Unique mechanics that may be a bug.

[DVGMedia]

So Im typing this in here because I am currently working on a tips and tricks video for wendy.
From the years I have played as this character I have amassed some tricks that players may not have noticed And I would love to share them.
However Im worried about shareing them.
Because many times before I have shared a trick to make the game easier it gets patched out as a bug due to it being "unintentional design."

one common one in the past I shared was that you could hold a lantern in your mouse cursor and hold another item in your hand slot. so you could use a lantern and either cane or a weapon at the same time.
this was patched out  so that equipping an item in your hand slot while your lantern was in your mouse would turn it off
This makes sense.
Recent updates though also changed it so lanterns in your mouse hand does not give light anymore
Which why i don't understand why they took out. It was just a silent patch.

But you can see my problem with wanting to share knowledge.
I understand patching out bugs that are game breaking and unintended Like being able to walk in the void using gates

However there are some small patches that really make me not want to share information  Just because I fear The information I want to share is a bug that gets patched out.

What do you guys think?
Should certain quirks of the engine stay if they do not harm players or make the game look broken?


 

[lv746591263]

I don't think it should be kept. This bug should be fixed

[Faintly Macabre]

I'm not sure I understand. If you can't use something else in the hand slot anyway, what's the point of holding your lantern with your cursor?

[DVGMedia]

8 minutes ago, Faintly Macabre said:

I'm not sure I understand. If you can't use something else in the hand slot anyway, what's the point of holding your lantern with your cursor?

The only reason that the lantern should still have light while in your cursor is so that you can place it on the ground.
Which is why the normal bugfix affecting the whole item in the hand slot did fix that issue.
However in the recent update(QOL one) you can't hold a lit lantern in your mouse anymore meaning you cant drop it at night from your hand
you would need to use the drop command instead.

This also kind of goes into other mechanics that were changed
Stuff like being able to animation cancel.
you had to be fast to be able to get any benefit from it.
This part kind of tied into my other thread a bit. Where there is really no more mechanical skill in the game.
But thats a whole other discussion.

I just fear that because I want to share some intricacies of the game; that potentially those unique things end up getting patched out.

I Mean I was the curator of the original sanity station and it mostly got taken out.
Which I don't mind that thing broke a core aspect of the game which was sanity. lol  
 

23 minutes ago, lv746591263 said:

I don't think it should be kept. This bug should be fixed

Can you give your reasoning behind it?

 

[Lokena]

23 minutes ago, EsaiXD said:

However in the recent update(QOL one) you can't hold a lit lantern in your mouse anymore meaning you cant drop it at night from your hand
you would need to use the drop command instead.

No you don't? You can still just take the lantern and drag it with the mouse to the ground. Yes, the screen will turn dark for a second, and there should be nothing on the ground preventing you from putting the item there, but as long as the lantern is displayed green, you don't need to see anything to drop it - it's just like putting a bonfire in the dark. I've never used a command for this and didn't even think about it until you said that. Does it really complicate someone's game so much? To the point where you can't use this still fully working method? Seriously?

[DVGMedia]

27 minutes ago, Lokena said:

No you don't? You can still just take the lantern and drag it with the mouse to the ground. Yes, the screen will turn dark for a second, and there should be nothing on the ground preventing you from putting the item, but as long as the lantern is displayed green, you don't need to see anything to drop it - it's огые like putting a bonfire in the dark. I've never used a command for this and didn't even think about it until you said so. Does it really complicate someone's game so much? To the point where you can't use this still fully working method? Seriously?

Well My use case is more being on a beefalo  or when the item is wet.
if the lantern was wet I would put it in my mouse so i don't get the sanity loss from the wet item being equipped

and 2 would be using the lantern when fighting the bearger or goose at night. They have abilities to knock your hand item off and they still do it while riding a beefalo. so I would put the lantern in my cursor to avoid that.

But also having the lantern stay lit can be useful  for easier placing.

"The lantern is displayed green?" I have never seen the lantern displayed green.

You can drop the lantern on the ground if you drop it close to you. but dropping it further away you cant.

It does seem though klei changed that Interaction
Before you used to not be able to do anything in the darkness because it made placing in darkness invalid
You could circumvent that by using geoplacement.
But it seems klei has changed that. so that you have more options in darkness

[ArubaroBeefalo]

2 hours ago, EsaiXD said:

The only reason that the lantern should still have light while in your cursor is so that you can place it on the ground.

quick drop was added so is safer and more confortable for dropping lanterns

[lakhnish]

4 hours ago, EsaiXD said:

Because many times before I have shared a trick to make the game easier it gets patched out as a bug due to it being "unintentional design."

Rule of thumb: if you don't want something patched, stay silent about it.

The devs can't patch what they don't know. 

[Lokena]

5 hours ago, EsaiXD said:

Well My use case is more being on a beefalo  or when the item is wet.
if the lantern was wet I would put it in my mouse so i don't get the sanity loss from the wet item being equipped

and 2 would be using the lantern when fighting the bearger or goose at night. They have abilities to knock your hand item off and they still do it while riding a beefalo. so I would put the lantern in my cursor to avoid that.

Well, these two specific cases look to me like the exploitation of mechanics, so I don't see any problems with them being fixed. Wet objects should reduce sanity. Bosses knocking items out of your hands should knock them out of your hands. This is a feature. And by bypassing it, you negate both of these things. Does this simplify things for you? Maybe. But that doesn't sound to me like an honest way to do it. The only thing I support on this list is that just putting a lantern on the ground might be a little more inconvenient, but again, I've never had a problem with that. You can still drop it in the dark - either manually or by command. It's not like they introduced a change, and it broke the very possibility of throwing lantern out from your inventory entirely.

[SomebodyRandom]

Not all bugs should be patched, like the Wardrobe reskin bug for example. (I still don't understand why they did).

I see the mouse slot as like your offhand. You hold your hand item on your right hand for example, and another object on your left hand.

If the Lantern was to work while on your mouse slot though, it should still be affected by things like sanity loss from wet items and Moose/Goose throwing items off your hands. Because you're just holding another item in your hand, after all.

If Klei doesn't want to make the mouse slot more like your offhand, then I don't think the Lantern should still work on it.

[Guille6785]

be like me and always have a backup cheese method for when the one you use gets patched

[Falkenpelz]

Meanwhile in singleplayer DS you can get cursor-locked - you can't drop anything in total darkness and even if you have a heckton of grass and twigs, if all spots including your cursor are filled up, with no way to quickly eat a spot empty, you're dead

[SinancoTheBest]

4 hours ago, SomebodyRandom said:

Not all bugs should be patched, like the Wardrobe reskin bug for example. (I still don't understand why they did).

To this day I'm still very happy that that one got fixed. I'll be even happier whrn they fix voidwalking.

I guess some people just like to see the world burn...

[GelatinousCube]

57 minutes ago, SinancoTheBest said:

. I'll be even happier whrn they fix voidwalking.

It's been a hell of a long time since I've had to cross the atrium properly and I am not looking forward to doing so again at all.. 

Only thing I use void walking for but my god is it useful... I hate the atrium and its sanity gates so goddamn much. I know you can easily just use lazy explorers to skip through them but even still I hate it. 

Void walking being patched will be a painful one but should it happen I'll just have to deal with it. It honestly probably shouldn't be a thing. 

[Owlrust]

Bugs can affect other bugs in unintended ways, so keeping the existence of a bug to yourself has the chance of making other bugs harder to fix for the developers going forward. It would be great service for the games you love if you report them even if you might not want to.

I understand how you feel though, in Paladins I used to play a character called Torvald whom can place a shield over your allies. The ability had a decently long cooldown and you could modify the ability to give you a (very small) bit of shield for yourself every time you used it. I discovered an exploit that let the ability benefit me but not go on cooldown, so I basically could get infinite shield whenever I wanted by spamming the button and looking away. I ended up reporting it after a few days, it sucked because I loved doing it, but I reported it because I knew it was never intended, I didn't want to get used to bad habits that may just get patched out anyways, and I didn't want this bug to potentially cause bigger issues going forward. That, and I didn't want to get banned.

Not only that, If it wasn't intended, then getting used to it would be doing yourself a disservice as it may get patched out eventually from some other person that reports it; after all you'd be making a main facet of your playstyle around something that wouldn't be allowed. The best you can hope for is that you advocate for it to become a feature or have it explored in some fashion down the line.

[hhh2]

2 hours ago, Falkenpelz said:

Meanwhile in singleplayer DS you can get cursor-locked - you can't drop anything in total darkness and even if you have a heckton of grass and twigs, if all spots including your cursor are filled up, with no way to quickly eat a spot empty, you're dead

But you can do the lantern glitch in singleplayer.

[Hornete]

1 hour ago, hhh2 said:

But you can do the lantern glitch in singleplayer.

This was patched as far as I recall.

[lv746591263]

20 hours ago, EsaiXD said:

The only reason that the lantern should still have light while in your cursor is so that you can place it on the ground.
Which is why the normal bugfix affecting the whole item in the hand slot did fix that issue.
However in the recent update(QOL one) you can't hold a lit lantern in your mouse anymore meaning you cant drop it at night from your hand
you would need to use the drop command instead.

This also kind of goes into other mechanics that were changed
Stuff like being able to animation cancel.
you had to be fast to be able to get any benefit from it.
This part kind of tied into my other thread a bit. Where there is really no more mechanical skill in the game.
But thats a whole other discussion.

I just fear that because I want to share some intricacies of the game; that potentially those unique things end up getting patched out.

I Mean I was the curator of the original sanity station and it mostly got taken out.
Which I don't mind that thing broke a core aspect of the game which was sanity. lol  
 

Can you give your reasoning behind it?

 

Does this need a reason? If you like to deceive yourself so much, you might as well play in God mode

[DVGMedia]

15 hours ago, SomebodyRandom said:

Not all bugs should be patched, like the Wardrobe reskin bug for example. (I still don't understand why they did).

I see the mouse slot as like your offhand. You hold your hand item on your right hand for example, and another object on your left hand.

If the Lantern was to work while on your mouse slot though, it should still be affected by things like sanity loss from wet items and Moose/Goose throwing items off your hands. Because you're just holding another item in your hand, after all.

If Klei doesn't want to make the mouse slot more like your offhand, then I don't think the Lantern should still work on it.

This was patched long ago for dst so im not even really worried about the lantern stuff. it was just an example.

Another thing I remember got changed recently Was animation canceling while fighting.
it was kind of similar to what occurred in the forge.  Where you could multi target and attack faster.
It was a problem during the forge because people were writing scripts to  maximize their times and the forge was a competition for deathless and the fastest times.
IN the PVE Survival game mode you can animation cancel while inputing a movement direction on a beefalo or by swaping weapons.
I was a bit sad for this  because i practiced this alot while being on a beefalo.
This would allow you to attack faster than normal getting slightly more than 2 hits a second in. Which is about normal attacking speed.
It was actually kind of hard to do with ping involved.
But it was something that dealt with mechanical skill in the game.
But since normal survival is the pve game mode it is.
Learning animation canceling actually felt like a skill earned but was taken away.
 

[loopuleasa]

On 5/9/2022 at 9:25 AM, EsaiXD said:

However Im worried about shareing them.
Because many times before I have shared a trick to make the game easier it gets patched out as a bug due to it being "unintentional design."

No one man should have all that power.

 

[Guille6785]

9 hours ago, EsaiXD said:

Another thing I remember got changed recently Was animation canceling while fighting.
it was kind of similar to what occurred in the forge.  Where you could multi target and attack faster.
It was a problem during the forge because people were writing scripts to  maximize their times and the forge was a competition for deathless and the fastest times.
IN the PVE Survival game mode you can animation cancel while inputing a movement direction on a beefalo or by swaping weapons.
I was a bit sad for this  because i practiced this alot while being on a beefalo.
This would allow you to attack faster than normal getting slightly more than 2 hits a second in. Which is about normal attacking speed.
It was actually kind of hard to do with ping involved.
But it was something that dealt with mechanical skill in the game.
But since normal survival is the pve game mode it is.
Learning animation canceling actually felt like a skill earned but was taken away.
 

animation cancelling still exists in survival so idk what you mean by it being taken away

notice how I'm landing 5 hits instead of 4 in between bee queen stings which basically boosts my dps by 20%

that said I've had my fair share of discussions about this topic with other people and I personally don't find anim cancelling to be the most engaging or rewarding mechanic you can learn as it is, it's heavily influenced by a lot of factors and completely impractical outside of a solo world (unless they decide to embrace it and make it more consistent and more impactful then who knows)

[DVGMedia]

1 hour ago, Guille6785 said:

Spoiler

animation cancelling still exists in survival so idk what you mean by it being taken away

notice how I'm landing 5 hits instead of 4 in between bee queen stings which basically boosts my dps by 20%

that said I've had my fair share of discussions about this topic with other people and I personally don't find anim cancelling to be the most engaging or rewarding mechanic you can learn as it is, it's heavily influenced by a lot of factors and completely impractical outside of a solo world (unless they decide to embrace it and make it more consistent and more impactful then who knows)

 

 

Mmm Interesting  I know they took it out for beefalo riders though.
cant do it anymore with them. 
This though just makes me think of why people like wanda so much.
The High Base damage she can reach
Range
Abilities to counter damage or dodge it completely via teleporting and backstep
Mass teleportation network across the world.
Her and wortox are like the only characters that have mechanics that allow them to  have a much higher skill ceiling.