Randomness in this game is what kills the fun

[Cheggf]

2 hours ago, Mike23Ua said:

That’s only people on PC who open the games files and look into its programming code- but I’d bet you 9 votes out of 10 anyone playing on Xbox, Playstation or Nintendo who can’t look at the games files to tell that would vote that Meters do indeed move.

Yeah. I just said that people incorrectly think they move. People on PC think they move too. It's probably less than 1% of the people who play on PC that actually look at the game files, I don't know why you always act like it's such a ubiquitous thing.

[SmallBirdHungry]

Well it just seems like if you want to speedrun some things you need to rely on getting lucky, and this is true for MANY speedruns of many games. It's just a risk you'll have to accept if you want to do stuff faster than the devs probably expected.

You could also turn things to more in world settings to increase your chances?

[sudoku]

Im sure there are many responses echoing what im about to write at this point, but if there was no randomness, and id argue there should be more randomness - like random seasonal variants (mild, normal, harsh), things would be incredibly stale. Randomness injects uncertainty in a scenario where after youve experienced it for the first time you know exactly how it'll go. It keeps you on your feet and adds far more replayabilty than if it were gone.

[reallychina]

13 minutes ago, sudoku said:

Im sure there are many responses echoing what im about to write at this point, but if there was no randomness, and id argue there should be more randomness - like random seasonal variants (mild, normal, harsh), things would be incredibly stale. Randomness injects uncertainty in a scenario where after youve experienced it for the first time you know exactly how it'll go. It keeps you on your feet and adds far more replayabilty than if it were gone.

Seasonal variants sound awesome (maybe paired with some bonuses like extra items on harsh - higher gem chance from ice/fire hounds, more ice from ice blocks, more cactus from cactuses, better tusk and tam chance from walrus etc).

 

My gripe is with RNG that doesnt add anything to the game except "walk more". Walking more doesn't keep you on your feet or anything.... you just waste time walking more.

[sudoku]

14 minutes ago, reallychina said:

My gripe is with RNG that doesnt add anything to the game except "walk more". Walking more doesn't keep you on your feet or anything.... you just waste time walking more.

I guess it depends on how you look at it. I find the wilderness exploration aspect probably the most fun in this game, and so without rng, and say the pig king, biomes and caves etc generated the same way everytime, id have probably stopped playing long ago. But if you simply just want to skip ahead to already knowing where you want to base and prepare for boss fights then i can see how rng might not be your favorite. 

At the end of the day i dont think the rng in this game is overdone or detracts from the game. Theres always setting the worldgen landmass setting to tiny if walking too much is taking away from your gameplay experience.

 

 

[Octohunter777]

On 5/15/2022 at 7:09 AM, kNichael said:

Alright, first of all, I am writing this as a result to my salt levels reaching an all time high, but I also wanted to share my thoughts about this topic and get it out of the way.

The game can be fun and all that, but because of the sheer randomness and the punishment you get for not being lucky enough to get x thing in your world in that specific time can either make or break your world, this is more or less leaning towards boss rushes but I think that some of it might apply to other ways of playing, so feel free to disagree, I don't intend to create any heated arguments, I just want to express myself.

This is all from personal experience, so I have some very specific examples to back up my claim.

I'm playing Wanda and I want to rush the ruins in autumn and I need marble to make my alarming clock and another ageless watch, while gathering materials I am also searching for marble sculptures, more than half of the world is explored, tough luck buddy, seems that the clock is ticking and you still haven't found your precious marble, looks like you will have to rely on the earthquakes to drop your marble, or just restart the world. I make another world, I find the marble, but tough luck again, no moleworms to be found. Okay, I make ANOTHER world and I find everything and I go to ruins, what I get as a reward is the smallest ruins branches. Let's say in another run, I don't get enough gems for the full setup. Okay, get that out of the way, and it is winter and I want to fight Klaus while also prepping for BQ, Deerclops and moving the suspicious marble pieces but again, tough luck, no deer to be found because their movement is so ******* random and the map doesn't show the deer so I have to spend precious time to find them and maybe I won't even since I searched for them in the biomes they are intended to appear in. I fight shadow pieces and some spiders aggro one of them and that piece despawns so I have to wait 20 days to even attempt this fight again and maybe something else will happen that will interrupt the fight and cause me to wait 20 MORE days, ah, such fun. Maybe I want to do my pearl tasks but I can't seem to find one salt formation or whoever knows what I am looking for in the sea. Okay, I did everything intended, and I start to make my mega base and it is exactly near a meteor field, guess I have to make another world and repeat the same stuff again and again until finally the gods bless me with a normal world. This could go on forever because there are many more instances of rng screwing my play time, and also others.

With all of this said, rng sucks in this game, I know it might not be a big deal, yes I know I am salty rn and I wish you a good day <33.

In my opinion randomness adds replayability. If it was the same every time or if the need for exploration was removed I wouldn't have 235 hours in the switch version of Don't Starve Singleplayer. While I can see your complaints have merit, I also feel that randomness is a big part of the survival game genre.

Besides, Don't Starve is a game that is designed in a way that usually makes me feel like if something happens it's my fault. Sure, a meteor shower destroyed your base, but those also only spawn in certain areas. (When it comes to the No Eyed Deer, I have no excuse. Their herd mechanics are just kind of annoying.)

[oregu]

On 5/15/2022 at 2:21 PM, reallychina said:

What many people seem to be missing here is that more randomemess is not inherently better. Theres good randomness and stupid randomness, which only makes you run around like an idiot for a day or two.

By the logic of more randomness = good, there should be no astral detector, no message in a bottle, no cut edges to point to lunar etc. Congratulations, you just spent 50 days more on this super rAndOm ocean to find them.

Good randomess is having some degree of predictability on where stuff should be. It doesnt mean they will always be there. It means you can make a plan and slightly modify it.

 

Marble statues being pure random is bad randomness, atrium tentapillar is bad randomness, salt is bad randonness, wormhole randomness etc.

 

Moleworms are not bad rng because they are bound to certain biomes and  there are a lot of them scattered so its inevitable you will find some, you only need to make a mental note about their place as you scout

Yeah, I believe there should be a certain way to find anything you want to find in a reasonable amount of time. That's one of the things I really enjoyed about other aspects of the world generation; Random, but traceable. Marble can actually be really scarce on the world because there's only two guaranteed set pieces of it (and one doesnt even give over 10 marble most the time). Possible fixes for this is that every guaranteed structure should remain by a road. I've done my best to circumvent RNG in rushes without using exploitative client mods/methods (roads, traveling zoomed out and by far from ocean as possible, knowing which biomes are often dead ends and recognizing which branching/looping pattern the world is early on, etc.), but the things OP mentioned can still be an issue for those who care about doing things in a reasonable timeframe. I've gotten better at lessening the disadvantageous RNG aspects, but the point remains that there's no intuitive good way of tracking where those things are. Hoping to randomly stumble on a setpiece to progress on a character quicker seems counterintuitive and understandably frustrating. Like imagine if there were no good way to find graves early on as Wendy (didn't spawn in forests or mosaic), per se. Also marble is a priceless material in speedrun and is a good reason why a lot of my speedruns in the game were constantly reset.

[kNichael]

Another thing to add that I just absolutely hate: the spawning of the Celestial Orb, day 120 and no Celestial Orb, all I need to kill the Celestial Champion is this ******* thing. Also, I found myself to agree on some parts and still stick to others but in conclusion, rng is bad in some areas, mainly when you are prepared to do something you have set out to do but are missing one thing because rng has not blessed you yet, basically holding you back because you are not lucky but are prepared to do said task, in these types of cases rng can go eat a big one <3.

[reallychina]

8 minutes ago, kNichael said:

Another thing to add that I just absolutely hate: the spawning of the Celestial Orb, day 120 and no Celestial Orb, all I need to kill the Celestial Champion is this ******* thing. Also, I found myself to agree on some parts and still stick to others but in conclusion, rng is bad in some areas, mainly when you are prepared to do something you have set out to do but are missing one thing because rng has not blessed you yet, basically holding you back because you are not lucky but are prepared to do said task, in these types of cases rng can go eat a big one <3.

did you run a count_prefab command? it should spawn by day 60. Sometimes the meteor zone can overlap with another biome and the boulder lands there. I had my last one in the swamp next to mosaic

[kNichael]

40 minutes ago, reallychina said:

did you run a count_prefab command? it should spawn by day 60. Sometimes the meteor zone can overlap with another biome and the boulder lands there. I had my last one in the swamp next to mosaic

Says 0

[Cloakingsumo198]

I just wished they made world seeds an implemented feature already.

Seems strange that survival game with randomly generated world's doesn't have a way use to use world seeds.

Perhaps I'm just too spoiled by Minecraft and Terraria but since there's already a mod made by a dev for world seed's shouldn't it be implemented at some point?

[goodguythatguy]

This seems more like an issue of "Randomness in this game is what kills rushing the Ruins with Wanda"

I don't know who invented the concept of "Rushing", it sounds like a strategy for people that are desperate, have no patience, have little long-term thinking, and aren't much interested with collaborating with other players. I guess the fiends need their fix. 

[Maxil20]

On 5/15/2022 at 2:28 PM, Guille6785 said:

you can completely bypass it by deconstructing 2 of pearl's lures and then duping cookie cutter shells with the cookie cutter cap.

…gotta admit, I never would have thought of doing this in order to dupe cookie cutter shells, especially since this is pretty realistic if you only wanted to get cookie cutter shells to fix the house up.

[kirihime]

tl;dr speedrunning is not the intended way to play the game and more than 99% of the playerbase isn't doing it but these speedrunners still demand the game be rebuilt entirely around them

[Faintly Macabre]

1 hour ago, goodguythatguy said:

I don't know who invented the concept of "Rushing", it sounds like a strategy for people that are desperate, have no patience, have little long-term thinking, and aren't much interested with collaborating with other players. I guess the fiends need their fix. 

Why so mean? Most of those people aren't hurting you or anybody else. Having fun a different way than intended isn't some kind of failure of character. As long as they're not being jerks about it.

[Random Guy000]

Isn't this kind of the point of the game? It creates random obstacles for you and you try to avoid them the best way possible. It's randomness that actually makes the game enjoyable

[Psychic Chicken]

3 hours ago, reallychina said:

did you run a count_prefab command? it should spawn by day 60. Sometimes the meteor zone can overlap with another biome and the boulder lands there. I had my last one in the swamp next to mosaic

In my main world it took at least 200 days and I checked with commands too. The coding behind it is misinterpreted by a lot of people and it only guarantees a moon rock boulder to be smooth, but it doesn't guarantee a boulder to be moon rock. I really think this should be properly guaranteed past like, day 100 or something.

[Cheggf]

2 hours ago, goodguythatguy said:

This seems more like an issue of "Randomness in this game is what kills rushing the Ruins with Wanda"

I don't know who invented the concept of "Rushing", it sounds like a strategy for people that are desperate, have no patience, have little long-term thinking, and aren't much interested with collaborating with other players. I guess the fiends need their fix. 

What is your long-term and collaborative plan? Sitting around at the base watching the character's idle animation? The most collaborative players I've ever seen have been rushers since most everyone else just stands around doing nothing but draining resources.

[Capybara007]

3 hours ago, goodguythatguy said:

This seems more like an issue of "Randomness in this game is what kills rushing the Ruins with Wanda"

I don't know who invented the concept of "Rushing", it sounds like a strategy for people that are desperate, have no patience, have little long-term thinking, and aren't much interested with collaborating with other players. I guess the fiends need their fix. 

tfw others like to have a different playstyle instead of doing ruins in day 500

[Copyafriend]

54 minutes ago, Cheggf said:

What is your long-term and collaborative plan? Sitting around at the base watching the character's idle animation? The most collaborative players I've ever seen have been rushers since most everyone else just stands around doing nothing but draining resources.

I mean, typically doing all the stuff you do while rushing but at a more relaxed pace. In other words you got a point.

[kirihime]

1 hour ago, Cheggf said:

What is your long-term and collaborative plan? Sitting around at the base watching the character's idle animation?

Rushing is hardly long term, what exactly are you going to do afterwards, sit at base and watch the character's idle animation?it's never done collaboratively either
I'm just rushing the end goal here. You're probably going to take 20-30 days to do your things, maybe 50 if you're going for the lunar content? Me? I find the base and my rush is complete. You tell me who has the more effective strategy,

 

[goodguythatguy]

4 hours ago, Faintly Macabre said:

Why so mean? Most of those people aren't hurting you or anybody else. Having fun a different way than intended isn't some kind of failure of character. As long as they're not being jerks about it.

"Why so mean?" isn't an argument, there's nothing logical, rational or related to the topic about the question at all. You've 'Poisoned The Well'. This fortifies and validates my original sentiment. 

"Most of those people aren't hurting you or anybody else." Again, this has nothing to do with the topic at all. How did "Hurt" and "Being Mean" come into the conversation? I don't trust you, you're a scam artist as far as I'm concerned. 

Most people in this thread responding to my comment aren't even talking about the same thing I'm talking about, I'll let this stand as my only response and good luck with whatever you're talking about. 

[Capybara007]

11 minutes ago, goodguythatguy said:

Most people in this thread responding to my comment aren't even talking about the same thing I'm talking about, I'll let this stand as my only response and good luck with whatever you're talking about. 

By the way you put it it sounded like you dont like when someone rushes something and everyone should do a slow gameplay.

Now you probably didnt meant to say that but you couldve been more specific in your comment, rather than blaming the others for not understanding your point.

[goodguythatguy]

 

34 minutes ago, Capybara007 said:

By the way you put it it sounded like you dont like when someone rushes something and everyone should do a slow gameplay.

Now you probably didnt meant to say that but you couldve been more specific in your comment, rather than blaming the others for not understanding your point.

"It sounded like you dont like it when someone rushes something and everyone should do slow gameplay" Did it really sound like what you said it sounded like? I'm not launching a campaign against 'Rushing'. It's none of my business if a person even decides to c_freecrafting() as soon as they enter their World and c_gonexts directly to their Rush destination. However fast or slow a person wants to Rush is their preference and they're entitled to their preference. May the Rush be with you. EXTREME!!!

http://media3.s-nbcnews.com/i/streams/2012/July/120711/460611-g-ent-120711-Harold-and-Kumar-Go-to-white-Castle.jpg

"Blaming others for not understanding your point" Did I really blame someone here? Like, for serious? If I did, then my apologies. No one is to blame for what I blamed you for, you're innocent until proven guilty. I will focus more on not blaming people because I don't like to be blamed myself and I can understand that position. Live long and Rush on.

[Cheggf]

2 hours ago, kirihime said:

Rushing is hardly long term, what exactly are you going to do afterwards, sit at base and watch the character's idle animation?it's never done collaboratively either
I'm just rushing the end goal here. You're probably going to take 20-30 days to do your things, maybe 50 if you're going for the lunar content? Me? I find the base and my rush is complete. You tell me who has the more effective strategy,

 

What