Comment your Oasis tactics!

[natanstarke]

Hi ppl! I want to bring a fun discussion about your tactics for oasis while we wait for the crash fix to keep our testings! As for me i was doing the following.

Food: meal lice as in all other maps but the ones we can rush mushrooms when possible.

Water: i rush bathrooms to get a little surplus.

External heat: i insulate the entire oasis " green area " when possible double layer. 

Expansion: carefull digging avoiding sand when possible to not be buried alive and spam hatch ranches all of them eating sand.

Power: that was my flaw i was using wood gens which brought more problems than solutions i will change to manual generators.

Oxygen: oxyferns and protect them with your life!

Wild farming: only for trees and when possible ferns the rest of crops just dont grow.

Other considerations:

- i try to keep the crops next to the printer where the green area is even safer.

- i try to use as little water as possible.

- im liking to start with a cook researcher and supplyer this combination makes early building faster and i avoid making mushbars like my life was on line because of them " it is" thats why the cook is rushed. The supplyer helps you more than a miner here because expansion is just too slow and brings heat each step taken.

- i use only 3 or 4 dupes max 5 to need less resources and have time to build the mass ranchs " they helped me expand.

- this one i do not tested but im thinking about not using wood all together and let then be in the ground for a very slow passive cooling " good design here im impressed even :)". Even impressed by idk how effective it will but im looking foward to it.

World traits:

Im playing all my maps not only oasis with subsurface ocean " except for oceania", geo active or buried oil, medium boulders/geodes and frozen core/volcanos.

[Lurve]

I don't know how reliable it is, but when I tried Oasis a few patches ago, irregular oil without subsurface ocean made a ring of oil biomes outside the ring of sand biomes.  Double the cherry-red fun!

That time, I was lucky enough to find a polluted o2 vent just outside.  With wild oxyfern and toilet offgassing I had just enough for my three dupes.  Unfortunately the starter biome had a cross shape, which really complicated insulating it.  I'd probably go with a researcher/supplier who prioritizes farming, a miner, and a builder/supplier, and spend the water on farmed oxyferns to reduce CO2.  There was a lot of gasping for air in the bottom section.

[ETA] I should add, I stopped playing that map because I found a cool slush geyser, and then it was like "welp, that's this game solved."

[EnderCN]

I didn't find this one very hard.  I insulated the worst parts of my base.  Set up oxyferns on the bottom of my base.  I let the pips plant a ton of wild mealwood.  Then i just built one tunnel out of the base until I found a bunch of algae and a salt biome.  At that point I had plenty of O2, plenty of water and was moving towards hatch farms for food.  The heat didn't seem like that big of an issue while staying small, it just made it obnoxious to expand.  Of course that is just one game, quite possible I got an easier starting area.

Not sure why you need a cook early.  Liceloaf isn't worth it, just eat the raw mealwood.  I play with food reqs turned up one notch and still never had a food issue as long as you start it fast enough (I start planting cycle 2 or 3).

I did end up quitting that game because the patch with the new map features hit and I wanted to try those.  I think the heat would have been a much bigger issue moving to mid game than it was early game.  Especially with the new changes to fixed temp outputs.  That probably ups the challenge a lot on this one.

 

[natanstarke]

12 minutes ago, EnderCN said:

I didn't find this one very hard.  I insulated the worst parts of my base.  Set up oxyferns on the bottom of my base.  I let the pips plant a ton of wild mealwood.  Then i just built one tunnel out of the base until I found a bunch of algae and a salt biome.  At that point I had plenty of O2, plenty of water and was moving towards hatch farms for food.  The heat didn't seem like that big of an issue while staying small, it just made it obnoxious to expand.  Of course that is just one game, quite possible I got an easier starting area.

Not sure why you need a cook early.  Liceloaf isn't worth it, just eat the raw mealwood.  I play with food reqs turned up one notch and still never had a food issue as long as you start it fast enough (I start planting cycle 2 or 3).

I did end up quitting that game because the patch with the new map features hit and I wanted to try those.  I think the heat would have been a much bigger issue moving to mid game than it was early game.  Especially with the new changes to fixed temp outputs.  That probably ups the challenge a lot on this one.

 

I rush the grill for picled meals! yes your right its not that hard start but hard to expand a harder start is aridia " have you played it?" Its like rime you cant have crops right from the start you have to live on mush bars AND in my case i had only 1 pool of eater accessible oo. Its a fun map too anyway.

Today if the crashes stop i plan on playing rime first time.

15 minutes ago, Lurve said:

I don't know how reliable it is, but when I tried Oasis a few patches ago, irregular oil without subsurface ocean made a ring of oil biomes outside the ring of sand biomes.  Double the cherry-red fun!

That time, I was lucky enough to find a polluted o2 vent just outside.  With wild oxyfern and toilet offgassing I had just enough for my three dupes.  Unfortunately the starter biome had a cross shape, which really complicated insulating it.  I'd probably go with a researcher/supplier who prioritizes farming, a miner, and a builder/supplier, and spend the water on farmed oxyferns to reduce CO2.  There was a lot of gasping for air in the bottom section.

[ETA] I should add, I stopped playing that map because I found a cool slush geyser, and then it was like "welp, that's this game solved."

I know the feeling i love/ hate coolslushs for that.

[asdf11784]

It's not really as bad as it first looks.Your dupes can handle temperatures up to about 73 degrees (in oxygen or carbon dioxide at least, just don't leave liquids lying around), so you can mostly wander around the map without atmo suits still to get whatever resources you need (some areas get too hot, but generally the areas around geysers and other biomes will have been cooled down somewhat so you can usually go everywhere that you actually want to go). Keeping your farm at the right temperature is still the only real consideration, and if you build your farm at the center of your base and avoid putting heat producing buildings near it them it will stay under 30 degrees for probably about 200-300 cycles (more if you insulate it) which is plenty of time to get everything you need. I don't really treat it that much differently from other maps, except that I make an effort to find one of the oil biomes early on so I can get a lot of refined metal (lead) very easily. Finding a swamp biome for gold amalgam is also a pretty big priority for me too. If you're ever in any real trouble, you can switch to farming waterweeds (they can handle temperatures up to iirc. 65 degrees) which gives plenty of breathing room too.

 

When you get to the stage of the game where you want to cool the map down, you may want to consider having a storage room in a vacuum so you can dig up the map and sweep all the ~70 degrees stuff off the ground which will make it much, much easier to cool down.

[natanstarke]

19 minutes ago, asdf11784 said:

It's not really as bad as it first looks.Your dupes can handle temperatures up to about 73 degrees (in oxygen or carbon dioxide at least, just don't leave liquids lying around), so you can mostly wander around the map without atmo suits still to get whatever resources you need (some areas get too hot, but generally the areas around geysers and other biomes will have been cooled down somewhat so you can usually go everywhere that you actually want to go). Keeping your farm at the right temperature is still the only real consideration, and if you build your farm at the center of your base and avoid putting heat producing buildings near it them it will stay under 30 degrees for probably about 200-300 cycles (more if you insulate it) which is plenty of time to get everything you need. I don't really treat it that much differently from other maps, except that I make an effort to find one of the oil biomes early on so I can get a lot of refined metal (lead) very easily. Finding a swamp biome for gold amalgam is also a pretty big priority for me too. If you're ever in any real trouble, you can switch to farming waterweeds (they can handle temperatures up to iirc. 65 degrees) which gives plenty of breathing room too.

 

When you get to the stage of the game where you want to cool the map down, you may want to consider having a storage room in a vacuum so you can dig up the map and sweep all the ~70 degrees stuff off the ground which will make it much, much easier to cool down.

Nice really good ideas too :), lead is amazing i agree i like to use them all inside the base for automation and metal tiles. I need to experiment more with water weeds right now they just make me sad " same for beans".

About the vaccum are i guess we dont need it to be vaccum if everything there is same temp lets say 70c then in theory it would stay thhe same without machinerys close by then we can just make a hole and put automatic dispensers with sweep only mode :).

 

[EnderCN]

43 minutes ago, natanstarke said:

I rush the grill for picled meals!

Why are you making pickled meals?  I mean if you are the type that doesn't believe in using CO2 to store food I guess this makes some sense.  Pickling just removes germs and makes food take longer to spoil, it doesn't add calories. I mean I think I would rather rush a refrigerator rather than pickling.  I just use a CO2 pit.

[beowulf2010]

1 hour ago, natanstarke said:

- this one i do not tested but im thinking about not using wood all together and let then be in the ground for a very slow passive cooling " good design here im impressed even :)". Even impressed by idk how effective it will but im looking foward to it.

Not too effective just laying on the ground. Fairly effective once you have conveyor rails and can run the wood through granite or metal walls. 

[asdf11784]

1 hour ago, natanstarke said:

Nice really good ideas too :), lead is amazing i agree i like to use them all inside the base for automation and metal tiles. I need to experiment more with water weeds right now they just make me sad " same for beans".

About the vaccum are i guess we dont need it to be vaccum if everything there is same temp lets say 70c then in theory it would stay thhe same without machinerys close by then we can just make a hole and put automatic dispensers with sweep only mode :).

 

The main selling point of waterweeds to me is just the temperature range it works in - they can handle very high temperatures, so if your base does get to a point where it's getting too hot and you can't deal with it yet then waterweeds are an easy way to get more food. They're definitely not something you should plan to be using as a long term solution since it's difficult to make them sustainable, but as a short term solution they can work if you're in trouble. It's only really a problem if your base starts going above 30 degrees since the jungle biome has nearly infinite amounts of dirt to use mealwood as long as you need to.

[natanstarke]

3 hours ago, EnderCN said:

Why are you making pickled meals?  I mean if you are the type that doesn't believe in using CO2 to store food I guess this makes some sense.  Pickling just removes germs and makes food take longer to spoil, it doesn't add calories. I mean I think I would rather rush a refrigerator rather than pickling.  I just use a CO2 pit.

I use the co2 pit its because picled meal uses 0 water and the liceloafs uses water. Im using mealwoods a lot now i cant see to find another food source for mid game then late game i try to live on barbeque and maybe just maybe some stuffed berrys. Having been thinking about some stuff and maybe just switch to eating normal gristle berrys for some of my dupes late game.

3 hours ago, beowulf2010 said:

Not too effective just laying on the ground. Fairly effective once you have conveyor rails and can run the wood through granite or metal walls. 

It makes them more effective? Thanks good to know! As for i was playing a little bit sooner but had to stop "i was getting to the point of making bathrooms so yeah would crash non stop so i just saved and an now waiting im hoping they at least rollback the update if they cant solve the new system problem.

Ps: on this oasis map i got an even harder start with even less water but so far the plan of using farms in the middle is working :).

[beowulf2010]

1 hour ago, natanstarke said:

It makes them more effective? Thanks good to know! As for i was playing a little bit sooner but had to stop "i was getting to the point of making bathrooms so yeah would crash non stop so i just saved and an now waiting im hoping they at least rollback the update if they cant solve the new system problem.

Debris on the ground doesn't transfer heat to anything but the gas or liquid it is in. And with the low mass that gas has, it takes a while. 

Things on conveyors get an additional significant multiplier (might be 25, probably is 200 as Mathmanican mentioned, we have a few code divers that should be able to tell us the actual number) on the transfer/exchange of heat with the tiles they are moving resulting in much faster energy exchanges and cooler tiles to radiate the heat/cold into the surrounding air/buildings. 

This is why you see most metal volcano setups grabbing the hot metal and running it on a conveyor line through metal tiles cooled by liquid pipes running though the same tiles. (Sorry I don't have a picture of mine to show.) 

[natanstarke]

4 minutes ago, beowulf2010 said:

Debris on the ground doesn't transfer heat to anything but the gas or liquid it is in. And with the low mass that gas has, it takes a while. 

Things on conveyors get an additional multiplier of 25 on the transfer/exchange of heat with the tiles they are moving resulting in much faster energy exchanges and cooler tiles to radiate the heat/cold into the surrounding air/buildings. 

This is why you see most metal volcano setups grabbing the hot metal and running it on a conveyor line through metal tiles cooled by liquid pipes running though the same tiles. (Sorry I don't have a picture of mine to show.) 

Seems to combo well using metal tiles made of lead and maybe ice too. Even powering turbines with regolith on rails i guess.

 

[mathmanican]

3 minutes ago, beowulf2010 said:

multiplier of 25

It might actually be 200. I believe @Angpaur could clarify this, or @NightinGale.  I will then have been quite guilty of spreading a false "25 multiplier" fact.  Either way, passing stuff through rails greatly accelerates the heat exchange, so very well worth it.  

[asdf11784]

Conveyor rails providing faster heat exchange is also largely because it splits it up into smaller chunks - 10 different piles of 20kg will exchange heat much faster than 1 pile of 200kg will. If you've ever watched the temperature of something like 10t of a material on the floor, it takes ages for it to heat up/cool down, much longer than a small pile would.

[beowulf2010]

1 hour ago, mathmanican said:

It might actually be 200. I believe @Angpaur could clarify this, or @NightinGale.  I will then have been quite guilty of spreading a false "25 multiplier" fact.  Either way, passing stuff through rails greatly accelerates the heat exchange, so very well worth it.  

Gotcha. I'll edit the initial post. Thanks. 

[EnderCN]

2 hours ago, natanstarke said:

I use the co2 pit its because picled meal uses 0 water and the liceloafs uses water. Im using mealwoods a lot now i cant see to find another food source for mid game then late game i try to live on barbeque and maybe just maybe some stuffed berrys. Having been thinking about some stuff and maybe just switch to eating normal gristle berrys for some of my dupes late game.

If you are storing them in co2 and you aren't using mealwood with food poisoning on it, pickling doesn't do anything at all.  You are spending a bunch of dupe time for no gain.  3 raw mealwood give the exact same calories as the resulting pickled mealwood you get.  The only thing pickling does is removes germs and lengthens the time it takes to rot.

[Angpaur]

On 5.07.2019 at 10:34 PM, mathmanican said:

It might actually be 200. I believe @Angpaur could clarify this, or @NightinGale.  I will then have been quite guilty of spreading a false "25 multiplier" fact.  Either way, passing stuff through rails greatly accelerates the heat exchange, so very well worth it.  

There are 2 different equations for for debris:

Debris in a Tile: q = klow * dT * 200

Debris on a Tile: q = klow * dT * 12.5

Rails refer to the first one and multiplier is 200.

When debris lie one a tile it still transfers heat with the tile, even in vacuum, but at a much slower rate, because multiplier is 12.5.

And indeed there is a 25 multplier as well, for gas to solid tiles interactions.

All info can be found here: 

 

[Zakery]

Is it normal, that i can"t find any water/slush/cool staem geysers on oasis map?

i find 6 magma volcano, 1 iron, 1 copper, 2 hydrogen, 2 NG, 2 Chlorine, 2 Hot Carbone, 2 leaky oil, 1 hot steam and any normal water source.....

I can transfer some lamber for water, but its too limited source.

 

[EnderCN]

Oasis has no rust or ice biome so you should still be getting cool steam vents at the very least.  It used to be you always got 1 in caustic and 1 in swamp.  I don't know if that has changed with the new biomes added.

[metallichydra]

here's a picture of my oasis base:

as you can see, my petroleum generator makes a lot of carbon dioxide, but i really need it, so my dupes dont have to run on the wheels all the time, and to get water too

[natanstarke]

9 minutes ago, Zakery said:

Is it normal, that i can"t find any water/slush/cool staem geysers on oasis map?

i find 6 magma volcano, 1 iron, 1 copper, 2 hydrogen, 2 NG, 2 Chlorine, 2 Hot Carbone, 2 leaky oil, 1 hot steam and any normal water source.....

I can transfer some lamber for water, but its too limited source.

 

In my map i always find 1 cool steam geyser oo your map maybe bugged or a boulder eated your cool steam vent!

[metallichydra]

just realised that i need way more carbon skimmers ...

well, huess i'll go for space, and try to vent it all out

[natanstarke]

2 minutes ago, metallichydra said:

here's a picture of my oasis base:

as you can see, my petroleum generator makes a lot of carbon dioxide, but i really need it, so my dupes dont have to run on the wheels all the time, and to get water too

My first attempt was looking similar but i was burning wood directly now youll be able to make some polluted water with carbon skimmers for yout metal refinery or your cooling system for the coolsteam/aquatuner or a tree farm ! " i love acorn trees so beautifull.

[metallichydra]

2 minutes ago, natanstarke said:

My first attempt was looking similar but i was burning wood directly now youll be able to make some polluted water with carbon skimmers for yout metal refinery or your cooling system for the coolsteam/aquatuner or a tree farm ! " i love acorn trees so beautifull.

still need a source of phosphorite before i start getting my tree / pip farm.

i guess i'll make it when i reach a caustic biome

i mean

if i reach a caustic biome

[natanstarke]

1 hour ago, metallichydra said:

still need a source of phosphorite before i start getting my tree / pip farm.

i guess i'll make it when i reach a caustic biome

i mean

if i reach a caustic biome

Use varios carbon skimmers connected to manual generators located at the top of your base "gens at top skimmer at bot" then store the pwater in liquid reservoirs for metal refinery later.