A friendly reminder to people who complain about the status of the game and it’s updates

[Mike23Ua]

I know that’s a long title for a new thread I apologize in advance for that but I just felt I needed to speak my mind. People are currently arguing that Wanda should be allowed to Respawn with her clocks after she dies and currently she does this with most clocks when every other character in the game loses their entire inventory after dying.

The Age-less clock I completely understand her respawning with she needs that to not die, but the OTHERS are all Additional Fluff, and being able to Respawn with them when no other character who dies respawns with any of their stuff is just Unfair.

People are complaining that “All those other characters items are Easy to recreate etc etc..” “Wanda’s watches need Thelucite and aren’t as easy to create..”

Yeah lets stop right there for a second: Yes CURRENTLY Thelucite may be seen as this “End-Game” Material that’s tough to get, but if past updates are any indication to go by, it WON’T remain that way.

Before Wormwood or Lunar Grotto Update: Getting Living Logs required finding non-replaceable Totally Normal Tree’s, Spawning and killing a Treeguardian.

Wormwood comes out, can craft living logs from himself out of no where.

Lunar Grotto comes out, can get Living logs from relatively easy to kill Mush Gnome mobs.

My point? There may be an update or character in the future that makes Thelucite just as passive & easy to gather as to how living logs are now.

So it’s important that we don’t think of characters how they play NOW, because as seen above future updates can and likely WILL impact them in significant ways.

Theres also the RWYS update which made getting food in Winter or Veggies for Wurt or Warly dishes a highly passive objective now.

Thank You for reading, just food for thought, have a nice day. 

[Pruinae]

There may not be an update or character in the future that makes Thulecite just as passive & easy to gather as to how living logs are now.

So it’s important that we think of characters how they play NOW, because we don't know how future updates can and likely WILL impact them in significant ways.

[Zeklo]

I disagree. Sure being mindful that changes to the game may cause a ripple effect is fine. But that doesn't mean we should hold out of giving criticism towards the current state of the game, nor give out criticism based on 'what if' scenarios. In this case, Thulecite being 'end-game' is part of what allows Wanda to be a somewhat balanced character. With this being discussed and stated, the hope is that Klei will keep that feedback in mind and not make Thulecite significantly easier to come by. Or, on the off chance they do, they'll know they have to revisit some balance on Wanda.

[HowlVoid]

Dust moths are a thing.

i know, I forget they exist too.

They just need to make it so they have a more usable and consistent number per world as @Ohan has been suggesting.

[Mike23Ua]

58 minutes ago, Zeklo said:

I disagree. Sure being mindful that changes to the game may cause a ripple effect is fine. But that doesn't mean we should hold out of giving criticism towards the current state of the game, nor give out criticism based on 'what if' scenarios. In this case, Thulecite being 'end-game' is part of what allows Wanda to be a somewhat balanced character. With this being discussed and stated, the hope is that Klei will keep that feedback in mind and not make Thulecite significantly easier to come by. Or, on the off chance they do, they'll know they have to revisit some balance on Wanda.

Meanwhile: 5 Characters yet to get reworks, a Season two story arch that explains the cliff hanger ending to whatever the heck Wagstaff is up to at the end of Return of Them, New characters, and QoL updates can completely tip the scales of balance 

In fact I would EVEN go so far as to say now that we can toggle off core game features like rather or not sanity monsters can spawn at all- Balance has long gone out the Window.

What matters now is fun, characters with unique abilities, biomes, mobs and just in general things to do…

And by the way yes Klei confirmed Return of Thems odd abrupt ending as a Season Finale.. not a SERIES Finale- which means there will be more story arch’s in the future, who knows.. maybe even one coming up really really soon.

But the point I’m trying so desperately to make? If the upcoming QoL allows us to for example toggle “Tons” on Ancient Statues: And those things will now spawn all over EVERYWHERE like how setting “Tons” on Clockworks now does to Clockwork monsters OR if Klei adds a new Biome like Ancient Library or updates an existing mobs behavior to passively drop it- Who other than Klei can say what is or isn’t balanced?

But the very fact that Wanda’s equipment requires this “currently” hard to obtain resources, yet she respawns with these items still in her inventory: Just sounds highly off… Whats the point?

And more importantly: How do we know there won’t be updates focused on adding MORE to the caves, ruins, ancient library- etc..

how do we know Wagstaff or some new character won’t become playable and one of their craftables becomes Thelucite? We DON’T Know..

Thats the purpose of this thread: we can’t complain about the status of the game how it plays NOW because Klei is probably thinking 4 to 5 updates ahead of anything We can possibly come up with.

But.. to give you the benefit of the doubt: IF Wanda’s kit is supposed to be this expensive near “end-game” materials, then Why exactly is she still respawning with them instead of having to craft more?

Klei is obviously AWARE of how much power and utility Wanda’s watches have- so Why is her dying with them so meaningless?

The Ageless I understand, but being able to teleport and open wormholes? Those watches need to drop wherever she recently kicked the bucket so she at least has SOME challenge in going to get them back.

[Zeklo]

6 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

Thats the purpose of this thread: we can’t complain about the status of the game how it plays NOW because Klei is probably thinking 4 to 5 updates ahead of anything We can possibly come up with.

You completely missed my point.

The idea of not giving feedback towards the game we have in the now, simply because more content is on the way is silly. So we're just supposed to wait... how many years until Klei stops updating the game? And then start giving feedback? By then the game might be constant (heh), but now it's not getting updated so what's the point of feedback at that point??

Giving feedback is essential while there is change happening. It's counterintuitive to withhold feedback because change is happening. 

6 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

But.. to give you the benefit of the doubt: IF Wanda’s kit is supposed to be this expensive near “end-game” materials, then Why exactly is she still respawning with them instead of having to craft more?

I really have no intention or desire to go into a "is Wanda balanced" discussion. The example you used was Thulecite being made more common, so that's the example I used. That's all. I have plenty of qualms with Wanda atm, that's besides by point.

[QuartzBeam]

On top of what Zeklo said, I believe you are heavily overestimating how far Klei plans things. As evidenced by the loads of scrapped concept art and ideas that Klei showcases in their streams, Klei's plans for the game go through a lot of iterations and generally end up in a very different place from where they started.

If Klei has a long-term plan for the game, that plan is vague as heck. There is no hundred page document sitting around the klei folders about how every single underappreciated item will one day have a worthwhile use. There can't be such a document, because Klei's ideas constantly change and evolve, often due to the feedback you are saying we shouldn't bother providing.

And I'll give you some concrete examples of this.

2019: Klei releases Wurt in October. Wurt needs 20 fish to make the Royal Tapestry. Then, Klei releases Hook, Line & Inker in November and fish suddenly become unstackable, so they have to remove the 20 fish from the Royal Tapestry's recipe because this new change made carrying 20 fish a pain in the butt.

Again, Wurt and HL&I were released just a month apart. If Klei had a fraction of the foresight you think they have, the fish would have never been required in the first place. But they were, because Klei hadn't planned far enough ahead to know that 20 fish would require 20 inventory slots just a month after they released this new fish-related character.

2020: Klei comes out with a roadmap that states they have no current plans to revisit existing mechanics or alter the core gameplay loop. Before the year is over, they released Reap What You Sow, which does exactly that.

You know what happened between the roadmap and RWYS? A whole lot of people complained about farming being absolutely terrible. Klei wasn't planning to overhaul farming in March 2020. They changed their plans based on the feedback they received.

 

2021: A few days after the Webber refresh went live, one of the devs stated that they hadn't even began to think about which character would be getting a refresh after Webber. So, the decision to give the last refresh of the year to Wolfgang was made sometime in the last month or so; just 4 months before the actual refresh comes out.

And chances are, based on their record, that the devs themselves don't know what the refresh will end up looking like yet.

[ArubaroBeefalo]

What an irony. The user which spam confusing, useless or even lie feedback ask others to dont share feedback in case klei alreadt though that

What the forum needs is useful feedback of players that plays the game first and talk later not people biased about things that doesnt know how works or because thinks that something is unbalanced without trying it

[Maxposting]

Mike, by the way you disable elements, you barely experienced the game, please learn what you are talking about. I'm not trying to be hurtful, just please think twice. Your thoughts are valuable, but sometimes you are saying nonsense about the game mechanics

[ArubaroBeefalo]

13 hours ago, Mike23Ua said:

But the very fact that Wanda’s equipment requires this “currently” hard to obtain resources, yet she respawns with these items still in her inventory: Just sounds highly off… Whats the point?

The real question is why you complain about something about a character you dont play

Maybe in a future update klei will give a reason for that clocks spawning with her so please, dont talk about it again because you dont know klei plans (:

[TemporarySolutn]

The way that life giving amulets exist is just unfair, albiet red gems arent the most common the fact that you can use gold and nightmare fuel to ignore death just makes the game too easy

 

Mike its just a portable touch stone, a thing that is already in the game, and a end game already know what you're doing item

Thread title is not a friendly reminder, it is you who goes on a tangent and complains

 

FURTHERMORE you are complaining about a QoL item, doesnt insta kill bosses or anything, just makes it so I don't have to rollback 1 day everytime I die or move straight towards a touch stone if I was even lucky enough to see it in the firstplace

 

Finally what you say about thuelicite becoming "passive & easy to gather" is honestly enraging, getting living logs as wornwood makes sense when (regen health is hard + cutting trees has negative effect + you need to cut alot for treegaurd) and you have no proof that "this is going to be in a next update" and nobody and i mean literally nobody agrees with you on this, this is a point where you really really should take a step back and think "yeah maybe i am over exaggerating" because you most certainly are, to the point this is past just a hot take

 

And honestly I hope they do make thuelicite a little easier to get because I never get my hands on the ****

[lakhnish]

If we followed what you were suggesting, it would leave the game to in a bad state. Lack of user feedback on the state of an update or content in general tells the devs nothing helpful on where things can be improved in the game.

It's been 2 years since the ocean became sailable and it's only recently with the Waterlogged update where the ocean started to have some interesting biomes to revisit, with only more to come as that is what they said would be their focus till the next arc.

Klei reads feedback, they listen, and make changes where they see fit. What you're suggesting is that people should stay silent on stuff that they feel the game is lacking or could use improvement.

Also, aren't you the one that didn't know that catcoons stole items on the ground and wanted catcoons to steal items from player's inventory instead cause of your misunderstanding? It seems that giving feedback only applies to you and not for other people :/

[Maxposting]

1 hour ago, lakhnish said:

aren't you the one that didn't know that catcoons stole items on the ground and wanted catcoons to steal items from player's inventory instead cause of your misunderstanding? It seems that giving feedback only applies to you and not for other people :/

He did also die to a moleworm taking his thermal stone. Oh well.

[ArubaroBeefalo]

11 minutes ago, __IvoCZE__ said:

He did also die to a moleworm taking his thermal stone. Oh well.

i remember dying in early dst because of that. Why did they change it? was hilarious

 

[ALCRD]

2 hours ago, lakhnish said:

Also, aren't you the one that didn't know that catcoons stole items on the ground and wanted catcoons to steal items from player's inventory instead cause of your misunderstanding? It seems that giving feedback only applies to you and not for other people :/

Wait .. Catcoons can steal items that are on the ground?

*PANIK cause my current base is in Deciduous Forest*

Hold on while i proceed to kill every single Catcoon in the area..

[QuartzBeam]

1 minute ago, ALCRD said:

Wait .. Catcoons can steal items that are on the ground?

It gets even worse: Catcoons don't have an inventory to store items in, so they just delete them. Meaning there is no way to retrieve the items they steal. At least that was the case in DS.

[ALCRD]

1 minute ago, QuartzBeam said:

It gets even worse: Catcoons don't have an inventory to store items in, so they just delete them. Meaning there is no way to retrieve the items they steal. At least that was the case in DS.

Oh my..

[Mike23Ua]

Why do you people expect someone to know every little thing, the in’s and the out’s of how every item, mob, structure, craftable etc in this game works? And then you INSULT them for their lack of knowledge? I’m sorry we can’t all be on a PC with console commands to know exactly how something works or how much damage something deals, or that Catcoons only take clocks when you leave them laying on the ground (when is anyone ever going to do that??!) 

I’m not about to even enlighten you guys by arguing back all I will ask is that you please stop, if you have nothing nice to contribute to the thoughts & feedback of the thread then honestly don’t bother commenting at all, this was just to remind people not to complain too much that Wanda’s clocks require Thelucite because how does ANYONE know there aren’t plans for new biomes, mobs, or even characters that make it more readily available?

I saw someone say cutting living logs from Wormwood costs him health- yeah but his health is easily recovered by sleeping in a tent so Meh..?

Or you need to lose sanity and chop trees to get Treeguards to spawn, alternatively.. you could just go down into the new-ish Lunar Grotto and kill the mobs down there for your living logs.

So who can say there won’t be enemies added in a future update MADE of Thelucite that drop it when killed?

Please be nice & remain respectful, thank you all and have a blessed day. <3

[Pig Princess]

53 minutes ago, QuartzBeam said:

At least that was the case in DS

It is the case in DST, last time I checked was about 2 weeks ago in my lights out world.

Speaking about feedback: one more example of this is march QoL, where not only bugs were fixed, but amount of entities on "tons", "little" and the like was adjusted, new toggles were added, including protection of new players right after joining server and starting items, as well as ability to change settings of already generated world. I doubt we would have that QoL if not for feedback.

On the contrary, not much people generate worlds with non-default settings for branches and loops, so not much feedback here, and I assume that is the reason why cave map is so wonky when loops are set to "always", e.i. biomes inaccessible without lazy explorer or at all, fractured labyrinth, etc. generate often.

[lakhnish]

45 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

I’m sorry we can’t all be on a PC with console commands to know exactly how something works or how much damage something deals, or that Catcoons only take clocks when you leave them laying on the ground (when is anyone ever going to do that??!) 

You don't need to be a PC player to notice that catcoons steal items off the floor. The difference here is that once a player learns the mechanic, how do they deal with the new knowledge: do they learn to adapt or do they complain cause it's not how they thought it worked and it should be how they thought it incorrectly worked.

45 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

this was just to remind people not to complain too much that Wanda’s clocks require Thelucite because how does ANYONE know there aren’t plans for new biomes, mobs, or even characters that make it more readily available?

It also doesn't take away the very real point mentioned by several people here that they can give feedback on how things currently are implemented on the game because the future is unknown.

Banking on the future without being able to provide feedback in the present is my beef atm.

Without that feedback at that moment, we wouldn't have a thing to look forward to in the future rather.

Just about every update shows that (look at all the feedback in Waterlogged, or look at when they patched year-round moslings and said they would look into it for the rain machine, or look at renewable volt goat herds).

For thul frags, you can go to the archive biome and hammer the thul walls to safely get thule frags.