Occupational Upgrade is a Giant Nerf?

[PhailRaptor]

29 minutes ago, BDelacroix said:

In fact, I don't even have a massage table for a very long time as I determined to work with prettying up their sleeping quarters and making actual rooms for the bathrooms.  Turned out to be a lot more effective at reducing stress than the tables I have been using for so many versions.

This isn't new.  It's been the end result ever since the Room mechanic was implemented.

[Oozinator]

Back to topic!"Occupational Upgrade is a Giant Nerf?"
We have to define first, how big a Giant is!
I say: A giant is bigger then a bicycle.
Q: Is the ONI nerf bigger then a bicycle?

[GrindThisGame]

My thoughts of the preview after 200 cycles:

First off, I love this game so I hope not to sound negative but more constructive. This is a preview so I realize it's not done yet.

My primary thought is that things feel much much slower now. I wasn't rushing but it took about 200 cycles to get into the oil (15 hours real time). Others have said that we need to make better use of firepoles (check) and tubes to speed dupes around the map. Since it takes a very long time to get to plastic you need to crawl to that point.

I also encountered an issue digging abyssalite down in the oil. I have two dupes that can use exosuits without the speed penalty but they can't dig abyssalite. The only way is to send a digger in an exosuit down and they are very slow. Firepoles help them get down fast but it takes a very long time to climb back up. I guess I could build mini work camps at the bottom of the map but that would also take quite a while.

Finding dupes that can train mechatronics seems quite rare and as others have said it takes 100+ cycles to train them up. And maybe this is ok since conveyor systems are late game. Late game content is great I just wish I could get to it sooner  (without debug mode)

I guess if there was a 4x speed or the ability to get a speed boost (espresso machine?)  to all dupes this would solve the issue for casual players of the game. I'll shut up now until the preview is done since part of previews are to balance things out.

[BDelacroix]

My main point is that a new approach needs to be taken in the preview.  It is slower, though.  I had been used to getting to the researching as fast as possible and get that done while growing a sustainable base.

 

You can still do mealwood, but you now need to elevate that and not promote everyone as fast as they become available since they want better and better food.  Once I figured that out, it was a lot better.  THough I think my last game I messed up and tore down my mealwood too soon.

[chemie]

1 hour ago, GrindThisGame said:

My thoughts of the preview after 200 cycles:

First off, I love this game so I hope not to sound negative but more constructive. This is a preview so I realize it's not done yet.

My primary thought is that things feel much much slower now. I wasn't rushing but it took about 200 cycles to get into the oil (15 hours real time). Others have said that we need to make better use of firepoles (check) and tubes to speed dupes around the map. Since it takes a very long time to get to plastic you need to crawl to that point.

I also encountered an issue digging abyssalite down in the oil. I have two dupes that can use exosuits without the speed penalty but they can't dig abyssalite. The only way is to send a digger in an exosuit down and they are very slow. Firepoles help them get down fast but it takes a very long time to climb back up. I guess I could build mini work camps at the bottom of the map but that would also take quite a while.

Finding dupes that can train mechatronics seems quite rare and as others have said it takes 100+ cycles to train them up. And maybe this is ok since conveyor systems are late game. Late game content is great I just wish I could get to it sooner  (without debug mode)

I guess if there was a 4x speed or the ability to get a speed boost (espresso machine?)  to all dupes this would solve the issue for casual players of the game. I'll shut up now until the preview is done since part of previews are to balance things out.

I created a thread on this very issue.  Most tasks require multiple "jobs".  You digger needs to get to the place to dig.  Unless you manually swap hats on every dup (which is impossible with 10+ dups), how to have a digger also wear an exosuit?  By the time he gets to the job site, it is time for a pee.

[Saturnus]

9 minutes ago, chemie said:

I created a thread on this very issue.  Most tasks require multiple "jobs".  You digger needs to get to the place to dig.  Unless you manually swap hats on every dup (which is impossible with 10+ dups), how to have a digger also wear an exosuit?  By the time he gets to the job site, it is time for a pee.

Or eating. Or sleeping.

[chemie]

1 minute ago, Saturnus said:

Or eating. Or sleeping.

Dup sets out early morning on his long journey to the end of the map....puts on his hat slowly and jumps with joy as he begins to dig....but then realizes it is quiting time...boy that day went by quickly....time to go home.  He has to fall asleep on a ladder because alas it took too long to get home.  He then starts a fresh the next day.  The dig never does happen but it is the new meta.

[Zarquan]

5 hours ago, chemie said:

Dup sets out early morning on his long journey to the end of the map....puts on his hat slowly and jumps with joy as he begins to dig....but then realizes it is quiting time...boy that day went by quickly....time to go home.  He has to fall asleep on a ladder because alas it took too long to get home.  He then starts a fresh the next day.  The dig never does happen but it is the new meta.

Then make him a bed near where he needs to dig.  Make a whole minibase.  Complete with O2, food, beds, mess hall, everything.  And don't let the miners leave that area until the job is done!  They can be supplied by courier, who are more than fast enough to get anywhere on the map if they are fast enough.

[SchlauFuchs]

19 minutes ago, Zarquan said:

Then make him a bed near where he needs to dig.  Make a whole minibase.  Complete with O2, food, beds, mess hall, everything. 

That brings us to the demand of campsites - beds that stay unassigned, first come first serve, if the dupe's pathfinding indicates it makes no sense to walk 'home'.

[Zarquan]

@SchlauFuchs I agree.  Or, at least, they should give us the ability to assign more than one bed to a dupe.   If I could assign a base bed and a camp bed, then I wouldn't have to micro as much.  Same with tables.  Why does each dupe need their own table anyway???  I don't know of a mess hall out there which has exactly one table for each person they expect to serve.

The thing is we have public bathrooms and public message tables.  Why not public beds and tables?

[Amara313]

53 minutes ago, Zarquan said:

@SchlauFuchs I agree.  Or, at least, they should give us the ability to assign more than one bed to a dupe.   If I could assign a base bed and a camp bed, then I wouldn't have to micro as much.  Same with tables.  Why does each dupe need their own table anyway???  I don't know of a mess hall out there which has exactly one table for each person they expect to serve.

The thing is we have public bathrooms and public message tables.  Why not public beds and tables?

I really like this idea.  Any dupe that is close at the right time can choose a bed or a table.  Might be hard to fix the path finding to allow that though. 

[Rusjcd]

End of the game means the Goal! Tubes and belts can't be the end game content cause they don't give any new abilities. Just speed up things which we had and which we need to build that content. We get it to... what? Whatch on it?

[Rusjcd]

BTW, it's sad, bit it seems, that Klei games will never have goals and the end, just more and more content which opens even more content..

[trukogre]

2 hours ago, Zarquan said:

 They can be supplied by courier, who are more than fast enough to get anywhere on the map if they are fast enough.

So, let me get this straight, you're saying, that if they're fast enough, that they're fast enough.  But, I have another scenario in mind.  What if, and I'm just putting this out there hypothetically, what if they're-- fast enough...  What happens then?

[Zarquan]

1 minute ago, trukogre said:

So, let me get this straight, you're saying, that if they're fast enough, that they're fast enough.  But, I have another scenario in mind.  What if, and I'm just putting this out there hypothetically, what if they're-- fast enough...  What happens then?

Oops, now I feel silly.  I restructured that sentence and didn't fix it lol.

 

[Oozinator]

Someone of you running a base with exos and the new preview/patch, like before?

[trukogre]

4 minutes ago, Zarquan said:

Oops, now I feel silly.  I restructured that sentence and didn't fix it lol.

 

It was an obvious typo and yet I found it hilarious for no real reason.  It somehow reminded me of Gene Wilder's portrayal of Willy Wonka, from the movie which on reflection contains some similarity in general mood and feel to ONI.

[BlueLance]

On 27/01/2018 at 6:10 AM, Kabrute said:

I feel like forcing them to hold a job for any length of time would finish breaking the early game.

I assigned my dupes jobs as soon as they come out of the printer, but I would still say I am in early game, I have done in about 60 cycles what I could usually do in about 20, I am NOT complaining though, I am loving it a bunch Stress has played a bit more on my colony than usual, because they are slowe jobs take longer, hey cannot carry as much so they the overall speed has slowed down which is good.

If the devs do not speed it up, I think this is them preparing for end game content to start making its appearances because dupes being super dupes let us get to the end to test things rapidly, now I think they are wanting to slow it down. But that is my thoughts if they do not speed or balance it