skip a good majority of the reason to make a boat, characters who ignore seasonal mechanics, characters who ignore limited time event restrictions, characters who ignore food systems, storage systems, bypass the follower system, and so on with so many abilities that trivialize so many aspects of the game the main universal improvement left becomes combat and even that is becoming trivialized as time goes on so now we're getting lots of weapons that are trying to play catch up and a system to weaken alternatives to refocus it. Basically power creep is pushing the survival out of don't starve together. 

[xhyom]

5 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

Deadly Brightshades won’t ever be challenging to someone who kills CK and CC.

But for me? Personally.. it’s easier to get Brightshade Armor then it is fighting Pigmen for Pigskin to make Helmets and Hambats.

As funny as it is, I actually think it's easier theoretically to get brightshade weapons if rifts are enabled by default because those plants have a VERY simple pattern. It's easier for me to get punched by a pig than to get slapped by that plant. If it's just one, then there's no chance. And I would use this new and powerful weapon to kill the pig that would punch me, which is kind of what's left at this point in the game, where you did everything to open those rifts for some reason

[chincer]

at this point we need a way that isnt setting related to activate rifts before killing the supposedly laike game bosses, since so much content is gear behind them.

also we need more stuff to do around each cave biome, when was the last time anyone was "im going to go find the cave swamp!" at the very least make hutch always spawn there? as an immovable glowthorn tree?