Critters don't fall anymore through the doors

[SamLogan]

Hello,

Since this version :

All doors have a metallic background that prevent the gas escape to space vacuum when it opens but it also prevent the fall of any creature that place on it. So you can forget some automated ranching setup.

I've tried with the 3 doors models. What do you think about this change?

On the other side, eggs still go through closed pneumatic doors. o_O

[blash365]

Imho the change makes alot of sense (and was documented in the changelog), since the old behaviour was a bit, well, unexpected.

I'd rather see a new element such as a "trap door", "tractor beam" or similar that provides exactly what you require for your automation (some sort of gravity-switch), but also has its proper place in the in-universe physics.

[LaShomb]

Have you tried the door horizontally? Dropping through vertical doors never made sense to me. The top of the door would be the framing and where the door goes when open. When sideways I would expect it to act like a trap door.

It would suck if they just remove that ability from doors. They're was a lot of good automation happening that relies on it. A new "trapdoor" structure could work too, but it would basically be the same thing at what were had, so why not make the door work?

[6Havok9]

I really don't like the new pneumatic door look. Feels too heavy, almost industrial. The security doors in the ruins, however, are super cool.

About the lost functionality of doors for ranching automation, don't quite like that either. Wondering if this all happened as a side effect or if it's an intentional restriction. If this change is indeed final I would really appreciate a trap door like item that well... Behaves exactly like doors currently do. Else, back to wrangling, with the killroom next to the ranch.

[beowulf2010]

1 hour ago, LaShomb said:

Have you tried the door horizontally? Dropping through vertical doors never made sense to me. The top of the door would be the framing and where the door goes when open. When sideways I would expect it to act like a trap door.

Tried it. Nothing alive falls through doors now if they were standing on them when the door opens. 

On the plus side, critters will still fall through open doors if they're already falling.

The trick is to get them falling in the first place... 

Oh, and eggs still act the same way they always have so just change your kill rooms to drop extra eggs into water through a door and drown the critters when they hatch. Much simpler automation and not difficult to change where eggs are delivered using the critter sensors. 

[Xuhybrid]

Let's not forget how awful it looks, having something that allows gas and liquid through it, but appears to be completely solid.

[6Havok9]

3 hours ago, beowulf2010 said:

Oh, and eggs still act the same way they always have so just change your kill rooms to drop extra eggs into water through a door and drown the critters when they hatch.

This is true, but it merely covers the egg to critter to meat part. Without a method to reliably relocate the critters we can't keep stables topped up by setting up dispenser like automation. You can wait for some eggs to hatch inside the stable, but that reduces the maximum number of living critters that can be in the room without getting a debuff. If you then decide to sweep some of them with an autosweeper, you can never be sure of which egg is gonna be picked up, maybe the 99% incubation one. You could potentially be left with a room with 1/2 critters and 6 eggs, unless you leave blind spots on purpose, which is bad.

So this means we will have to rely on incubators and/or wrangling. We can easily setup automation for an incubator to only accept an egg if there are less than X critters, so it's fine. Can live with that... It's gonna take some extra space, but whatever, time to change layout. Wrangling is meh, since it's not reliable. If you are going to use wrangling as your main relocation method it's going to put severe limitations on room layout, no multifloor structures, cause if a critter gets dropped, it's gonna be annoying. I think wrangling is just for capturing, like the button in the UI says.

It's a bit sad, because those living critter dispensers are fun and effective, but we can do fine without, and also the incubator is gonna see more use, which is good. Thinking about it, the "trap door" item is probably not needed, albeit I would certainly use it, since it would allow for fun builds.

However... my auto drecko stable not only is not gonna be affected in any bad way, it's gonna be even more reliable after this change  And this probably opens up some unexplored possibilities for other kinds of stables.

P.S. Of course this change DID hit me a bit initially, but the more I think about it, the more I think it's for the better. I still hate the new look of the pneumatic door tho. Bad, ugly, evil pneumatic door.

[beowulf2010]

2 minutes ago, 6Havok9 said:

(Snip) 

It's a bit sad, because those living critter dispensers are fun and effective, but we can do fine without, and also the incubator is gonna see more use, which is good. Thinking about it, the "trap door" item is probably not needed, albeit I would certainly use it, since it would allow for fun builds.

However... my auto drecko stable is not gonna be affected in any way  

Agreed. My version of the Pez dispenser hatch ranch is sadly dead at the moment. The only reason I even mentioned the critter kill rooms is that I've seen a lot more people complaining about kill rooms being ineffective than ranches. I honestly can't remember the last time I either dropped critters into water or used doors to fill a drowning room. It's so much easier to just drop an egg through a pneumatic door and let it hatch on its own and immediately drown.as a baby. 

I do think we should ask for some sort trap door item. Make normal vertical door sized and require it to be powered (60w?) and have all 4 block to each side be tiled with a pressure sensor built in. The automation for it would input only to turn it on and off. 

As for your drecko farm, I love it and have blatantly stolen it for my bases. Thanks! 

[qqqqqqqqqqqq]

1 hour ago, 6Havok9 said:

So this means we will have to rely on incubators and/or wrangling. We can easily setup automation for an incubator to only accept an egg if there are less than X critters, so it's fine. Can live with that...

https://imgur.com/a/iui5bqE
 

It is not that simple
the eggs are even delivered to the disconnected incubator and incubated
if you put the incubator on the door, the eggs will not fit
but pets who enter this door when it is opened will be "outside the room" and imprisonment.

[Yunru]

I don't get it, you can set population with incubators, then just drown the rest. Sure a lot of builds no longer work, but there's no functionality lost.

[GemeinerJack]

i mean, there are a few ways to auto kill hatches even without dropping them trough open doors

[Rogue Witch]

There is still a way to drop hatches through vertical doors. If you place a vertical pneumatic door right above a vertical mech door and trap a hatch in the pneumatic door, then it will fall through when the mech door opens. And its easy to trap a hatch in the pneumatic door using critter sensor and automation.

 

[Sasza22]

5 hours ago, beowulf2010 said:

Nothing alive falls through doors now if they were standing on them when the door opens. 

You can still use a gantry to make critters fall.

Not like it`s somethinng useful but still.

[beowulf2010]

Just now, Sasza22 said:

You can still use a gantry to make critters fall.

Not like it`s somethinng useful but still.

Do gantries provide room barriers like doors or would you need to put pneumatic doors under them too? (At work so I can't check myself.)

[Sasza22]

7 minutes ago, beowulf2010 said:

Do gantries provide room barriers

Afaik they don`t. And doors under will stop critters from dropping further. You`ll need to make a much more complicated system i think.

[beowulf2010]

1 hour ago, Sasza22 said:

Afaik they don`t. And doors under will stop critters from dropping further. You`ll need to make a much more complicated system i think.

When I played around with it a couple days ago critters would fall through open doors if they were already falling. So if the gantry can start them falling then we'd just need a bit of extra room for an open door to break up the rooms. I'll play around with it tonight... 

[Fallonius]

Has anyone tried an automation setup for incubators? I've noticed that you don't need them running 24/7 once you get the lullaby buff. Meaning, you can set a timer for a 1/10 of a cycle to get the dupe to run over and apply the lullaby buff then shut them down to save power while maintaining the buff. That would speed up egg production/hatching and food for a fraction of the cost.

Anyone have ideas on that or noticed it?

[Yunru]

10 minutes ago, Fallonius said:

Has anyone tried an automation setup for incubators? I've noticed that you don't need them running 24/7 once you get the lullaby buff. Meaning, you can set a timer for a 1/10 of a cycle to get the dupe to run over and apply the lullaby buff then shut them down to save power while maintaining the buff. That would speed up egg production/hatching and food for a fraction of the cost.

Anyone have ideas on that or noticed it?

I just leave them unpowered and unranched.

[Fallonius]

Think maybe tamed, powered for a time to get lullaby is better or no?