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Why DID Dragonfly get moved, anyway?


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I never stopped to actually wonder, why did they move Dragonfly to the desert in DST? It's been that way for so long that I forgot to wonder why it actually happened. Seems a bit weird to break the one giant for each season pattern, no? Did anyone at Klei ever answer this? I searched for a few minutes and couldn't find anything.

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idk but I think it was a good call.  Few people actually play on the surface during summer, so the boss would be a waste.  A lot of people skip antlion too.  Wildfires just too annoying to bother with any surface content for many players.

Funny I see people talk about turning disease off because its such a bad mechanic but they all keep wildfires on...  Fire hounds are enough of a threat for summer, wildfires are just problem-vomit.

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5 minutes ago, BeeClops said:

Summer is hard enough dude, you want a 27k health dragonfly burning you base too? :D 

She had only 2.7k health before being moved to the desert.

15 minutes ago, Erthos said:

I never stopped to actually wonder, why did they move Dragonfly to the desert in DST? It's been that way for so long that I forgot to wonder why it actually happened.

I assume it's either because they didn't want such a destructive boss in a cooperative game with public servers where someone could easily destroy everything on accident, or they really wanted to dial the dragon jokes up.

17 minutes ago, Erthos said:

Seems a bit weird to break the one giant for each season pattern, no?

Antlion is the new summer giant.

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Klei is allergic to fire, if you haven't already noticed.

 

The Dragonfly was a very destructive boss, who would burn down forests, crops, and bases. She was also the most difficult boss, you could kite and hit her once if you had a cane and were on a road (or had a magni), which took a long time, and the main way people fought her was to tank 1 hit, get 3 hits in, then kite her stomp attack.

[ MATH AHEAD, TL;DR BELOW ]

In classic Don't Starve, armor protection would stack, if I remember correctly, damage would be reduced by your highest armor, then THAT damage number would be reduced again by your second armor value.

So, with a football hat and log armor, that would be 80% of 75 (DFly's damage) > 15.

80% of 15 > 3. This means most often you would take 3 damage from the Dragonfly when tanking with the most commonly used armor.

In Don't Starve Together, armor protection does NOT stack, it only protects itself, so damage will be split between all armor pieces you are wearing (unlike Classic Don't Starve), but only the HIGHEST protection amount will be used.

So using any Football Helmets or Log Armor would only reduce her damage to 15, which is can be pretty massive when you are often forced to tank, so you would be forced to wear marble armor to reach the same damage numbers as Classic Don't Starve.

 

TL;DR - Tanking the dragonfly was the most common method when fighting her, and in DST you would essentially take 5x damage because of the way armor stacking works in DS vs DST.

Understandably, in a way, this is a massive threat compared to the other giants, and the punishment for not fighting her is having everything burned to the ground.

 

The Antlion was an attempt to replace the Dragonfly, the devs have directly referred to it as such, but I would argue it fails because the sinkholes are a complete joke.

Seriously, a couple of easily avoided, easily baited, barely destructive cookies are NOT worth the effort of giving the Antlion trinkets, or killing it.

 

And what we've lost is a difficult challenge boss who presented a real threat to your world. Now she is just a raid boss, who is mainly used for trophies, and to kill bosses for the player.

And, to top it off, people just hide in the caves during summer, because you no longer overheat, compared to Classic Don't Starve.

 

 

Yes class, I would like to show Uncompromising Mode for the 8th week in a row, where the Classic Dragonfly returns with all her functions intact, the Antlion's sinkholes are actually a major destructive threat, the Raidfly will actually fly away if she detects any other bosses nearby (and during summer when she can invade your base. Also its harder to cheese her with walls due to explosive Lavae), fissures can open in summer during earthquakes, which will erupt in fire, spawning Lavae, and soon threats will be coming to the Oasis, and you will be able to overheat in the caves just like Classic Don't Starve.

(She only has 5000 health when invading, not 27,000 btw)

If you couldn't tell, I'm perhaps a little mad that summer was nerfed so heavily in DST, I get that the Dragonfly was destructive, and players could join during the middle of summer, but I feel like Klei went WAY too overboard trying to account for this.

 

(And to bring this around to my opening sentence, I wish Willow got another refresh, her Pyromaniac side was completely left in the dust, and instead Klei focused on a bear which is only useful when you are insane. Willow's only real claim to fame is a niche bear that helps during insanity, which is already a joke to veteran players)

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2 hours ago, Erthos said:

I never stopped to actually wonder, why did they move Dragonfly to the desert in DST? It's been that way for so long that I forgot to wonder why it actually happened. Seems a bit weird to break the one giant for each season pattern, no? Did anyone at Klei ever answer this? I searched for a few minutes and couldn't find anything.

Maybe it saw a sign and thought it said "dessert". With those black beady eyes reading must be troublesome.

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I kinda like dragonfly as raid boss (and make ds single player worth to play the fight is so cool with her enrage all time) but antlion should spread the sand storm to other biomes to be worth mess with him or with the googles (and some loot for soloplayers )

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4 hours ago, Ogrecakes said:

Klei is allergic to fire, if you haven't already noticed.

 

The Dragonfly was a very destructive boss, who would burn down forests, crops, and bases. She was also the most difficult boss, you could kite and hit her once if you had a cane and were on a road (or had a magni), which took a long time, and the main way people fought her was to tank 1 hit, get 3 hits in, then kite her stomp attack.

[ MATH AHEAD, TL;DR BELOW ]

In classic Don't Starve, armor protection would stack, if I remember correctly, damage would be reduced by your highest armor, then THAT damage number would be reduced again by your second armor value.

So, with a football hat and log armor, that would be 80% of 75 (DFly's damage) > 15.

80% of 15 > 3. This means most often you would take 3 damage from the Dragonfly when tanking with the most commonly used armor.

In Don't Starve Together, armor protection does NOT stack, it only protects itself, so damage will be split between all armor pieces you are wearing (unlike Classic Don't Starve), but only the HIGHEST protection amount will be used.

So using any Football Helmets or Log Armor would only reduce her damage to 15, which is can be pretty massive when you are often forced to tank, so you would be forced to wear marble armor to reach the same damage numbers as Classic Don't Starve.

 

TL;DR - Tanking the dragonfly was the most common method when fighting her, and in DST you would essentially take 5x damage because of the way armor stacking works in DS vs DST.

Understandably, in a way, this is a massive threat compared to the other giants, and the punishment for not fighting her is having everything burned to the ground.

 

The Antlion was an attempt to replace the Dragonfly, the devs have directly referred to it as such, but I would argue it fails because the sinkholes are a complete joke.

Seriously, a couple of easily avoided, easily baited, barely destructive cookies are NOT worth the effort of giving the Antlion trinkets, or killing it.

 

And what we've lost is a difficult challenge boss who presented a real threat to your world. Now she is just a raid boss, who is mainly used for trophies, and to kill bosses for the player.

And, to top it off, people just hide in the caves during summer, because you no longer overheat, compared to Classic Don't Starve.

 

 

Yes class, I would like to show Uncompromising Mode for the 8th week in a row, where the Classic Dragonfly returns with all her functions intact, the Antlion's sinkholes are actually a major destructive threat, the Raidfly will actually fly away if she detects any other bosses nearby (and during summer when she can invade your base. Also its harder to cheese her with walls due to explosive Lavae), fissures can open in summer during earthquakes, which will erupt in fire, spawning Lavae, and soon threats will be coming to the Oasis, and you will be able to overheat in the caves just like Classic Don't Starve.

(She only has 5000 health when invading, not 27,000 btw)

If you couldn't tell, I'm perhaps a little mad that summer was nerfed so heavily in DST, I get that the Dragonfly was destructive, and players could join during the middle of summer, but I feel like Klei went WAY too overboard trying to account for this.

 

(And to bring this around to my opening sentence, I wish Willow got another refresh, her Pyromaniac side was completely left in the dust, and instead Klei focused on a bear which is only useful when you are insane. Willow's only real claim to fame is a niche bear that helps during insanity, which is already a joke to veteran players)

You had us in the first half, not gonna lie.

Glad to see you're embracing the meme of uncomp. mode

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I think the most logical reason is that dragonfly was designed for solo players when it roamed around, but In DST she gains a whopping 20,000 extra health points... to account for multiple players.

To this day I have not killed a Dragonfly in DST yet.. but I won’t let that discourage me, because checking the stats of how many people on Xbox have actually beat her- Not many other people have done it either.

image.thumb.jpg.f0636df0ea9f71e659652cb5a2f9b185.jpg

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Her destruction on top of summer wild fires was kinda annoying and too much, just like trolls burning stuff around, so you had to stop her. Now she's optional and Deerclops and Bearger are fair enough.

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1 hour ago, Mike23Ua said:

I think the most logical reason is that dragonfly was designed for solo players when it roamed around, but In DST she gains a whopping 20,000 extra health points... to account for multiple players.

To this day I have not killed a Dragonfly in DST yet.. but I won’t let that discourage me, because checking the stats of how many people on Xbox have actually beat her- Not many other people have done it either.

image.thumb.jpg.f0636df0ea9f71e659652cb5a2f9b185.jpg

i have beaten dfly, both on xbox and on the pc

image.jpeg.b05ffb16e9815d2d57d3168e0aac97dd.jpeg

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In truth, I feel as though it was because they wanted a boss tailored to the multiplayer experience when it was first introduced; and placing one of the hardest RoG bosses in an area that both fits the theme of the Dragonfly (desert) and has plenty of room to explore only made more sense. 

If they were planning on making any of the RoG bosses into a raid boss they might have had to consider how and where to place the boss, so it may have been way harder to put a large boss in a biome that well-represents them if the area itself is small, overcrowded with other natural resources, or often ventured to. The desert is large with the only resources often ventured into being both the cacti and the tumbleweeds (there are others of course but those are the primary resources).

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8 hours ago, Ogrecakes said:

Yes class, I would like to show Uncompromising Mode for the 8th week in a row

Acknowledging your problems doesn't make them go away. Joking about how you advertise Uncompromising Mode in every single thread doesn't make advertising the mod in every single thread somehow better. Whenever you talk about this mod in literally every thread about a game mechanic, it just gives off this impression that you all at the Uncompromising Mode team think you're better than Klei, which just makes me less and less interested in the mod every time.

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9 hours ago, Ogrecakes said:

The Dragonfly was a very destructive boss, who would burn down forests, crops, and bases. She was also the most difficult boss, you could kite and hit her once if you had a cane and were on a road (or had a magni), which took a long time, and the main way people fought her was to tank 1 hit, get 3 hits in, then kite her stomp attack.

idk what you're talking about.  You could feed her a stack of ash to put her to sleep, then wake her up with an old bell lolol

or are you going to say that feeding her ash to put her to sleep wasn't intended by the devs or that Old Bell is cheese XDXDDXDDDD

I don't want to get too distracted here because I think such problems are best left ignored (people constantly inserting their irrelevant thoughts into every thread) but uncom mod is nothing more than people enforcing their meta play style on the game because they were disappointed any alternative methods worked.  I'm pretty sure if I bothered to play with it I could find enough cheese to make installing it moot, but why bother?  They just want to play the game their way, and that's fine - All I ask is they keep their MOD games out of General Discussion pls.

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41 minutes ago, Sunset Skye said:

Acknowledging your problems doesn't make them go away. Joking about how you advertise Uncompromising Mode in every single thread doesn't make advertising the mod in every single thread somehow better. Whenever you talk about this mod in literally every thread about a game mechanic, it just gives off this impression that you all at the Uncompromising Mode team think you're better than Klei, which just makes me less and less interested in the mod every time.

Yeah people umm people seem to get that confused, their talking about something called an Uncompromising Mod..

Im talking about a Klei Official Totally Uncompromising Mode.. The Two are not even Remotely the same in any way.

While I appreciate the efforts of mod creators attempting to make an Uncompromising Mod... that does not help me in any way shape or form as a console player, Because we do not and will not ever have Mod Access.. mods are not Officially part of the game.

The (Currently Non-Existent) Klei Official Totally Uncompromising Mode is content made by Klei, designed only by people working at Klei, and Inspired by all of Klei’s previous works & add-ons- This Mode would obviously burrow ideas and gameplay mechanics from The likes of Dont Starve Giant Edition, Dont Starve Shipwrecked, Dont Starve Hamlet, Dont Starve Pocket Edition (The ability to toggle starting the game with reduced overall health specifically) it my even burrow a few ideas outside of the Don’t Starve franchise from the likes of Oxygen Not Included or Any of Klei‘s other games.

 

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1 hour ago, Sunset Skye said:

Acknowledging your problems doesn't make them go away. Joking about how you advertise Uncompromising Mode in every single thread doesn't make advertising the mod in every single thread somehow better. Whenever you talk about this mod in literally every thread about a game mechanic, it just gives off this impression that you all at the Uncompromising Mode team think you're better than Klei, which just makes me less and less interested in the mod every time.

bravo

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1 hour ago, Sunset Skye said:

Acknowledging your problems doesn't make them go away. Joking about how you advertise Uncompromising Mode in every single thread doesn't make advertising the mod in every single thread somehow better. Whenever you talk about this mod in literally every thread about a game mechanic, it just gives off this impression that you all at the Uncompromising Mode team think you're better than Klei, which just makes me less and less interested in the mod every time.

we've all known it, you're just the first to say it

that takes stones, my dear Sunset Skye. you've earned a bit of respect.

however, let's focus on the question of the post. we can talk about mod promotion and the effects of it in a different topic.

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1 hour ago, Shosuko said:

idk what you're talking about.  You could feed her a stack of ash to put her to sleep, then wake her up with an old bell lolol

or are you going to say that feeding her ash to put her to sleep wasn't intended by the devs or that Old Bell is cheese XDXDDXDDDD

I don't want to get too distracted here because I think such problems are best left ignored (people constantly inserting their irrelevant thoughts into every thread) but uncom mod is nothing more than people enforcing their meta play style on the game because they were disappointed any alternative methods worked.  I'm pretty sure if I bothered to play with it I could find enough cheese to make installing it moot, but why bother?  They just want to play the game their way, and that's fine - All I ask is they keep their MOD games out of General Discussion pls.

Old Bell and Freezing/Panflute/Sleeping works against any of the giants.

2 hours ago, Sunset Skye said:

Acknowledging your problems doesn't make them go away. Joking about how you advertise Uncompromising Mode in every single thread doesn't make advertising the mod in every single thread somehow better. Whenever you talk about this mod in literally every thread about a game mechanic, it just gives off this impression that you all at the Uncompromising Mode team think you're better than Klei, which just makes me less and less interested in the mod every time.

"Every single thread" is clearly hyperbole, and what I brought up is directly related to the Dragonfly, and summer as a whole.

 

By nerfing and removing mechanics from summer Klei left it void of its original challenge, and in their attempt to fill it they added the Antlion, which is a complete joke.

 

Uncompromising is relevant because it adds these things back in, so in this instance, yes, it's better than Klei. They cut content and nerfed things, leaving a sizable portion of the player base disappointed, just because new players might join a server during summer, and the Dragonfly was a major threat if not taken care of.

When I talk about insanity being a joke, it's in threads that ask questions like "Why should I ever not be insane?"

 

The fact that insanity is a positive thing is insane to me, and when characters have downsides that are related to sanity, I point out how it fails as a challenging mechanic.

 

I'm trying to give people a choice, hoping that anyone who cares about actual challenging content will have somewhere to get it, because clearly Klei is NOT providing.

 

Glad you casual players get pandered to constantly, probably wouldn't know what it feels like to be a veteran player who had their game nerfed and filled with casual multiplayer hallmarks, sorry that it is incredibly annoying and that I chose to do something about it.

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Yeah let me just cut you off there- Any game that was originally single player has to make compromises when transitioning into being a Multiplayer game. And I’ll provide a few examples- In the original State of Decay wrecking a vehicle or blowing up a vehicle meant one less vehicle you had that you could use around the map..

this worked fine in Single Player, However for Anti-Grieving Measures people were given new found options with the Multiplayer Sequel, you can flip vehicles that get turned over by rocking back and forth, you can use the “Unstuck Me” Button to get a vehicle that’s been crashed back onto a driveable path, And last but not least... if some jerk blew up your vehicle you could repair it good as a new with a simple repair kit. 
 

It took a lot of the challenge out of the game, but you can’t take a single player game and turn it multiplayer without compromises.

If you don’t like SoD as an example.. fine let’s use the juggernaut that EVERYONE has played- Grand Theft Auto V.. In Single Player vehicles have different physics, you launch off a ramp wrong and nose dive into the concrete expect to explode... you don’t Nose dive but still hit hard.. expect to watch your tire pop off rolling down the street, you run into something head on at high speeds, Congratulations you just become a windshield canon.

All of these don’t exist outside of Story Mode because in Online Compromises has to be made to avoid grieving.

DST is the same way.... however there are some things that Klei could bring back, such as Hamlets hazmat biomes... that I feel would fit into DST.

And I will continue to beg for those things in the appropriate threads to beg for them-

In the meantime... just remember that any single player game that later becomes multiplayer, has to make compromises.

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4 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

Yeah let me just cut you off there- Any game that was originally single player has to make compromises when transitioning into being a Multiplayer game. And I’ll provide a few examples- In the original State of Decay wrecking a vehicle or blowing up a vehicle meant one less vehicle you had that you could use around the map..

this worked fine in Single Player, However for Anti-Grieving Measures people were given new found options with the Multiplayer Sequel, you can flip vehicles that get turned over by rocking back and forth, you can use the “Unstuck Me” Button to get a vehicle that’s been crashed back onto a driveable path, And last but not least... if some jerk blew up your vehicle you could repair it good as a new with a simple repair kit. 
 

It took a lot of the challenge out of the game, but you can’t take a single player game and turn it multiplayer without compromises.

If you don’t like SoD as an example.. fine let’s use the juggernaut that EVERYONE has played- Grand Theft Auto V.. In Single Player vehicles have different physics, you launch off a ramp wrong and nose dive into the concrete expect to explode... you don’t Nose dive but still hit hard.. expect to watch your tire pop off rolling down the street, you run into something head on at high speeds, Congratulations you just become a windshield canon.

All of these don’t exist outside of Story Mode because in Online Compromises has to be made to avoid grieving.

DST is the same way.... however there are some things that Klei could bring back, such as Hamlets hazmat biomes... that I feel would fit into DST.

And I will continue to beg for those things in the appropriate threads to beg for them-

In the meantime... just remember that any single player game that later becomes multiplayer, has to make compromises.

I don't know what cutting things like cave overheating has to do with greifing, because I put that back in and it works 100% fine.

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39 minutes ago, Ogrecakes said:

Glad you casual players get pandered to constantly, probably wouldn't know what it feels like to be a veteran player who had their game nerfed and filled with casual multiplayer hallmarks, sorry that it is incredibly annoying and that I chose to do something about it.

Oh come on, this is such a Reddit attitude: "If anyone disagrees with me about a videogame, they're simply casual players who don't understand me." I completely understand why you feel the way you do about the game's difficulty, actually, even if I don't personally agree. Regardless of that though, you have no idea how long or how actively I've been playing the game. Do I need to like, provide my steam purchase history in order for you to take my posts seriously?

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3 minutes ago, Sunset Skye said:

Oh come on, this is such a Reddit attitude: "If anyone disagrees with me about a videogame, they're simply casual players who don't understand me." I completely understand why you feel the way you do about the game's difficulty, actually, even if I don't personally agree. Regardless of that though, you have no idea how long or how actively I've been playing the game. Do I need to like, provide my steam purchase history in order for you to take my posts seriously?

If you want to view casual play as a bad thing thats up to you. But your stance on things in the past and now are clearly against veteran design.

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4 minutes ago, Sunset Skye said:

Oh come on, this is such a Reddit attitude

Not to be rude, but forums like these attracts the circlejerk. Controversial is not very welcoming in topic of discussion, so it boils down to big majority liking each other. Exceptions like "The New Home" topic really shook up the community and I see a big split in opinion, hence the number of replies. Not to mention using confused reaction as a downvote (and I know you do it). One thing I can agree, @Ogrecakes you should calm down with your shilling. You can express your opinion without your mod absolutely fine.

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It looks like we will soon get a new game that can compete with dst! Where can I buy it? Or is it just a joke by someone who feels good about themselves? Looks like Klei is going to be defeated by them? I'm so scared XDDDDDDDDDDDDDD 

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