minespatch Posted September 25, 2018 Share Posted September 25, 2018 We were discussing lore at Taco Bell and he was curious about Winona and her work at the Voxola factory, here's his questions: When was Wolfgang a soldier? His spiked picklehaube helmet suggests 1916 or earlier. When did Winona enter the Constant? Could her being hired by the Voxola Company have happened about 1917 or 1918, because male soldiers being sent to war meant women were hired. I'll be printing out the Kevin displayed lore out for my father but if you guys could hypothesize some things, that would help him understand the lore better. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/95847-my-fathers-lore-questions/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maxposting Posted September 25, 2018 Share Posted September 25, 2018 3 hours ago, minespatch said: When did Winona enter the Constant? After the 2nd WW started because: Spoiler It could honestly be Winona , even the face links Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/95847-my-fathers-lore-questions/#findComment-1087322 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ali Bun Posted September 25, 2018 Share Posted September 25, 2018 Wolfgang had to have at least fought in WW1 or even one of those Russian wars a little before. Winona just hurts lore but yeah.. she has to be around the second world war as women both in America and Canada had factory jobs making not only war products but also household, like the radio. Althoughhhh, if that's the case that would make her like really old. She's the older sister of Charlie, assuming Charlie was 30-25 before she was taken to the Constant in 1916(sorry if that's the wrong date) she would be wayyyy old. She didn't leave the same time as Charlie and I'm not sure if Klei just forgot the fact Wilson was the last one to enter in the 30's but it seems like they made Winona come last due to the time period look they're going for. It's hard to figure out if thats what they meant to do or its just inconsistent and they made a small timeline mistake or something. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/95847-my-fathers-lore-questions/#findComment-1087344 Share on other sites More sharing options...
minespatch Posted September 25, 2018 Author Share Posted September 25, 2018 1 hour ago, Ali Bun said: assuming Charlie was 30-25 before she was taken to the Constant in 1916 1906 due to the San Francisco earthquake as featured in "Last Act". My father insists that the radio was built right after ww1 which would means she was part of the labor force. The Voxola company burned down after the first world war 2(gone in 1919). How can she work on a radio during 1940s when the company burned down in 1919? The confusion reminds me how in Bendy and Ink Machine features "Buy War Bonds" when the game was set before the second war. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/95847-my-fathers-lore-questions/#findComment-1087362 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ali Bun Posted September 25, 2018 Share Posted September 25, 2018 1 minute ago, minespatch said: 1906 due to the San Francisco earthquake as featured in "Last Act". My father insists that the radio was built right after ww1 which would means she was part of the labor force. The Voxola company burned down after the first world war 2(gone in 1919). How can she work on a radio during 1940s when the company burned down in 1919? The confusion reminds me how in Bendy and Ink Machine features "Buy War Bonds" when the game was set before the second war. Thank you for correcting the date for me, it's been awhile since I have last seen the timeline forum post and watched the Last Act. She could have been working in the factory during WWI yeah, its just really confusing because she's was made to look like she's from the 40's like you say. It would help if we knew how old she was or at least how many years older she is to Charlie. Just for a more clearer timeline you know? Maybe she was taken right after the fire though because she can't be the last to enter the Constant, she's just the last to join the group in DST ( mainly because she was implemented last thing). Also wish we got more lore on Voxola and the factory and why its so important. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/95847-my-fathers-lore-questions/#findComment-1087364 Share on other sites More sharing options...
minespatch Posted September 25, 2018 Author Share Posted September 25, 2018 1 minute ago, Ali Bun said: Just for a more clearer timeline you know? Maybe she was taken right after the fire though because she can't be the last to enter the Constant, she's just the last to join the group in DST I think you actually raise a point. The Constant isn't clear so Winona probably got lost during the time stream before arriving in the main hub where the protagonists are in. Charlie probably used the gateway in "What Lies Beyond" to open a way for her sister to find our heroes so maybe Charlie was doing a service for her sister? Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/95847-my-fathers-lore-questions/#findComment-1087365 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ali Bun Posted September 25, 2018 Share Posted September 25, 2018 25 minutes ago, minespatch said: maybe Charlie was doing a service for her sister? A pretty messed up service lol. I just don't understand why Charlie would do that to her sister though. To put here in the Constant just seems like a punishment in a way, not only because (up until DST) she would be completely alone, have no idea how she got there, and have to deal with constant threats on a daily; she would also have to be tortured by the creature of the night that was her sister. I understand why Maxwell stole people from "our" world and brought them to the constant because he's a crazy evil dude but Charlie despite being possessed by whatever it is that posses her still has her own conciseness deep down. Or maybe not. It's just odd, and I wish they explained somehow *cough*puzzle*cough* what her reason being here is for. Wilson was probably the only exception to why he was sent to the Constant ( maybe), Maxwell knew he could get Wilson to get him off the Throne..I don't want to say maybe Charlie is doing the same because she probably isn't. Ahh, so much lore to cover but so little answers or even evidence to back up a proper theory... Also looking back at some history notes and old propaganda pictures, yes Wolfgang was a soldier from 1916 around the beginning of Russia's great famine. A lot of soldiers during 1916 were killed or seriously injuried which can explain why Wolfgang seems to have PTSD, he went through hell. Since he was a strong man though, I'd imagine either he escape Russia to some other country close by maybe somewhere dutch. He could have also possibly changed his name when he left because Wolfgang is a very Germany/ Dutch name. Not many Wolfgang's in Russia. He was probably there up to the Russian revolution in 1917 when Communist rule over threw the monarchy. So Wolfgang could have been taken after these events. Does anyone remember in the William Carter puzzle what year it was when we see the circus posters? If that's even him, then he was in the Circus before the war and possibly was forced to be drafted. Point is though he had to have came to the Constant after being a soldier though, he mentions being in the Calvary when he rides a beefalo I think. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/95847-my-fathers-lore-questions/#findComment-1087378 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maxposting Posted September 25, 2018 Share Posted September 25, 2018 1 hour ago, Ali Bun said: A pretty messed up service lol. A normal service doesn't make you evil shadow monster and make your sister stuck between dimensions with no time 1 hour ago, Ali Bun said: Spoiler A pretty messed up service lol. I just don't understand why Charlie would do that to her sister though. To put here in the Constant just seems like a punishment in a way, not only because (up until DST) she would be completely alone, have no idea how she got there, and have to deal with constant threats on a daily; she would also have to be tortured by the creature of the night that was her sister. I understand why Maxwell stole people from "our" world and brought them to the constant because he's a crazy evil dude but Charlie despite being possessed by whatever it is that posses her still has her own conciseness deep down. Or maybe not. It's just odd, and I wish they explained somehow *cough*puzzle*cough* what her reason being here is for. Wilson was probably the only exception to why he was sent to the Constant ( maybe), Maxwell knew he could get Wilson to get him off the Throne..I don't want to say maybe Charlie is doing the same because she probably isn't. Ahh, so much lore to cover but so little answers or even evidence to back up a proper theory... Also looking back at some history notes and old propaganda pictures, yes Wolfgang was a soldier from 1916 around the beginning of Russia's great famine. A lot of soldiers during 1916 were killed or seriously injuried which can explain why Wolfgang seems to have PTSD, he went through hell. Since he was a strong man though, I'd imagine either he escape Russia to some other country close by maybe somewhere dutch. He could have also possibly changed his name when he left because Wolfgang is a very Germany/ Dutch name. Not many Wolfgang's in Russia. He was probably there up to the Russian revolution in 1917 when Communist rule over threw the monarchy. So Wolfgang could have been taken after these events. Does anyone remember in the William Carter puzzle what year it was when we see the circus posters? If that's even him, then he was in the Circus before the war and possibly was forced to be drafted. Point is though he had to have came to the Constant after being a soldier though, he mentions being in the Calvary when he rides a beefalo I think. Hammer - Needs Sickle , so Wolfi is a communist Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/95847-my-fathers-lore-questions/#findComment-1087399 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alarsin Posted September 25, 2018 Share Posted September 25, 2018 Alright. First of all, we must all understand that the unreleased Wolfgang skin is not exactly a good piece of lore. With that out of the way: Russians wore usual caps during WW1, those spike helmets were used by German and sometimes Austrian soldiers. The theory of Wolfgang experiencing shell shock is pretty interesting, even though the symptoms are not quite the same. That sickle reference doesn’t really prove anything. He could be a Bavarian communist but keep in mind the frog legs quote. No real answer here. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/95847-my-fathers-lore-questions/#findComment-1087438 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fuffles Posted September 25, 2018 Share Posted September 25, 2018 Winona as it was stated was dragged into the constant by something sinister (I assume the elusive THEM fused with Charlie) for its own enjoyment? I guess THEM have access to Charlie's memory, and I believe it wasn't a very nice relationship between the two, thus I'd say THEY pulled her over to appease Charlie seeing her sister suffer? maybe it'll be a key point to convert her back, since even if she hates/hated her in her young age, when one matures they love their siblings. As how THEY did it, well we saw already THEY used the gateway Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/95847-my-fathers-lore-questions/#findComment-1087443 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ali Bun Posted September 25, 2018 Share Posted September 25, 2018 3 minutes ago, Alarsin said: Alright. First of all, we must all understand that the unreleased Wolfgang skin is not exactly a good piece of lore. With that out of the way: Russians wore usual caps during WW1, those spike helmets were used by German and sometimes Austrian soldiers. The theory of Wolfgang experiencing shell shock is pretty interesting, even though the symptoms are not quite the same. That sickle reference doesn’t really prove anything. He could be a Bavarian communist but keep in mind the frog legs quote. No real answer here. Yeah I noticed that about the helmets. Maybe he's Prussian or German, not sure what he is. His quotes have so many refference to different countries it hard to tell. Who is he lol...no but seriously. Can't really say with what we got. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/95847-my-fathers-lore-questions/#findComment-1087444 Share on other sites More sharing options...
minespatch Posted September 25, 2018 Author Share Posted September 25, 2018 6 hours ago, __IvoCZE__ said: It could honestly be Winona , even the face links It's just a artistic shorthand by the devs to show that Winona is a handy-person with machines like Rosie, does not mean she is Rosie. 2 hours ago, Ali Bun said: I don't want to say maybe Charlie is doing the same because she probably isn't. Ahh, so much lore to cover but so little answers or even evidence to back up a proper theory... Also looking back at some history notes and old propaganda pictures, yes Wolfgang was a soldier from 1916 around the beginning of Russia's great famine. A lot of soldiers during 1916 were killed or seriously injuried which can explain why Wolfgang seems to have PTSD, he went through hell. Since he was a strong man though, I'd imagine either he escape Russia to some other country close by maybe somewhere dutch. He could have also possibly changed his name when he left because Wolfgang is a very Germany/ Dutch name. Not many Wolfgang's in Russia. He was probably there up to the Russian revolution in 1917 when Communist rule over threw the monarchy. So Wolfgang could have been taken after these events. Point is though he had to have came to the Constant after being a soldier though, he mentions being in the Calvary when he rides a beefalo I think. Does anyone remember in the William Carter puzzle what year it was when we see the circus posters? If that's even him, then he was in the Circus before the war and possibly was forced to be drafted. 1 minute ago, Alarsin said: Alright. First of all, we must all understand that the unreleased Wolfgang skin is not exactly a good piece of lore. With that out of the way: Russians wore usual caps during WW1, those spike helmets were used by German and sometimes Austrian soldiers. The theory of Wolfgang experiencing shell shock is pretty interesting, even though the symptoms are not quite the same. That sickle reference doesn’t really prove anything. He could be a Bavarian communist but keep in mind the frog legs quote. No real answer here. The ending of the Forge trailer seems to show she's possessed. While Winona's blurry appearance in What Lies Beyond hints she was already in the Constant by the time Charlie got changed into the mistress we see her now. So Winona might've even been in the Constant's timeline streams when Charlie was a gruu, we'll just have to wait until there's a Lore-related Rhymes with Play. I have some questions about the inn keeper that I hope will be answered. Winona and Inn Keeper are the most enigmiatic of the cast in my opinion. I'll ask my father when I get back from work. From the wiki: Quote The fourth puzzle is an article from a newspaper, a circus poster, some blueprints of what appears to be an obelisk, a postcard to Jack Carter, and a Coach Ticket. The Newspaper reads: TRAGIC TRAIN CRASH Circus wagon struck at crossing Many passenger injuries reported Elephant unharmed The date of the paper is August 23, 1904. This is the third such incident at the crossing since the railway's construction in 1875, but the first to involve a circus wagon. Local businessman and railway investor Harold J. Rutherford assured this publication that all portinant safety precautions had been taken, but no one could have foreseen the appearance of such a dangerous blockage on the tracks A passenger train struck a circus wagon that had broken down along the tracks at the Old Mill crossing. Dozens of passengers were injured, and at least one man is missing. The missing man has yet to be identified, but fellow passengers described him as a tall, nervous fellow with an English accent. A search party was convened but quickly abandoned when it became apparent that a (Second column begins after tear in the first column) cage full of potentially dangerous trained monkeys had been vacated in the collision. Given the remoteness of the crash site, the scorching desert sun, and the escaped animals, the missing man has been presumed dead. 1 hour ago, __IvoCZE__ said: Hammer - Needs Sickle , so Wolfi is a communist I think we know who the real fascists of the Constant are. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/95847-my-fathers-lore-questions/#findComment-1087455 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alarsin Posted September 25, 2018 Share Posted September 25, 2018 Actually, I just found out that French cuirassier regiments wore slightly different versions of the Pickelhaube up until WW1. So here we go. Wolfgang is a French Guard soldier in early World War I with communist sympathies and shell shock. 104% legit Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/95847-my-fathers-lore-questions/#findComment-1087468 Share on other sites More sharing options...
minespatch Posted September 25, 2018 Author Share Posted September 25, 2018 Okay, Wolfgang=German name. The Picklehaube was used until 1916. There's two alternate skins: My father really feels that he wasn't involved with ww1 due to the train crash. He probably served in the German military, retired, and became a Circus performer to use his skills to use. We're not sure if he is the same strongman but I'll tag devs who are familiar with the lore: @Kevin@Bigfoot@KrisRF I know you guys are busy but these are big questions that the fandom have been debating for years. My father would love to see the record settled straight. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/95847-my-fathers-lore-questions/#findComment-1087478 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ali Bun Posted September 26, 2018 Share Posted September 26, 2018 2 hours ago, Alarsin said: Actually, I just found out that French cuirassier regiments wore slightly different versions of the Pickelhaube up until WW1. So here we go. Wolfgang is a French Guard soldier in early World War I with communist sympathies and shell shock. 104% legit That works too because wasn't communist ideals actually being favored by the French people but not the government? Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/95847-my-fathers-lore-questions/#findComment-1087499 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zeklo Posted September 26, 2018 Share Posted September 26, 2018 6 hours ago, FuffledBeeQueen said: Winona as it was stated was dragged into the constant by something sinister (I assume the elusive THEM fused with Charlie) for its own enjoyment? I guess THEM have access to Charlie's memory, and I believe it wasn't a very nice relationship between the two, thus I'd say THEY pulled her over to appease Charlie seeing her sister suffer? maybe it'll be a key point to convert her back, since even if she hates/hated her in her young age, when one matures they love their siblings. As how THEY did it, well we saw already THEY used the gateway Problem with Them being fused with Charlie is that the Fuelweaver clearly states "You are not Them..." when being turned into a pretty flower by none other then Charlie. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/95847-my-fathers-lore-questions/#findComment-1087543 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maxposting Posted September 26, 2018 Share Posted September 26, 2018 The lines of dialogue are hellishly confusing Spoiler Camouflage - Wickerbottom when expecting bush hat like punctuation LADY Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/95847-my-fathers-lore-questions/#findComment-1087565 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ali Bun Posted September 26, 2018 Share Posted September 26, 2018 8 hours ago, FuffledBeeQueen said: Winona as it was stated was dragged into the constant by something sinister (I assume the elusive THEM fused with Charlie) for its own enjoyment? I guess THEM have access to Charlie's memory, and I believe it wasn't a very nice relationship between the two, thus I'd say THEY pulled her over to appease Charlie seeing her sister suffer? maybe it'll be a key point to convert her back, since even if she hates/hated her in her young age, when one matures they love their siblings. As how THEY did it, well we saw already THEY used the gateway I don't think they had a bad relationship before hand only because Charlie writes a letter to Maxwell talking about how hr sister will let her borrow the family cabin for a small get away in the Carter Puzzles. Max, Where are you? I haven't heard from you in days! I stopped by your place, so I've got your props and costume for the show. I'll see you at the theatre tonight, I hope? We need to talk about your... Study room. There's some creepy stuff going on in there! Maybe when this run is over we can take a little break? My sister said we could use the family cabin up in BC if we want to get away XO, Charlie Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/95847-my-fathers-lore-questions/#findComment-1087570 Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpikeGuy Posted September 30, 2018 Share Posted September 30, 2018 I think Winona still deeply cares for Charlie at this point, given a lot of her lines. It may actually be the reason Winona entered the Constant in the fist place, since her quote for the Mossy Gateway is "I might not be good at rescue missions.". I can't think of anyone other than Charlie she'd be this motivated to save. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/95847-my-fathers-lore-questions/#findComment-1089065 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ali Bun Posted September 30, 2018 Share Posted September 30, 2018 3 hours ago, SpikeGuy said: I think Winona still deeply cares for Charlie at this point, given a lot of her lines. It may actually be the reason Winona entered the Constant in the fist place, since her quote for the Mossy Gateway is "I might not be good at rescue missions.". I can't think of anyone other than Charlie she'd be this motivated to save. She said that during the Gorge? Now I need to check everyone's quotes, that's interesting.. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/95847-my-fathers-lore-questions/#findComment-1089105 Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpikeGuy Posted September 30, 2018 Share Posted September 30, 2018 I remember doing several quote compilations before, but they're scattered in archived threads and probably include a quarter of the lines in the game or something. So, anyway, here are some of the more notable ones: Winona Spoiler Florid Postern- "That was a one-way ticket." Miner Hat- "I put that behind me." Marble Statue (Tragedy)- "We thought she was gone..." Rose- "Not sure how to feel about that..." Campfire and Fire Pit (out)- "My sister was afraid of the dark." Rainometer (burnt)- "Must fire take everything I love?" Winona (Firestarter)- "Haven't we lost enough to fires, %s?" Odd Radio- "I'm not messing with anymore radios." Divining Rod- "I'm probably one of the few left that knows how to use these." Divining Rod Base (generic)- "Just like in the bossman's workshop." Divining Rod base (rod placed, unlocked, leaked version)- "Is... this how the bossman disappeared?" Wooden Thing- "That gadget has my name on it." Molten Gateway (off)- "Just like the one I came through..." Ancient Gateway (activated)- "Not sure I trust strange portals anymore." Maxwell Spoiler Ancient Obelisk- "I can't believe I've forgotten how to read this." Ancient Gateway (activated)- "This is a most wretched idea." Molten Gateway (off)- "Meddling with it will only cause further trouble." Mossy Gateway- "Nobody listens to me." Winona (Firestarter)- "You were the last one I expected to start fires, %s." Note: Work in progress Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/95847-my-fathers-lore-questions/#findComment-1089160 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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