[Game Update] - 516063

[maxwell_winters]

2 minutes ago, HowlVoid said:

What if the book required Glommer's flower instead of the iridescent gem. 

Not really, the cost is still too low and people would be pissed if someone joins the server and kills Glommer. Besides, Glommer isn't actually a lunar creature, he just happens to spawn on the full moon. 

[Owlrust]

The richest person in a server is gonna be the Wickerbottom with 2 Lunar Grimoires, Bone Armor, and a Celestial Crown.

[Spino43]

6 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

What I mean to say is Wortox can be everywhere.. simultaneously all at once- All you need is a bunch of souls, or bundled stacks of creatures to kill for souls and Wortox can effectively “Blink” around the entire game map to burn each and every players base down.

If I was playing PvP Wortox would be the only character i would pick from that point forward.

PvP is meant to fight and defeat other players, at that point it's not even griefing, it's just gaining advantage.

And I doubt Klei even cares about PvP balance at this point.

Now, I don't know if Wortox can teleport to areas that are unexplored (probably no), but if no then he still has to travel around until he can find the base itself. And if there's already a beacon for the base (any moonlens, Ocuvigil, Orb,...), any character can just be able to walk there and destroy the base.

You are making Wortox like the ultimate griefer and OP when in reality it's not really anywhere near that level.

[HowlVoid]

5 minutes ago, maxwell_winters said:

Not really, the cost is still too low and people would be pissed if someone joins the server and kills Glommer. Besides, Glommer isn't actually a lunar creature, he just happens to spawn on the full moon. 

As apposed to people being angry for stealing all three iridescent gems?

Glommer being a lunar creature is irrelevant, the flower only blooms during full moon moonlight, so it must absorb it's energy. Iridescent gems are similar in that regard.

Edited July 21, 2022 by HowlVoid

[maxwell_winters]

4 minutes ago, HowlVoid said:

As apposed to people being angry for stealing all three iridescent gems?

Glommer being a lunar creature is irrelevant, the flower only blooms during full moon moonlight, so it must absorb it's energy. Iridescent gems are similar in that regard.

In any case, it doesn't solve the issue I had with the previous recipe. Except for "go to the mosaic biome and craft a powerful item", it is "wait 10 days, go to the deciduous and craft a powerful item. Effort ≠ the reward..  

Edited July 21, 2022 by maxwell_winters

[HowlVoid]

6 minutes ago, maxwell_winters said:

In any case, it doesn't solve the issue I had with the previous recipe. Except for "go to the mosaic biome and craft a powerful item", it is "wait 10 days, go to the deciduous and craft a powerful item. Effort ≠ the reward..  

Go day one to the archives and take the two iridescent gems already there? Lol

As I stated already this is more about CONTROL, this is people's number 1 problem with the book, griefing. This change makes the griefing possibilities with the book GREATER than they were, do you realize that? 

Glommer can be taken somewhere and keep Wicker from crafting the book period. This means people can fight the shadow pieces without fearing what wicker is up to. Rather than make backup gems, someone keep track of the gems and/or doing multiple moon events because Wicker is up to no good.

Edited July 21, 2022 by HowlVoid

[maxwell_winters]

3 minutes ago, HowlVoid said:

Go day one to the archives and take the two iridescent gems already there? Lol

I suggested about 3 times in this topic to make those 2 gems unpickable. 

Besides, we shouldn't focus fully on griefing on public servers that much, or we'll get a castrated survival game where everything is overly safe. 

Edited July 21, 2022 by maxwell_winters

[PuffinBy]

Cool! Now, nerf the rain book. 

[Mike23Ua]

8 minutes ago, HowlVoid said:

As apposed to people being angry for stealing all three iridescent gems?

Glommer being a lunar creature is irrelevant, the flower only blooms during full moon moonlight, so it must absorb it's energy. Iridescent gems are similar in that regard.

I kinda like the idea of putting the spotlight onto more obscure game content, for example, what if to get the blueprint for this book the player needed to first find & Unlock Shadow Chester (filling each of Chester’s inventory slots with nightmare fuel then waiting until Full Moon) then once the Additional storage slots are open for chester the Wicker player can store Lunar Mothwings inside fill up its inventory with them, which: just like trading Pearl empty bottles granting the player Bundle of Thanks, would grant the play this book instead.

However- it doesn’t match up with her quote of exploring the Archives, so it seems Klei ACTUALLY intends for you to go to archives and “politely burrow” the Opals that are there.

Otherwise- just lock the craft behind a scroll Wicker can find and read in Archives

[xxXolot]

Like the other thread suggested, I think using the "distilled knowledge" (Edit: or the Astral Detector suggest from other thread!) item is actually the best ingredient..

• Requires you to actually do the moon staff event first rather than just stealing gems
• No risk of iridescent gems stealing due to book because need all 3 to activate Archive
• More yellow gem for other players to use, there will be no wasting on yellow gem just for either the Archive Switch or the Book.
• Actually require people to go to Archive, which fit her quote even better then iridescent gem as ingredient (it's the literal knowledge!), because one doesn't actually have to go to Archive it they make iridescent gem from staff, which made the quote a bit weird in that case.

Edited July 21, 2022 by xxXolot

[HowlVoid]

1 minute ago, Mike23Ua said:

 

In that case I'd prefer if it was distilled knowledge instead. 

Edited July 21, 2022 by HowlVoid

[maxwell_winters]

3 minutes ago, xxXolot said:

Like the other thread suggested, I think using the "distilled knowledge" item is actually the best ingredient..

• Requires you to actually do the moon staff event first rather than just stealing gems
• No risk of iridescent gems stealing due to book because need all 3 to activate Archive
• More yellow gem for other players to use, there will be no wasting on yellow gem just for either the Archive Switch or the Book.
• Actually require people to go to Archive, which fit her quote even better then iridescent gem as ingredient (it's the literal knowledge!), because one doesn't actually have to go to Archive it they make iridescent gem from staff, which made the quote a bit weird in that case.

If you already unlocked archives, at this point it would be just easier to unlock everything you need in archives and get the gem back or even all three (again, two initial gems shouldn't be pickable imo). 

Edited July 21, 2022 by maxwell_winters

[Arcwell]

Just now, maxwell_winters said:

If you already unlocked archives, at this point it would be just easier to unlock everything you need in archives and pick up a gem or even all three.  

I thought you didn't want us picking up gems?  

[maxwell_winters]

Just now, Arcwell said:

I thought you didn't want us picking up gems?  

Only two gems that are already spawned with the world. I don't mind if the third one would be pickable.

[Duck986]

7 minutes ago, xxXolot said:

Like the other thread suggested, I think using the "distilled knowledge" item is actually the best ingredient..

• Requires you to actually do the moon staff event first rather than just stealing gems
• No risk of iridescent gems stealing due to book because need all 3 to activate Archive
• More yellow gem for other players to use, there will be no wasting on yellow gem just for either the Archive Switch or the Book.
• Actually require people to go to Archive, which fit her quote even better then iridescent gem as ingredient (it's the literal knowledge!), because one doesn't actually have to go to Archive it they make iridescent gem from staff, which made the quote a bit weird in that case.

I dunno, some players said that currently it will be easier to do moonstorm event instead. Idk how true is it, but if it is - there's not a lot of sense in replacing it with distilled knowledge. Yes, griefing probability will be lowered, but you still need to start archives, so...

Edited July 21, 2022 by Duck986

[PetulantPansy]

Really depends on if you guys want to nerf the book. The full moon book is really useful in the early/mid game. Once you activate the archives and are just a few steps removed from activating semi-permanent moonstorms, the usefulness of the book is greatly diminished. 

 

At the same time, woodie is left on the sidelines this entire time. Early moon storms in the game can be fairly deadly for him so I suppose there are reasons to nerf it. 

[xxXolot]

4 minutes ago, maxwell_winters said:

If you already unlocked archives, at this point it would be just easier to unlock everything you need in archives and pick up a gem or even all three.  

But if the "distilled knowledge" item is the recipe, you can do absolutely same thing, and even better because you don't have to deactivate the Archive. What if there are other people who want the blueprint after the gem is taken because they are offline? Now they will need to the the staff event 3 time lol.. sucks

Edited July 21, 2022 by xxXolot

[maxwell_winters]

3 minutes ago, xxXolot said:

But if the "distilled knowledge" item is the recipe, you can do absolutely same thing, and even better because you don't have to deactivate the Archive. What if there are other people who want the blueprint after the gem is taken because they are offline? Now they will need to the the staff event 3 time lol.. sucks

Yeah, but the "distilled knowledge" isn't general knowledge. As you pick it up from colored fountains, each only has 1 recipe stored in them. In other words, those are just 3 fancy blueprints you need to decipher, two of which has little to do with the moon. 
 

I didn't express myself clear. I want the pre-spawn 2 gems to be unpickable but the one you need to install yourself should be pickable. 

[xxXolot]

1 hour ago, Duck986 said:

I dunno, some players said that currently it will be easier to do moonstorm event instead. Idk how true is it, but if it is - there's not a lot of sense in replacing it with distilled knowledge. Yes, griefing probability will be lowered, but you still need to start archives, so...

That is absolutely not true, you need archive turned on AND find the archive moon altar pieces with detector AND bring them to lunar island AND max Pearl friendship AND defeat pearled crab king AND bring his drop to lunar island too, just to activate moonstorm event. That's quite different then just archive turned on.

 

1 hour ago, PetulantPansy said:

Once you activate the archives and are just a few steps removed from activating semi-permanent moonstorms, the usefulness of the book is greatly diminished. the usefulness of the book is greatly diminished.

A few BIG steps like what I say, I think the lunar book sit right there in between perfectly.

Edited July 21, 2022 by xxXolot

[Noaa]

Thank you for the changes Klei. I love the Wicker changes. 

I do prefer the cost being an iridescent gem to the 2 moon rocks of before. If Klei wants to change the recipe again like a goldilocks situation it might need to happen. One recipe too cheap. One recipe too expensive. Maybe they can find something in the middle. Though I do not personally mind the iridescent gem being use in the crafting cost. 

I'm so happy for the Arachnophobia book changes. I think it's good enough that it can be experimented with for various things. 

The bee book changes seem pretty balanced. 16 should be enough for boss fights. 

I'm very happy for the Maxwell changes since it does ensure that Wicker is preferable to read the books. I don't really think it was needed given the state of Maxwell. But it does protect Wicker for when Maxwell's refresh does come out. 

I still would like to see Tempering Temperatures buffed to interact with the thermal stone or to just pause your temperature for a while.

And for Horticulture Abridged and Horticulture Expanded to be changed to affect 9 crops and 18 crops respectively. 

Thank you so much for the work Klei I'm loving the refresh. 

[-Nick-]

The iredecent gem nerf isnt a big deal. The book itself makes it easier to get opals. 

The bookcase also repairs books, making it actually have infinate uses.

Edited July 21, 2022 by Nickolai

[Well-met]

2 hours ago, ShadowDuelist said:

This is absolutely horrible. Let me explain why:

1) this book although it was strong, its not THAT powerful to require an opal gem to craft. I think requiring 2 lunar moths is more than enough nerf for it, if preventing early game abuse was the point.

2) this will make Wickerbottoms now rush for the archives, steal the free opals and curse the world so they have to make the lunar event THREE TIMES just to start the quest there

3) Without stealing the original 2 free opal gems, a book this expensive will most likely never be crafted: the materials come too late for it to be effective, you'd just do better going all the way to activate the moonstorm event.

Please review this (IMO very poorly thought suggestion) and just make it 2 moon moths only instead. Or add 5 moon stones and 5 moon moths, doesn't matter, just remove opal gem from it. keeping it at this price is the same as effectively removing the book altogether.

can't you just repair the books? you probably don't need to craft more than one for an entire run.

[maxwell_winters]

20 minutes ago, PetulantPansy said:

Once you activate the archives and are just a few steps removed from activating semi-permanent moonstorms, the usefulness of the book is greatly diminished. 

Could you stop comparing peaceful full moon nights of Lunar Grimoire with a total mess that moonstorms are? 

Edited July 21, 2022 by maxwell_winters

[Arcwell]

2 minutes ago, Well-met said:

can't you just repair the books? you probably don't need to craft more than one for an entire run.

2 is required to have permanent full moon uptime, plus another if you're holding one in your inventory (and thus not letting it recover).

Not necessary, sure, but 2-3 is definitely preferred.

[Ohan]

Not sure about the Grimoire change but thanks a bunch for all the other changes keli. Who knew the hort books not growing nanas/avocados fully would turn out to be a bug?  

Any chance the End is Nigh will get any changes? Anything to make it more useful

Many people suggested the grimoire should require an opal basically as soon as the beta dropped. But most eventually came to the conclusion that this would too exorbitant. 

The grimoire is stuck between the actual gameplay power of it being very moderate but the “lore” implications/world altering aspect of it being huge. 

Without big laborious setups the full moon itself wont provide u much besides above ground light and glommer sacrifices. <- this does not justify an opal. But the “idea” of being able to summon a full moon does, if u get what i mean… 

having the effect somehow be localized wouldve perhaps solved everything, just a concentrated beam of moonlight in a big area instead of the world altering ability to summon the real full moon. Several people have suggested this as well. But i can imagine this would be hard to implement. 

Eeh… *shrugs* 

Edited July 21, 2022 by Ohan