Pretty Heavi Wire

[Craigjw]

So, looking at the data on Heavi-Watt Wire and Heavi Conductive Wire, I can only come to the conclusion that the wire needs to be re-named, to properly represent it's properties.

Both wires have a max of 20kw, so what makes the Heavi Conductive wire, well Conductive?  Nothing, the ONLY difference between the two is, that one costs more to make, by virtue of using refined materials and is more pretty.

My Conclusion is that Heavy Conductive Wire be renamed to Pretty Heavi Wire, as the name currently used to describe it is misleading.  I'd at least expect it to have more CONDUCTIVITY, as the name implies, just like Conductive Wire has compared to regular Wire.

[Eliontt]

Rename and remove this awful -decor from it =)

[heckubis]

200 raw metal vs 100 refined is the same material cost from a rock regulator all other refinement processes are more efficient making the refined the better option past standard 1k wires

[Craigjw]

21 minutes ago, heckubis said:

200 raw metal vs 100 refined is the same material cost from a rock regulator all other refinement processes are more efficient making the refined the better option past standard 1k wires

If you have to use 1200 watts to make the 100 refined metal for 1 Pretty Heavi Wire, vs 0 watts for 100 raw metal for 1 Heavi Watt wire, then the latter is more efficient and the only benefit to using the Pretty Heavi Wire is that you've spent a ton of resource to create a wire that is ONLY prettier than the standard.  After all, Pretty Heavi Wire and Heavi Watt Wire have the same capacity of 20kw.

I'm calling for an upgrade in the Capacity of the Pretty Heavi Wire, as it stands to reason that a Wire made from a purer form of metal SHOULD have a higher conductivity than the regular wire, because it doesn't contain the impurities that the Heavi Watt wire will contain.

[heckubis]

oh you can make it at 75% cost with no heat or energy at all just hatches. if your already making refined the refinery power consumption is no biggie 1 coal generator with a few batteries will work . and although it cost energy at the time to make the energy cost of the dupes discomfort is stack able past the 1200w mark

[Craigjw]

1 minute ago, heckubis said:

oh you can make it at 75% cost with no heat at all just hatches

You also forgot to mention the ton of time, space & effort that's requires to make a hatch farm of suitable size, for enough hatches to defecate enough refined metal to support your Pretty base.

[heckubis]

with in 50 cycles to have smooth hatches is my best so far but that was a lucky build but a pretty base causes less stress to dupes resulting in less time on the tables and such reduces random extra power costs and work stoppages. and you only need 1 stable the tamed adults can go anywhere else in your base and be decor items. and it is mostly there as a means of replacing your old copper wires with something so you can reuse your copper for atmo suits and such

[Craigjw]

3 minutes ago, heckubis said:

with in 50 cycles to have smooth hatches is my best so far but that was a lucky build but a pretty base causes less stress to dupes resulting in less time on the tables and such reduces random extra power costs and work stoppages. and you only need 1 stable the tamed adults can go anywhere else in your base and be decor items

In which case, if that's the only intended function of the Pretty Heavi Wire, then it should be renamed to Pretty Heavi Wire, as it's NOT any more conductive than the Heavi Watt Wire.  My original point stands.

[heckubis]

 its using less mass to produce them so it is a smaller gauge of wire that is conducting the same volume of energy as the heavy watt,, yes its nicer looking and less flawed and bulky than the heavy watt it is although heavy watt is initially your best option

[Craigjw]

43 minutes ago, heckubis said:

 its using less mass to produce them so it is a smaller gauge of wire that is conducting the same volume of energy as the heavy watt,, yes its nicer looking and less flawed and bulky than the heavy watt it is although heavy watt is initially your best option

I'm not convinced they are using less mass, after all, 100 kg of raw metal is the same mass as 100 kg of refined metal.  If Hatches can crap more mass than they consume, then I think that's for a different discussion about the inequalities of Hatches violating the law of conservation of energy in a make believe game environment.

What I want is simpler, much simpler; either fix the name or fix the numbers to properly represent the title, for common sense sake!

 

 

[martosss]

Meh, who needs (something) heavi, if you can get by with (almost entirely) just normal wires? (check out my electricity tutorial to learn how to use smart batteries to avoid heavi wires throughout your base)

However, if you really want to compare the 2, consider the fact that raw metal is limited on the map, whereas refined metal is generated from volcanoes(and space?), so

1. You can get potentially free refined metal from volcanoes(-cooling costs, which can be as low as a pool of water below the volcano and some insulated tiles)
2. In the long run you won't have enough raw metals, so refined metals will be your only option.

Seems like 2:0 for pretty heavi wires to me.

Of course, there are also tons of gold ore on the map. And, for the record, I'm not using pretty heavi wires - better spend the refined metal on smart batteries and logic circuits instead.

In any case, I recently counted my heavi watt wires - 72 in total for 10kW generating power. Now since I have ~5t of refined metal, switching to pretty heavi wires isn't worth it for me(I'll run out refined metal), that's why I keep them just heavi and use the refined metal for the other goodies. But if you're drowning in refined metal, you should probably think about using that and save the metal ores.

[heckubis]

no need to fix either, one uses less mass. Its your production methods that makes them cost more. its all ready fairly simple the refined is a smaller gauge even visually you are not required to use them but they do have their benefits for doing so asking for one to be removed because you dont like having a similar thing in the menu that cost different for the same result would only remove creativity and progression towards more efficient systems that effect more then just power supply but the dupes environment as well

[Sasza22]

Has anyone actually get overloaded heavy watt wires in survival mode? I saw one guy getting them overloaded in sandbox with a ridulously large base but for now there`s no need to sustain more than 20kW. Maybe if the devs add more power sinks like the new relaxation items there will be need for more power on the heavy line. Maybe then they will buff the heavy coductive ones.

[heckubis]

personally not for alot of patches i think last time i saw that was pre thermal

[Craigjw]

I haven't had an overload on Heavi yet.  I also designed rooms to avoid the ugly hammer of Heavi wires, so what's the benefit of upgrading them I asked myself?  Hence the post.

The electricity tutorial has been very useful.  I personally don't like the idea of using the dual battery/PS thing though, so choose not to use it.  But I am going to use the PS power shutt-off on the high side of the TF's though.

[heckubis]

well the granulator is 50% material loss to sand, smooth hatches are 25% loss(no heat) and refinery is 100% conversion power cost and high heat.

Wire is 25 raw conductive is 25 refined, bridges are 25 and 25  heavy-watt is 100/100 joint plates are 200/100 . the joint plates are definitely cheaper. but yes it all comes down to preference

i could toss you an old save that Should still run in EU update(did in experimental) but despite its former stability pre-updates  it wont survive for very long but would show you a good example of some of the power grids we used to have to run 1000.sav 

oh a few steam geysers no critters left back then i was running mostly power wheels for power

[Yucie]

Don't you mean Pretti Heavi-Watt Wire to better match the theme?

I use them all the time when metal volcanoes are on the map, which saves the much more valuable and finite raw metal for other things. Those metal volcanoes undermine an entire tech path while making automation and power an absolute breeze to set up. It's almost like a cheat code is enabled when you find one.

[heckubis]

5 minutes ago, Yucie said:

Don't you mean Pretti Heavi-Watt Wire to better match the theme?

I use them all the time when metal volcanoes are on the map, which saves the much more valuable and finite raw metal for other things. Those metal volcanoes undermine an entire tech path while making automation and power an absolute breeze to set up. It's almost like a cheat code is enabled when you find one.

even better when its in or directly above an ice biome

[Alfons100]

7 hours ago, 459601_1452785885 said:

Rename and remove this awful -decor from it =)

Uh, it already has less Decor impact than regular Heaviwatt, and thats the point of Heaviwatt, if you even think about placing them in areas Duplicants often visit, you're stupid. Thats the point

[Nativel]

I do remember time when it was 40kW, but devs set it up to 20kW might be accidentally, because many times I see some little upgrade in the game or bug fix, and at the same time downgrade on some fixes or upgrades. So I do remember it was not only decor it was 40kW power.

[ToiDiaeRaRIsuOy]

You'd need an extrodinary amount of power consumers to go beyond 20kw. I never did it myself.

Some posts here are confusing and giving me the impression that normal heavi watt wires now cost 200kg a piece. Surely that is me getting the wrong impression right?

Ultimately, I think the need for high wattage wires hits much earlier than the ability to produce high enough quantities of refined metal. And even after I have the necessary quantity I don't bother switching because the benefits of heavi conductive wires bring are just too small to bother. raw iron ore or raw gold amalgam ore can be basically mined everywhere so you are always near enough to a deposit. refined metal is only generated at specfic points of the map, and usually requires a whole lot of dupe travel time.

[Craigjw]

57 minutes ago, ToiDiaeRaRIsuOy said:

Some posts here are confusing and giving me the impression that normal heavi watt wires now cost 200kg a piece. Surely that is me getting the wrong impression right?

Normal Heavy Watt Wire still costs 100kg, no one has stated otherwise. 

You maybe confusing the reference to the raw material cost of the Heavi Conductive Wire, aka Pretti Heavy Wire, when using the crusher, which costs 200kg's of raw materials, crushed into 100kgs of refined.

[ToiDiaeRaRIsuOy]

14 minutes ago, Craigjw said:

Normal Heavy Watt Wire still costs 100kg, no one has stated otherwise. 

You maybe confusing the reference to the raw material cost of the Heavi Conductive Wire, aka Pretti Heavy Wire, when using the crusher, which costs 200kg's of raw materials, crushed into 100kgs of refined.

ok, I was contemplated if I perhaps missed a patch note somewhere.

[martosss]

Since you guys are asking for an overload example, here it is. Just for the fun of it, I'm not using any consumers, just batteries and Power transformers, the heavi wires are overloading because the power transformers act as consumers with 5kW usage(4kW in the latest version).

Notice, also, that the normal wires aren't overloading, although the same amount of electricity is flowing through them. ONI Logic!

[TOOK14]

I gotta ask, who actually mass refines metal post surface breach?  I just use all the free iron falling from the sky to upgrade my power grid, and fill out my automation. 

On topic, I do stick to normal hevi wire until I have run the vast majority of my conductive small wire and automation, and I'm only replacing it now due to EU update's massive emphasis on maxing out decor. 

I would like to see conductive hevi wire buffed, as it's really not worth using under any circumstance until you have so much refined meta there's no reason not to.