Make petroleum with midgame

[Tunechi_sama]

making petroleum with lava is super easy. I really dont see the argument here.  The challenge is making natural gas.

[Yunru]

40 minutes ago, lee1026 said:

Now we are assuming that you roll a volcano?

 

Volcano handling tends to be tricky in general, and there is a lot of ways to do it wrong.

Well yeah, they're the safest and easiest, don't suffer from pressure, plus give you free stuff.

As for volcano handling... it depends on the volcano. Gold cools quick enough that I just leave it exposed and limit access once dupes get to half health.

[lee1026]

Metal volcanoes tend to be limited in the heat they give you, so petrol cooking with them is somewhat risky, and you probably want to prioritize getting the metal anyhow.

 

I think most map seeds don't have a magma volcano?

 

 

[Saturnus]

This isn't entirely stable yet as it very slowly loses temperature which I need to fix but it does create 2222g/s petroleum out of thin air using about 640W on average. So see it as a proof of concept.

As always. No special materials used. No diamond, no steel, no ceramics, and no space age materials.

You might say that 2222g/s of petroleum for 640W is a terrible waste but we already have methods of creating completely free energy so the energy cost doesn't matter. Plus, burn it in a petroleum generator and you have free energy forever.

What matters is that you can create petroleum to make plastic without ever having to ranch a single drecko or going anywhere near the oil biome.

EDIT: I originally wrote it produced 222g/s. It's actually 2222g/s. Corrected.

[JohnFrancis]

Just to comment on magma health and safety I would like to read you a story.

Once upon a time a player was moving geo thermal magma via exo suit dupes to a useful location. Vacuum rooms were being used for safety reasons due to being an experienced player. Unfortunately lunch was called while a dupe was mid liquid lock so they dropped the 200kg of magma right there. The liquid lock vaporized. Double unfortunately this liquid lock was on the collection end, so the heated gas got superheated by the rest of the geo thermal magma that up until recently had been in a safe vacuum. Everything in the oil biome melted. The end.

The moral of the story, "if the magma does not get you the dupes will" or maybe it's "Magma finds a way" something like that anyway.

[0xFADE]

Oh yeah. They made it so thermostats can go over 300 now. They spoil us too much. 

46 minutes ago, Saturnus said:

This isn't entirely stable yet as it very slowly loses temperature which I need to fix but it does create 2222g/s petroleum out of thin air using about 640W on average. So see it as a proof of concept.

As always. No special materials used. No diamond, no steel, no ceramics, and no space age materials.

You might say that 2222g/s of petroleum for 640W is a terrible waste but we already have methods of creating completely free energy so the energy cost doesn't matter. Plus, burn it in a petroleum generator and you have free energy forever.

What matters is that you can create petroleum to make plastic without ever having to ranch a single drecko or going anywhere near the oil biome.

EDIT: I originally wrote it produced 222g/s. It's actually 2222g/s. Corrected.

You can splurge for at least diamond. People will get access to both oil and diamond around the same time. 

[Saturnus]

8 minutes ago, 0xFADE said:

Oh yeah. They made it so thermostats can go over 300 now. They spoil us too much. 

You can splurge for at least diamond. People will get access to both oil and diamond around the same time. 

It's not needed nor desirable. Generally speaking temp shift plates should be used when you want to equalize temperatures. That is the exact opposite of what you want in this build where you want as large a temperature gradient as possible.

Let me explain. You want the petroleum in the reservoir to be as cold as possible in order to reduce power draw for the freezer but you want the temperature of the doors where the frozen petroleum melts several degrees above the freezing point.

Similarly you want the rightmost end of the freezer to be the coldest place so your petroleum only freezes in the rightmost tile and then the frozen petroleum is extracted on conveyor rails through the incoming petroleum helping to pre-cool it so you reduce the power draw.

You should always be careful about using temp shift plates where you're not absolutely sure you will benefit from them.

[MorsDux]

1 hour ago, lee1026 said:

Metal volcanoes tend to be limited in the heat they give you, so petrol cooking with them is somewhat risky, and you probably want to prioritize getting the metal anyhow.

 

I think most map seeds don't have a magma volcano?

 

 

Of metal volcanoes iron can be used limitedly to convert oil. You cannot convert huge amounts, I doubt even 1 petrol generator could be fed from an iron volcano in the long run. 

 

[lee1026]

With a sufficiently sophisticated setup, you can process a lot of oil with a very limited amount of heat. Of course, when you are putting that much effort to get a sophisticated setup, you might as well as just go and get some therium.

 

The trick is to interchange heat between the outgoing petrol and income crude. Someone posted a build where the final incoming crude hit 398 degrees. The build is big and I didn't think it was very practical, but hey, someone actually did it.

[MorsDux]

24 minutes ago, lee1026 said:

With a sufficiently sophisticated setup, you can process a lot of oil with a very limited amount of heat. Of course, when you are putting that much effort to get a sophisticated setup, you might as well as just go and get some therium.

 

The trick is to interchange heat between the outgoing petrol and income crude. Someone posted a build where the final incoming crude hit 398 degrees. The build is big and I didn't think it was very practical, but hey, someone actually did it.

true, looked into it, if you make your heat exchanger sufficiently large (huge) you can even convert 10 kg/sec with an iron volcano.

[JohnFrancis]

21 minutes ago, MorsDux said:

true, looked into it, if you make your heat exchanger sufficiently large (huge) you can even convert 10 kg/sec with an iron volcano.

I'v been doing research into this recently and with 10 tons of gold radiant pipe it should be possible to make a copper volcano power a 10kg/s petroleum boiler. Possible yes, easy... I'm still working on that bit.

[mathmanican]

6 hours ago, Saturnus said:

This isn't entirely stable yet as it very slowly loses temperature which I need to fix but it does create 2222g/s petroleum out of thin air using about 640W on average. So see it as a proof of concept.

I LOVE IT!!!!!  Nice work.

[Oozinator]

15 hours ago, lee1026 said:

If you want to say that it is easy, show us a survival build.

I can not see why @Yunru's build should be someway complicated.
When i build something like that, i give manual build orders for every tile/ +a diagonal tile below.
For every tile i need to build(remove abby) for example, i place diagonally below that tile another block (before target tile is placed) and that block is removed after target tile is built.
Not really a problem..

[0xFADE]

Vacuum is your main friend when dealing with lava.

Everything in the biome makes it easy to get to.

Oil there will let you make a liquid lock to start in a vacuum.

Then using the also available diamond to make a diamond heat rod in to the lava to use the heat is very easy.

[flapee]

Or one can dump the heat from metal production into petrol cookin' ( no space materials )

[0xFADE]

2 hours ago, flapee said:

Or one can dump the heat from metal production into petrol cookin' ( no space materials )

Oh nice. Is that molten glass?  I was thinking of trying something like that a long time ago but the low heat capacity makes it seem pretty touchy. 

[flapee]

11 minutes ago, 0xFADE said:

Oh nice. Is that molten glass?  I was thinking of trying something like that a long time ago but the low heat capacity makes it seem pretty touchy. 

Actually ur not too far off; first iteration used molten glass(MG) from forge as heat source, but there seems to be a (yet another) bug in solidification. I'm planning to use MG refinery as heat source for  oil to NG conversion.

In this case, MG seemed too risky, since primarily steel will be produced, hence naptha's been chosen ( petrol should work as well ) 

[0xFADE]

Oh yeah petrol does fine. That more compact conversion design is nice. I also forgot they raised the heat sensor past 300.

Very good use of bridge priority on those pipe loops. 

[Dyrewulfe]

In response to people wanting to see a simple survival build using magma:

[jlarner]

Nice, what are the radiant pipes made out of?

[Dyrewulfe]

@jlarner I used copper for the radiant pipes(had a bunch of it laying around from scavenging ruins), except for the last section 'cuz I ran out. There's not a huge amount of difference in common metal radiant pipes, any common refined metal should work fine.

And, I ended up cleaning that up and making it more efficient(This was my first time actually building a rig like this.) This is outputting steady 155C petroleum, and the crude is going to the burner at 372C avg.

[Arcus2611]

On 18/03/2019 at 6:40 AM, Yunru said:

???

Literally the only way to set it up wrong is to not configure the temperature sensor. Open doors in a gas-less environment transfer no heat. The heat will never go above what you set it at.

It is possible to get a situation where your hotplate tiles get heated up to >1000C while the crude oil is <400C. So yes, it is possible for the heat to go above what you set the thermo sensor at.

 

Admittedly, this was with diamond window tiles + tempshift plates, but it remains a possible failure condition.

[GemeinerJack]

my current challenge base (no wheezewort, no aetn) has a pre space petrol boiler:

This is a screenshot from my test world, where i used insulation for the insulated tiles, in my survival base i use a double row of ceramic.
From top to bottom:

Holding chamber:

Nothing fancy, just to make sure, enough crude oil collects so the temp sensors are submerged

Boiler chamber

Petrol from the metal refinery heats it up to 404°C to cook the crude into petrol, the petrol is allowed to flow back into the refinery after it cooled past 405°C to prevent it cooking to sour gas with the next steel melt

Cooling chamber:

New crude oil from oil well at 90°C cools down the petrol below 250°C to make to keep the steel pump safe. The heated up crude oil will be used for the next patch of cooking and leaves the cooling loop above 220°C

Pump chamber:

Nothing fancy, pumps it away and gives feedback to the chamber above if it is empty

 

 Edit: and the inital Petrol was made with a self feeding crude oil metal refinery until the pipes break

Spoiler

[0xFADE]

Those are some harsh working conditions.