Slime farm puft ratio?

[Technoincubus]

Aglae distiller requires 360 kgs of slime per cycle to produce 120 kg of aglae

Given infinite amount of morbs, how much pufts are needed to fully sustain one distiller?

Also, about tame status. Does it stay once achieved and puft constantly being fed? Or it'll require dupes to groom puft to preserve tame status?

I am still not sure from biology topic how much PO2 Puft is eating per cycle. So I will assume puft will excrete about 200 g of slime.

And overcrowding only affects chances of reproduction, but not amount of slime produced? So you can shove dozens of pufts on of chamber?

[PhailRaptor]

51 minutes ago, Technoincubus said:

I am still not sure from biology topic how much PO2 Puft is eating per cycle. So I will assume puft will excrete about 200 g of slime.

Based on @R9MX4's Puft table from the Biology thread, this assumption incorrect.  When Tamed, a Puft will expect 200 kcals to sustain itself.  All types of Puft (except the Squeaky Puft) consume atmosphere and convert it into kcals at a ratio of 30 kg to 200 kcals.  So each day, each Puft or Puft Prince will require 30 kg of P-O2 each day in order to survive.  From that 30 kg, it is then converted into Slime at a ratio.  Normal Pufts produce Slime equal to 50% of their food consumed, so that will produce 15 kg of Slime each day from 30 kg of P-O2.  A Puft Prince, on the other hand, only has a 10% conversion, meaning it will make 3 kg of Slime instead.  Note that for both types, the Slime will spawn with 1000 Slimelung on it, which will then begin multiplying rapidly due to being existing on Slime.  Which, depending on your atmospheric density, could result in airborne Slimelung throughout your Puft Stable, since it will inevitably be filled with P-O2 for them to consume.

TL; DR --  Assuming the ideal "perfect" conditions, a normal Puft will produce up to 15 kg of Slime per cycle, while a Puft Prince will produce only 3 kg per cycle.

[FIXBUGFIXBUGFIX]

a supplement:

tame critters without grooming will trap into glum, Metabolism: -80, which means they eat 20% and excrete 20%

[Technoincubus]

So you'll need 24 pufts to supply one aglae distiller. That's a damn lot. Problem is that morb excrete PO2 at random intervals but they produce 200 g per excretion. I assume they produce about 15 kgs of PO2 per cycle. So 48 morbs for a farm. Quite a load for CPU I'd say

[blash365]

It's a mystery to me as well how to have a sustainable supply of slime/algae now. :/

[Carnis]

Slush geysir and evaporation with 750-800kg Pwater tiles?

[blash365]

You still need to groom all the pufts, which will bind 2-3 dupes an entire cycle (not including transport of slime) for simply filling one algae distiller.

the output of the distiller would be almost exactly the amount an algae deoxidizer consumes, which can support ~8 dupes.

So basically half your population will be busy grooming pufts the entire day if you want to run a colony like that.

 

[Grimgaw]

19 minutes ago, blash365 said:

the output of the distiller would be almost exactly the amount an algae deoxidizer consumes, which can support ~8 dupes.

I thought that the algae distiller is there for water not O2, otherwise you'd just deodorize or breathe the pO2.

[blash365]

23 minutes ago, Grimgaw said:

I thought that the algae distiller is there for water not O2, otherwise you'd just deodorize or breathe the pO2.

24 pufts -> 240 kg slime -> algae distiller -> 120 kg algae -> algae deoxidizer -> o2 for roughly 8-9 dupes.

not accounting for transfer tasks, power costs and supply of pO2 (for pufts) this would bind 2-3 dupes for grooming pufts, if i am not mistaken.

[Grimgaw]

1 minute ago, blash365 said:

24 pufts -> 240 kg slime -> algae distiller -> 120 kg algae -> algae deoxidizer -> o2 for roughly 8-9 dupes.

What are you feeding the pufts again?

[blash365]

2 minutes ago, Grimgaw said:

What are you feeding the pufts again?

Having different ways to convert pO2 to O2 might be a nice thing to have, but my point is that the output of pufts seems a bit low for practical use.

Same goes for mushroom farms, if i am not mistaken.

[Grimgaw]

2 minutes ago, blash365 said:

my point is that the output of pufts seems a bit low for practical use.

That's because you're ignoring the water output of algae distiller for some reason. You gain water both directly and indirectly by using algae for O2.

[blash365]

1 minute ago, Grimgaw said:

That's because you're ignoring the water output of algae distiller for some reason. You gain water both directly and indirectly by using algae for O2.

What's the indirecf way?

 

In any case it seems fairly unbalanced that you need 24 animals to use one device (destiller) at capacity. Requiring the work from many dupes.

Even when you look at hatches, they have a better ratio (~1:12 coal generator:hatch, half if you use sage hatches). And they actually eat up non-renewable resources in most cases.

 

[Grimgaw]

Just now, blash365 said:

In any case it seems fairly unbalanced that you need 24 animals

Except it's not. There's literally tons of slime on the map. 

[blash365]

1 minute ago, Grimgaw said:

Except it's not. There's literally tons of slime on the map. 

Still its limited. And that is exactly my point.

[Grimgaw]

When you get to the point of using all slime on the map, you have fall back of pufts until your PC burns and you have to start new map. Don't see a problem whit this. Instead you're try-harding to make pufts work while saving slime on map...

[blash365]

I guess we just have different approaches to the game.

[Technoincubus]

It is a matter of dependance and the knowledge that you are living on a burrowed time,.It is the reason i will never ever touch hydroponic pepper growing - because it is using limited phosphorite.

[crypticorb]

Seems a lot of effort for so little gain. It'd be a lot simpler and power efficient to keep the base below 5^oC (to kill slimelung) and let the pO2 flow freely to be breathed in. Keep all dupes in warm sweaters to counter the cold, and you're golden.

3 hours ago, Grimgaw said:

Except it's not. There's literally tons of slime on the map. 

It's a finite amount if you are extending a game into the thousands of cycles. After around cycle 500-1000, infinite solutions and positive feedback loops are the only means of survival.

[Grimgaw]

12 minutes ago, crypticorb said:

It's a finite amount if you are extending a game into the thousands of cycles. After around cycle 500-1000, infinite solutions and positive feedback loops are the only means of survival.

 

3 hours ago, Grimgaw said:

When you get to the point of using all slime on the map, you have fall back of pufts until your PC burns and you have to start new map.

 

[avc15]

On 4/28/2018 at 3:39 AM, blash365 said:

You still need to groom all the pufts, which will bind 2-3 dupes an entire cycle (not including transport of slime) for simply filling one algae distiller.

 

Don't groom them. Have 1 stable with 4 pufts cranking out continuous eggs. These are the only ones you groom. Incubate puftlets in an overcrowded feeding stable. Just keep on cranking em out until you're making slime as fast as you can use it.

You're not wasting any PO2 doing this, just spending some power+fuel to ramp up production. 4 pufts are easy to groom, 24 is a bit much.

[blash365]

29 minutes ago, avc15 said:

Don't groom them. Have 1 stable with 4 pufts cranking out continuous eggs. These are the only ones you groom. Incubate puftlets in an overcrowded feeding stable. Just keep on cranking em out until you're making slime as fast as you can use it.

You're not wasting any PO2 doing this, just spending some power+fuel to ramp up production. 4 pufts are easy to groom, 24 is a bit much.

But non-groomed pufts are becoming glum, which lowers their output by 80%. Also having a ton of pufts might become a problem in terms of performance.

Is this still a viable solution?

[avc15]

1 hour ago, blash365 said:

But non-groomed pufts are becoming glum, which lowers their output by 80%. Also having a ton of pufts might become a problem in terms of performance.

Is this still a viable solution?

I was doing it in mk1, you just have a room with TONS of pufts, and the overcrowded effect in mk1 was similar to glum. Klei is working on critter optimizations, so it should be okay (by tomorrow at least)

 

Biggest difference I think will be lifecycle. If you're going to keep 120 glum pufts I think that means keeping something like (edit) 4 incubators running constantly? So, saving tons of dupe labor but spending about a constant 1kw of power to do it.

[BionicSandwich]

There are other solutions to oxygen outside of pufts, most of which are less cpu intensive. you should only use pufts as a supplement to food and oxygen, not as the sole provider. take the dense puft for example. it eats oxygen, and produces 95% of the consumed mass in oxilite, which in turn turns back into oxygen. this means that you can get eggs for just the cost of a small percentage of your total oxygen. the dense puft even allows you to easily handle your oxygen, making up for the amount lost. and the squeaky puft turns a mostly useless material, chlorine, into food as well. the vanilla pufts are more useful for food than oxygen production as well, as pacus can only be fed with alage, and mushrooms can only be fed with slime.

[vovik]

Hmm, if we supercool slime? Easy liquid o2 generation? Not sure.