I made thulecite crowns (almost) obsolete using math

[Seero]

 

I'm using health as a point system, you don't actually get this much health when doing this, since you still take damage

Long post, did this for fun you decide if crowns are obsolete

Lets say we have 4 green gems, Let's also say that we just turned those green gems into 2 deconstruction staves and two construction amulets.

What do we do with them?
if we have 30 Thulecite and 20 Nightmare Fuel

We can double it into 60 Thulecite and 40 Nightmare Fuel using Thulecite Suits.

That turns around into 10 crowns, 15 if you have enough Nightmare Fuel.

I'm going to measure in armor durability each crown in DST has 840 health

840 x 10 = 8400 840 x 15 = 12600 

So if we use 4 green gems to their fullest potential, the maximum amount of health we can technically have is 12600.

Now what if instead of making 10-15 crowns

We used these green gems to duplicate pig houses

To avoid doing probability i'm going to multiply every pig house by .25 since each pig has a 25% chance to drop pig skin, and then i'll count for werepigs.

I'll also not count the stone because its an odd amount needed to craft and im not sure how the Construction amulet deals with odd numbers

there are 10 pig houses you can deconstruct

you can reconstruct them into 15 pighouses  20 if you had 2 more construction amulets.

15 x .25 = 3.75 football helmets per pig war

15 x 1 = 15 per werepig slaughter

Football helmets are a mere 315 he

315 x 3.75 = 1181.25 health

315 x 15 = 4725 

They also protect you for 10% less then the crown does, (80)

it costs 60 monster meat to do the werepig method

and you can repeat this process every 4 days

Here is the formula to determine how much health you can get over a certain amount of days:

(days) / 4 = X

(amount of health) * X = the amount of health you get over a certain period of days

You get 17.5 harvests in 70 days If we plug this into the calculator with the werepig method thats equals too

17.5 x 4725 = 81506.25

1035 monster meat.

Assuming killing fuelweaver nets you only 4 green gems, 30 thulecite and 20 nightmare fuel

you can do the thulecite method 3.5 times a year

which is 44100, only half the amount. But with dragonfly, ancient guardian and the ruins itself chances are that you might get more thulecite and green gems then I've mentioned. 

So is this method worth it? It really depend, I didn't account for a lot of things such as

Thulecite crown invincibility

the fact that pig houses are also a source of food and weapons.

the fact that instead of spending all of your pigskin on helmets, you can spend it on more pig houses. 

this was only done with 15 pig houses, where a really good pig farm requires a lot more then 30.

But each pighouses adds 70 monster meat to the annual pool

The amount of pig houses/pig heads in a world.

Probability plays a HUGE role in this as well, the way I did it by taking drop chances and using them as a coefficient was not accurate, it's just an estimation

it assumes you will get pig skins 25% of the time guaranteed when you could get more or less since it's a probability.

 

[prezera]

But they look cool

[ArubaroBeefalo]

I prefer 90% protection than watching my hp all the time and bringing with me healings, anyways i always have a chest with pig skin that i never use, but still being interesting

 

[GelatinousCube]

Great detailed experiment and math here!

Just a few notes that are maybe relevant.

If you are getting your thul by clearing ruins then just like with pig houses there are plenty of other resource being obtained at the same time, each ruins clear will get you gears, all the other coloured gems, trinkets etc as well as the thul, nightmare fuel and gems for the helms. You'll end up with Clubs and whatnot as well as the crowns.

The Pig Farming method can be pretty time consuming if you are actually doing it every four days, also time and inventory slots consuming to be making so many Football Helms.

Also the whole experiment applies to everyone but Wigfrid as Battle Helms are massively better than Football Helms and MUCH cheaper than Thul Crowns, as a Wig main I genuinely don't remember the last time I made a Football Helmet, all my pig skins go towards hambats or get hoarded away in chests.

Just now, ArubaroBeefalo said:

I prefer 90% protection than watching my hp all the time and bringing with me healings but still being interesting

This too, much less healing required with Thul Crowns/Battle Helms and you don't have to keep quite as close an eye on your health. The more times you are eating or getting some distance to heal up the less DPS you're doing to your target.

[Cheggf]

This isn't making the Thulecite Crown obsolete, this is just saying that you can use green gems to duplicate pig houses to create an inferior armor that requires more healing items. Pig houses aren't even particularly difficult to amass unless you're on a public server where someone smashed every single one then logged off. If I saw someone greenstaffing pig houses I'd start spamming the /cry emote next to them since that staff could be used for better things like duplicating resources which don't automatically appear every couple of days or making iridescent gems to reverse pickpocket into new players' inventories.

[Seero]

1 minute ago, Cheggf said:

This isn't making the Thulecite Crown obsolete, this is just saying that you can use green gems to duplicate pig houses to create an inferior armor that requires more healing items. Pig houses aren't even particularly difficult to amass unless you're on a public server where someone smashed every single one then logged off. If I saw someone greenstaffing pig houses I'd start spamming the /cry emote next to them since that staff could be used for better things like duplicating resources which don't automatically appear every couple of days or making iridescent gems to reverse pickpocket into new players' inventories.

well the title would've been clickbait if I didn't put the (almost) in there.

it really depends on how you play, also if someone gets a greenstaff and starts using it on pig houses, I wouldn't really care, I'd think it would be funny to see

also

13 minutes ago, ArubaroBeefalo said:

I prefer 90% protection than watching my hp all the time and bringing with me healings, anyways i always have a chest with pig skin that i never use, but still being interesting

 

is 10% that big of a difference? I can't say that I relate because I am very used to checking my health like it's breathing because I play Maxwell all the time

[Cheggf]

1 minute ago, Seero said:

is 10% that big of a difference?

It is an enormous difference, yes. Instead of looking it as the difference between 80% and 90% protection look at it backwards: the difference between 10% and 20% damage taken. You are taking half the damage the football helmet would have you take.

[Seero]

Just now, Cheggf said:

It is an enormous difference, yes. Instead of looking it as the difference between 80% and 90% protection look at it backwards: the difference between 10% and 20% damage taken. You are taking half the damage the football helmet would have you take.

holy crap is that how armor works? that COMPLETELY changes things in Thulecite Crown's favor I did not know this

 

[Owlrust]

1 hour ago, Seero said:

1035 monster meat.

Constant news reporter: "This just in, local spider folk and hounds go into hiding as mass-killings devastate the entire constant. Spider Queens and state Vargs convened this Autumn to discuss the matter in detail, and have made this shocking announcement":

Spider Queens representative: "Over the past 70 days we have experienced a loss far outreaching that than we could combat against; the enemy kites too well and refuses to re-plant spider eggs after destroying our dens. Hound mounds are in threat of closing after repeated camping operations by the enemy, many Vargs are suffering from health problems involving their throat in an attempt to keep their hound numbers steady via roaring. Spider Warriors are in short supply and recruits are barely hatched. We may very well lose this battle with the way things are going if things do not change for the better. We can only hope this Winter will prove enough a challenge to our enemy so that we may re-group in that time."

Constant news reporter: "With these new announcements come new regulations for the community as well. Spider hatchlings are to now board with any cave-dwelling or lunar relatives in an attempt to slow the massacre, and spiders are urged to leave their dens only at night for the time being. MacTusks are now taking applications for hounds of any kind to take with them in the off seasons; a significant relief for desparate hound parents whom have taken the liberty of painting their pups' coat white to fool the Yule-Hound Review Committee (YHRC). We have yet to get a word from the Pig King on this matter, but we will keep you posted as time goes on. Stay safe out there Constant, and as always, Don't Starve."

[ArubaroBeefalo]

6 hours ago, Seero said:

well the title would've been clickbait if I didn't put the (almost) in there.

it really depends on how you play, also if someone gets a greenstaff and starts using it on pig houses, I wouldn't really care, I'd think it would be funny to see

also

is 10% that big of a difference? I can't say that I relate because I am very used to checking my health like it's breathing because I play Maxwell all the time

Well what do you prefer, receiving 20 damage or 10? Most bosses deal +70 damage. Also the shield prevents stun lock so it can save you from situation where you will die with other kind of armor, think that 1 hound might sound weak (and still doing a great damage to an unprotectec character) but receiving 5 hits at the same time is a lot of damage so having that 10% extra makes a big difference. 

For that i only use beequeen hat and cookie cutter helmet with another armor with better protection, to have the hight durability of the hemlet but the protection of the bone armor or thulecite armor but, in terms of efficiency/protectioon, wearing a crown is the best you can do

[00petar00]

Difference between 80% and 90% protection is huge, if you look at the damage daken, you take double the damage with football helmet.

There's also thulectite crown ability to consider, at least it can save you when nothing else can.

Why do you kill fuelweaver when you want green gems? In my megabasing worlds, i have winona catapults set at dragonfly and i kill it every 20 days. If you don't want to megabase or waste a lot of resources, its not hard to use Wickerbottom's tentacles, they are much cheaper to set up or you can use Wolfgang but it may require much more resources unless you know how to kite it well.

I only kill Fuelweaver like once every 100-250 ingame days, depending on how fast i spend resources gathered from caves. That is for me as a solo player.

Obviously you shouldn't be using thulecite crown on weak enemies and allow them to hit you and damage the crown. The best option is usually to just switch between crown and football helmet for efficiency. It is possible for you to always use crown, but if that is what you want, you need to kite everything to the best of your ability, so you don't get hit by spiders or anything that isn't a boss.

[BeeClops]

I'm also on the crown train, i almost never use pig helms after my first ruins trip.

Both the damage difference and the durability are huge deals imo. When I rely on pig helms for armor, i have to carry pigskin and ropes on me, bc the helm will break decently fast when i fight, on the other hand with the crown i just carry 1 piece, it is durable enough that i don't need to use more than 1 inventory slot with armor, instead of 3, and just plan a little ahead when it's about to break.

It's been highlighted above, but the difference between 10 and 20% is huge and you'll end up needing much less healing when using crowns.

[me real life]

You can't use math to make an item "obsolete" in a sandbox game. There's way too many factors to account for, which vary from player to player.

[Psychomaniac]

Tldr: USE Football helmets (Like i always do, even before reading this). Right ?!

P/s: When you master the art of kiting, you can fight Bosses as any char..... NAKED & came out NO dmg taken.

[W0l0l0]

You could always be a hipster and use Shelmets.

(Damn I wish you could get them easier  ) 

[Primalflower]

you are trying to play dont starve like oxygen not included...the actual things that matter id say in terms of making something "obsolete" is conveniency...football helms can be acquired infinitely easier and in more mass if you use something like the moonstone method to farm pigskin in mass... that sentence does orders of magnitude more to me in the way of making me think that the thulecite crown is obsolete compared to throwing numbers of hp blocked per green gems...

[Seero]

16 hours ago, Sunset Skye said:

You can't use math to make an item "obsolete" in a sandbox game. There's way too many factors to account for, which vary from player to player.

watch as I account for all of these arbitrary factors next time

[goatt]

On 12/26/2020 at 7:05 PM, Seero said:

which is 44100, only half the amount.

The assumption this comparison is based on, is not so relevant to my regular play. I don't dedicate myself to clearing ruins 3.5 times a year. I don't do pigs every 4 days like a ritual. I don't even clear ruins whenever I can.

Yes it's only half the amount assuming compared in durability hit points and within this framework. But it wouldn't change anything for me, because this is not the primary reason why I choose football helmet or crown. So I don't really think it's obsolete.

This is just a reader's feedback. Not all readers, just me.

[BeeClops]

20 hours ago, Psychomaniac said:

Tldr: USE Football helmets (Like i always do, even before reading this). Right ?!

P/s: When you master the art of kiting, you can fight Bosses as any char..... NAKED & came out NO dmg taken.

kiting is a waste of time in the mid-late game

[Psychomaniac]

14 minutes ago, BeeClops said:

waste of time

Does playing games itself is somewhat "a waste of time" already?!  

[BeeClops]

1 minute ago, Psychomaniac said:

Does playing games itself is somewhat "a waste of time" already?!  

Generally it is, since there are probably more productive things to do in life, but don't make me question my life choices this early in the day  . However my point is that kiting is less effective than tanking in most fights if you have late game gear.

[MondayNight]

It also depends on how often you get hit/damaged during various combat scenarios - aka your general combat proficiency. If that frequency is high, better stick with what armor you think you can burn more of without feeling its cost - most likely Pig Skin as is way easier to amass in high quantity as opposed to Thulecite. Likewise Wood/Marble suits are a most-valid option, if one finds amassing their raw materials easier and combat use higher compared to Pig Skin and/or Thulecite. Various options pliable on one's play-style.

[ArubaroBeefalo]

On 12/27/2020 at 1:12 PM, Psychomaniac said:

Tldr: USE Football helmets (Like i always do, even before reading this). Right ?!

P/s: When you master the art of kiting, you can fight Bosses as any char..... NAKED & came out NO dmg taken.

and for that the crown is better, 1 crown can last in game years

[Psychomaniac]

23 minutes ago, ArubaroBeefalo said:

the crown is better

Sure, with that much effort to create it (compare to a Football Helmet), it has to be better.

23 minutes ago, ArubaroBeefalo said:

1 crown can last in game years

Theoretically, when you take no dmg, any armors will last forever.

[Seero]

 

4 hours ago, Psychomaniac said:

Theoretically, when you take no dmg, any armors will last forever.

Theoretically armor is obsolete if you take no damage

also I think i've reached a conclusion on this math experiment

we need to use body slot armor more. Log suits aren't bound by pig skin or thulecite and NIGHT ARMOR is pretty busted if you are usually insane and have a ton of papyrus it's so ridiculously cheap

that is only 12 reeds for an armor that protects you for 95% damage the crown only protects you for 90 and the thulcite suit also protects for 90%