Jump to content

Fur Roll fixable with sewing kit + campfire synergy


Recommended Posts

 Even if one use of sewing kit restored one use of fur roll instead of fixing it completely? I could see it as a big thing for wormwood for example.

There could be three approaches.

  1. One use of sewing kit fixes 3 uses: Fur roll would have to not break at 0% and can't be used at 0%, use kit to get 100% back.
  2. One use of sewing kit fixes 2 uses: Sewing kit restores fur roll to 100% when it's on 33%.
  3. One use of sewing kit fixes 1 use: It just restores 1 use. 33%>66% or 66%>100%.

In the real world/movie, you'd often see people sleeping under the naked sky do it near a campfire. If straw rolls or fur rolls were used near the campfire, they would be boosted. 

Currently, both per-minute provide

  • Hunger: -60
  • Sanity: [Straw 40] [Fur 60]
  • Health: [Straw 0] [Fur 60]

People mostly care about saving time directly so faster sanity and health regen for sleeping near fire would be worthy change. Maybe also add a minor health regen to straw roll like 20HP per minute. It normally takes long to restore good amount of health, time is very precious I'm sure light, heat source synergy with bed rolls would be balanced.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Now that you mention it, it is quite weird that you can’t use a sewing kit on them already, I mean, you can sew up a thermal stone but not a fur sleeping bag?
 

I haven’t used the straw roll since Winter’s Feast from about 2 years ago and I don’t think I’ve ever crafted a fur roll since bunny buffs are so difficult to get and valuable. Any change that makes them any amount better is more than welcome. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

14 minutes ago, deemo_ said:

I don’t think I’ve ever crafted a fur roll since bunny buffs are so difficult to get and valuable. Any change that makes them any amount better is more than welcome.

That hedgehog speaks the truth :distracted:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Actually I would prefer more uses to them and tent. Is so punishing if these items consume whole, 1/3 or 1/6 of their durability while usage can last just few seconds and resore just few points of stats.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Having the durability for rolls and tent tick down as they're being used rather than all coming off in one chunk when you start would go a long way towards making them better.

An idea I had was that the tent could have a few inventory slots where you can place items like fur rolls, bernie, slurper pelts maybe?: and then those items would determine the effects of sleeping in the tent, with their durability slowly going down as you use it

the tent itself would no longer have durability but would do very little for you on its own

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

This idea is great, more uses for sleeping items would be super appreciated. But what if 'Well Rested' was added, providing a daily boost to speed or lower food loss for the day. Im not completely sure of a balanced temporary boost, but I find it to be a nice addition. 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Sleeping items really need to be time-based for their durability too. I think the fur roll should provide the same health regen as tents too.

The usage-based durabiltiy is an outdated mechanic from when sleeping was instanteous, it's probably one of the biggest oversights in the transition of mechanics/items in DS to DST.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 hours ago, Wonz said:

In the real world/movie, you'd often see people sleeping under the naked sky do it near a campfire. If straw rolls or fur rolls were used near the campfire, they would be boosted. 

How do you convey this information to the player?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Cheggf said:

How do you convey this information to the player?

Could be in the examination quotes of the character, or in the item description of the crafting menu. They tend to be quite vague, I think it would hint well without telling too much.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Cheggf said:

How do you convey this information to the player?

Voice lines I think.
When a character wakes up after sleeping without a nearby heat source they'll say something like "I hate sleeping in the cold".

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Nah fur roll is fine as is, any buffs to it would undermine walter's portable tent, which is awesome btw with 10uses, warms you up, drys you off.. great for exploring caves in winter with beefalo hat or in spring with rain coat. 

Only buff to fur roll i would want is to increase bunny puff drop rate to like 40%.

Sleeping is a great mechanic, people are just too lazy to wait 2mins to get full health and sanity but are happy enough to waste 2mins organising ingredients an waitin for crockpots to cook. Makes no sense to me.

Much rather eat raw meat/lichen/cooked monster meat/blue caps than havin to run back to base to cook food. Walter is great for nomadic play cause of his tent and faster cookin speed on campfire. Crockpots are overrated. Sleeping is the way!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, Cheggf said:

How do you convey this information to the player?

Why would you need to convey this? Some mechanics can be hidden, and this one wouldn't hurt. Plus, it's not like it would be impossible to notice that you got more when you slept near light/heat source.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I will always remind people to consider game balance in changes like this.

Sleeping facilities in the game share some common features: they cannot be repaired, they are relatively expensive compared to food, and they are low efficiency. I think it's a design choice to discourage people from using sleeping facility in general.

With an efficient and portable sleeping facility, recovering status is as easy as 2 meatball plus sleeping for a little. I believe that is part of the reason why it's discouraged.

I'm just reading cues. I can be wrong.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

16 minutes ago, goatt said:

I will always remind people to consider game balance in changes like this.

Sleeping facilities in the game share some common features: they cannot be repaired, they are relatively expensive compared to food, and they are low efficiency. I think it's a design choice to discourage people from using sleeping facility in general.

With an efficient and portable sleeping facility, recovering status is as easy as 2 meatball plus sleeping for a little. I believe that is part of the reason why it's discouraged.

I'm just reading cues. I can be wrong.

So ... Let's have underutilized mechanics in the game and call it a day ? Because if it was good, people might actually use it ? Just like farming post RWYS I guess.

I get your point though. Don't make it too good.. But that's for Klei to adjust.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

21 minutes ago, Caochu said:

Let's have underutilized mechanics in the game and call it a day ? Because if it was good, people might actually use it ? Just like farming post RWYS I guess.

It's always a choice, by utilizing preferred option, you always underutilize its alternatives. Now lots of people go to farming, and berries are under-utilized. My base in pub game usually have very few decorative berry bushes but no one is complaining because people like to farm.

You can argue there is a balance of preference to strike, but at the end of the day, "under-utilization" is highly dependent on preference in this game genre when game balance is good.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

47 minutes ago, goatt said:

I will always remind people to consider game balance in changes like this.

Sleeping facilities in the game share some common features: they cannot be repaired, they are relatively expensive compared to food, and they are low efficiency. I think it's a design choice to discourage people from using sleeping facility in general.

With an efficient and portable sleeping facility, recovering status is as easy as 2 meatball plus sleeping for a little. I believe that is part of the reason why it's discouraged.

I'm just reading cues. I can be wrong.

That's bad game design if it was intentional and I completely doubt it was they probably were unsure how to balance sleeping at the time and never got back around to tweaking it.

 

3 hours ago, Gashzer said:

Nah fur roll is fine as is, any buffs to it would undermine walter's portable tent, which is awesome btw with 10uses, warms you up, drys you off.. great for exploring caves in winter with beefalo hat or in spring with rain coat. 

Only buff to fur roll i would want is to increase bunny puff drop rate to like 40%.

Sleeping is a great mechanic, people are just too lazy to wait 2mins to get full health and sanity but are happy enough to waste 2mins organising ingredients an waitin for crockpots to cook. Makes no sense to me.

Much rather eat raw meat/lichen/cooked monster meat/blue caps than havin to run back to base to cook food. Walter is great for nomadic play cause of his tent and faster cookin speed on campfire. Crockpots are overrated. Sleeping is the way!

I've said many things with Walter are being power crept but this case is fine at the end of the day Walter's tent will be the easiest, fastest, or most accessible if they boost the uses however all they need to do is do the same to his.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Mysterious box said:

That's bad game design if it was intentional and I completely doubt it was they probably were unsure how to balance sleeping at the time and never got back around to tweaking it.

A bad design would be to allow sleeping to be a good alternative to food healing, boss loot healing and other healing means in many cases.

For example, you can easily make 10 meatballs in early game and carry fur roll (hammering a bunny hutch that's always outside ruins) to ruins and sleep between every 2 fights to recover sanity and hp. This is much more advantageous than other means such as looking for tons of blue caps for ruin rush.

Other uses such as carrying 10 meatballs and fur roll to clear forest spiders for days without any healing food.

Replacing Tam'o and use portable fur rolls to restore sanity every several days and then repair the fur roll using sewing kit.

I'm trying to say that making sleeping a desirable choice seems a bad game design, because fur roll can solve many problems and players will find less incentive to explore many other interesting aspects of the game to form their own version of strategies and routines.

I'm only voice the downsides, not because I don't see why it's a good idea, but because I wanna input something different and not repeat what's already under the thread.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

18 minutes ago, goatt said:

A bad design would be to allow sleeping to be a good alternative to food healing, boss loot healing and other healing means in many cases.

For example, you can easily make 10 meatballs in early game and carry fur roll (hammering a bunny hutch that's always outside ruins) to ruins and sleep between every 2 fights to recover sanity and hp. This is much more advantageous than other means such as looking for tons of blue caps for ruin rush.

Other uses such as carrying 10 meatballs and fur roll to clear forest spiders for days without any healing food.

Replacing Tam'o and use portable fur rolls to restore sanity every several days and then repair the fur roll using sewing kit.

I'm trying to say that making sleeping at desirable choice seems a bad game design, because fur roll can solve many problems and players will find less incentive to explore many other interesting aspects of the game to form their own version of strategies and routines.

Personally I'm of the opinion controversial as it may be that food heal healing should be weaker considering sleeping, Medicine, and healing magics exist. The fact that food is as good as it is, is the reason people don't pursue more strategies making sleeping more viable increases variety rather that than lowering it as most players are going to use food for immediate stat increases and tamo for passive increases because 1 requires you to stop and the other keeps you topped off while on the move only using durability. The fact those 2 sources are a end all be all for most is clearly a balance issue in the first place just how rare it is for someone to use the fur roll shows the current state of things pretty well heck a fair amount don't even use sleeping considering it a waste of time.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

16 minutes ago, Mysterious box said:

food heal healing should be weaker considering sleeping, Medicine, and healing magics exist.

I'm guessing, the reason of discouraging sleeping is to demote stationary play style. I think the game wants players to move around and do things, multi-task and plan ahead. I can't very well state the reason, but yeah, sleeping seems discouraged.

I think healing medicine is already a good alternative, because you can prepare them in large quantities with high efficiency, and they won't expire. The reason people don't use them, I think, is because people are lazy. When they are in the kitchen, they just use kitchen to heal without thinking too much. But healing salves and honey poultice are actually really good and efficient for mass production and general healing.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 minutes ago, goatt said:

I think healing medicine is already a good alternative, because you can prepare them in large quantities with high efficiency, and they won't expire. The reason people don't use them, I think, is because people are lazy. When they are in the kitchen, they just use kitchen to heal without thinking too much. But healing salves and honey poultice are actually really good and efficient for mass production and general healing.

No it's because healing foods heal a lot more, can fill all 3 stats, and can be used faster you can also stop the spoilage of food or slow it down a lot using different methods the problem still lies in the fact food is far too powerful to consider much else.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

41 minutes ago, Mysterious box said:

No it's because healing foods heal a lot more, can fill all 3 stats, and can be used faster you can also stop the spoilage of food or slow it down a lot using different methods the problem still lies in the fact food is far too powerful to consider much else.

You are only limiting your scope to battle. I'm talking about in all situations, and with players of all kinds of levels and knowledge. In many non battle scenarios, a raw gland is better healing if all you are out of healing food and far away from base or food source. I would not go all the way back to base and cook healing food then travel back to my tasks. In this case, carrying stacks of medicine is superior for emergencies for new players, for example.

Just because food is objectively better doesn't mean it's subjectively preferred. You can only speak for your own level of experience and for you own subjective preference. But I think the cost-to-value ratio is good, especially honey poultice.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 minutes ago, goatt said:

You are only limiting your scope to battle. I'm talking about in all situations, and with players of all kinds of levels and knowledge. In many non battle scenarios, a raw gland is better healing if all you are out of healing food and far away from base or food source. I would not go all the way back to base and cook healing food then travel back to my tasks. In this case, carrying stacks of medicine is superior for emergencies for new players, for example.

Just because food is objectively better doesn't mean it's subjectively preferred. You can only speak for your own level of experience and for you own subjective preference. But I think the cost-to-value ratio is good, especially honey poultice.

I wasn't talking purely in terms of battle there are longer lasting healing foods, ways to slow spoilage and after kill bee queen ways of outright stopping spoilage at which point medicine just can't compete a glan can be nice for scraps and nicks you might get fighting spiders and salves and honey poultice are decent enough at healing but they really can't compare to food even more so in the hands of experienced players are they bad means of healing? No but more often than not because of how much better food is they go ignored don't get me wrong I still use meds and such but that's more so due to me playing characters who restrict food healing usage rather than me actually caring to go out of my way to use medicine on it's own.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

9 minutes ago, Mysterious box said:

ways to slow spoilage and after kill bee queen ways of outright stopping spoilage at which point medicine just can't compete

That's correct, you added another condition just to compare to medicines' advantage of not expiring. You clearly compare them with pre-condition, without admitting those conditions themselves are important factors. Like I said, meds are good cost-to-value ratio, and they are good in certain scenarios. Just because you deliberately compare meds and food in your preferred conditions, doesn't mean other conditions don't exist.

Just because meds are not good in some scenarios doesn't mean they are bad in all scenarios. Even axe is good for fighting something, for example, birds killing in sack farming.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, goatt said:

That's correct, you added another condition just to compare to medicines' advantage of not expiring. You clearly compare them with pre-condition, without admitting those conditions themselves are important factors. Like I said, meds are good cost-to-value ratio, and they are good in certain scenarios. Just because you deliberately compare meds and food in your preferred conditions, doesn't mean other conditions don't exist.

But I've been mentioning slowing and stopping the spoilage mutliple times before this I'm not sure if you were not reading what I wrote or what also what the preferred condition where medicine excels over food? The fact that it never spoils innately? Are we saying healing foods are expensive? 

 

4 minutes ago, goatt said:

Just because meds are not good in some scenarios doesn't mean they are bad in all scenarios. Even axe is good for fighting something, for example, birds killing in sack farming.

As for this refer to what I quoted below because it seems you may have skipped it.

 

22 minutes ago, Mysterious box said:

at which point medicine just can't compete a glan can be nice for scraps and nicks you might get fighting spiders and salves and honey poultice are decent enough at healing but they really can't compare to food even more so in the hands of experienced players are they bad means of healing? No but more often than not because of how much better food is they go ignored

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

Please be aware that the content of this thread may be outdated and no longer applicable.

×
×
  • Create New...