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the almighty meal lice... not... =(


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I'm sure there are posts that explaining how awesome meal lice is by itself without been processed. After 280 hours of playing this awesome joint, I just realized it is also awesome source for our favorite hatches. I have trapped 7/8 of the hatches to the farming area to feed them and yielding coals (going to expand the section to include left section of the small farms tomorrow to make even bigger hatch playground.) I lost count on how many farm tiles on this maps, but it is only growing larger by earth days. I also have one guy making liceloaf at all time (should have expand to 2 by now) to reduce frige loads. 

Side note, stole the water separator idea from other posts to block out natural gas from going out of the fertilizers, also a layer of it to block polluted water to produce polluted oxygen. 

Still have yet to figure out hydrogen cooling; efficient way to recycle slim, better control with temperature.  

 

nvm, never knew they only eat as 0.5kg instead the normal 50

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Why do you even keep the fertilizer area accessible? Nowadays I seal it all in abyssalite because fertilizer is pretty useless as anything other than hatch fodder. You don't seem to keep hatches in fertilizer area.

Food makes relatively poor hatch fodder. They eat some set amount of it per "bite" and excrete coal based on mass consumed. Since one harvest of mealwood is just 8kg, it's way below a bite of "proper" hatch food, which is at least 50kg.

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51 minutes ago, Coolthulhu said:

Why do you even keep the fertilizer area accessible? Nowadays I seal it all in abyssalite because fertilizer is pretty useless as anything other than hatch fodder. You don't seem to keep hatches in fertilizer area.

Food makes relatively poor hatch fodder. They eat some set amount of it per "bite" and excrete coal based on mass consumed. Since one harvest of mealwood is just 8kg, it's way below a bite of "proper" hatch food, which is at least 50kg.

From my understanding, it's not because of the per bite size, but that hatch gets "full" and will stop eating more stuff when consuming "food" instead of mats.

At least that's what the wiki says.

Edit: nvm, I reread what you wrote and finally clicked.

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@LZ96, since it looks like you have some proper food source going, another idea would be to switch out you sole chef for another one of less skill, they'll do things more slowly, but they'll level up in the process. This is generally good for creating better chefs. I do this on the grill and make pickled meal lice after I graduate to mushroom farming. This levels the dupes and gets rid of meal lice sitting in food storage without wasting water.

The above postings are also right about the hatches eating meal lice - they eat .5kg per bite - this is a rather slow build up to a 50kg dropping.

ps. pickled meal lice lost it's 'never goes stale' perk in the oil update - not sure if its a bug or what. If you can get your meal lice into the polluted dirt or spoiled food state, the hatches will eat more of it.

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1 hour ago, The Plum Gate said:

@LZ96, since it looks like you have some proper food source going, another idea would be to switch out you sole chef for another one of less skill, they'll do things more slowly, but they'll level up in the process. This is generally good for creating better chefs. I do this on the grill and make pickled meal lice after I graduate to mushroom farming. This levels the dupes and gets rid of meal lice sitting in food storage without wasting water.

The above postings are also right about the hatches eating meal lice - they eat .5kg per bite - this is a rather slow build up to a 50kg dropping.

ps. pickled meal lice lost it's 'never goes stale' perk in the oil update - not sure if its a bug or what. If you can get your meal lice into the polluted dirt or spoiled food state, the hatches will eat more of it.

i see, never thought about the pickled meal lice doesn't use water, trying that tomorrow. Even thought I have both steam geyser, I still don't want to waste water. I didn't set anymore on only chef duty so I guess I'm good there; I hate white boxes lol. 

Also didn't know they eat spoiled food faster, also trying that after I make some plastic and move them to another area; I have such ocd I dont like bad air in my base =/. edited, now i know what u mean by faster =/

Thank you for the advises  

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2 hours ago, Le0n1des said:

I'm confused... If your wary is feeding the hatches - trap them in the toilet to take care of the polluted dirt...

had that, they were above with the two were the outhouses were. Gotten rid of them and dropped them below, and ended up making a farm afterwards.

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1 minute ago, LZ96 said:

Also didn't know they eat spoiled food faster, also trying that after I make some plastic and move them to another area; I have such ocd I dont like bad air in my base =/

The bad air is an understandable issue, but if you put a deodorizer next to the drop point... spoiled food only emits PO2 at a rate of around 1.8g/s so it will vanish into O2 as soon as it gets emitted.

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2 hours ago, Coolthulhu said:

Why do you even keep the fertilizer area accessible? Nowadays I seal it all in abyssalite because fertilizer is pretty useless as anything other than hatch fodder. You don't seem to keep hatches in fertilizer area.

Food makes relatively poor hatch fodder. They eat some set amount of it per "bite" and excrete coal based on mass consumed. Since one harvest of mealwood is just 8kg, it's way below a bite of "proper" hatch food, which is at least 50kg.

i kept it open and blocked with water so it stopped gas from coming out; saved some metal and better blockage than door, and won't risk natural gas coming out in case i need to go in there for whatever reason. I currently make enough coal to use, but once I expand more, I'm going to move them to better location if i ever start running negative on food production or coal.

gg should have look up wiki before even creating the thread. Not fair, why only 0.5kg, i misread as 5kg... sigh, i guess i definitely need to move them. 

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6 minutes ago, The Plum Gate said:

The bad air is an understandable issue, but if you put a deodorizer next to the drop point... spoiled food only emits PO2 at a rate of around 1.8g/s so it will vanish into O2 as soon as it gets emitted.

it uses sand, i'm so cheap to use them. I didn't even have water filtration out lol

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8 minutes ago, LZ96 said:

it uses sand, i'm so cheap to use them. I didn't even have water filtration out lol

Look around on the map. In the ice and green biomes you'll usually find large pockets of sand. Each tile of which is 5 tonnes. There's enough sand on the map to keep you going for a very very long time.

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9 hours ago, LZ96 said:

Side note, stole the water separator idea from other posts to block out natural gas from going out of the fertilizers

A slight OP tip, your water locks are highly inefficient.  You don't need a full-on 3 wide 2 deep tank of water.  Just have it two deep in the middle, with a step on the left and right.  Dupes can hope down between offset areas.  The water locks you have there require over 3000 kg of water to function.  A stepped water lock requires just grams, and technically only one one of the stairs, though if you use a bottle emptier the dupes will empty 200 kg in it most of which will end up in the bottom tile.  You can leave out the second step temporarily and after filling mop that up, then put the second step back in.   It's the few grams on either one of the steps that does the locking.  It will save you a ton of dupe time filling it, and they won't get the 'sopping wet' debuff.

This is, btw, a mechanic I hope Klei nerfs at some point, somehow.  Perhaps by having thin water layers evaporate over time.

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48 minutes ago, brummbar7 said:

This is, btw, a mechanic I hope Klei nerfs at some point, somehow.  Perhaps by having thin water layers evaporate over time.

Then we have to deal with a new gas, water vapour, that is technically the same as steam but with a lower dew point. That would create all sorts of problems and exploits with it. Better leave it as is. 

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1 hour ago, Saturnus said:

Then we have to deal with a new gas, water vapour, that is technically the same as steam but with a lower dew point. That would create all sorts of problems and exploits with it. Better leave it as is. 

It would be unrealistic, but if water would just slinky itself down to the lowest point and behave more like a jello in small quantities, then it might be doable via the physics system.

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7 hours ago, Saturnus said:

Then we have to deal with a new gas, water vapour, that is technically the same as steam but with a lower dew point. That would create all sorts of problems and exploits with it. Better leave it as is. 

No, we don't have to have any such thing.  It just disappears.   Like used to happen with mopping.

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On 9/29/2017 at 10:02 AM, brummbar7 said:

A slight OP tip, your water locks are highly inefficient.  You don't need a full-on 3 wide 2 deep tank of water.  Just have it two deep in the middle, with a step on the left and right.  Dupes can hope down between offset areas.  The water locks you have there require over 3000 kg of water to function.  A stepped water lock requires just grams, and technically only one one of the stairs, though if you use a bottle emptier the dupes will empty 200 kg in it most of which will end up in the bottom tile.  You can leave out the second step temporarily and after filling mop that up, then put the second step back in.   It's the few grams on either one of the steps that does the locking.  It will save you a ton of dupe time filling it, and they won't get the 'sopping wet' debuff.

This is, btw, a mechanic I hope Klei nerfs at some point, somehow.  Perhaps by having thin water layers evaporate over time.

Hi Brummbar7, do you have a example of the build? I'm a bit confused based on what you said; sorry didn't get back to the thread for so long

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4 hours ago, LZ96 said:

Hi Brummbar7, do you have a example of the build? I'm a bit confused based on what you said; sorry didn't get back to the thread for so long

waterlocks.thumb.jpg.ece7ef76a11f86ef5f9cdab17370de4b.jpg

Not exactly a 'build' of stepped waterlocking, but several good examples of where water forms a vertical tile space when there are terrain variations. bonus: water on polluted water takes up two spaces...

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they removed my favorite "feature" so no longer can build cheaty doors, they open doors when their head hangs inside them, but still can make vacuum rooms or vacuum layers, only that cant build inside them vertically. i dont like poopy waterlocks, cool guys do liquid co2 or chlorine locks. they dont have any negative effect.

also now placing a storage with bleachstone inside farms is even better, as it keeps food fertile and kills germs. 

with the new bottlers, i found to be better to make a 5x1 basin and place a vent above, with a valve to refill it, same goes for the waterlocks, just place the vent and valve and pour fresh water for it.the other method is an algae deoxidizer, as it creates oxygen but stops at full pressure, so if you place it between 2 airlocks, the pressure coordinates the flow, the only way it can go is outside, which keeps all bad air outside, the small room fills up fast with oxygen, this preserves algae, so minimum 1x2 in size, but small rooms with oxygen are good ideea when expanding, dupes tend to run back for oxygen, or toilet, and their stress also grows, so the multi functional lavatory/statue/deoxidizer combo never goes wrong, maybe a vent or a lamp to fill it. 

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14 hours ago, LZ96 said:

Hi Brummbar7, do you have a example of the build? I'm a bit confused based on what you said; sorry didn't get back to the thread for so long

These are the two examples I use in my base. 

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The one on the right no longer has the bottler, but it was set up just like the one on the left.  I don't even need the water in the bottom, it's only the water on the left step that stops the gas.  You just need to deliver one bottle, that's it.  there's only a few grams of water on that left step.  I just never bothered to mop up the stuff in the bottom - I'd have to remove the right step to spread the water out enough to mop.  The left example I start do that, then got distracted.   Both are for access to geyser rooms, due to extremely high pressure in those rooms - they're basically never accessed once built, so no worries on debuffs.  I hate water locks and wish they would get nerfed as much as possible, but when in Zeboim...

In cases where pressure on both sides is similar, I use U-traps with a deoxidizer at the bend:

U-trap.jpg.3bf7114c5d2f4f99f07a93a708813302.jpg

No debuffs from liquid involved.  They work better when going from oxygen to a heavier gas such as chlorine or CO2.  but they'll do ok in hydrogen as well.  The door at the bottom right is due to the hydrogen, if it were chlorine or CO2 on the right I would not have the door there.

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On 29.9.2017 at 4:02 PM, brummbar7 said:

This is, btw, a mechanic I hope Klei nerfs at some point, somehow.  Perhaps by having thin water layers evaporate over time.

I'm not sure how hard it would be to implement, but maybe gas and liquid could be capable of sharing a tile as long as the liquid's mass is below 1000 kg?

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On 10/8/2017 at 4:42 PM, Michi01 said:

I'm not sure how hard it would be to implement, but maybe gas and liquid could be capable of sharing a tile as long as the liquid's mass is below 1000 kg?

I'm not a coder, but I would imagine that would be largely the same as doubling the number of tiles in the game.  So probably not great for performance.  But that's a guess.

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