Capacity decreased further???

[whitewalker82]

Did they decrease the capacity further? I can only hold 20 logs and 20 meat!! I mean going from 32 to 24 was bad enough and now they lowered it again? is this some kind of glitch or did they lower it again?

[Shwez]

It's the new hotfix.

Don't worry, now you can carry 40 roasted berries.

[whitewalker82]

I see, I can hold 40 grass too. What does hotfix mean exactly? Are they just adjusting based on use or need? Because 20 logs suck! I can handle the meat and whatever else but the logs are in need of an increase not decrease.

[Excess]

Make sure to read the threads the developers post (Kevin, JoeW and Tathan are the programmers and Corey does support), as they usually explain most of their decisions and rationale. Capacity has been discussed widely across the forums.

Nov 14 - Hotfix and tuning

[Donik]

Hotfix. Aka quick fix. Ooops we don't like how it is, we'll quickly change it and push it out.

I see no problem with the hotfix. While it makes things more difficult, that's fine with me. I'm all for survival hell. Right now I'm sitting pretty 56 days in. Make me struggle already!

[Shwez]

Hotfix means a quick fix/balancing after an update.

They adjusted the stack number according to the item size, logically. (ie. items that can be put in pockets, items that look heavy, etc).

[PistonPower]

This will play hell with my balancing of planks vs firewood ratio, Still, bring on the pain!

[Bogpad]

did anyone check the possible stacksize of charcoal? this might be the moment where it can shine compared to normal logs as fire fuel... only if you can stack it up to 40 times though...

[Shwez]

Charcoal stack is...

*drum roll*

...40

[whitewalker82]

Well the only thing I can really complain about is the log capacity, but trees are everywhere so I guess it is okay to have to work for them haha. Making boards will be a pain though because you can only make 3 and then have to go chop down like 8 more trees to get another stack. I guess I am not a fan of nerfing things I am used to, but this game is incredible none the less. Thanks for the quick replies.

[PistonPower]

In lieu of Shwez's comment I have decided that my personal forest may be in need of some pruning with fire.

God I love controlled burning

[Excess]

Making boards will be a pain though because you can only make 3 and then have to go chop down like 8 more trees to get another stack.

If it's planks you are after, you can make them right there in the forest, where you are chopping wood. Each plank requires 6 logs. That means you needs 60 logs for 10 planks. Chop down a large forest (hire pigs for this, they'll do %90 of the work and take the hit if a tree guardian shows up) without picking up the logs, then as you pick the logs, "refine" them to planks. No running needed.

At least this is how I always did it, even when the stacks where of 32.

[whitewalker82]

I just used an effigy because of those stupid tentacles turds, anyway I thought it would be a good idea to use a hammer on it and scavenge some part and when I clicked on it once it instantly stood back up like nothing had ever happened. Does it still work as an effigy since it stood back up? Has anyone tried this?

[whitewalker82]

If it's planks you are after, you can make them right there in the forest, where you are chopping wood. Each plank requires 6 logs. That means you needs 60 logs for 10 planks. Chop down a large forest (hire pigs for this, they'll do %90 of the work and take the hit if a tree guardian shows up) without picking up the logs, then as you pick the logs, "refine" them to planks. No running needed.

At least this is how I always did it, even when the stacks where of 32.

How do you hire the pigs? I am sort of new to this game, just started Sunday. Do I have to build the pig house, or can I go and give them meat and an axe? lol

[Excess]

I am sort of new to this game, just started Sunday.

If that's so, I'll let you figure it out by yourself. Half the fun of this game is trying things out by your own (and suffering the consequences).

The hammer and effigy thing is probably just a graphical issue, but be my guess and try it out. We need more men with answers than we need questions. I keep trying to convince people to do stuff...

(dramatic pause)

...FOR SCIENCE! But apparently I keep failing.

[whitewalker82]

If that's so, I'll let you figure it out by yourself. Half the fun of this game is trying things out by your own (and suffering the consequences).

The hammer and effigy thing is probably just a graphical issue, but be my guess and try it out. We need more men with answers than we need questions. I keep trying to convince people to do stuff...

(dramatic pause)

...FOR SCIENCE! But apparently I keep failing.

Haha, I am trying to make it farther in the game not start over I am on day 39, but I want to gamble with it so bad lol. What do the effigies do when they are used normally? do they just sit there in a pile and disappear after awhile or what?

[whitewalker82]

Okay screw it, I am going for it.....Test#1 will report back with results.....haha

Edit: You still die, lol "FOR SCIENCE!!!" -Excess

Edited November 15, 2012 by whitewalker82

[NomadCF]

I really Don't understand the reasoning behind the limiting items based on size, when you can carry something like 14 slots worth of stuff... So it's like saying being able to carry only 280 logs is better (more realistic, maybe harder...???) then 448 logs.

Rant

These kinda "fixes" are just annoying to me. They barely change the game play, yet took a good deal of dev time (planning,testing,etc) which could have been spent one something more useful. Like trying to make the game actually challenging.

If your going to give the user a large in-general inventory space(s) (slots). Then consider doing it based on weight in stead of the quantity items. This would require the player to really make some hard choices about what they want / NEED to carry VS available weight limits. I mean as it is right now. If I'm going to carry LOGs with me. Then why won't I always carry my MAX, as to do so bare no consequences on me as I've already decided to use one of my slots. Yet not carrying my max just feel foolish as either way I decided to use one of my slots, so I might as well MAX it out. Weight also helps immerse the player, as they can relate to only being able carry X.

But now think of the alternative, Not only would I have to decide on what to put in my (some say limited, I say we have way to many) slots. But also how many of each item I want to carry! As maybe my weight limit is 55 X and logs weight 5,berries 0.5, Axes 15,Shovels 15, picks 15, stones 10. If I carry all my tools that's 45 X, so now I only have room for 1 log and small load of berries. But If I carry only my Ax, I've got enough room for wood and food. But I had to think and sacrifice the other tools.

Side note: limiting ones carrying ability is only use full if Items can disappear. Like if for example they are left on the ground for so long. Other wise it's easily defeated by simply having small "storage" locations around the island(s). And since the items don't disappear users don't even have to build "boxes". They can simply just drop and store the items where ever. (this is true for food too. Although if you worried about the random pig (or other) eating something, just put up a few trees. cut them down and leave the stumps. It's a simple box that cost you basically zero resources as pine cones are every where. And you don't have to use the annoying tech tree to build planks first then the box.

Rant

The tech tree for building "complex" items is extremely annoying to me. If I've got all the raw materials on me to make the "end" item. Don't make me refine everything first, then build it. Just simply build it, going though the extra steps doesn't add anything to the game. It's just simply annoying, which is also *another* reason I find my self not wanting to build anything in the tech tree (beside finding just about everything in the tech tree useless).

[LadyD]

NomadCF if you find the game so annoying and irritating why are you playing it?

I mean refinement is a requirement and perfectly logical steps towards building more complex items. It means you have to have the time. The space and dedication. It makes sense.

If you aren't finding the game perhaps you should wait until its out of beta and the difficulty curb is established?

The new inventory limits are set based on 'large, medium, small ideas' which are probably SEMI related to weight since larger things typically have more mass (very general terms-And Based on them being of similar materials).

[Excess]

These kinda "fixes" are just annoying to me. They barely change the game play, yet took a good deal of dev time (planning,testing,etc) which could have been spent one something more useful. Like trying to make the game actually challenging.

I don't think this "tweak" took them time at all. The system was already there, when farming vegetables was introduced. Now, doing something like what you suggest... man, that would take some MAYOR time. Researching the different weights, coding the new system, re engineering the inventory, testing it out, reaching a balance between reality and playability... I'm even tired of writing it.

Don't get me wrong, I like your idea. But not like Diablo or Fallout 3, where you had a weight limit but ultimately you could carry 10 different weapons at a time. No, something even more realistic, like having to carry the stones in a separate bag that you'd have to pull around, or making an improvised stretcher/sled to push all the collected wood. Putting wood logs in your pockets it's plain silly.

But if I have to choose, I'd stay with the current system in exchange of more bizarre creatures, more funny things to build and even more ways to die because I made a stupid/risky decision.

At the end of the day, it's the Devs game, and they have been doing a great job already. They always welcome friendly suggestions, wacky ideas and love reading a good debate, but it's THEIR game. We can only influence it... gently.

[JoeW]

A great deal of the reason for having people playing during beta is for tweaks like that. We get feedback and monitor progress as you guys go through the content and adjust according to how those are intended to function.

Like a few of the players here might know, it was much much more difficult when there was only one bar of inventory slots and it required much more food to make it through an entire day.

I played a good five times or more before I could make it through one night. While some enjoyed the difficulty, overall that type of challenge was not the experience we wanted to provide.

These adjustments are critical to the overall health of the game. In general, there haven't been a high amount of these types of adjustments, but there have been some, and there will continue to be until things are at the level that we feel is providing the experience intended by the design of those particular systems.

That being said; player feedback is just as important. The entire development team keeps a close eye on these forums as much as possible while still maintaining a pretty aggressive update schedule. So, good or bad, like it or not, always feel free to let us know!

[NomadCF]

NomadCF if you find the game so annoying and irritating why are you playing it?

It game can be fun at times. And has a lot of potential. Which is my we (wife and I) bought 2 keys in stead of just sharing the extra. We think this game could really become something and we wanted to support the devs.

I mean refinement is a requirement and perfectly logical steps towards building more complex items. It means you have to have the time. The space and dedication. It makes sense.

Only if your trying to waste or detract from the players fun time. Extra steps for meaning tasks, detracts from the "action". Simply allow the user to auto create the item provided they have the raw goods and increase the create time. The time and goals are the same but the users experience is made more pleasant.

If you aren't finding the game perhaps you should wait until its out of beta and the difficulty curb is established?

It's better to speak up now, rather then later. And beside this is what it is to be a beta tester. Give back your input, the good, bad and the rants.

The new inventory limits are set based on 'large, medium, small ideas' which are probably SEMI related to weight since larger things typically have more mass (very general terms-And Based on them being of similar materials).

I can see your confusion, your relating the terms weight with quantity. It's a very common mistake, one I tried to keep people from making using the example and context I did. Using a more "true" weight system in survival games is a basic stable, take the fallout style games for example. And using limited storage based on slots or inventory counts works best in games dealing with magic and such like final fantasy and the like (which is why they use them instead of a weight system).

[Excess]

Using a more "true" weight system in survival games is a basic stable, take the fallout style games for example.

Which is completely useless if your character can carry 3 tons worth of useless stuff around and still sprint and jump.

Take the fallout style games for example.

You are just changing a faulty system for another faulty system, making the devs lose time and gaining what? personal preference?

You almost sold me the "refinement is useless" pitch though. But I wouldn't take it out completely. I prefer having 10 planks on my inventory than 60 logs. On the long run, I had to chop down 20 trees both ways, but it's easier to carry around 10 planks on 1 slot than 60 logs on 3.

I understand though the possibility of automatically refining the materials when building high tier things if you have the sufficient raw materials.

I can live with it.

[501105]

A great deal of the reason for having people playing during beta is for tweaks like that. We get feedback and monitor progress as you guys go through the content and adjust according to how those are intended to function.

Like a few of the players here might know, it was much much more difficult when there was only one bar of inventory slots and it required much more food to make it through an entire day.

I played a good five times or more before I could make it through one night. While some enjoyed the difficulty, overall that type of challenge was not the experience we wanted to provide.

These adjustments are critical to the overall health of the game. In general, there haven't been a high amount of these types of adjustments, but there have been some, and there will continue to be until things are at the level that we feel is providing the experience intended by the design of those particular systems.

That being said; player feedback is just as important. The entire development team keeps a close eye on these forums as much as possible while still maintaining a pretty aggressive update schedule. So, good or bad, like it or not, always feel free to let us know!

Makes me wonder just how difficult it was before. Also kudos for listening to your fans, many developers day they do, but never actually do it.

[NomadCF]

Which is completely useless if your character can carry 3 tons worth of useless stuff around and still sprint and jump.

Oh I couldn't agree more! But that's where the tuning would need to come in. Like in skyrim,fallout,etc. If your characters max weight limit is on slower side. It forces to consider "A" what to carry for supplies. And "B" what kinda armor you want. Heavy armor is wonder for defense cut dramatically cut down on how much you could carry. The Same could be applied here. If wear that wood armor, I can carry less. If I carry all my tools, I can't take as much fire and food supplies, etc.

You are just changing a faulty system for another faulty system, making the devs lose time and gaining what? personal preference?

Again I agree no system is prefect, But there are other things that can be gain here. Like for example "gold" version of tools could also be lighter then the starting versions. Which would give you more incentive to make them. But your also gaining more piece of "I must decide" OR "again thing to struggle with".

But don't get me wrong, I like the simpler setup we have now. I just think that it lacks any real feeling of "oh no what do I need to take" VS "what can I take". Because as it sits now you really don't have to struggle with what to take or not. as you can pretty much just take all the basic with you all the time (all your tools,food,wood,armor and extras) and there is no reason not to.

Or for another example, maybe it force OR gives the player other things to think about. Like "hmm I really want to take all my tools...." but they are heavy and wood is also semi heavy. But I could take some fireflies and a net. And while it would use up 2 slots. They together weights are less then the wood so I can take my all tools! It gives the players even more options and ways to strategize.