I hand an epiphany, maybe I sound dumb idk

[Cloakingsumo198]

5 minutes ago, HowlVoid said:

So no more ideas about speed guys, throw them all away here:

At least we can still say that for what we've it traded in for we got the raw end of the deal 

[Mike23Ua]

2 minutes ago, Cloakingsumo198 said:

At least we can still say that for what we've it traded in for we got the raw end of the deal 

That’s still TBD..

Now that speed has been removed give them their 3 weeks of much deserved holiday vacation with their family & then let’s see what they come back with before saying the rework is finalized.

(Wendy’s Rework was given some time before changes too)

As a personal note: NO ONE Wants to see Wolfgang ruined… we want to see him have an identity and playstyle that is unique to picking to play as him.

[Catchee]

14 minutes ago, HowlVoid said:

So no more ideas about speed guys, throw them all away here:

[Erineyes7]

19 minutes ago, -Variant said:

Here's the statement from the public DST Discord.

That...

Really really sucks...

Unless Klei can really make some improvements, and add something interesting, I have no interest to touch him like ever again. Just play Wanda at that point.

[Toroic]

3 hours ago, Gi-Go said:

Absolutely true. But why rework one and delete the another one. Was that the same in your Wolfgang mod? Did you reworked damage but deleted speed?

I love thematically thematic characters as much as the next guy, which is why I love gym and even dumbbells, even tho most people think staying afk a little bit is a time waste. But do we really need to cut out all gameplay perks that aren't perfectly fitting into theme? Wolfgang is just a dumb strongman who is easy to scare stereotype, not a very deep theme to build character around. Willow has Bernie and that's not pyro themed.

Klei are wrong. I don't think this is something I need to explain. Even if it's their game they still don't know much about balance, which is why they rely on forums. And forums provided them with misinformation. I don't blame klei, but they sure did made a mistake in balance.

Wolfgang is very weak right now and needs buff instead. I'd say 2.5 damage, and a speed boost. Then he could match Wendy and Wanda - the only characters he should be balanced around. No point in nerfing combat character because he is better than working or minion character because of course he is - combat is the most important aspect of survival. Duh. Wigfrid is a tutorial character and should be ignored when it comes to balance, because people abandon her once they get better at the game. Tanking is not all that useful and everyone can do it. 

Oh and lastly, isn't Warly spice an overkill? Multiplayer throws balance out of the window and bosses are being bullied at that point. 

I had removed speed and left the scaling damage, but cranked up the side perks and buffed normal form.
For example, normal form had 1.25x damage and also ignored slowdown from gear.
Mighty form could carry heavy items on back with 0 slowdown and use a cane, so you could have a statue on your back and move at 1.25x speed.
Rowing was buffed to the point where with a driftwood sail you could zoom across the ocean and pretty quickly change direction or stop via rowing.

Becoming mighty worked the same way (but you could cancel out of animations) but hunger drain was capped at 2x.
Health max was 200, sanity max was 150, and sanity drain from all sources was 1.3x.
Also, if your sanity dropped below 15, you'd get induced insanity like a purple amulet or bone helm so more shadows could spawn than usual, potentially 4 or even 5 terrorbeaks if you got unlucky.
Klei wants to have some internal balance among the characters, and if that's the goal then buffing Wolfgang without nerfing doesn't make sense.  It's much easier to nerf a few standouts than buff everyone up to Wendy/Wanda.
Tanking is plenty useful in certain scenarios, and against deerclops is often the easiest and cheapest way to beat him due to his sanity drain.  Instead of restoring your sanity, just throw on armor as wolf and hold F with a hambat until he dies.  Bearager and Goose have mechanisms to discourage tanking, and that's fine as kiting them is a lot more fun than for deerclops.

The way you repeatedly frame subjective statements as if they're objective doesn't strengthen your argument.  It's perfectly fine to say that you don't want to play wolfgang without a speed boost, but double damage alone is a very powerful perk and no one has more reliable access to it than Wolfgang.  Compare him to Willow, Winona, Woodie, Webber, Wes, and Wigfrid and it's clear that he brings something valuable to the table.  Wendy even post-rework was in a very different place until beefalo bell and people realized Abi's 40% boost still applied while on a beefalo.  Wanda is high risk/high-reward and needs thulecite and to be at low health before she can compete with Wolf's damage.  There are clear tradeoffs and if you could look at the characters holistically instead of though what I would call a powergamer lens where someone is either the best or irrelevant, I believe you could recognize that.
Based on character popularity, Wendy, Wigfrid, and Wilson must be the strongest but in reality most people play the character they enjoy, not the one that gives the most mechanical advantage.
Multiplayer is also an important balance consideration, because DST has "Together" right in the title.  Many people do in fact play with others.

[Gi-Go]

58 minutes ago, HowlVoid said:

I believe Zark said in discord that the team had agreed that speed was not making a return. "Period". 

Oh thank God. I can finally officially drop the subject. 

[Mike23Ua]

14 minutes ago, Gi-Go said:

Oh thank God. I can finally officially drop the subject. 

Yes but.. what kind of creative ideas do you have for his New Rework.. what would you like to see that would make his gameplay more unique & allow the character to truly feel “Mighty” for you?

That’s what I want to know.

[Gi-Go]

2 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

Yes but.. what kind of creative ideas do you have for his New Rework.. what would you like to see that would make his gameplay more unique & allow the character to truly feel “Mighty” for you?

That’s what I want to know.

Nothing. I'm pleased with rework already, it's everything I could ever want. Stationary stats is quality of life and gym is fresh mechanic. Is what I'd say If they'd also kept Wolfgang an actual good character instead of nerfing his speed. 

But the worst part.... the worst part is Wolfgang was just a pre taste. He was just my number 5. The juicy stuff is comming. My old main, Wikerbottom, is gonna get train run on her. If I learned anything from this rework, it's that Klei nerf characters based on how overrated they are, and Wikerbottom is the most overhyped char this game has. It's gonna be a total disaster. 

[Mike23Ua]

2 minutes ago, Gi-Go said:

Nothing. I'm pleased with rework already, it's everything I could ever want. Stationary stats is quality of life and gym is fresh mechanic. Is what I'd say If they'd also kept Wolfgang an actual good character instead of nerfing his speed. 

But the worst part.... the worst part is Wolfgang was just a pre taste. He was just my number 5. The juicy stuff is comming. My old main, Wikerbottom, is gonna get train run on her. If I learned anything from this rework, it's that Klei nerf characters based on how overrated they are, and Wikerbottom is the most overhyped char this game has. It's gonna be a total disaster. 

No, If anything her books will be tweaked to require more ingredients from around the game (preferably even encouraging her to interact with newer areas released with the 2019-2021 updates) Wickers Vignettes actually show her as being even MORE powerful then her in-game portrayal, she needs that power but make her have to earn it by putting in the work.

I love Wicker (plus she’s been Nerfed already & her Rework hasn’t even come yet.)

[Gi-Go]

Wikerbottom rework wasn't even released, and one of her books is already ruined. I have zero hope these last 5 reworks will be any good. 

[Cloakingsumo198]

My question now is somebody gonna start a thread where there's only suggestions for tweaking/adding to Wolfgang without everybody fighting. Cause I saw alot more ideas in the all general madness then in the suggestions.

[HowlVoid]

2 minutes ago, Cloakingsumo198 said:

My question now is somebody gonna start a thread where there's only suggestions for tweaking/adding to Wolfgang without everybody fighting. Cause I saw alot more ideas in the all general madness then in the suggestions.

What about the

'Wolfgang streng brainstorm' thread?

I'm putting my ideas there 

[minespatch]

Wolfgang speed idea: Cane 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Cloakingsumo198]

1 minute ago, HowlVoid said:

What about the

'Wolfgang streng brainstorm' thread?

I'm putting my ideas there 

Lol I dunno why that thread has been mostly peaceful so far it's been great, perhaps the best choice.

[minespatch]

Wolfgang speed idea: Wormwood update: Coffee beans

[Cloakingsumo198]

You already know mains:

Spoiler

 

[viberr]

guys I found a solution to this peed problem, Really, I did

all you need to do is boot up the original don't starve, and BOOM, you have old wolfgang

no need to thank me , it's ok

[QuartzBeam]

3 hours ago, -Variant said:

Here's the statement from the public DST Discord.

We have reduced the speed. Pray that we do not reduce it further.

[Yuuko]

On 12/17/2021 at 9:21 PM, Gi-Go said:

It's not that easy to let Wolfgang's case go, since his death wasn't some kind of accident. It was a deliberate assassination by klei. The question is... who payed for it and why?

Anyone else find it kinda irksome that they out Wolfgang as a fake strongman in his video?  Like they don't just outright nerf him, they make him a fraud too :\ 

[QuartzBeam]

1 minute ago, Shosuko said:

Anyone else find it kinda irksome that they out Wolfgang as a fake strongman in his video?  Like they don't just outright nerf him, they make him a fraud too :\ 

Next up:

Wickerbottom cheated on all her exams. 

 

But seriously, Wolfgang is not a fake strongman. He is strong af, he just pretended to be superhumanly strong for the views, I mean, the applause.

[Milordo]

4 hours ago, HowlVoid said:

 

That's actually fine to me tbh if the whole team has unanimously agreed to not revisit a potential aspect of a character.

 

It's cool when an indie company, who has been for years the flag of it and inspiration for many others, now transform into a normal company and starting to behave more as a normal shitty Triple AAA company. Don't you love it right? 

[Yuuko]

8 hours ago, viberr said:

yeah but I haven't really seen many complain about the speed cept you and the guy with the troll face pfp

Most of the complaints were in the beta thread the week they had that open.  Since then, most of the ppl gave up completely and moved on (no longer playing wolfgang.)  I've avoided Wolfgang threads here because I'm pretty sure he's just gonna be what he is and don't think saying anything will drive any changes.  I think Klei wants him to be what he is now, something few people will actually pick or stick with :\ 

4 hours ago, HowlVoid said:

I believe Zark said in discord that the team had agreed that speed was not making a return. "Period". 

That's actually fine to me tbh if the whole team has unanimously agreed to not revisit a potential aspect of a character.

What I didn't like is that this was not communicated to us. Not sure when this decision was made, but a lot us could have refocused our ideas on other aspects of Wolfgang rather than waste our valuable time on things the team is completely ignoring. 

Kinda irked me tbh.

In other words don't waste time trying to bring speed back, at all. Any posts you make is only to fight other forumers, unless that's your thing... Then go for it.

imo this is kinda bad - I think removing the speed was good, but to say "we won't do x no matter what" is a pretty closed minded way to design something.  Its not like speed perks don't exist with other characters...  Do they actually HATE Wolfgang or something?

30 minutes ago, QuartzBeam said:

But seriously, Wolfgang is not a fake strongman. He is strong af, he just pretended to be superhumanly strong for the views, I mean, the applause.

idk about that :\ he didn't do anything that really showed you he was strong.  He lifted what was probably fake weights, because what he did next was also fake.  He didn't help pull the elephant out of the way of the train, and the shadow muscles helped him lift it :\ Its like they want Wolfgang to be this guys

instead of this guy

and that really makes me feel bad for Wolfgang :\

[Cloakingsumo198]

13 hours ago, viberr said:

yeah but I haven't really seen many complain about the speed cept you and the guy with the troll face pfp

This guy shows up late to the party and misses all the debates. Then spreads his objectively wrong opinion to people already done debating, just go read the fourms. 

6 hours ago, viberr said:

all you need to do is

[sudoku]

5 hours ago, Shosuko said:

imo this is kinda bad - I think removing the speed was good, but to say "we won't do x no matter what" is a pretty closed minded way to design something.  Its not like speed perks don't exist with other characters...  Do they actually HATE Wolfgang or something?

i was very confused on their breif synopsis of how they approached the rework in the first place, you know the one where they said they focused on a more fantasy role. What does that even mean anyway? 

Im assuming it means living out the fantasy that you are the strongman, which is why the main addition was the gym, which when i first saw i immediatley likened it to roleplaying. But its strange to me to focus on roleplay for a character who mostly appeals to players at the top who are concerened about stuff like game strategy, speed running, and damage stats.

So maybe the additional roleplay was for the average casual player, which im not sure really worked because out of all the characters a burly mustached guy seems like hes on the bottom of the barrel when it comes to this especially in a game that includes a talking plant, spider boy, fish girl, demon dog, and of course Wendy and Wigfrid. I dont think players who want to live out a characters fantasy want to roleplay as a strong dude working out at the gym. 

I think their original goal was flawed from the start.

[zarklord_klei]

5 hours ago, Shosuko said:

imo this is kinda bad - I think removing the speed was good, but to say "we won't do x no matter what" is a pretty closed minded way to design something.  Its not like speed perks don't exist with other characters...  Do they actually HATE Wolfgang or something?

First off I am a Wolfgang main, and I still am, though now I actually have a reason to play other characters, which is a good thing.
Secondly, we weren't originally a hard no on speed coming back, I believe on the Monday after we launched the beta was when, we as a team came to the agreement that it definitely wasn't coming back, period, and that it didn't fit his character.

Edit: I also want to clarify in regards to that screenshot that the "speed is not coming back period" comment is in reference to this rework, we can't know exactly where this game will be in several years and what might change, but for the immediate future we have no intentions to return his speed.