Top-hat spooder

[DrMcGillacactus]

I was re-watching the latest Klei livestream, and they said something that caught my attention: "There's a hint for the Webber rework in the new gameplay trailer".

The one thing we see Webber doing is placing a top hat on a spider. Many people have already speculated that it would be a feature in the rework, but this basically confirms that Webber will be able to dress up his spider friends.
It's entirely possible they were referring to a completely different hint, but I think it's safe to assume it's that.

That is all.

[DarkPulse91]

Maybe it will be like wurt. Where she has merms instead of pigs.

Webber gets spiders that do what he asks like fighting or maybe even chopping and mining.

And much like pigs, they could have a sanity aura for Webber and you can put hats on then.

Just speculation of what MIGHT happen

[Dextops]

but what would be the use putting a football helmet on something that will die in 3 hits and get stunlocked and then die same goes with any dress clothing i would much rather have webber be able to make spider variation ex the long range spider armored spider ect ect

[DrMcGillacactus]

Just now, Dextops said:

but what would be the use putting a football helmet on something that will die in 3 hits and get stunlocked and then die same goes with any dress clothing i would much rather have webber be able to make spider variation ex the long range spider armored spider ect ect

We'll find out what it entails once it's out

[1moregame]

11 minutes ago, Dextops said:

but what would be the use putting a football helmet on something that will die in 3 hits and get stunlocked and then die same goes with any dress clothing i would much rather have webber be able to make spider variation ex the long range spider armored spider ect ect

A helmet would increase the number of hits before death...would be nice if it also prevented stun locking.  

[Dextops]

Just now, 1moregame said:

A helmet would increase the number of hits before death...would be nice if it also prevented stun locking.  

but it wouldn't be worth it because of their low health they would still die quickly

[Echsrick]

1 hour ago, Dextops said:

but it wouldn't be worth it because of their low health they would still die quickly

well warrior spiders exist

[1moregame]

1 minute ago, Dextops said:

but it wouldn't be worth it because of their low health they would still die quickly

Spider warriors would be the obvious choice for adding armor to.  They have more health than a pig.  Granted they don't kite, but still could be a benefit.

[Mike23Ua]

22 minutes ago, DarkPulse91 said:

Maybe it will be like wurt. Where she has merms instead of pigs.

Webber gets spiders that do what he asks like fighting or maybe even chopping and mining.

And much like pigs, they could have a sanity aura for Webber and you can put hats on then.

Just speculation of what MIGHT happen

Unless Webber can equip knives to his spiders or unless they can spit corrosive acid- I don’t think spiders should be able to mine and chop- Maybe they can gather silk, twigs, lose resources etc..

But anything else would just feel oddly out of place.

I would like to be able to put cute hats on them though just for the heck of it.

[Dextops]

and then again merms would still just be better since you can put helmets on them so it would just be a weaker merm

[BoysenSyrup]

...hat

[HowlVoid]

I'm honestly concerned. I wouldn't want another Wurt character in the game honestly. Merms are already worse than bunnymen imo and they are missing a lot of animations for smoother interactions. Will Webber have the same issues with a lack of animations in spiders? Hopefully its just a small thing and not the main selling point of the rework.

Some have said that the gif they teased could be an idle animation for a crafting tab? That's sounds better even if everyone is getting a crafting tab. I mean it's a crafting survival game .

[ShadowDuelist]

Going around with 4 permanent spitters that have a thulecite helmet and “maybe” can be healed somehow, does not sound bad at all. 

I mean a “pet” minigame would probably be alright too, to sort of tame your spiders,  and upgrade them so they stay with you permanently and accept hats and helmets.

And it would be quite different from Wurt.

[Cr4zyFl4mes]

1 hour ago, Dextops said:

but it wouldn't be worth it because of their low health they would still die quickly

based on wiki:

spiders have 100 hp (which is more than Maxwell and Wes btw), so saying it isn't worth it cause they have low health doesn't make much sense.

The football helmet has 315 durability and 80% resistance, so 1 football helmet perfectly covers their health. The helmet would break after 6 hits with dark sword and you'd still need 1 more hit to kill the spider. If we would ignore the stun-lock it protects them for the same amount of time as it protects pigs. The helmet's worth on spiders isn't tied to their HP, but to their DPS.

Also football helmet has 20% water resistance, so the spiders wouldn't get wet as quickly, which completely validates its use on them in and of itself.

[Dextops]

1 minute ago, Cr4zyFl4mes said:

based on wiki:

spiders have 100 hp (which is more than Maxwell and Wes btw), so saying it isn't worth it cause they have low health doesn't make much sense.

The football helmet has 315 durability and 80% resistance, so 1 football helmet perfectly covers their health. The helmet would break after 6 hits with dark sword and you'd still need 1 more hit to kill the spider. If we would ignore the stun-lock it protects them for the same amount of time as it protects pigs. The helmet's worth on spiders isn't tied to their HP, but to their DPS.

Also football helmet has 20% water resistance, so the spiders wouldn't get wet as quickly, which completely validates its use on them in and of itself.

touche

[Cr4zyFl4mes]

3 minutes ago, Dextops said:

touche

You like the water resistance argument, rigth?

[Mysterious box]

1 hour ago, HowlVoid said:

I'm honestly concerned. I wouldn't want another Wurt character in the game honestly. Merms are already worse than bunnymen imo and they are missing a lot of animations for smoother interactions. Will Webber have the same issues with a lack of animations in spiders? Hopefully its just a small thing and not the main selling point of the rework.

Some have said that the gif they teased could be an idle animation for a crafting tab? That's sounds better even if everyone is getting a crafting tab. I mean it's a crafting survival game .

While merms are missing things like the loyalty timer warning animation(kiel why?) and names to help keep track of them they surpass bunnymen in most areas like such as resource gathering, respawn speed, not sleeping, and hunger bonus that being said...

I wish we'd get word from Kiel if they ever intend to give us a way to tell when merm loyalty is close to ending it's super problematic for teamplay...

[HowlVoid]

22 minutes ago, Mysterious box said:

While merms are missing things like the loyalty timer warning animation(kiel why?) and names to help keep track of them they surpass bunnymen in most areas like such as

Bunnymen are great for their purpose, farming Bee Queen and dragonfly.

22 minutes ago, Mysterious box said:

resource gathering,

Deerclops can tople over 80 trees in a single day. Thats where I get my first supply of wood for chests and then there's bearger. People say well bearger needs a year before he spawns but I don't sit on my hands waiting for him. I actually DON'T need much wood until I'm setting up pig houses and bunnymen houses on year 2. Year 1 is for rushing the ruin and killing lots of bosses with my ruins gear.

22 minutes ago, Mysterious box said:

respawn speed,

I dunno man, once you have 50 set up respawn doesn't even matter. Plus, if I equip 20 or so with beekeeper helmets then only 3 or so die. With dragonfly, she actually only targets the player and ends up getting stun locked before long.

22 minutes ago, Mysterious box said:

not sleeping

They don't sleep in the middle of battle. Its not hard to plan ahead.

22 minutes ago, Mysterious box said:

, and hunger bonus that being said...

They automatically aggro onto bosses, you don't even need to feed them. Fence in their homes, get meat to lure them out, close gate and done! Know what I don't like? Merms watching me get my ass chewed out while they stand around doing nothing. This even happens DURING boss fight. They de-aggro because the boss is chasing me and the timer ran out, ok cool, let me die. Also respawn is butt during Winter, bunnymen don't stop all year. 

22 minutes ago, Mysterious box said:

I wish we'd get word from Kiel if they ever intend to give us a way to tell when merm loyalty is close to ending it's super problematic for teamplay...

They should fix the A.I with merms getting lost in the world first.

[Cheggf]

2 hours ago, Dextops said:

but it wouldn't be worth it because of their low health they would still die quickly

Assuming the helmet doesn't break, warrior spider would have 2,000 EHP with an 80% helmet, and 4,000 EHP with a 90% helmet. Spitters would have nearly as much health.

2 hours ago, Dextops said:

and then again merms would still just be better since you can put helmets on them so it would just be a weaker merm

Merms are a lot more expensive and lack a ranged attack. And merms aren't even the be-all-end-all like you think they are, they are more expensive than bunnymen while having less DPS (although more health). 

[Mysterious box]

9 minutes ago, HowlVoid said:

Bunnymen are great for their purpose, farming Bee Queen and dragonfly.

Deerclops can tople over 80 trees in a single day. Thats where I get my first supply of wood for chests and then there's bearger. People say well bearger needs a year before he spawns but I don't sit on my hands waiting for him. I actually DON'T need much wood until I'm setting up pig houses and bunnymen houses on year 2. Year 1 is for rushing the ruin and killing lots of bosses with my ruins gear.

I dunno man, once you have 50 set up respawn doesn't even matter. Plus, if I equip 20 or so with beekeeper helmets then only 3 or so die. With dragonfly, she actually only targets the player and ends up getting stun locked before long.

They don't sleep in the middle of battle. Its not hard to plan ahead.

They automatically aggro onto bosses, you don't even need to feed them. Fence in their homes, get meat to lure them out, close gate and done! Know what I don't like? Merms watching me get my ass chewed out while they stand around doing nothing. This even happens DURING boss fight. They de-aggro because the boss is chasing me and the timer ran out, ok cool, let me die. Also respawn is butt during Winter, bunnymen don't stop all year. 

They should fix the A.I with merms getting lost in the world first.

While using bearager is fine merms can mine thru more than enough rocks and trees to make them a good option they are multipurpose with use outside of boss fights they work as followers people don't really use bunnymen as followers they just exploit their a.i. it's basically the same as calling bearager a follower. Merms eat any non meat food so getting food to recruit them is a non issue. If the timer is a issue just boost their loyalty timers to 16 mins before the start of the boss fight.

[Copyafriend]

On 5/10/2021 at 5:32 PM, Cheggf said:

Assuming the helmet doesn't break, warrior spider would have 2,000 EHP with an 80% helmet, and 4,000 EHP with a 90% helmet. Spitters would have nearly as much health.

250 x 5 = 1250 250 x 10 = 2500 assuming you replace the armor perfectly.

Also assuming the helmet wont break is a big assumption to make, and spiders only deal 20 damage, half as much as a buffed regular merm.

a warrior spider with a football helm (a whole pigskin and rope each) is 565 ehealth. Only fractionally  better than a buffed merms base health without a helmet.

A spider with a thulecite crown will do better at 1090, but lets be honest we both know either pigs bunnymen or merms would be a better pick on damage alone.

four hits from any seasonal boss and your helmet and spider are dead, and thats ignoring the fact that most seasonal bosses will hit your whole swarm, wiping out any basic ones in the first attack, any unarmored ones in the second, and any armored ones in the third. Not that merms or pigs would do much better, but they might dodge an attack or two at least. 
my point isnt that webber and his spider army are bad, just that adding armor isnt an easy fix to webber’s weak minions. They need utility or the other variants to be more useful. A spitter wont need armor because its not going to be within range, it could help with even deerclops if you’re careful. Cave spiders are good distraction, and normal spider/warrior are cheap disposables for minor threats. 
finally before any spiderwar arguments for utility, wendy can farm spiders fast as if not faster than webber.

[sudoku]

it would be strange to allow football helmets for spiders based on the sheer amount of spiders webber can amass. Maybe they could have their own specialed armor made from silk that helps them a bit, but i would like to see Webbers army playstyle more focused on numbers that are easily replenishable but weak. You know kinda like a zerg-like playstlye from Starcraft.

[HowlVoid]

On 5/10/2021 at 3:38 PM, Mysterious box said:

While using bearager is fine merms can mine thru more than enough rocks and trees to make them a good option they are multipurpose with use outside of boss fights they work as followers people don't really use bunnymen as followers they just exploit their a.i. it's basically the same as calling bearager a follower. Merms eat any non meat food so getting food to recruit them is a non issue. If the timer is a issue just boost their loyalty timers to 16 mins before the start of the boss fight.

I kinda forgot to reply... What I mean is that merms arent unique enough, in my opinion, to base an entire character around them and only them. Merms should have something unique that truly sets the apart from other followers and being able to gather resources is not exactly unique.

[Masked Koopa]

Merm uniqueness comes from the fact that they're just all around very consistent and cheap to set up. They lack the downsides of pigs when it comes to time of day, as well as ability to mine petrified forests, meaning they can be used to gather flint for roads and nitre for salt licks. Their general versatility makes bunnymen and pigs nigh redundant as minions, making them only really useful for spider farming/pigskin production. While bunnymen may have higher raw dps, merm guards compensate this through a much higher HP stat as well as cheaper setup cost. 30 merm guards can kill a bee queen with zero help from the player, and no beekeeper hats required, with the only active cost being 30 uncooked juicy berries.

It would be very hard to make spiders compete on a combat or logging/mining front, especially since so much of the power of merms comes from the king. I've said this before, but I'd like to see spiders be able to do what eyeplants can; bite off grass tufts and eat items from the ground, so they can spit them out at webber's feet. That would make them insanely useful in both the early game, as well as late game for large scale logging/mining. Trying to make them compete with merms directly just isn't feasible.

[Dextops]

34 minutes ago, Masked Koopa said:

Merm uniqueness comes from the fact that they're just all around very consistent and cheap to set up. They lack the downsides of pigs when it comes to time of day, as well as ability to mine petrified forests, meaning they can be used to gather flint for roads and nitre for salt licks. Their general versatility makes bunnymen and pigs nigh redundant as minions, making them only really useful for spider farming/pigskin production. While bunnymen may have higher raw dps, merm guards compensate this through a much higher HP stat as well as cheaper setup cost. 30 merm guards can kill a bee queen with zero help from the player, and no beekeeper hats required, with the only active cost being 30 uncooked juicy berries.

It would be very hard to make spiders compete on a combat or logging/mining front, especially since so much of the power of merms comes from the king. I've said this before, but I'd like to see spiders be able to do what eyeplants can; bite off grass tufts and eat items from the ground, so they can spit them out at webber's feet. That would make them insanely useful in both the early game, as well as late game for large scale logging/mining. Trying to make them compete with merms directly just isn't feasible.

couldn't have agreed more the spiders shouldn't be focused on combat (unless webber can make the long range shield spider which could prove useful and give him diversity with the gatherers and the fighters) but they aren't that all good and being able to gather tedious  resources quickly would not only be good but a relief from a big pain in the a** other characters suffer from