I learned how to use the AETN after many errors!

[Express]

Descriptions are below the images. Let me know if you can see any potential improvements, I'm still a very new to this game.

https://imgur.com/a/DMCSRF

[LookingForBaal]

Welcome to the forums!

Looks functional but that is a TON of gold to use.  The AETN can get very cold so maybe you should make the room smaller to save on the tempshift plates some.  You may be able to get by with less as well.

I'm sure someone else will reply with how this is all wrong but experimentation is how you learn

[Xuhybrid]

You don't need anywhere near that amount of machinery. The whole point is that it's free cooling. Having the aquatuner in there is an interesting idea though.

[Nitroturtle]

Doesn't the AT just move heat?  Wouldn't it be the same as just running radiant pipes through the AETN room (though maybe slower) and save a lot of power?

[Lilalaunekuh]

I use the AETN a similar way, but I would always keep an thermo sensor attached to my AETN (to be more accurate: to a shut off valve feeding it)

Just to prevent the possibility of my coolant freezing (My builds are designed without dupe access to repair)

 

3 minutes ago, Nitroturtle said:

Doesn't the AT just move heat?  Wouldn't it be the same as just running radiant pipes through the AETN room (though maybe slower) and save a lot of power?

AETN deletes heat if you feed it with some hydrogen.

If you preheat the hydrogen with a thermium aquatuner using some metling gold as temperature sensor your able to delete so much heat^^

(You can raise the temperature of hydrogen coming from an electrolyzer by about 1000K )

 

PS: Add some drywalls behind your airflow/mesh tiles for some more temperature stability inside the room

[Nitroturtle]

10 minutes ago, Lilalaunekuh said:

AETN deletes heat if you feed it with some hydrogen.

Yes, I understand what the AETN does.  I was referring to the AT (aquatuner) just moving heat from the liquid being passed through it to the surrounding area.

[ChickenMadness]

6 hours ago, Xuhybrid said:

You don't need anywhere near that amount of machinery. The whole point is that it's free cooling. Having the aquatuner in there is an interesting idea though.

It's a good idea if the aquatuner is cooling some other part of your base down.

For example if you have a LOX factory close by.

[Iriswaters]

Just as a note, diamond is a better tempshift plate material than gold,with a thermal conductivity of 80(vs 60) and a somewhat higher SHC.   It's a bit of a question whether low or high SHC is better for heat transfer.   Low means the effect is faster, but high means that once it shifts, it retains heat/cold more effectively.  Since you are trying to bring everything to the same temp, higher is probably somewhat better.   Though all in all it doesn't matter too much.  

The main point though of using diamond over gold is that gold has a lot of other great uses and the uses for diamond are somewhat limited.  Also, it is a bit easier to come up with in bulk than refined gold.  Unless you are going to make diamond windows for your space facing buildings, it really doesn't have another use, and it does have a fantastic conductivity.  Best available without space materials.

 

[Manar]

One thing no one talks about here and was the first peev I noticed when looking at the design is you usually don't want to have your tempshift touching your insulated tiles, because as you can see in your images the stabilization happens then close to the insulated tiles' temperature due to their low heat transfer, granted it is not as critical as when insulated tiles where made from abyssalite and had no heat transfer at all, but this is essentially why the SPOM designs incorporating a cooler through WW always have a tile gap between tempshift plates and insulated tiles. 

[Angpaur]

If you are cooling for example water via the aquatuner then each second it is delivering 585 kDTU if you are using full 10kg packets of liquid. AETN can remove 80 kDTU per second. So how is that suppose to work? You will enable aquatuner only for 1 second and then disable for 6 seconds? If someone needs to use aquatuner continously then such setup will not provide enough cooling.

[fredhp]

Nothing is more efficient for heat deletion than two steel aquaturner turning PWATER from a cold slush into steam an venting it to space.

Just need a small amount of automation and an autominer to remove dirt - what i do is to keep an open door when atmospheric pressure is below 12Kg to prevent PO2 from forming (i know... 2kg is sufficient..), and a thermo sensor setting to enable when temparature is above 250C to enable a steam turbine to farm some power. You can even put a gas pump to refuel a steam rocket!

There are projects infinitely recycling steam, but i think it is a form of exploit, so i dont use it.

Every 1000g (1Kg) of 0c PWATER, heated to 120c to became steam, when deleted in space, removes 501480 DTU.

One idea, if AETN is near,  is to pump some of the steam released by the turbine to the AETN room, this way it can be turned into water again, but i never tested it.

[Angpaur]

8 minutes ago, fredhp said:

Nothing is more efficient for heat deletion than two steel aquaturner turning PWATER from a cold slush into steam an venting it to space

Venting it to space? Right, so efficient... But if it is only for heat deletion purpose and you agree to waste pwater like this than it for sure will work well do remove heat from asteroid.

[fredhp]

1 minute ago, Angpaur said:

Venting it to space? Right, so efficient...

.....  is efficient to delete the heat  

3 minutes ago, Angpaur said:

Venting it to space? Right, so efficient... But if it is only for heat deletion purpose and you agree to waste pwater like this than it for sure will work well do remove heat from asteroid.

Until i got space grade materials, this is the way i do - simple and efficient. Just need a slush geyser.
When i got space materials, i do the classic oil -> sour gas conversion with the aquaturner heat.

[avilmask]

7 minutes ago, fredhp said:

Every 1000g (1Kg) of 0c PWATER, heated to 120c to became steam, when deleted in space, removes 501480 DTU.

So. Where do you get 0c pH2O?

You must have a lot of water sources if you can afford just dumping pH2O into the void.

I think it would be more efficient to convert hot pH2O into not so hot H2O using sieve.

[fredhp]

6 minutes ago, avilmask said:

So. Where do you get 0c pH2O?

You must have a lot of water sources if you can afford just dumping pH2O into the void.

I think it would be more efficient to convert hot pH2O into not so hot H2O using sieve.

The map need to have a Cool Slush Geyser.
Just pump the water....

Dont need to be 0c water, any water will do, but the colder, the better (more heat deleted per water).
 

 

[avilmask]

1 minute ago, fredhp said:

The map need to have a Cool Slush Geyser.
Just pump the water...

Alright, I didn't explore rocketry update yet, and didn't know klei added a source of cold water. I guess, with tools like this, water cooling isn't much of a problem.

[fredhp]

Cold water slush exists for a long time.... i think it was included in the oil upgrade...

Using the thermo sensors is possible to delete more heat yet: Using this method, when water evaporates for the first time, all the water turns into steam, that is 1000kg per tile. 

The steam pressure will be is so high that it will absorb all the aquaturner's heat without damaging it, so is possible to heat the steam until near the aquaturners heat limit. 
A steel aquaturners can reach 270c, this means 270c steam..... or 11283300 Dtu deleted per 1000g of PH2O..... That is a lot of heat!!
 

[avilmask]

2 minutes ago, fredhp said:

Cold water slush exists for a long time.... i think it was included in the oil upgrade...

If cold water was introduced in oil upgrade, then your method is inconsistent and requires a lucky seed, because I played a lot of oil upgrade and didn't get any.

[fredhp]

https://oxygennotincluded.gamepedia.com/Geyser

 

Cool Slush Geyser

[fredhp]

Just some maths (numbers rounded for simplicity) :
1 AETN destroy 80kDtu

The kDtus transferred by aquaturners is dependent of the coolant.
Considering 10Kg per packet:

Water or PWater as coolant transfer  585kDtus ( 7 times an AETN)

Petroleum as coolant transfer  246 kDtus ( 3 times an AETN)

SuperCoolant, 1181kDtu (or 14 AETN)

1000Kg (1 tile) of water, heated from 0 to 270 (maximum safe temperature for steel aquaturner) absorbs 1128330 kDtus.

By using termium aquaturner, its possible to heat steam up to 300C if automated steam dump is used (300C is the sensor maximum limit), or 1253600kDtu. Without automated dump (or if Klei raises the maximum limit of thermo sensors), it is possible to heat steam up to 1500c..... or 6268500 kDtu. 
When this super heated steam is dumped into space..... heat is destroyed....

In my experience, because water keeps being added by the pump system after steam is generated, pressure goes greater than 1000Kg........ How can i recycle more than 9000Kg per tile of super heated (270c, or  10154970
 kDtu) steam???? I just use it for power generation and let the space get rid of all the heat.

 

[Iriswaters]

Fredhp:   Or you could just heat it to 100C and then sieve it, and you immediately have 40C water.  That way you don't lose water.   Or you could feed the hot pwater to peppernuts.   These don't delete as much heat, but they also don't waste water.  They make it available as clean water, or put it to good use growing quality food.

Or if you are going to insist one venting it into space, at the very least you should do so via a steam  turbine stack.  That being layering several steel steam turbines, one above the other with some room in between and a ton of high-conductivity heat transfer plates(I suggest diamond) running up the middle.  Stick your aquatuner, or aquatuners(this will eat as much heat as you can throw at it) in the bottom in water, set to feed it more water when it gets too hot or the pressure drops too far.   Then proceed to forget about it forever as it deletes up to tens of millions of DTU/s while spending very little of your water.   Also it produces some energy, but that's really an aside.

[Express]

On 11/28/2018 at 3:11 AM, Manar said:

One thing no one talks about here and was the first peev I noticed when looking at the design is you usually don't want to have your tempshift touching your insulated tiles, because as you can see in your images the stabilization happens then close to the insulated tiles' temperature due to their low heat transfer, granted it is not as critical as when insulated tiles where made from abyssalite and had no heat transfer at all, but this is essentially why the SPOM designs incorporating a cooler through WW always have a tile gap between tempshift plates and insulated tiles. 

Thanks for this tip! I realized it some time after. I’ll make sure to avoid placing plates next to tiles.

[ruhrohraggy]

That's great! Always fun learning new things. This game has a very high learning curve it seems. To me that system seems to use alot of extra power and hydrogen, that probably could be better spent elsewhere.

While it's a neat idea to bring liquid into the system, and then output that liquid again at a desired temperature...It's probably more efficient to have a dedicated cooling system running in a closed loop, that runs through a body of gas or liquid. You use far less power regulating where things need to go, or with any sorta pumping. That and it gives you the option to pre-cool your coolant to a desired temperature for cooling.

To those that feel bad about using a looped steam system for deleting heat, you shouldn't. We do similar things in real life with re-heaters. Condensate return feeds usually go back to a gas combustion boiler, because it's cheaper. Electricity is more refined energy and is thus, more expensive.

So the Aquatuner is the re-heater in this case...We are just using electricity for heat instead of gas or petrol...and it just so happens that the electricity is also doing something useful for us. We also piggy back exchange systems to other systems this way in real-life as well. Got a process that's generating too much heat? Why not use that heat for something else that's useful.

And yeah while it's "Deleting" heat, it's turning that heat back into electricity again. Seems fair to me.

Here's some things you might try out for an earlier game cooling system using the AETN. (It's really good for this applicatoin)

Spoiler

What's nice about this, is with this system, your electrolyzer will be producing surplus hydrogen that can be fed into the AETN to cool the O2 you pump into your base (or anything else you decide to cool with it). Also, If you route a hydrogen output to storage, this thing will output more hydrogen than the entire system will consume...It's also self powered.

Aaaand. temperature controlled! You can use a shutoff valve to the AETN with a gas temp sensor to cut off the flow of hydrogen if it gets too cold.

 

For anything dealing with the Aquatuner and Liquids, I've found this next system the way to go. It's compact, can be made into a closed loop, and gives you some energy back in return...which is nice.

 

Spoiler

 

 

Spoiler

 

What I like about this system, is that it's pretty similar to charging a cooling system in real life. You have a reservoir you fill the line with and you then let 'er run until adequate coolant is in the system. (Air conditioners, radiators in your car, etc...)

Once the system is primed, you deconstruct 2-3 pipes with liquid in it, and disconnect the pump to add some empty spaces, else the Aquatuner won't run in a closed loop. (Or it will run, just not very well, again, much like real life!)

My pump is still attached, but is not running...I've been too lazy to retrieve it, and the other 1400kg of supercoolant I thought i'd need.

The only space age material used in this is the super-coolant and only 600kg at that! This system is for LOX though. You could use any liquid you wanted for lighter cooling applications I imagine. The Aquatuner and battery are made out of steel, the steam turbine and everything else is made out of iron. (It won't go past 450 degrees)

So you would use this system in the opposite way in which you've proposed.

Instead of bringing the hot stuff in and trying to cool it to a temp you want... you send your already really-cold-stuff out to get heated up and come back. You could run water cooled with the Aquatuner through the room with your cold steam geyser (or whatever), and cool it at the source as it comes out, which would also help the steam geyser not go over pressure. That, and as your room heats up, you get some power back in the process! With larger bodies of liquid or gas, the temperature control is fairly accurate as well.