steam turbine Occupational Upgrade Steam Turbine

[pacumos]

 Another reasonable solution:

Every time steam pass thru, it should decrease the temperature by a fixed amount, let's say 10 ºc, and condensing a fixed amount of resource, let's say 0.3 kg, when the steam passing thru get's too cold by the cooling factor, perhaps, only 90% get's condensed and the rest cooled by 4 ºc factor. The heat is transformed into electricity, that's not how it woks on real world, but on real world it get's a lot more of power to transform water into steam so ... that should work.

[n37runn3r]

I make MASSIVE bases, my most recent one in the Tubular is about 1/3 of the map enclosed and I use some of all the generators, every one I have installed is running constantly, and I have every circuit (with conductive wire) maxed out, and my power plants have to have the heavy wire in a lot of cases. Therefore, I could see the Steam Turbine actually being useful for me. One thing that confuses me though, is that the Transformers don't seem to work with the conductive wire. Does anyone know if that's changed?

[clickrush]

7 minutes ago, n37runn3r said:

I make MASSIVE bases, my most recent one in the Tubular is about 1/3 of the map enclosed and I use some of all the generators, every one I have installed is running constantly, and I have every circuit (with conductive wire) maxed out, and my power plants have to have the heavy wire in a lot of cases. Therefore, I could see the Steam Turbine actually being useful for me. One thing that confuses me though, is that the Transformers don't seem to work with the conductive wire. Does anyone know if that's changed?

Transformers work with conductive wire. They only pass 1kw through so you need 2x if you want to max out a circuit.

[Saturnus]

3 minutes ago, clickrush said:

Transformers work with conductive wire. They only pass 1kw through so you need 2x if you want to max out a circuit.

No. Transformer pass up to 1KJ through. Not the same as 1KW. It says so right in the tool tip, 1000 J

[Zarquan]

6 minutes ago, Saturnus said:

No. Transformer pass up to 1KJ through. Not the same as 1KW. It says so right in the tool tip, 1000 J

How often does a power transformer pass 1 kJ?  If it is only once per second, then it is 1 kW, as a W is a J/s.  I never tested it and assumed I needed two because a second seems to be the main unit on machines in this game, so I assumed it was 1kJ/s

[Saturnus]

Just now, Zarquan said:

How often does a power transformer pass 1 kJ?  If it is only once per second, then it is 1 kW, as a W is a J/s.

4 times per second

[clickrush]

1 minute ago, Saturnus said:

No. Transformer pass up to 1KJ through. Not the same as 1KW. It says so right in the tool tip, 1000 J

Right. But that has the same implications. I assumed that @n37runn3r tried to power a 1kW circuit with only one transformer.

[Zarquan]

Ok, so it conveys 4 kW of power, assuming it transfers the full 1000 J every quarter second.  Good to know. 

[clickrush]

Just now, Saturnus said:

4 times per second

I'am 100% certain that you cannot power an aquatuner with a single transformer behind the circuit.

[Saturnus]

Just now, clickrush said:

Right. But that has the same implications. I assumed that @n37runn3r tried to power a 1kW circuit with only one transformer.

Not quite. The state machine updates 4 times per second so you can draw 4KW from a single transformer. No single consumer can be above 1000W though without a battery on the consumer side.

1 minute ago, clickrush said:

I'am 100% certain that you cannot power an aquatuner with a single transformer behind the circuit.

You wanna bet? 

 

[clickrush]

Just now, Saturnus said:

Not quite. The state machine updates 4 times per second so you can draw 4KW from a single transformer. No single consumer can be above 1000W though without a battery on the consumer side.

Ah right that makes sense. So it's kind of a fake 4kW. Good to know.

[Zarquan]

4 minutes ago, clickrush said:

Ah right that makes sense. So it's kind of a fake 4kW. Good to know.

From what I can tell, it's not "fake" so much as it is not continuous.  Without a battery to store the excess, the aquatuner would ask the line "how much power do you have" and it would say "1 kJ" and the aquatuner would be sad and not work because it wants 1.2 kJ.  In a more continuous system on a scheme like this, it would ask more regularly with smaller amounts of power, like every quarter second ask for 400J.  In this case, it would work.  I think they should change the transformer to reflect this:  Make the transformer hold 4 kJ and release every second.  Or were they concerned that it might trigger overload on the wire?  I don't know. 

Either way, batteries everywhere is usually the answer to these problems.

[Saturnus]

7 minutes ago, clickrush said:

Ah right that makes sense. So it's kind of a fake 4kW. Good to know.

Here's an old example. It runs a tepidizer, an aquatuner, and 4 liquid pumps all on the same first transformer. I then loop the heavi-watt to the next transformer because of how the fail safe design works. If there is too much water in the condenser, the secondary transformers gets flooded and shuts down the system in a controlled manor that avoids pipes breaking.

(this was before we had conductive wire)

(note: it only needs a battery... any battery, to run an aquatuner on the line, a tiny one as here will do)

[clickrush]

@Saturnus So basicly you inner HW circuit has a capacity of 4kW because the game decides to update the transformers 1kJ * 4/s and the battery essentially transforms the 1kJ packets into 4kW packets to provide the power for the aquatuner. Nice. I always just built 2x tranformers but I will definitely use this mechanic from now on.

[Vectrobe]

@clickrush

 

On another note though; they seem to have disabled the turbine completely in the latest build...

[pacumos]

I don't seem to have any problem with the steam turbine in the latest patch, what seem that they've done is adding some textures. I've calculated if the machine utilizes any steam, seems that, at least on the environment that I measured that it consumes 12% of what pass thru them, I think it's because it stores some steam before releasing them, and the set environment don't have somehow to predict those kinds of behaviors. I'm still waiting, curious, for futures patches. 

I wonder if they will make a "Pressure Upgrade", I've saw the latest hotfix patch notes and it's said that the sublimation process of polluted water stops on a set threshold. If so, I have somethings planned and I wonder of someone want to hear them, until then, bye for now I hope.

Edit: I've made another test, it definitively consumes steam.

[Vectrobe]

1 hour ago, pacumos said:

I don't seem to have any problem with the steam turbine in the latest patch

Could you give me a screenshot of yours? mine only displays 'output blocked' nomatter what's around it...

[Bubby4940]

I got mine to work but now it is only 2kw so it gives me like 120 watts because I am using a aquatuner with pumps

[pacumos]

1 hour ago, Paul17041993 said:

Could you give me a screenshot of yours? mine only displays 'output blocked' nomatter what's around it...

Basically what you need is a room where there is nothing but steam, you need a pressure difference of 3kg from the bottom to the top, you can make it work with a simple room like this:

Where at the top there is nothing more than vacuum, but there could be steam at a lower pressure than the bottom part, which there is steam at 400K and 10kg of pressure. The bottom part of the steam can have virtually indefinite amount of steam, at least at the current build, and if the top part have any other kind of gas, it will display "Output blocked".

[Vectrobe]

yea, I got it to work for a bit after pumping it out to a vacuum, then steaming it up, it currently lacks the ability to push other gasses out of the way, so as little as 1mcg of CO2 for example will 'block' it...

[Gooblender]

 I disagree that a turbine should not generate more energy than it takes to generate the steam though it should be not be excessively more. The principal behind any renewable energy technology (which this is touted as) is that it outputs more than you input. That said I think a steam output leaves room for an huge exploit (stacking) and a hot liquid output would solve this issue. That or decrease the steam temperature by 20 degrees on output. This would create a limit on the number stackable dependent on how hot you can get the steam.

[Vectrobe]

I think the best bet at this point would be a pipe output of 99C water, no other output, and a fixed steam intake. In its current state it doesn't take much to loop it indefinitely with a fraction of water being the only input...

[pacumos]

On 31/01/2018 at 7:00 PM, pacumos said:

 Another reasonable solution:

Every time steam pass thru, it should decrease the temperature by a fixed amount, let's say 10 ºc, and condensing a fixed amount of resource, let's say 0.3 kg, when the steam passing thru get's too cold by the cooling factor, perhaps, only 90% get's condensed and the rest cooled by 4 ºc factor. The heat is transformed into electricity, that's not how it woks on real world, but on real world it get's a lot more of power to transform water into steam so ... that should work.

A bit more complex than what you've proposed, but I think that would balance quite well.

[Vectrobe]

 

[Vectrobe]

ya know what actually, the turbine's pretty balanced as-is...