Gas filter

[Smife]

Can a gas filter reliably handle the outputs of two pumps, like in a SPOM for example? I noticed that the O2 pockets vary in size quite considerably. Is it wasting power?

[mathmanican]

4 minutes ago, Smife said:

Can a gas filter reliably handle the outputs of two pumps

Yes.

4 minutes ago, Smife said:

Is it wasting power?

Yes.

[TheMule]

8 minutes ago, Smife said:

Can a gas filter reliably handle the outputs of two pumps, like in a SPOM for example? I noticed that the O2 pockets vary in size quite considerably. Is it wasting power?

A mechanical filter if properly used is better and has no power requirements.

[Smife]

1 hour ago, TheMule said:

A mechanical filter if properly used is better and has no power requirements.

A mechanical filter? I hope it's not something oversized or overcomplicated.

[Steve8]

No. It's extremely simple. You simply use the fact that that a tile can only contain one gas:

When first set up you need to vent the hydrogen pump to the general environment until the center area only contains hydrogen. After that it's perfectly stable as long as you consume enough of it. So route the excess hydrogen into a tank and burn it off for electricity. If you don't then the hydrogen can build up and get into the oxygen pumps below

[mathmanican]

@Steve8 showed you a natural filter.  Here is link for more details on a mechanical filter. Both types of filters (natural and mechanical) utilize one-element-per-tile mechanics, just one does it before pumping, the other does it with stuff in pipes. 

 

[0xFADE]

Mechanical filters are one of the best use of game mechanics possible.  Only one gas existing in a pipe at a time allows it to work.  it will always work till they change that.

My general oxygen rooms use 3 each, each pump has one to filter oxygen and they combine to another to filter hydrogen.  Only oxygen is ever on the oxygen line and only hydrogen goes out the other.  Over engineered for sure but I have had polluted oxygen work its way though less filtered setups.

[Smife]

Wow, thanks for the examples everyone. Does one gas per tile mechanic considered bad for the game?

[mathmanican]

4 minutes ago, Smife said:

Does one gas per tile mechanic considered bad for the game

To me, this IS the game.  This one little rule makes for an entirely different universe in which we get to play, explore, and imagine how reality would be different. 

[0xFADE]

Most of what we can do with the game wouldn't work if you could have more than 1 of a gas/liquid in a tile.

[mathmanican]

24 minutes ago, 0xFADE said:

it will always work till they change that

If they changed this mechanic, it would be a very different game.  I look forward to DLC some day that makes a change to this, or add some other rule (actual gravity, or PV=nRT, or something else). They could have a DLC that allows you to pick and choose the laws you want to exist in your universe, and then play the game that way. So much fun could be had. 

[Steve8]

22 minutes ago, Smife said:

Wow, thanks for the examples everyone. Does one gas per tile mechanic considered bad for the game?

There are way too many exploits and bugs that people like to pretend are game mechanics, but this isn't one of them. It's just too fundamental to the whole system

[Lifegrow]

You could always use gas shutoffs for easy filtration too, they're reliable nowadays - here's an example of a simple loop for filtering multiple gasses. Change each element sensor to whatever gas you want to filter out.

Also Catbit.

[mathmanican]

9 minutes ago, Lifegrow said:

 

Welcome back, you hermit.  

[Angpaur]

16 hours ago, Smife said:

Is it wasting power?

Pumps have 5 sucktions points in a shape of a cross. Each game tick (0.2s) one of that points is sucking 100g of gas spending 48W doing so. It goes from top to bottom and then left and lastly right point.

So as long as you have there at least 100g per tile of any gas it will not waste power.

Also another thing important to know is that pumps have internal storage, so if during one full cycle (1s) pump sucks 200g of Hydrogen and 300g of Oxygen it can release a 200g Hydrogen packet first and store that 300g of Oxygen. If in next second it sucks same amount of gases then it will release a 600g packet of Oxygen, while keeping in storage 200g of Hydrogen.

 

Below screenshot shows that behaviour:

Spoiler

 

[Smife]

12 hours ago, Angpaur said:

Pumps have 5 sucktions points in a shape of a cross.

  Hide contents

 

I thought pumps cover only the 4 tiles they occupy. That's what wiki says as I can remember.

[mathmanican]

From the liquid pump page:

The wiki page is clearly wrong on the gas pump page. 

I always use the forums to find correct information.

Then I check it myself to verify.

[Angpaur]

8 hours ago, Smife said:

I thought pumps cover only the 4 tiles they occupy. That's what wiki says as I can remember.

 

[Smife]

39 minutes ago, Angpaur said:

 

Mind blown

[KittenIsAGeek]

One side note on all this gas filtering stuff.. if you're using mechanical filters, there are two things to keep in mind:

1) If your filtered gas packet is 1000g, you need a double-bridge setup, otherwise 0.1g of the filtered gas is going to go out the wrong pipe.
2) If your filtered gas output gets clogged, the filtered gas will start going out the non-filtered pipe.

If you're using a gas element sensor connected to a gas shutoff, you need to remember these tips:

1) If you lose power to the shutoffs, you won't filter.
2) If your filtered output gets full, you won't filter.

With the gas filter building, if either output gets full, the filter shuts off instead of sending gas down the wrong pipe. If the power goes out, no gas continues through.  So you don't need to worry about any sort of feedback with the filter building -- it takes care of all of that.  If you're filtering in any other way, your design needs to ensure that your gas goes where you want it when things aren't going right.

If I'm confusing, I apologize .. I should have been asleep a couple hours ago... ...but..but.. ONI!!!!

 

Edit: 

PS: If you're using the gas element sensor and gas shutoff, pairing it with any additional automation can have unintended side effects.  For example, connecting the gas element sensor to a not gate, intending to filter "not hydrogen" for example, may open the shutoff too late.  There is a propagation delay that needs to be accounted for: Gas sensor trips, then not gate trips, then valve opens.

[nakomaru]

Kitten raises good concerns, mostly caused by using an unfiltered pipe as if it were a filtered pipe. Fortunately, Lifegrow's schematic deals with these problems. Mechanical filters on a similar loop also works (and double bridges are definitely ideal for them).

[0xFADE]

Double bridges and going in the opposite direction too.

You gotta remember that you are only guaranteed what goes through the filter.  You can still get the filter out of the other side if the filter backs up.  Which is why each thing needs a filter and either some loop or exhaust at the end.

Still, it is completely safe, safer than anything that uses energy.