I don't understand why Klei haven't made the Ancient Guardian uncheesable

[me real life]

23 minutes ago, Desblat said:

How come you don't see the problem?

If INTENDED BY THE DEVS  method of killing boss is unfun and players have to invent their-own method using bugs and exploits (that were NOT INTENDED BY THE DEVS) that means there is A FAILURE IN GAME DESIGN.

I didn't state if I think the game design is good or bad, that's a completely different topic. I'm replying to the post that said If someone finds any exploit acceptable then it means they must not actually like the rest of the game, because I think it's a silly attitude to have.

[bruhmoment23]

I'm sorry to say this, but this thread has really become a big clusterf*ck. Can't we just settle this over a pint? I mean we're all people at the end of the day, and winning some internet argument doesnt bring much happiness to ones life. Just drink some tea and chill.

[Prajdo]

Ancient Guardian needs rework. His drop lack a Festive Bauble! 

[Wumpus the 19th]

16 hours ago, bruhmoment23 said:

I'm sorry to say this, but this thread has really become a big clusterf*ck. Can't we just settle this over a pint? I mean we're all people at the end of the day, and winning some internet argument doesnt bring much happiness to ones life. Just drink some tea and chill.

I agree with this man. namely on the beverage point of their argument. i shall now toss another maxwell meme onto this heated debate as to calm down the internet rage.

Bond over your love of stupid photoshop memes

I am glad my stupid memes to quell the internet arguments are getting so many likes 

[Owlrust]

It could just be that Klei doesn't believe it's a problem. In games it usually comes down to what the devs intended, and sometimes people will abuse a mechanic, thereby self-adopting a different view than what the developers wanted. For example, Fortnite. In that game, building was meant to be used as a means to make buildings and forts to defend and lock down positions originally, but people prefer to use the mechanic to win fights directly; do those players own the mechanic and define how it was intended to be used? No. Are those players a focal point for balance on those mechanics? Of course. In this circumstance, the fight was intended to revolve around dodging its charge attack but people found a way to make it their own and cheese it. I always thought exploits were like a reward for inventive players who discovered a way to make fights easier, and I remember spending hours trying to find the next cool thing. The ancient guardian is still fight-able the way it was intended, it's just up to people to choose not to do it.

[Spep]

ah yes, another symptom of DST's lackluster combat mechanics.


 yes hello, battlemaster pugna? yes i would like to order absolutely every weapon you have left in stock to the ruins, yes i can pay that, yes i would like better enemy AI with that, pleasure doing buisness with you.

[GetNerfedOn]

Imo I think exploits are an intelligent use of game flaws. Some of them, like the infinite lantern glitch in DS alone (if its still there, correct me.if im wrong) were left ingame by the devs foe the players (though im not sure either, do correct me of im wrong too.)

[ArubaroBeefalo]

If people wanna chese there is the iceflingo that are better ice weapon than ice staff...But its so anticlimatic to save the minotaur for being bugged in the middle of the fight 

Maybe its an intelligent way to win the fight but only was smart the guy who discover it the rest of players just google "how to kill ancient guardian".

Unless iceflingo cheesing needs a little of preparation

[Owlrust]

Also, for a suggestion, what if the player  was put in an indestructible ring when they fight the AG? That way it makes the fight more skill-based, while also removing the ability to cheese the fight. I believe the Iron Hulk from Hamlet was also able to trap the player in boulders too, so it may not be that entirely far-fetched.  

[Sinister_Fang]

Ok. I'll just tank it with marble suits and thulecite helmets then. Maybe even some garlic spice too if I'm playing as/with Warly. It might cost a bit more, but it's a strategy that's just as cheesy.

[Spep]

1 hour ago, Owlrus98 said:

Also, for a suggestion, what if the player  was put in an indestructible ring when they fight the AG? That way it makes the fight more skill-based, while also removing the ability to cheese the fight. I believe the Iron Hulk from Hamlet was also able to trap the player in boulders too, so it may not be that entirely far-fetched.  

the lazy explorer would like a word with you.

[Primalflower]

no LOL

[me real life]

4 hours ago, GetNerfedOn said:

Imo I think exploits are an intelligent use of game flaws. Some of them, like the infinite lantern glitch in DS alone (if its still there, correct me.if im wrong) were left ingame by the devs foe the players (though im not sure either, do correct me of im wrong too.)

The lantern glitch was actually fixed recently, since Hamlet added lamp posts as a legitimate infinite light source. It is true though that some glitches are acknowledged by the devs and then left in the game, like fire farms or the way that any Teleportato (even Hamlet's) will reset the volcano and caves/ruins.

1 hour ago, Owlrus98 said:

I believe the Iron Hulk from Hamlet was also able to trap the player in boulders too, so it may not be that entirely far-fetched.  

I think the basalt eruptions the Iron Hulk makes is more meant to make things unpredictable and confusing than it is to actually trap the player, considering almost all the Hulk's attacks will destroy that basalt if you're standing next to it.

[MilesUpshore]

Imo if ancient guardian needs a rework, it being cheesable isn't a good reason, since every boss is cheesable and there are multiple strategies that players have used over the years. Also if it being cheesable = very easy and therefore needs rework, then consider how there's still a lot of players who don't do ruins rush since beating ancient guardian is part of the course, and finding those who can is pretty uncommon on the public servers. Though if ancient guardian needs a rework, I see its fighting pattern being a rook v.2 but deals more damage, which gets really boring (toadstool is challenging but it has interesting attack patterns), but I can't think of any suggestions for that change so shrug.

[layangan putus]

Just now, ArubaroBeefalo said:

you can solo kill every boss without cheating

and such thing gives you great experience and self-satisfaction.

[moneymonday]

19 hours ago, Desblat said:

How come you don't see the problem?

If INTENDED BY THE DEVS  method of killing boss is unfun and players have to invent their-own method using bugs and exploits (that were NOT INTENDED BY THE DEVS) that means there is A FAILURE IN GAME DESIGN.

I don't really blame them, ancient guardian is one of the oldest bosses (i think) and so I understand why it is very simple. 

Look at the newer bosses they have added. Each is unique, fun, and introduces new mechanics, so I wouldn't call it a failure. More like an outdated feature. Plus, the main reason most people kill ancient guardian is to spawn ancient fuelweaver, so I don't expect it to get a lot new mechanics. 

(The following text may boil your blood)

I'm not going to not cheese ancient guardian because the journey is fun enough and I don't want to fight a unicorn head with legs that can only charge at me

[Viktor234]

10 minutes ago, PrezPara said:

the main reason most people kill ancient guardian is to spawn ancient fuelweaver

Disagree, the real main reason why me and the others are killing Ancient Guardian is in most cases to get a Lazy Explorer and some other loot before the first winter starts. And if you want to spawn the Ancient Fuelweaver, then the Ancient Guardian is already dead in most cases, because of the loot he grants.

Your reason does rather fit into long term worlds where loot like that is already useless, or solo worlds where you don't need to share your loot.

[moneymonday]

19 minutes ago, Viktor234 said:

Disagree, the real main reason why me and the others are killing Ancient Guardian is in most cases to get a Lazy Explorer and some other loot before the first winter starts. And if you want to spawn the Ancient Fuelweaver, then the Ancient Guardian is already dead in most cases, because of the loot he grants.

Your reason does rather fit into long term worlds where loot like that is already useless, or solo worlds where you don't need to share your loot.

Yeah, I do see that, but the lazy explorer and ruins loot he drops can also be gained by just exploring ruins. This just makes him a less important boss, his only unique loot is his horn for houndicus shooticus