ArubaroBeefalo Posted March 15, 2022 Share Posted March 15, 2022 1 minute ago, Dextops said: tentapillars are annoying because of the amount of tentacle spam that happens needing more gear than just a simple wormhole. Making your limited fast travel points a pain in the ass isn't challenging it is annoying. And of course people who want to play efficiently will do the more efficient option if you don't want to do that it is your choice there isn't much point in limiting something for everyone you can limit yourself. For the safer part, what is there to be afraid of? caves are empty anyway so no person does it for being safe hutch+lightbulb+spear near you and hold F Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/138190-in-the-caves-the-void-should-be-like-the-ocean-where-players-can-fall-and-throw-objects-into/page/2/#findComment-1548777 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dextops Posted March 15, 2022 Share Posted March 15, 2022 Just now, ArubaroBeefalo said: hutch+lightbulb+spear near you and hold F that is only a small part of my argument and it is still annoying having to look for hutch Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/138190-in-the-caves-the-void-should-be-like-the-ocean-where-players-can-fall-and-throw-objects-into/page/2/#findComment-1548779 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArubaroBeefalo Posted March 15, 2022 Share Posted March 15, 2022 4 minutes ago, Dextops said: that is only a small part of my argument and it is still annoying having to look for hutch oh, idc about the people walking throw the void, i dont understand why they do that but idc, i should just quoted the part you were talking about tentapillars btw, hutch most of the time spawns near snurtle dens before reaching the lichen biome Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/138190-in-the-caves-the-void-should-be-like-the-ocean-where-players-can-fall-and-throw-objects-into/page/2/#findComment-1548781 Share on other sites More sharing options...
SinancoTheBest Posted March 15, 2022 Author Share Posted March 15, 2022 3 minutes ago, Dextops said: tentapillars are annoying because of the amount of tentacle spam that happens needing more gear than just a simple wormhole. Making your limited fast travel points a pain in the ass isn't challenging it is annoying. And of course people who want to play efficiently will do the more efficient option if you don't want to do that it is your choice there isn't much point in limiting something for everyone you can limit yourself. For the safer part, what is there to be afraid of? caves are empty anyway so no person does it for being safe have you heard the one about the Celestial Portal, Moon Idol, Wormwood and Bramble Husks? Keeping of the glitch allows half the players to get away with being decadent while punishes the other half with a hefty opportunity cost for wanting to be fair to the game design. Oh joy. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/138190-in-the-caves-the-void-should-be-like-the-ocean-where-players-can-fall-and-throw-objects-into/page/2/#findComment-1548785 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dextops Posted March 15, 2022 Share Posted March 15, 2022 1 minute ago, SinancoTheBest said: have you heard the one about the Celestial Portal, Moon Idol, Wormwood and Bramble Husks? Keeping of the glitch allows half the players to get away with being decadent while punishes the other half with a hefty opportunity cost for wanting to be fair to the game design. Oh joy. and fixing it changes what exactly? now everyone has to suffer? Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/138190-in-the-caves-the-void-should-be-like-the-ocean-where-players-can-fall-and-throw-objects-into/page/2/#findComment-1548787 Share on other sites More sharing options...
SinancoTheBest Posted March 15, 2022 Author Share Posted March 15, 2022 1 minute ago, Dextops said: and fixing it changes what exactly? now everyone has to suffer? Im sure ultimately less people will suffer the opportunity costs of not using the glitch, unless we're past a point of no return where a majority of people do use the glitch. Then it should be made into actual content like idk, belt of phasing? Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/138190-in-the-caves-the-void-should-be-like-the-ocean-where-players-can-fall-and-throw-objects-into/page/2/#findComment-1548789 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dextops Posted March 15, 2022 Share Posted March 15, 2022 12 minutes ago, SinancoTheBest said: Im sure ultimately less people will suffer the opportunity costs of not using the glitch, unless we're past a point of no return where a majority of people do use the glitch. Then it should be made into actual content like idk, belt of phasing? if only a small portion of people do it why does it matter then? and if a lot of people do it why does it matter? ultimately it doesn't because no one is forcing you to do void walking, it is in the same pool as celestial portal if you don't like to use it then don't it is fine as is. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/138190-in-the-caves-the-void-should-be-like-the-ocean-where-players-can-fall-and-throw-objects-into/page/2/#findComment-1548799 Share on other sites More sharing options...
goatt Posted March 16, 2022 Share Posted March 16, 2022 I would be fun if the cave void is replaced by lava. Then you have rock boats which can temporarily solidify parts of the lava and act as bridges and is melted later. Tho it won’t happen cuz obviously it will overheat the entire cave. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/138190-in-the-caves-the-void-should-be-like-the-ocean-where-players-can-fall-and-throw-objects-into/page/2/#findComment-1548829 Share on other sites More sharing options...
SinancoTheBest Posted March 16, 2022 Author Share Posted March 16, 2022 5 hours ago, goatt said: I would be fun if the cave void is replaced by lava. Then you have rock boats which can temporarily solidify parts of the lava and act as bridges and is melted later. Tho it won’t happen cuz obviously it will overheat the entire cave. Would be pretty nice if the void have a different filling depending on the biome, almost as part of the biome and perhaps interacting with the biome, making the cave biomes feel more active, interesting and engaging. Most could be regular ground water, flowing through like sewers and at points falling to thedeeper unseen void like a waterfall. Around the grotto would be lunar infused water, which like the vitreoasis could solidify into mineable moonglass at parts of it like salt formations. The rocky areas could have more metallic water to appear infused with minerals. Guano biomes could have dirty contaminated water. Mushtree biomes would have nutrition rich, sparkling water. Mud biome could have poison, waiting too much at the edges causing minor health loss. Some parts could have lava, heating up that sprcific room or the edges, adding overheating mechanics into special rooms within the caves or to the edges of those rooms... Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/138190-in-the-caves-the-void-should-be-like-the-ocean-where-players-can-fall-and-throw-objects-into/page/2/#findComment-1548913 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pig Princess Posted March 16, 2022 Share Posted March 16, 2022 8 hours ago, SinancoTheBest said: unless we're past a point of no return where a majority of people do use the glitch I saw people using voidwalking to find atrium and then return there for next fights via void every single time they were going to fight Fuelweaver (at least around 10 times on pubs not counting second and further fights), and only when it was me alone or only me and @x0-VERSUS-1y once, someone actually tried to use tentapillars. Even though I use tentapillars, every time I search for that only one that leads to atrium, even as Wendy or Wormwood, I question why am I doing this to myself. It is boring, but most importantly, too RNG-dependant, you can find atrium from first tentapillar located in the muddy biome on the way to the ruins, or can check 10 tentapillars and search for the one that has to spawn somewhere in countless grassy biomes you won't ever want to visit. On top of that tentapillars are annoying, and switching to character or 2 for whom its less tedious should not be a solution. Instead, I would rather have root of the problem fixed. Specifically, making cave biomes worth exploring and revisiting, since right now only ruins, blue mushroom, grotto, archives and muddy on the way to ruins/with glowberries are interesting to me - basically 2 and a half places in the whole cave system, - as well as red mushroom forest in early game (for minerals and fossils, not even for revisiting). That leaves numerous grassy biomes, with bunnies/spiders/mushrooms/cave savannah and such, guano biome, rocky with rock lobsters, rocky with dangling debth dwellers, rocky with spitters, green mushroom, mixed mushroom, mushroom meadow, majority of muddy, cave swamp, cave swamp with lightbulbs that are in 99% cases USELESS. On top of that, I would like a way to establish fast and convenient connection to the atrium once I found it. Only Wanda has this luxury legit, and given how much of a difference it makes, it's just beyond unfair. I like concept of rope bridges or whatever (like making lazy deserter usable for it's main purpose solo), depending on whether developers would like to stick with "wall" canon or would change their mind and treat it as void/ocean, and in case of bridges it would be balanced with their cost being the more the longer they are. I like being able to connect surface biomes with boat bridges in small gaps, and I would like that for caves too. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/138190-in-the-caves-the-void-should-be-like-the-ocean-where-players-can-fall-and-throw-objects-into/page/2/#findComment-1548928 Share on other sites More sharing options...
reallychina Posted March 16, 2022 Share Posted March 16, 2022 i just want void briges man, thats it. its so painful to be a few steps away from a point of interest but in fact be 4 minutes away because you have to go around Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/138190-in-the-caves-the-void-should-be-like-the-ocean-where-players-can-fall-and-throw-objects-into/page/2/#findComment-1548969 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArubaroBeefalo Posted March 16, 2022 Share Posted March 16, 2022 48 minutes ago, reallychina said: i just want void briges man, thats it. its so painful to be a few steps away from a point of interest but in fact be 4 minutes away because you have to go around telepuff Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/138190-in-the-caves-the-void-should-be-like-the-ocean-where-players-can-fall-and-throw-objects-into/page/2/#findComment-1548983 Share on other sites More sharing options...
reallychina Posted March 16, 2022 Share Posted March 16, 2022 32 minutes ago, ArubaroBeefalo said: telepuff wastes resources unnecessarily, that's like saying don't use boat bridges, telepoof around Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/138190-in-the-caves-the-void-should-be-like-the-ocean-where-players-can-fall-and-throw-objects-into/page/2/#findComment-1548986 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArubaroBeefalo Posted March 16, 2022 Share Posted March 16, 2022 5 minutes ago, reallychina said: wastes resources unnecessarily, that's like saying don't use boat bridges, telepoof around i wont say unnecessarily since you are saving time and we already discussed how much orange gem get dusty in chests. If i dont have a boat bridge i will telepuff would be nice, atleast for the surface, to have real bridges. Would look cool in the caves too but i doubt they will add them when they already change wanda's alarming clock to dont hit between gaps because "there are walls in the caves", walls that doesn't stop you from telepuffing or bishops hitting you... Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/138190-in-the-caves-the-void-should-be-like-the-ocean-where-players-can-fall-and-throw-objects-into/page/2/#findComment-1548988 Share on other sites More sharing options...
MondayNight Posted March 16, 2022 Share Posted March 16, 2022 Ah, the "Abyss Gate" cheat, my proverbial "ol' friend" - and one to many advanced players as well. Won't mind if it gets patched; but yes, a mid-to-late game valid approach of shortening trips over map, after initial incursion, would be quite appreciated as alternative and not relegate all wanting such "legit" way to solely playing Wanda. As others stated in past and in this thread: adding some new perk/mechanic to Lazy Deserter and make it useful in solo manner - sure win for everybody. Regarding how "abyss walking glitch" could be corrected, if KLei so-chooses... am sure devs would find an appropriate, convenient solution. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/138190-in-the-caves-the-void-should-be-like-the-ocean-where-players-can-fall-and-throw-objects-into/page/2/#findComment-1549018 Share on other sites More sharing options...
therabidsquirel Posted March 17, 2022 Share Posted March 17, 2022 Void walking aside, when it comes to what the caves should be there's the Forgotten Knowledge trailer from a year and a half ago. It very clearly shows it actually being walls, not a void or ocean or anything. It's always what I thought it was supposed to be too, even before seeing the original caves that had walls. It just made sense to me that it's supposed to be walls but they opted for a void visually to not obstruct your view of anything. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/138190-in-the-caves-the-void-should-be-like-the-ocean-where-players-can-fall-and-throw-objects-into/page/2/#findComment-1549277 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yuuko Posted March 17, 2022 Share Posted March 17, 2022 Waste of dev time imo. Unless they're going to rework the caves so that we can build bridges, ghost over void, stop dropping loots, etc they should just leave it as it is. imo it was worthless to stop Wanda from attacking across the void. What a foolish thing to chase down, as if Wanda doing this is somehow game breaking the game lol Klei needs to shift AWAY from the "mEtA kNiGhT oP" balance quest and just build the game to be fun, and let what happens happen. If something actually breaks the game then fix it, but otherwise - who really cares? only try-hards that can't stand to know someone followed a youtube guide to set up walls for dfly (yet still stands by pan flute bypassing rage mode as "legit" even though all walls do is bypass ads lol) Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/138190-in-the-caves-the-void-should-be-like-the-ocean-where-players-can-fall-and-throw-objects-into/page/2/#findComment-1549291 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheggf Posted March 17, 2022 Share Posted March 17, 2022 8 hours ago, therabidsquirel said: Void walking aside, when it comes to what the caves should be there's the Forgotten Knowledge trailer from a year and a half ago. It very clearly shows it actually being walls, not a void or ocean or anything. It's always what I thought it was supposed to be too, even before seeing the original caves that had walls. It just made sense to me that it's supposed to be walls but they opted for a void visually to not obstruct your view of anything. I had forgotten about that trailer, that's another good piece of evidence that they're intended to be walls. I think, ignoring how much dev time it would take, if there were a cave update it would be incredible if they replaced the void graphics with truncated wall graphics and had an option in the options menu to display the full graphics like it used to be. Disabled by default of course. But that'd be the devs making full wall textures, probably even multiple if places like the archives and ruins had different walls, that the majority of players would never see. But I think it would be really immersive and I would love to turn it on. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/138190-in-the-caves-the-void-should-be-like-the-ocean-where-players-can-fall-and-throw-objects-into/page/2/#findComment-1549385 Share on other sites More sharing options...
maradyne Posted March 18, 2022 Share Posted March 18, 2022 On 3/15/2022 at 5:34 PM, Dextops said: if only a small portion of people do it why does it matter then? and if a lot of people do it why does it matter? ultimately it doesn't because no one is forcing you to do void walking, it is in the same pool as celestial portal if you don't like to use it then don't it is fine as is. Honestly a good point...but its basically Ancient Guardian's position, or the Moonstone event. If a noticeable portion of the player base would rather abuse oversights and glitches to approach a certain part of gameplay than do it with a method that looks remotely legitimate, then that gameplay needs some milk. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/138190-in-the-caves-the-void-should-be-like-the-ocean-where-players-can-fall-and-throw-objects-into/page/2/#findComment-1549931 Share on other sites More sharing options...
YesterdaysMindr Posted March 19, 2022 Share Posted March 19, 2022 On 3/17/2022 at 2:44 AM, Cheggf said: I had forgotten about that trailer, that's another good piece of evidence that they're intended to be walls. I think, ignoring how much dev time it would take, if there were a cave update it would be incredible if they replaced the void graphics with truncated wall graphics and had an option in the options menu to display the full graphics like it used to be. Disabled by default of course. But that'd be the devs making full wall textures, probably even multiple if places like the archives and ruins had different walls, that the majority of players would never see. But I think it would be really immersive and I would love to turn it on. To be devil's advocate, there is one place underground that's canonically shown to have an abyss instead of walls: Spoiler The Labyrinth. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/138190-in-the-caves-the-void-should-be-like-the-ocean-where-players-can-fall-and-throw-objects-into/page/2/#findComment-1550112 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baark0 Posted March 22, 2022 Share Posted March 22, 2022 Remove/rework tentapillars and your suggestion of people falling into the void is less garbage Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/138190-in-the-caves-the-void-should-be-like-the-ocean-where-players-can-fall-and-throw-objects-into/page/2/#findComment-1550989 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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