Glass Powered Oil Boiler (Mk II)

[QuQuasar]

AnotherBoris built a far simpler device to do the same thing.

 

They say if a name is stupid enough it loops around to being cool. They're wrong. Regardless, here's the Glass Powered Olliebollie, or G-POB! (Mk II)

 

 

How it works:

 

1. 80 C Oil is pumped into Preheating chamber 1, where it exchanges heat with 272 C gas coming from preheating chamber 2.

 

2. At intervals, determined by the rate of vaporization in the vaporization chamber, the vacuum seals will open, allowing oil to fall into the next preheating chamber (2 -> 3 -> 4), and gas to rise into the previous one.

 

3. In pre-heating chamber 2, 176 C oil interacts with 368 C gas. Each chamber enables equalization between progressively hotter oil and gas.

    NOTE: if you're willing to take a hit to efficiency, you can remove chambers 2 and 3 and compress the build a bit.

 

4. In pre-heating chamber 4, the oil is stored atop the vaporization chamber, which is necessary for proper vaporization function.

 

5. The vaporization chamber converts petrol to gas. As soon as this happens, more petrol is dropped in, displacing the newly created gas upwards. The lower door then closes, displacing the gas upwards again, followed by the upper door, pushing the gas into pre-heating chamber 4. Finally, the lower door opens, establishing a vaccum seal between pre-heating chamber 4 and the vaporization chamber.

 

6. From here, the heated gas gradually pushes it's way out to the cooling and extraction chamber via the pre-heating chambers (4 -> 3 -> 2 -> 1). Note that it will take a number of vaporization events for the gas to reach the exit, and significantly more for the device to reach optimal efficiency.

 

Spoiler

Overlays

 

Building in survival:

        

1. Vacuum.

This design should be built in a vacuum to save yourself a lot of pain later on. It's up to you how you establish said vacuum: if you can find a large space of rock where it's possible to dig out a vaccum behind a water/oil lock. Otherwise, gas pumps will eventually evacuate the area.

        

2. Prime the Heat Source

Before you do anything else, build and prime the heating chamber and automation with magma (you can extract it from the magma sea with an abyssalite pump). The magma will cool to igneous rock as you build the rest of the vaporization chamber atop of it.

Pre-heating is important for two reasons:

a. while this build is quite efficient once it reaches it's equilibrium, it takes an immense amount of heat to reach that point (I found it takes about 500 Kg glass before it even starts outputting gas from a cold start). Preheating with high-capacity igneous rock will accelerate the priming process significantly.

b. if you've accidentally built any automation wires or liquid vents out of meltables, you'll find out when it melts now rather at the end of the build. Fail fast!

 

3. Set up the Glass Extractor.

So long as it's middle tile is in a vacuum, this device will gain no heat from the glass it's picking up. The small amount of operational heat it generates can be transferred to the metal block via a drop of petroleum on the corner, and the block can be cooled by any means.

       

 

4. Build the heat plate.

... and pump hot water into the heat chamber. It will steam immediately upon contact with the igneous rock that used to be magma. 

        

5. Build everything else 

In general, use abyssalite for insulation, tungsten for condutivity, and gold amalgam/wolframite for machinery. The liquid vents in the Heat Source chamber should be wolframite.

The materials are expensive, but there's no special construction requirements here. Use ladders here and there to help your dupes get around.

     

6. Connect the coolant pipes

If you don't have a slush geyser, you can replace the slush vat with wheezeworts in hydrogen or an AETN. The cooler only needs to handle the tail end of cooling the gas to a pumpable temperature: assuming everything's functioning correctly, most of it's heat will go into the next batch of oil.

        

7. Connect the oil pipes

... to fill the first chamber with a few Kg of oil

        

8. Prime the system with oil.

Flick the hydro sensor in the vaporization chamber on and off a few times, until a small amount of oil reaches the vaporization chamber. Leave it on "Below 0.1 Kg".

        

9. The boiler is now functional

The heat from the igneous rock you added in step 2 will boil a fair amount of oil, causing the device to cycle a few times and push a bit of gas into the upper chambers.

It's unlikely much gas will reach the exit pump at first: that's okay. As more heat is provided via the glass forge, the lower chambers will become more pressurized, pushing more gas towards the upper chambers every time the device cycles. Gradually, it will reach an equilibrium point where oil-in equals gas-out.

 

Cheers,

Qu

G-POB Mk II.yaml

[Lifegrow]

Aaaand the throughput is still next to nothing, and still requires a constant processing of glass - thought you'd fathomed that on the last thread?

 

 

[Capsup]

I really like the idea, especially because my current seed doesn't have any volcanoes.

However, exactly how much throghput are you getting out of this thing? I tried importing the template and fiddling around with it, but I couldn't actually get it to be power positive. Setting up two glass forges (me just using debug mode and having a dupe operate the forge and then manually pressing the button at the same time too), starting to operate after having primed the system with gas and heat, in a single cycle, I could only generate enough heat to cook enough oil to make a single ng generator run for 1.5 cycles.

I only put 50kg of water into the heat source which for some reason resulted in precisely 1000g of steam on both tiles. What's the idea behind the water input? Just to create a bit of steam initially, to transfer the heat to the metal tiles?

[Zarquan]

6 hours ago, Lifegrow said:

Aaaand the throughput is still next to nothing, and still requires a constant processing of glass - thought you'd fathomed that on the last thread?

Just because the original has a lousy throughput doesn't mean this one does too.  That's why its a MK II.  The first was a basic concept and this is more advanced. 

How much oil does it boil per second or cycle?

Could this be more efficient if you were to run the hot solid glass on the conveyor through all the preheating chambers?  Kind of like how this one operates?

 

[Alfons100]

Sometimes I wonder what the hell people are doing with this game.

[AzeTheGreat]

Is your loader in a vacuum?  I'm not seeing it in any cooling so won't it start overheating?

[Carnis]

Im with lifegrow on this one... Its too much trouble for too little gain. Why not molten slicksters + petrol gens? Why not just use the magma and ignore the glass blowing?

 

I have been toying around with aze's boiler, which is magnificent.. but have not got it scaled to 10l/s without gas deletions.

[_Q_]

But you always have hot area at the bottom of the map. volcano is not needed at all.

[Zarquan]

19 minutes ago, Carnis said:

Im with lifegrow on this one... Its too much trouble for too little gain. Why not molten slicksters + petrol gens? Why not just use the magma and ignore the glass blowing?

Because you don't always have a volcano, from what I hear,  I personally have always had a volcano.

14 minutes ago, _Q_ said:

But you always have hot area at the bottom of the map. volcano is not needed at all.

Eventually, you would run out of magma.  For some of us, that is unacceptable in the long term.  If we can get an efficient method using glass, we can be sustainable if we have a sustainable source of sand (which could be hard without a volcano).  It's not always about practicality, its about long term stability.  I want my systems to keep working even if I left it on 3x speed for 10 years. 

Exploring these ideas, even if they are strange, can lead to innovation, like stables that connect to space, or Kabrute's old mealwood rotting fields (for the oxygen, before mealwood required dirt), which were hilarious and informative.

[_Q_]

22 minutes ago, Zarquan said:

Because you don't always have a volcano, from what I hear,  I personally have always had a volcano.

Eventually, you would run out of magma.  For some of us, that is unacceptable in the long term.  If we can get an efficient method using glass, we can be sustainable if we have a sustainable source of sand (which could be hard without a volcano).  It's not always about practicality, its about long term stability.  I want my systems to keep working even if I left it on 3x speed for 10 years. 

Exploring these ideas, even if they are strange, can lead to innovation, like stables that connect to space, or Kabrute's old mealwood rotting fields (for the oxygen, before mealwood required dirt), which were hilarious and informative.

Even if, but you still wont be 100% sure if they will work for next 10 years or not.

To be honest it really hard to find anything practical on this forums, when it comes to builds, almost everything is DEBUG mode build, and really hard to replicate in normal game.

Oil Well need to be operated by duplicant from time to time.

 

[Zarquan]

5 hours ago, _Q_ said:

To be honest it really hard to find anything practical on this forums, when it comes to builds, almost everything is DEBUG mode build, and really hard to replicate in normal game.

Almost everything you see on the forums could have been built in survival mode.  It would just take a while, but they are certainly doable.  For example, ReadySetRudy released a video where he builds a nat gas boiler in survival mode.  Though his build is not sustainable, it could easily have been built with a volcano and with a few tweaks, it would be a sustainable and safe structure.

We only build things in debug mode because it saves time and lets us start the discussion faster and to prove that the concept is good.  Then we build it in our games. 

Also, why did you all caps DEBUG?  Are you saying creative mode is a bad thing? 

Spoiler

 

 

5 hours ago, _Q_ said:

Even if, but you still wont be 100% sure if they will work for next 10 years or not.

You can be reasonably sure if you built it well enough.  Even if it would fail in an unexpected way within a year, we want the core design to rely on sustainability.  The goal is that it will work forever.  Relying on unsustainable means directly failing to reach the goal from the start.

5 hours ago, _Q_ said:

Oil Well need to be operated by duplicant from time to time.

Yes, the oil well would need to be accessible and probably not submerged in oil.

 

EDIT:  misattributed video.

EDIT 2:  Misread last quote

[he77789]

The oil well is ~80C as @QuQuasar said, perfectly ok for suits... The only suit unfriendly part is the glass at ~1300C. Even freshly boiled oil is ok for suits.

[Lifegrow]

1 hour ago, _Q_ said:

To be honest it really hard to find anything practical on this forums, when it comes to builds, almost everything is DEBUG mode build, and really hard to replicate in normal game.

Maybe your issue is attempting to copy/paste builds. Most builds on the forums are simply proof of concept - an idea to work with.

I've built 3 nat gas boilers live on stream - each was different from the last, and each was without following a block by block build guide - however if I were to build it in debug the basic premise would be the exact same, just cleaner/faster.

Debug is a tool to allow people to further the known "meta" (*shudder*), and as such you should take the ideas/concepts you like the look of, and make them your own.

 

6 hours ago, Zarquan said:

Just because the original has a lousy throughput doesn't mean this one does too.  That's why its a MK II.  The first was a basic concept and this is more advanced. 

The input is the same - and 25kg of molten glass can do very little. Single gas pump at the top is a fair indicator too.

[Oozinator]

The name alone is a +1
"Olliebollie" ^^

[Sevio]

@QuQuasar Nicely done with Mk2 of Olliebollie!

You mention in your build notes that the middle tile in the glass extractor has to be in vacuum however this goes for the glass forge room too. It is in an oxygenated area and the tile below it doesn't look insulated so it will exchange heat with the molten glass inside the glass forge that is waiting to be pumped into a pipe.

You lose about 21.3 C from that, which isn't that much on 1700+ C but with what I'm about to suggest below you might as well go for maximum here...

Having just finished work on my Glass Refinery Turbine build, I also see potential for a Mk3 with increased throughput if we put the glass forge in a vacuum room along with a metal refinery that further heats the molten glass. The vaporization chamber would need to be heated by 2 different sources, a glass chiller for glass that is going to be extracted and a hot buffer that gets heated by the metal refinery.

You would send any molten glass into the metal refinery first to create a closed refinery loop that can add heat to the hot buffer and if it doesn't fit there, send it on to the glass chiller. Or pump magma into the closed refinery loop and send glass directly to the chiller.

Either way, it would allow you to boil your NatGas based on whatever refinement need you have.

[AnotherBoris]

22 hours ago, QuQuasar said:

How it works:

Too complicated

You know that 1000g packs or less do not break pipes?

Accurate valve, some radiant pipes, and viola! Our boiler

Spoiler

 

[Carnis]

9 minutes ago, AnotherBoris said:

Too complicated

You know that 1000g packs or less do not break pipes?

Accurate valve, some radiant pipes, and viola! Our boiler

  Reveal hidden contents

 

If a bit exploity? Glass blower enough heat to run 1kg/s nonstop?

[AnotherBoris]

Just now, Carnis said:

If a bit exploity

I thought about this and ... I do not know The principle is that small doses of gas can not break a large, thick metal pipe. It's ... not an exploit. It seems ...

 

1 minute ago, Carnis said:

Glass blower enough heat to run 1kg/s nonstop?

No ... on the screen, I just tested the principle. In fact, there 50 kg of lava. And for glass, I think, is enough packets 10-30g.

[Sevio]

A smaller packet size is actually beneficial as it allows you to exchange heat more efficiently. This is a very interesting find about packets <= 1000 g not breaking @AnotherBoris!

So I quickly set this up in debug mode....

It's a closed loop of 1000 g packets running through an aquatuner. I can totally liquefy oxygen with this! Maybe even hydrogen, although the black holes will probably eat my game first.

I don't know if it's possible in survival since you can't simply fill the loop with a bridge + valve and you also cannot allow the packets to clump up behind a valve (except while setting it up beforehand) so your accurate valve build wouldn't work for this in a closed loop.

Success! Liquid hydrogen is possible with this:

It a

Packets passing through an Aquatuner or thermo regulator won't get any colder if it would take them below absolute zero.

[AnotherBoris]

1 hour ago, Sevio said:

Packets passing through an Aquatuner or thermo regulator won't get any colder if it would take them below absolute zero.

Aquatuner works with packages of 1kg? Does not it collect 10kg to process it right away? A full system screen, please!

[Sevio]

@AnotherBoris It does work with packets of 1 kg, and the picture above (of the polluted water plumbing) is all there is to it. Just a closed loop with packets traveling through constantly. It may not be possible to build in survival and if the aquatuner ever gets disabled it will create a 2 kg packet and break, with or without a bypass bridge.

As an addendum, I primed the loop with the valve you see in that screenshot above (the pipes were going up into the valve and back down into the loop with no direct connection onward), then I paused, destroyed the pipes and connected the loop together.

[AnotherBoris]

24 minutes ago, Sevio said:

It may not be possible to build in survival

Hmm ... You can make a way out of aquatuner from ceramics. It is infinite. Thus, if a large package gets there, it will break the pipe a little and create a gap (empty packet). When the gap becomes too much, you can drain all the water through Shutoff, and then pour it over again through the Accurate Valve, turned on for the desired amount of time. The only problem is that the new water will have to be re-cooled. But for this, it can be passed through pieces of ice obtained as a result of draining!

[AnotherBoris]

3 hours ago, Carnis said:

Glass blower enough heat to run 1kg/s nonstop?

Tested. 150g/s. 80-100kg NG per ~300kg Glass per cycle.

Spoiler

Now i have only one question: what to do with all this glass?

[Lifegrow]

2 hours ago, AnotherBoris said:

~300kg Glass per cycle.

You sure about that? 12 operations in a single cycle seems a little high to me, although I may be wrong.

[Zarquan]

2 minutes ago, Lifegrow said:

You sure about that? 12 operations in a single cycle seems a little high to me, although I may be wrong.

I think its doable if you only let your engineers work the forge.