Do you prefer the new job system or the old?

[Xedlord]

2 hours ago, watermelen671 said:

Maybe have them display their tenured job by wearing their job's uniform.

Like for example:

• Doctor/Nurse: Scrubs
• Scientist: Lab Coat
• Chef: Chef Uniform (Y'know the one)

And everybody else would just have different colored jumpsuits. :3 (Maybe with identifying accessories like a wrench or whatever hanging off their belts)

I did see some job outfits in the art files but those were probably scrapped for hats.

[NanoD]

3 hours ago, The Plum Gate said:

I've had some early game slow downs myself, but it hasn't been because of job assignments ( although slightly )..

I was mostly thinking about that the dupes will not have 20+ athletics to zip around with.

[goboking]

12 hours ago, Queron81 said:

t's now like in real life - or have you ever seen a cook with another daily job as a farmer?

Humans have been eating the crops they grow for tens of thousands of years.

 

11 hours ago, NanoD said:

Well every change that is big will hurt. You have to change the way you think, the way you play. 

I dont see any problem with the new update expect that my dupes will be slow

 

I've laid out a detailed critique of this new system in my original post, so I'm not sure why you're dismissing my argument as a simple inability or unwillingness to adjust to a new system.

 

[AileTheAlien]

Is there a guide on how the new jobs work? It just seems like a giant mess (tonnes of wasted space in the UI) system, and I don't know how it works. Does it override the old job checkmarks? Does it have higher priority? The UI doesn't tell me this, and I'm very confused. :S

[Kabrute]

They added a third option to the control scheme so you get checkmarks for anyone can do, then the bars are for those who have the job.  Will only let you set to bar if someone has job, and will revert to blank if noone has job but is set to bar, you can get creative but it keeps resetting as I change their jobs around.

[CobraA1]

3 hours ago, goboking said:

I've laid out a detailed critique of this new system in my original post, so I'm not sure why you're dismissing my argument as a simple inability or unwillingness to adjust to a new system.

It was more a detailed description of how your base is set up rather than a detailed critique of the new job system. In addition, Kabrute addressed most of your concerns in the very first post after your original post.

I should note that in the long run, the goal is to make a great game for the entire player base, not to make the game cater to a particular niche who plays the game in a particular way. Yes, that means that occasionally the game will break some bases.

That said: I do think it is fair to say that maybe some consideration should be made for the idea of having multiple roles assigned to dupes. But I hope you are getting the intent of the designers too? I think this is a reaction to a lot of players simply not caring about the roles of their dupes, and to dubes just becoming super-athletes..

[Oozinator]

After some testing i could say: "I don't like it". It's only macro for nothing. I like the hats, but that's all. Game takes forever now, to get it running. Expanding, research, all takes longer now. It's only an additional gameplay brake, if you ask me.

[goboking]

4 hours ago, CobraA1 said:

It was more a detailed description of how your base is set up rather than a detailed critique of the new job system.

The detailed descriptions were actual, practical examples of how this update works directly against the explicitly stated goal of the system, but it's your prerogative to hand-wave away criticisms if you feel compelled to do so.

[Queron81]

8 hours ago, goboking said:

Humans have been eating the crops they grow for tens of thousands of years.

I'm talking about the job. I'm cooking too, but I am far away from being a cook

[goboking]

Just now, Queron81 said:

I'm talking about the job. I'm cooking too, but I am far away from a cook

At the risk of being pedantic, these aren't jobs, per se, they're tasks that must be performed to ensure survival.  This isn't a space resort where people vacation for rest and relaxation and your cook isn't someone paid to prepare five star meals for guests; it's an asteroid colony of the brink of collapse and your cook is someone who presses mud and germ-filled water into bars to stave off starvation for one more day. 

[CobraA1]

6 hours ago, goboking said:

The detailed descriptions were actual, practical examples of how this update works directly against the explicitly stated goal of the system, but it's your prerogative to hand-wave away criticisms if you feel compelled to do so.

Against the goals of the system you built into your base making assumptions that, while perfectly correct at the time, are no longer correct due to the changes made to the game. They weren't so much criticisms of the game itself, but criticizing that the changes to the game broke your base.

And I didn't say all of your criticism was unfair, either. I did note that there was some flexibility lost. But I guess you're pretty invested in your narrative.

[goboking]

1 hour ago, CobraA1 said:

Against the goals of the system you built into your base making assumptions that, while perfectly correct at the time, are no longer correct due to the changes made to the game. They weren't so much criticisms of the game itself, but criticizing that the changes to the game broke your base.

And I didn't say all of your criticism was unfair, either. I did note that there was some flexibility lost. But I guess you're pretty invested in your narrative.

That's twice now you've tried to push the narrative that I'm just indignant because of changes I'll have to make to my base.  My base has been broken by plenty of previous updates and I happily adjusted to each new system in kind.  I'm criticizing this update because A), the reduction in priority settings from 9 to 5 diminishes efficiency and flexibility, and B) the specialist system necessitates more micromanagement or forces upon players a larger colony population.  Those are changes that don't just impact my base, they impact yours and everyone else's as well.  Now if you want to explain why you disagree with my assessment then I welcome the discussion.  If all you want to do is take repeated shots at a straw man then I guess I've got nothing more to say to you.

[Hechicera]

On 1/26/2018 at 9:28 AM, Queron81 said:

Cook and farmer at the same time is very uncommon, i don't know, if this even exists on our planet. Or how about scientist and farmer? *lol*

Oh heh! I have been a scientist and a farmer. Day job was basic research at a global (name you would know) pharma company. The first one, which merged with the second, had the record for number of Nobel's won by a company not a university. So this wasn't light stuff. My farm was also a specialty farm with my stock winning both at the state fair and nationally, and did lay ups for the local state vet school. Also not hobby level. There is even a whole field called Agricultural Science, which is mainly about the best way to set up factory farms. Ugh.

I have been an engineer and a farmer, when I ran a plant floor. Both jobs were 24hrx365days on-call.

I know a symphony level (employed state symphony) instrumentalist and farmer.

I do know more than one caterer and farmer (meshes well with current interest in organic produce).

The problem was picking farmer as the other. Most "family" sized farms require at least one member of the family hold a full time outside job to make ends meet. If one member gets to college, the X + farmer can be nearly anything! I have a long list.

We do live in an educational world where specialization is encouraged, but farming and some engineering fields (Chemical esp.) can still be the opposite.

I'd love if the game had more cross-classing. Let me be creative based on which dupes pop.

[CobraA1]

11 hours ago, goboking said:

I'm criticizing this update because A), the reduction in priority settings from 9 to 5 diminishes efficiency and flexibility, and B) the specialist system necessitates more micromanagement or forces upon players a larger colony population. 

The priority changes are a bit odd. Because it's actually not a simple reduction from 9 to 5, but the way priorities work are hidden under what looks like a 5 priority system, but with an extra button that allows you to set "strict" priorities.

. . . and the reason that button is needed is because priorities are actually affected by job assignments. Dupes will perform their assigned roles before moving onto other jobs, so their roles could be considered a kind of hidden priority system.

As I understand it, what's happening is that the developers are responding to things they've noticed about how many players play the game. Rarely are all of the priorities used, and the duplicants seem "flat," and don't really have much of a chance to be more individual. Basically, the developers wanted to add more depth to the duplicants themselves.

As far as whether the new system is going to mean more micromanagement - I guess we'll see how it plays out. It's largely going to depend on how often you go to the jobs screen to reassign dupes. I don't think that it would be a great idea to be constantly reassigning them.

[ScottFree]

I like the new jobs as a concept. It isn't that different than the old system imo. Switching jobs is easy and solves most of the problems being described. 

Priories now isn't much different than the past either if you use the strict/override feature. 5 priority numbers vs 9 doesn't really matter unless you want to make each cycle take an hour clicking each number. 

The hard parts are the bugs and slower movement speed of dupes.

 

[Oozinator]

1 hour ago, ScottFree said:

Switching jobs is easy and solves most of the problems being described. 

Priories now isn't much different than

It's unwanted additional macro for nothing.
Sorry but it's completely different, then before. I was used to use all 9 prios and see 5 as limitation..

[TheOlz]

As someone who was previously using between 5 and 8 different priorities, the reduction will take some adjusting to.  I really liked the granularity of the 1-9, tbh, as the game became more complex I'd have been okay with even more!

Also hatdancing (job switching) isn't what I understood the intention of this change to be, there was talk of less micromanaging, but swapping hats for dupes every day or so is way more micro. I like the jobs idea in general, but implementation at this time is fiddly and time consuming for very minor benefit (in fact, no real benefit over the previous iteration).

There needs to be a certain amount of micromanaging sure, but if you had to manually tell dupes to wash their hands every time they used a bathroom you'd say it's unnecessary.  Having to hatdance to have a dupe dig through abyssalite seems equally unnecessary.

At least that's my view currently, and I fully acknowledge that we've had months to get used to the previous system, so some of this is bound to just unfamiliarity and rejection of change - I just want to see nice, clear advantages if micro is going to become a major part of the game.

[ScottFree]

10 minutes ago, Oozinator said:

It's unwanted additional macro for nothing.
Sorry but it's completely different, then before. I was used to use all 9 prios and see 5 as limitation..

What is the macro difference between hat switching and setting 9 priority numbers? Switching hats isn't hard, its more of a strategic thing that I do when I in advance.

[Oozinator]

1 minute ago, TheOlz said:

 I just want to see nice, clear advantages if micro is going to become a major part of the game.

They have to add crystals, able in an ingame shop, to speed dupes up. ONI goes Godus ^^

[TheOlz]

Just now, Oozinator said:

They have to add crystals, able in an ingame shop, to speed dupes up. ONI goes Godus ^^

Oh god! Micro MANAGING, not micro transactions... for the love of all that is holy in the land of dupes!!

HAHAHAHA!

[Kabrute]

Just 30 rubies to get 2x game speed for 20 cycles

[TheOlz]

Coming soon, OnI iOS gatcha game

[Oozinator]

18 minutes ago, ScottFree said:

What is the macro difference between hat switching and setting 9 priority numbers? Switching hats isn't hard, its more of a strategic thing that I do when I in advance.

Hats switching is nasty, not hard, when you have to do it a dazillion times. "Strategic" sorry i don't have that feeling. It's gameflow-breaking for me.
Prio example. Before we had 0-9, now 1-5 (only looking at that part). When dupes go idle, they use 0/1. With the new system you have only four real options left. When i had some areas, where sweeping was not important, dupes handled it, when i set it to 2. Medbay/massage table always highest (5)and now you have only (-0/-5) 3 numbers to finetune. But that example is useless now, because whole jobsystem interacts with prios.

15 minutes ago, TheOlz said:

Oh god! Micro MANAGING, not micro transactions... for the love of all that is holy in the land of dupes!!

HAHAHAHA!

You can get free crystals every day, when you log in, to make it fair. Opening a "daily" chest with the 1,5% chance to win a legendary chest, with 2 crystals. When you took your dailys 50 days in a row, without missing one, you can raise the chance up to 1.7%.
With 30 crystals you can buy 2 x gamespeed, for 20 cycles, or 4x gamespeed for 40 cycles!

14 minutes ago, Kabrute said:

Just 30 rubies to get 2x game speed for 20 cycles

Crystals are the new rubies

[ScottFree]

6 minutes ago, Oozinator said:

Hats switching is nasty, not hard, when you have to do it a dazillion times. "Strategic" sorry i don't have that feeling. It's gameflow-breaking for me.
Prio example. Before we had 0-9, now 1-5 (only looking at that part). When dupes go idle, they use 0/1. With the new system you have only four real options left. When i had some areas, where sweeping was not important, dupes handled it, when i set it to 2. Medbay/massage table always highest (5)and now you have only (-0/-5) 3 numbers to finetune. But that example is useless now, because whole jobsystem interacts with prios.

The numbers only gave a feeling of control. Hats/jobs do the same thing. What are you miss is the granularity of control. I can't help reading this as criticizing a difference of 4 numbers. ONI always had streamlined priorities. You may have chosen to use your own priorities (and you still can) but its at the forefront now. Fundamentally, the game is the same.

[Kabrute]

Fundamentally the game is nowhere near the same, things that worked before are now broken, things that progressed before now stagnate, and things that were changed (dupes dont grow) is such a massive change, that a dupe you've had for 300 cycles can be assigned the same job as a dupe you've had for 10 and they get the same bonus......................