Marble armor should protect the beefalo rider from knockback attacks.

[Gashzer]

1 minute ago, Cheggf said:

So why is it then that you want to keep riders being dismounted in combat to give them a "well needed downside" to counteract how powerful it is that they're "an infinite tentacle spike, mag/cane and regenerating 80% armour all in one package"?

Because an ornery beefalo is overall very powerful for casuals or less skilled players. Post rift content is meant to be harder... no more handicaps . But i was talking about walter and woby being much better for skilled players in my last post.

[00petar00]

2 hours ago, Gashzer said:

Because an ornery beefalo is overall very powerful for casuals or less skilled players. Post rift content is meant to be harder... no more handicaps . But i was talking about walter and woby being much better for skilled players in my last post.

Casual players don't ever tame a beefalo, I don't know in what world do you live in where beefalo taming happens often.

Only experienced players tame beefalo and even a lot of them don't bother because it wasn't in the game as a viable option for a really long time and it is still very tedious. 

[Gashzer]

24 minutes ago, 00petar00 said:

Casual players don't ever tame a beefalo, I don't know in what world do you live in where beefalo taming happens often.

Only experienced players tame beefalo and even a lot of them don't bother because it wasn't in the game as a viable option for a really long time and it is still very tedious. 

There is a difference between casual but experienced players and straight up noobs. I know people with 700+ hours that cant solo dfly (casual/not skilled in combat but they still know the game)

Our Mike is a perfect example. Obviously hes very knowledgeable about DST and all its mechanics and workings but struggles soloing bosses.

Beefalo taming is really easy to do just tedious as u say and a ornery beefalo has alot of benefits already for semi-skilled players. Klei doesnt need to make every boss or any future combat content ornery beefalo friendly cause there are three other types of beefalo versions to tame that do their job great as convenient late game transports with different side perks without having to get rid of the knockdown effect. 

Having this knockdown effect actually encourages us to maybe try an tame one of the other types if in the long run a ornery might not be the best investment. Default has the convenience of easy mount and dismount (very underrated QoL) and decent infinite weapon for killing regular mobs like hounds, spiders, clockworks with war saddle. It may be the better choice for non-boss combat in the long run over the ornery.

As i said these downsides make us reconsider what the best choice is for things. It would be very dumb of klei to implement marble suit preventing knockdown on beefalos. 

 

[Arcwell]

5 hours ago, Gashzer said:

Klei doesnt need to make every boss or any future combat content ornery beefalo friendly cause there are three other types of beefalo versions to tame that do their job great as convenient late game transports with different side perks without having to get rid of the knockdown effect. 

Having this knockdown effect actually encourages us to maybe try an tame one of the other types if in the long run a ornery might not be the best investment. Default has the convenience of easy mount and dismount (very underrated QoL) and decent infinite weapon for killing regular mobs like hounds, spiders, clockworks with war saddle. It may be the better choice for non-boss combat in the long run over the ornery.

As i said these downsides make us reconsider what the best choice is for things. It would be very dumb of klei to implement marble suit preventing knockdown on beefalos.

I don't see how this is much of a choice.

• If I tame an ornery beefalo, I get knocked off by the new attacks.
• If I tame a rider beefalo, I get knocked off by the new attacks.
• If I tame a default beefalo, I get knocked off by the new attacks.
• If I tame a pudgy beefalo, I get knocked off by the new attacks.
• If I get knocked off and the beefalo aggros the enemy, I cannot remount it until it loses aggro. It will most likely die and I cannot do anything about it.

The only "choice" you're suggesting here is "don't fight with beefalo." I hope you can understand how that's not a satisfactory "choice" for someone who considers beefalo to be more of a playstyle than a weapon.

I don't fight with beefalo because it is the best choice, I do so because I think it's fun. Knockoff mechanics effectively making beefalo's hp become 1 is, in my opinion, not fun or reasonable.

[MagicalStorm]

11 minutes ago, Arcwell said:

The only "choice" you're suggesting here is "don't fight with beefalo." I hope you can understand how that's not a satisfactory "choice" for someone who considers beefalo to be more of a playstyle than a weapon.

This feels less of a choice and more of a "limiting your options", which seems to be a common theme in wanting to make this game harder. Then again I'm mostly playing Wanda so I only really tame rider beefalo for trips I haven't set up a teleport for yet

[Gashzer]

1 hour ago, Arcwell said:

I don't see how this is much of a choice.

• If I tame an ornery beefalo, I get knocked off by the new attacks.
• If I tame a rider beefalo, I get knocked off by the new attacks.
• If I tame a default beefalo, I get knocked off by the new attacks.
• If I tame a pudgy beefalo, I get knocked off by the new attacks.
• If I get knocked off and the beefalo aggros the enemy, I cannot remount it until it loses aggro. It will most likely die and I cannot do anything about it.

The only "choice" you're suggesting here is "don't fight with beefalo." I hope you can understand how that's not a satisfactory "choice" for someone who considers beefalo to be more of a playstyle than a weapon.

I don't fight with beefalo because it is the best choice, I do so because I think it's fun. Knockoff mechanics effectively making beefalo's hp become 1 is, in my opinion, not fun or reasonable.

Yeah but you are not going to fight mobs on a pudgy, you tame the pudgy for the sanity boost which is useful for wicker and wortox especially... so being able to counteract the knockoff mechanic is most useful for the ornery beefalo, correct?

Then why would it be fair for the ornery getting special treatment over the other types? Im fine if this buff is added but klei pls buff the rider with a unique saddle that makes the rider even faster that can only go on the rider. A unique saddle for the pudgy that boosts summer and winter insulation by tier 3 and a backpack saddle (like woby) for the default beefalo. (Please buff big woby alot in Walters skill tree tho.)

 

[Tranoze]

2 hours ago, Arcwell said:

• If I get knocked off and the beefalo aggros the enemy

I agree with you that beefalo should have a away to counter knocked off, like instead of knocked off in one hit, you become unstable in first hit and then, knocked off in 2nd hit. You should be restable if you run away far enough to remount.
 

2 hours ago, Arcwell said:

I cannot do anything about it.

But, in the mean while, for you to be able to do something when wanting to fight enemies with beefalo without it die:

• Carry a panflute, or sleep time story in your inventory. If you get knocked off, read the book or use the panflute. It will stop beef from agroo enemy.
• If you use ornery beef, make sure to feed him 2 steamed twigs + few extra before fight start for his obedience to reach 100. That way you dont have to refeed him during the fight if you want to remount.
• Drop bell far away from the fight so if you get knocked off, beef instantly runaway instead of stand still there for enemy to attack and agroo it.

That the 3 things you can do if you want to fight new enemies with knocked off mechanic.

The strength of beefalo pre-knocked off is if you riding a beefalo you dont have to prepare anything before any fight. In most fight you have to prepare armor and healing, and beef alone take care of that both. Now instead of saying you have no way to fight enemies with knocked off, you actually can, only if you prepared for it, just like other types of fight.

[Lardee]

2 hours ago, Arcwell said:

I don't see how this is much of a choice.

• If I tame an ornery beefalo, I get knocked off by the new attacks.
• If I tame a rider beefalo, I get knocked off by the new attacks.
• If I tame a default beefalo, I get knocked off by the new attacks.
• If I tame a pudgy beefalo, I get knocked off by the new attacks.
• If I get knocked off and the beefalo aggros the enemy, I cannot remount it until it loses aggro. It will most likely die and I cannot do anything about it.

The only "choice" you're suggesting here is "don't fight with beefalo." I hope you can understand how that's not a satisfactory "choice" for someone who considers beefalo to be more of a playstyle than a weapon.

I don't fight with beefalo because it is the best choice, I do so because I think it's fun. Knockoff mechanics effectively making beefalo's hp become 1 is, in my opinion, not fun or reasonable.

Doesn't dropping the bell away from the fight save the Beefalo if you get knocked off? Or does that only work against certain bosses like NMWP?

[Arcwell]

35 minutes ago, Gashzer said:

Yeah but you are not going to fight mobs on a pudgy, you tame the pudgy for the sanity boost which is useful for wicker and wortox especially... so being able to counteract the knockoff mechanic is most useful for the ornery beefalo, correct?

Then why would it be fair for the ornery getting special treatment over the other types? Im fine if this buff is added but klei pls buff the rider with a unique saddle that makes the rider even faster that can only go on the rider. A unique saddle for the pudgy that boosts summer and winter insulation by tier 3 and a backpack saddle (like woby) for the default beefalo. (Please buff big woby alot in Walters skill tree tho.)

I'm not convinced it does specifically benefit ornery beefalo. Remember they all still do physical damage, so you're dealing 32.99 damage per hit (or 40.44 with war saddle) if you decide to fight a planar boss with an ornery beefalo, all while not triggering their stagger mechanics. Realistically they would all benefit since they can all use brightshade staff or howlitzer while mounted, both of which trigger stagger mechanics.

That said, I do agree that in general content (pre-rift especially), ornery is the most overrepresented tendency and it would be nice to have better reasons to tame the other types. I do not think holding ALL of them back because of knockback mechanics is a good solution to this. Also +1 for Woby buffs, she deserves it .

18 minutes ago, Tranoze said:

But, in the mean while, for you to be able to do something when wanting to fight enemies with beefalo without it die:

• Carry a panflute, or sleep time story in your inventory. If you get knocked off, read the book or use the panflute. It will stop beef from agroo enemy.
• If you use ornery beef, make sure to feed him 2 steamed twigs + few extra before fight start for his obedience to reach 100. That way you dont have to refeed him during the fight if you want to remount.
• Drop bell far away from the fight so if you get knocked off, beef instantly runaway instead of stand still there for enemy to attack and agroo it.

That the 3 things you can do if you want to fight new enemies with knocked off mechanic.

The strength of beefalo pre-knocked off is if you riding a beefalo you dont have to prepare anything before any fight. In most fight you have to prepare armor and healing, and beef alone take care of that both. Now instead of saying you have no way to fight enemies with knocked off, you actually can, only if you prepared for it, just like other types of fight.

Thank you for the tips! Another method I've seen used is running away from the fight to unload the beefalo, although obviously it's not ideal and relies on the enemy not dealing enough damage in enough time. And there are still situations where, even with this prep, if you get hit in the wrong way once, you cannot recover, period. A prime example of this is Armored Bearger, where panflute doesn't stop bearger from waking the beefalo up again, and bell won't matter because the beefalo is already aggroed (example in spoiler):

Spoiler

Even with Wes/Maxwell, wearing full brightshade armor/helm lets you take 4 hits and still be alive. With beefalo, there is currently no amount of preparation that can save you from a single Armored Bearger swipe.

5 minutes ago, Lardee said:

Doesn't dropping the bell away from the fight save the Beefalo if you get knocked off? Or does that only work against certain bosses like NMWP?

Depends on the enemy:

• Daywalker and Crystal Deerclops do not cause the beefalo to aggro when you get knocked off, so it can run to the bell.
• Brightshade, Armored Bearger, and Rasp (that's the ink blight with the tentacles) make the beefalo aggro when you get knocked off, so it doesn't get a chance to run to the bell.

[Tranoze]

20 minutes ago, Arcwell said:

• Brightshade, Armored Bearger, and Rasp (that's the ink blight with the tentacles) make the beefalo aggro when you get knocked off, so it doesn't get a chance to run to the bell.

Here another way, have telelocator staff in your inventory, and if you get knocked off, cast tele locator on your beefalo. This will help with brightshade and armored bearger.

And panflute/sleep are not 100% safe if you use it wrong. Wait for the enemy to finished their combo, then panflute, then jump on beefalo right away and try to walk away as fast as possible. Panflute wont work with bearger cuz his cooldown too short, but i think it ll work with Rasp if you time it right. ( I think Rasp only knock you off with the jump, while the slap deal damage, it doesnt knock you off so you still can run away after taking some damage.)

[Dragonboooorn]

Imagine using beffalo lmao

#Wolfgang_gang  #Maxwell_gang

[DownloadADuck]

1 hour ago, Dragonboooorn said:

Imagine using beffalo lmao

#Wolfgang_gang  #Maxwell_gang

Maxwell is really good on ornery beefalo

[CuteC]

On 10/26/2023 at 9:58 AM, Gashzer said:

Yeah its a new downside for using an ornery beefalo for combat. Whats the problem?

What kind of backwards logic is this.

So you're saying it's fair for people to be punished for using the beefalo specifically designed to be good at combat for... combat?

That's like saying rider should throw you off every 100 meters you run, it makes no sense.

Besides, what a downside, instantly lose your beef if you get hit once, very fun.

They already have a downside against these bosses and it is not having planar damage, surely dealing less damage than an easy to repair brightshade sword or dark scythe is enough.

[mykenception]

6 hours ago, Tranoze said:

Carry a panflute, or sleep time story in your inventory. If you get knocked off, read the book or use the panflute. It will stop beef from agroo enemy.

Mobs that knock you off your beef, especially the new ones, are immune to sleep

 

6 hours ago, Tranoze said:

If you use ornery beef, make sure to feed him 2 steamed twigs + few extra before fight start for his obedience to reach 100. That way you dont have to refeed him during the fight if you want to remount.

It's not about having enough time to feed the beef for a remount, it's that getting knocked off from your beef tends to get your beef aggroed to the attacker thereby glueing your beef and getting it killed in the process.

the only choice that would help is the bell placement in these situations plus running away to unload and hope the beef survives

still doesn't solve the amount of risk and danger getting knocked off from your beef tho

[Captain_Rage]

6 hours ago, Tranoze said:

I agree with you that beefalo should have a away to counter knocked off, like instead of knocked off in one hit, you become unstable in first hit and then, knocked off in 2nd hit. You should be restable if you run away far enough to remount.

Drop the Beefalo Bell one or two screens away from the fight.

[Tranoze]

2 hours ago, Captain_Rage said:

Drop the Beefalo Bell one or two screens away from the fight.

Hmm what the point of this comment, read down in my same post pls:

8 hours ago, Tranoze said:

But, in the mean while, for you to be able to do something when wanting to fight enemies with beefalo without it die:

• Carry a panflute, or sleep time story in your inventory. If you get knocked off, read the book or use the panflute. It will stop beef from agroo enemy.
• If you use ornery beef, make sure to feed him 2 steamed twigs + few extra before fight start for his obedience to reach 100. That way you dont have to refeed him during the fight if you want to remount.
• Drop bell far away from the fight so if you get knocked off, beef instantly runaway instead of stand still there for enemy to attack and agroo it.

 

Also Arcwell posted video on what happened when you dropped bell when try to fight armored bearger:
 

 

7 hours ago, Arcwell said:

  Hide contents

 

 

[Tranoze]

6 hours ago, mykenception said:

Mobs that knock you off your beef, especially the new ones, are immune to sleep

It not about sleep the mob that knock beefalo off, it about sleep beefalo so you can ride on him. Because beef agroo on enemy, you cant remount, but if you sleep it you can.(right now sleep book and panflute are only 2 safe way i can think of to stun the beefalo. Using sleep dart or ice staff reduce beef tame progress i think)

The method is simple:

Wait for enemies to do the stun/knocked off combo.
Sleep your beefalo
Ride on it
Run far away.

 

[Gashzer]

7 hours ago, CuteC said:

What kind of backwards logic is this.

So you're saying it's fair for people to be punished for using the beefalo specifically designed to be good at combat for... combat?

That's like saying rider should throw you off every 100 meters you run, it makes no sense.

Besides, what a downside, instantly lose your beef if you get hit once, very fun.

They already have a downside against these bosses and it is not having planar damage, surely dealing less damage than an easy to repair brightshade sword or dark scythe is enough.

You are not punished, ornery is still great for all previous fights just not these new rift bosses and its still great for transport. God forbid Klei trying to break us from using the same tactic/gear for everything. Planar damage and this knockoff effect are great mechanics forcing people to get out of their comfort zones. 

Why are you so against simply dismounting your ornery and trying to fight with planar equipment? Why are you so adverse to change? You are the one with backwards logic, thinking you can simply tame a ornery and do 100% of fights easy peasy with it. 

If klei adopted this attitude of resisting change they would of stopped updating DST long ago and moved on to Rotwood much sooner.

 

[CuteC]

1 hour ago, Gashzer said:

You are not punished, ornery is still great for all previous fights just not these new rift bosses and its still great for transport. God forbid Klei trying to break us from using the same tactic/gear for everything. Planar damage and this knockoff effect are great mechanics forcing people to get out of their comfort zones. 

Why are you so against simply dismounting your ornery and trying to fight with planar equipment? Why are you so adverse to change? You are the one with backwards logic, thinking you can simply tame a ornery and do 100% of fights easy peasy with it. 

If klei adopted this attitude of resisting change they would of stopped updating DST long ago and moved on to Rotwood much sooner.

 

Using planar gear is obviously so much better, but this is about having your beef essentially instantly die not being exactly very fun, the game isn't gonna become the worst thing imaginable to play just because people don't instantly lose an animal that takes an entire season to tame.

Some people like using the beef more, sometimes it can't be used with things such as celestial champion phase 3 and it's understandable why, but having it die in a single hit with no way of stopping it is just extremely unfair for no reason.

[Valase]

Beefalo skill tree when!

[Lokena]

1 hour ago, Valase said:

Beefalo skill tree when!

Already has it built in. You choose from four skills branches, with experience slowly accumulating as you play, then you get to fix them at the twenty-day mark, and you can't reset without replacing the beefalo. It just doesn't have a visible UI where you press the button, and it's your actions before that determine the choice instead.

[Cheggf]

On 10/27/2023 at 1:57 PM, Gashzer said:

Yeah but you are not going to fight mobs on a pudgy, you tame the pudgy for the sanity boost which is useful for wicker and wortox especially... so being able to counteract the knockoff mechanic is most useful for the ornery beefalo, correct?

Then why would it be fair for the ornery getting special treatment over the other types? Im fine if this buff is added but klei pls buff the rider with a unique saddle that makes the rider even faster that can only go on the rider. A unique saddle for the pudgy that boosts summer and winter insulation by tier 3 and a backpack saddle (like woby) for the default beefalo. (Please buff big woby alot in Walters skill tree tho.)

 

Is this entire Joker arc because you're mad that Woby isn't as powerful as the things that require hours of taming? This isn't even a buff, if we want to "buff" the other beefalo in the same way, how about this: every 15 seconds of riding Woby or a non-ornery beefalo, you get knocked off. But, if you're wearing marble armor, you don't get knocked off. Pretty fair downside, and a nice buff to go alongside it. 

[Gashzer]

5 hours ago, Cheggf said:

Is this entire Joker arc because you're mad that Woby isn't as powerful as the things that require hours of taming? This isn't even a buff, if we want to "buff" the other beefalo in the same way, how about this: every 15 seconds of riding Woby or a non-ornery beefalo, you get knocked off. But, if you're wearing marble armor, you don't get knocked off. Pretty fair downside, and a nice buff to go alongside it. 

I main Walter because Woby is as powerful as a fully tamed beefalo atleast in the ways that truly matter, that is a beefalos massive speed boost, negating piggy backpack speed penality, mount and dismount at will and being able to move chess pieces and altar pieces. Having an ornery is convenient with the infinite 50 damage weapon and passive 80% armour but the shield of terror also provides the same stats.

If walter wasnt as good i wouldnt play him. I dont care about walters personality or anything like that. I play him cause the extra 9 slots woby provides and the easy access beefalo are S-tier perks making him the best starting character in the game. Then once you get the celestial portal going, you can switch to wolfgang after obtaining a cane and mag for that sweet meta action.

You are spot on about the joker arc. The reason im on the forums at all is to give my input about Walter and to try an prevent Klei destroying my main by them possibly listening to bad feedback from other forum users.

Once Klei have fully released Walters skill tree and there are to be no more changes to him, i shall fade back into lurker mode where i belong.

[Jakepeng99]

On 10/27/2023 at 8:51 AM, Gashzer said:

Because an ornery beefalo is overall very powerful for casuals or less skilled players

They would probably get it killed tbh.

15 minutes ago, Gashzer said:

Having an ornery is convenient with the infinite 50 damage weapon and passive 80% armour but the shield of terror also provides the same stats.

Beefalo heals itself, and is much faster. There is an option for 66 damage too and beefalo allows you to wear things like bone helms, bee queen hats, ect without them losing durability. It also allows you to have anything in your hand slot, wether it be a shadow thurable, strident, or lazy teleporter.

 

Beefalos are fast enough to run away from any threat.

[Gashzer]

1 hour ago, Jakepeng99 said:

They would probably get it killed tbh.

Beefalo heals itself, and is much faster. There is an option for 66 damage too and beefalo allows you to wear things like bone helms, bee queen hats, ect without them losing durability. It also allows you to have anything in your hand slot, wether it be a shadow thurable, strident, or lazy teleporter.

 

Beefalos are fast enough to run away from any threat.

Woby cant die and can run from any threat also, Walter has no need for bee queen hat and the bone helm has high durability it will last a while especially if you only use it for utility purposes with the bone armour. Bone helm removes walters downside too, fight with body armour and pinecone hat until you go insane then switch to bone helm. 

Also a mag/cane provides all the speed boost you need for combat. 

In my opinion, pre-skill tree woby is a million times better than a beefalo in terms of the amount of effort required for the reward/usefulness. Walter and woby will only get better once the skill tree drops!