[Game Update] - 599141

[IAmAFurrz]

9 hours ago, Reecitz said:

This sort of selective behavior is quite odd to say the least, and it may confuse people when they notice lureplants block one giant yet they don't block another. Personally, I ask for Klei to fully commit to a philosophy: either lureplants work for all, allowing people to have options to complete objectives like a sandbox game people claim this game is, or lureplants work for none, giving us a true idea of how they want to balance the game while encouraging people to either engage in the content or get more creative with the tools in their disposal. 

i heard they said theyll keep the cheese until they get to reworking the bosses from older content so you wouldnt even want to cheese them cuz honestly fw fight is has such stupid mechanics working against the player, like structures blocking your mouse clicks to attack faster/attack wovens or even nm creature rng, whether they disappear after you became sane or not being such a problem and can potentially just last the entire fight. i play wigfrid and she truly does make even this god awful fight fun, but its unfun as literally anyone else

[IAmAFurrz]

5 hours ago, arubaro said:

Controller should be changed before drastic changes but i don't see why a company would like to keep these AI bugs just because there is a bunch of lazy players that dont want to make the effort of learning how to beat their content with any of their multiple tools that make it easier 

 

usually i dont like throwing this card around but: hello. player with 6k hours here. literally this (aside from ck) is the only fight i really, REALLY do not enjoy ever. the main reason why i never reset ruins is bc of this awful fight. spent like 50 hours learning this fight, did it once, that world got corrupted, then everytime i get to the fight i have to practice again bc the small margin of error of the fight is mostly due to the statues/pillars in arena (also affects weather pains tragectory), plus nm creature rng mechanic, as well as wovens healing for 750 per. i never get to enjoy the fight without doing some other boring way bc if i do it properly its gonna drain my resources or time, with practice and whatnot. nowadays i either play wigfrid or just use lureplant bc that fight seriously needs a rework. just bc you know and can fight it doesnt mean others' opinions have to align with yours because 'they're lazy'

2 hours ago, Cruvimaster said:

Maxwell exists

period. maxwell's prison cage existing just makes all bosses become like every other mob. its also another way you can replicate the dumb lureplant cheese ANYWAY

8 minutes ago, Faintly Macabre said:

Why do people want to announce to everybody that they can't finish arguments they started?

he shutdown the argument, clearly he won 

Edited March 20 by IAmAFurrz
sounded mean, dont want to make enemies on forums (even tho it is true)

[Copyafriend]

20 minutes ago, Faintly Macabre said:

It's absolutely not a "totally separate discussion"; the end result is pretty much the same. And watching people cackle with glee as other people lose things they enjoy, I don't feel particularly bad for not being super nice about it.

No one is “cackling with joy” at an exploit being patched. You should not take a bug being patched; however useful it may be, personally. Its fine that you enjoy it.

 

If you think bugs and console commands are the same then you have lost nothing, simply use c_godmode() and hold f to win. If that doesn’t feel satisfying, then set up the things you used to use, spawn the boss and kill it with console commands. Its the same effect.

if you still don’t like it, then you need to understand that using the exploits to kill a boss is no less “cheating” (in quotation marks because it’s a single player game so who cares) than using console commands to kill the boss. It just gives a false sense of legitimacy because you never opened the cheat menu and only used “game mechanics” that killed the boss for you. 

again to reiterate, i do not care if you do use it, but if you’re going to pretend that its a cheat code then just use the actual built in cheat codes.

But if you want to return to reality for a minute, understand that its entirely up to a developer whether or not to patch an exploit, and that you liking an exploit is not a good reason to keep it. Skyrim isn’t exactly a good example of a well made game that kept its exploits. Klei specified that they’re going to unpatch it because they want to fix fuelweaver before removing the exploit, not because the exploit inherently has merit.

[arubaro]

10 minutes ago, IAmAFurrz said:

usually i dont like throwing this card around but: hello. player with 6k hours here. literally this (aside from ck) is the only fight i really, REALLY do not enjoy ever. the main reason why i never reset ruins is bc of this awful fight. spent like 50 hours learning this fight, did it once, that world got corrupted, then everytime i get to the fight i have to practice again bc the small margin of error of the fight is mostly due to the statues/pillars in arena (also affects weather pains tragectory), plus nm creature rng mechanic, as well as wovens healing for 750 per. i never get to enjoy the fight without doing some other boring way bc if i do it properly its gonna drain my resources or time, with practice and whatnot. nowadays i either play wigfrid or just use lureplant bc that fight seriously needs a rework. just bc you know and can fight it doesnt mean others' opinions have to align with yours because 'they're lazy'

I agree that the fight is really hard. It took me a bunch of time to start beating him (not even doing it well..) but things are changing, we have more perks, more buffs, better ways of farming materials, more damage to fight him or to fight the staff needed to beat him easily, we get moon gear, etc 

Something being hard doesnt mean it should also be free or have bugs (he doesnt even trigger his shield...)

 

Pd. This is a game about gathering resources and crafting items, ofc fighting a boss will drain your materials and items

Edited March 20 by arubaro

[Cheggf]

  

14 hours ago, V2C said:

Lureplants can now be trampled by creatures that can trample through obstacles and structures.

:steamhappy::steamhappy::steamhappy::steamhappy:

11 hours ago, V2C said:

We are likely going to change the Lureplant fix to only affect the newer content.

:steamsad::steamsad::steamsad::steamsad:

[cropo]

3 minutes ago, Copyafriend said:

Skyrim isn’t exactly a good example of a well made game that kept its exploits.

Why not? It's an open world Sandbox like Don't Starve is. Street Fighter became as popular as it was today because they rolled with an exploit, GunZ Online when it was around became an absolute juggernaut when sword canceling, an exploit, completely lifted the game from obscurity.  Grand Chase for a time had a competitive scene because of an exploit found in dashing, that was later incorporated into future characters base kits because of how much it made the game better. 

 

There are tons, tons of games that have kept or adapted unintended exploits for the betterment of the game/sandbox environment.  Don't Starve has always had an absurdist mockery in its artwork and style that perfectly matches the idea that an avatar of pure evil can be killed with a bunch of plants, it's in Don't Starve's blood.

[IAmAFurrz]

4 minutes ago, arubaro said:

I agree that the fight is really hard. It took me a bunch of time to start beating him (not even doing it well..) but things are changing, we have more perks, more buffs, better ways of farming materials, more damage to fight him or to fight the staff needed to beat him easily, we get moon gear, etc 

Something being hard doesnt mean it should also be free or have bugs (he doesnt even trigger his shield...)

rn, plenty of characters do not have skill trees, and the brightshade staff is god damn expensive thatll take extra waiting after already having beaten CC for surface rift

i know there is a fine balance thats reachable with the games difficulty and the enjoyment of fights, but there are so many mechanics in the game that completely makes me not want to participate in the fight at all

[mykenception]

30 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

Same Rules apply to video games, you’ll play the way the developers want you to and you’re gonna like it. (Or stop playing) 

Isn't this a sandbox game? where your creativity is rewarded?

saying you have to play this way so you can have fun is rather constricting. 

Strict RP-only servers exist but not everyone enjoys it. Forcing players to play a specific way and cut off other "it would be fun if this also works" moments is just awful. But yeah, you don't really approve of other playstyles which isn't surprising that you also have this take.

Klei also made it clear that they don't plan on caging other players' methods even if it does involve bugs. 

[Mike23Ua]

2 minutes ago, mykenception said:

Isn't this a sandbox game? where your creativity is rewarded?

saying you have to play this way so you can have fun is rather constricting. 

Strict RP-only servers exist but not everyone enjoys it. Forcing players to play a specific way and cut off other "it would be fun if this also works" moments is just awful. But yeah, you don't really approve of other playstyles which isn't surprising that you also have this take.

Klei also made it clear that they don't plan on caging other players' methods even if it does involve bugs. 

“Sandbox” does not translate to- “What the player can do is limited to their own creativity”

Because I can go through a rather exhaustive list of Sandbox games that have indeed been patched/changed based on what players were doing that the developers did not ever intend for them to be able to do.

7 Days to Die, Minecraft, Ark Survival Evolved, GTA V, the list goes on and on.. but the point is that the player actually IS limited to what they can do because if the devs don’t want you doing it, they’ll stop you from doing it.

Rather that’s patching a bug, or updating old mechanics, or adding new content that directly opposes whatever you were doing.

Sandbox has never = there are no rules I can do what I want.

[cropo]

Just now, Mike23Ua said:

7 Days to Die, Minecraft, Ark Survival Evolved, GTA V

All PVP oriented, "competitive" games, GTA V mostly because Rockstar has real incentive to nerf exploits that give the players a way to farm money to push them into buying their Shark Cards.

[arubaro]

8 minutes ago, IAmAFurrz said:

rn, plenty of characters do not have skill trees, and the brightshade staff is god damn expensive thatll take extra waiting after already having beaten CC for surface rift

i know there is a fine balance thats reachable with the games difficulty and the enjoyment of fights, but there are so many mechanics in the game that completely makes me not want to participate in the fight at all

Everything feels expensive if the fight can be beaten for free and everything will feel difficult if you can be afk and receive the (numerous) rewards...

Is fine if you dont enjoy the fighting aspect of the game but that doesnt justifies a boss being defeated by staying afk. I dont enjoy football games but wont ask to devs to keep a bug that allow me to score without playing

8 minutes ago, mykenception said:

Isn't this a sandbox game? where your creativity is rewarded?

There is no creativity to copy a youtube video to defeat a boss by standing still

[Copyafriend]

1 minute ago, Faintly Macabre said:

Bro, it happened on the literal first page, and many, many times since. I can't blame you if you don't want to read the entire thread but at least don't be so certain of its contents.

People being happy an exploit being fixed are not “cackling with joy” they can find it annoying without being a personal attack on people who use it.

secondly you never addressed me dismantling your claim that the exploit is a “cheat code”

3 minutes ago, Faintly Macabre said:

Not one person who cheeses this boss thinks they legitimately killed it. Not one.

This is either a lie or vastly misunderstanding the situation. Many people see exploits as perfectly valid ways to play. In other words they see it as not cheating. Its cheating. But who cares if someone wants to use console commands to beat the boss? My problem is that the reason many people defend it is because they see it as a valid and unique way of killing the boss, as if its not the boss walking at an indestructible wall for 30 minutes while being chipped away until it dies. Real dynamic gameplay there.

6 minutes ago, Faintly Macabre said:

Also a big portion of the people for whom this fight is a problem are console players, who don't have access to the console PC users do.

I’m sure, and klei has said they’re gonna work on the fight and it will be unpatched for now. Its reasonable to have trouble if the fight isnt designed with controllers

But that and your quote don’t really explain why you’ve went out of the way to bite and snap at every person who goes “i agree with this being patched”. They said they’re leaving it unpatched for now. They said they’re gonna work on it and come back, it seems like a settled thing that YOU agree with, why are you arguing then?

2 minutes ago, cropo said:

All PVP oriented, "competitive" games, GTA V mostly because Rockstar has real incentive to nerf exploits that give the players a way to farm money to push them into buying their Shark Cards.

The only game in this that’s “pvp oriented” is GTA V. Ark and minecraft having pvp as an option does not make it pvp oriented. And i have never seen anyone play 7 days to die pvp without it being the entire focus of that server.

[cropo]

3 minutes ago, arubaro said:

There is no creativity to copy a youtube video to defeat a boss by standing still

It is a community discovered thing, this game ran on that for a long time. You don't have to be the one to invent it to see its creativity and use it yourself.

[Cheggf]

15 minutes ago, Faintly Macabre said:

Bro, it happened on the literal first page, and many, many times since. I can't blame you if you don't want to read the entire thread but at least don't be so certain of its contents.

Not one person who cheeses this boss thinks they legitimately killed it. Not one. Also a big portion of the people for whom this fight is a problem are console players, who don't have access to the console PC users do.

And this isn't even about me; I made my personal feelings about their decisions pretty clear.

Why are you acting like an exploit being patched is a personal attack on you? It's just a glitch.

[cropo]

22 minutes ago, Copyafriend said:

The only game in this that’s “pvp oriented” is GTA V. Ark and minecraft having pvp as an option does not make it pvp oriented. And i have never seen anyone play 7 days to die pvp without it being the entire focus of that server.

The ability to walk around and kill anyone you want is a significant part of why people play most of those games, allowing exploits that let another human player insta-kill you, or gather end-game resources to raid your base in a few minutes would cause actual damage to the games.

 

A player planting a bunch of lureplants and sitting at fuelweaver for 30 minutes does not damage ANYONE's experience, there is no comparison between fixing exploits in games with competitive incentives and a harmless bug that a player has to purposefully perform and willingly consent to spending 30 minutes sitting there to do. 

 

If this bug stays:

No one is affected, allegedly Klei looks like a fool in the eyes of players looking up DST videos. Like, the first video they're going to see is a lureplant farm video, and immediately go ''Wow this game sucks, it's so unpolished" and never delve into the game or look into it any further. But being real here, no one is affected.

 

If this bug is patched:

You guys aren't affected, players who enjoyed using it are. All for some ideal of this noblese oblige developers seem to be bound to, thinly veiled ideals that players should be punished for getting a ''cheap victory" which you can practically smell from the majority of ''pro-fix'' posts, and what else? What is gained? Nothing. 

It's a net-negative to remove a harmless glitch that a player has to willingly consent to do, and enforce a certain playstyle on them. Opening up the console is NOT the same as making your own personal goldberg-machine to simulate an automated process. I could just type in a cheat code in Minecraft to get 3billion EXP, the process of making a mob-kill farm is more engaging than that and removing it would make the game far more obnoxious.

This isn't fixing a glitch with Honey Production, it's not fixing longstanding glitches that are still in the game and hinder the experience, this is a specifically targeted update to fix a problem that did not affect anyone unless they wanted it to affect them, and made the game more fun for them. This fix is not in the spirit of fixing flaws and polishing the game, it is SPECIFICALLY to deny a choice on the players part, telling them that it's not okay. I have a problem with that, this is a hollow and lifeless bugfix purely targeted at a specific group of people for no good reason. The reason people are assuming malice on "pro fix" people are because the only logical explanation for such an aggressive stance on such a harmless bug is the desire to finger-wag others into playing a certain way. All this talk about polish and other nonsense just doesn't really feel genuine, we know why you guys want it fixed.

Edited March 20 by cropo

[grm9]

15 minutes ago, Cheggf said:

Why are you acting like an exploit being patched is a personal attack on you? It's just a glitch

because they'll be unable to enjoy the game the way they previously did because of that

[Skyscale]

13 hours ago, Catuna_ said:

if there's a will there's a way.

Next target locked.

[Mike23Ua]

1 minute ago, grm9 said:

because they'll be unable to enjoy the game the way they previously did because of that

This is a Farcry, lmao like I legit don’t mean to be rude.. but I legitimately stopped playing as some of my favorite characters in DST before they got their Reworks, Because I did not want to get used to and fall and love with the way they played NOW only for Klei to change that later..

And now, we’re doing that all over again with skill trees *sarcastic yay* 

I legit worried the “Nerf her to the Ground!” Crowd would win during Wickerbottoms rework and she would be less enjoyable for me.

you over here talking about a small lureplant glitch, meanwhile I’m watching the entire game change before my eyes.

Stun-lock No eyed deer & Mactusk? Yeah no we can’t do that anymore..

So from my point of view- Your lureplant glitch is just as much “game” as any other change Klei has ever made.

[cropo]

1 minute ago, Mike23Ua said:

but I legitimately stopped playing as some of my favorite characters in DST before they got their Reworks, Because I did not want to get used to and fall and love with the way they played NOW only for Klei to change that later..

A fair criticism shared by many people.

2 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

And now, we’re doing that all over again with skill trees *sarcastic yay* 

Skill trees are optional and only add onto the character, I don't think any of them remove something from a character, unless we're talking their negative quirks.

3 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

you over here talking about a small lureplant glitch, meanwhile I’m watching the entire game change before my eyes.

Something a lot of players(not a majority, I think) are also disappointed in.

4 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

So from my point of view- Your lureplant glitch is just as much “game” as any other change Klei has ever made.

Fair enough, but that doesn't exclude the ability to argue in favor of it's preservation in that case. 

[Catuna_]

7 minutes ago, Skyscale said:

Next target locked.

Chances are they're keeping this, and reverting the lureplant change for older content until they get to revamping/improving older content.

[_zwb]

4 hours ago, Cruvimaster said:

It is at least shameful for a developer to openly accept that there are serious flaws in the programming

Funnily enough it's impossible to write any code without bugs, you have to admit that your code is bugged, and honestly it's nothing to be ashamed about, recognising the issue is the first step of fixing it.

[O Prea]

It would be interesting to use Embalming Spritz on the marble trees we planted, so we could leave them at an desirable stage.

[Cruvimaster]

5 minutes ago, _zwb said:

Funnily enough it's impossible to write any code without bugs, you have to admit that your code is bugged, and honestly it's nothing to be ashamed about, recognising the issue is the first step of fixing it.

Yes, you're right. But I wasn't referring to the fact of having errors in development, but rather knowing about their existence and not taking measures to repair them. That's what I meant. 
 

[_zwb]

2 minutes ago, Cruvimaster said:

Yes, you're right. But I wasn't referring to the fact of having errors in development, but rather knowing about their existence and not taking measures to repair them. That's what I meant. 
 

But they are taking measures right now? Maybe not for the fuel weaver fight but V2C said they will fix those boss fights later?

[Cruvimaster]

6 minutes ago, _zwb said:

But they are taking measures right now? Maybe not for the fuel weaver fight but V2C said they will fix those boss fights later?

Yes, and I already said this in a previous comment here.