End game content

[Mike23Ua]

3 hours ago, _zwb said:

Because destroying my decorational shrine has no effect on my survival. It's a decoration, it produces 0 resources and serves 0 survival function, it's just for the look.

Say if I build a little garden with fancy walls and statues, and maybe some flowers, how's that benefiting my survival at all? Hence how's destroying it threatening my survival?

This is subjective… I’m someone who turns on the Year of the Catcoon and Winters Feast Events and leave those ON 24/7 because….

Finding all 9 Kitcoons across all 9 Biomes they spawn within = Challenge. 

Same thing with Winters Feast food dishes, to craft a Buffet table of EVERY Winters Feast Dish requires you to yet again quest all over the constant, and gather the required ingredients. 
 

If these so called “Decorations” end up getting Destroyed, then I have to travel all over the constant to gather the resources to rebuild them…

And in the process, I might get attacked by a hound wave, I might get mauled by a RockJaw Shark in my boating trip, hell.. I might be walking through the meteorite biome and forget to put on a helmet to be killed by falling meteor.

Its not necessarily your decorations being destroyed that bring about survival challenges, but rather the Quest you’ll embark on (now with random crap spewing out funky Lunar/Shadow Portals) to restore it.

[Spino43]

5 hours ago, Mike23Ua said:

Which gives me a new task of either: A trying to catch them and put them all back, or B: Get new ones to place in the pens.

How does that = Survival challenge? Because it’s giving me something to actually do that could potentially take my concentration off my health or my sanity and then in a panic I scramble to try to find food or sanity restoration items.

YOUR very specific problem comes into play that you know too much about the game- you don’t struggle with sanity or hunger anymore, and to you having a Brightshade spawn in your pen, smash your fences and let all your Carrats out would only be seen as an annoying task.

So being a veteran player is a sin. Got it. 

[GelatinousCube]

4 hours ago, Mike23Ua said:

Finding all 9 Kitcoons across all 9 Biomes they spawn within = Challenge. 

Same thing with Winters Feast food dishes, to craft a Buffet table of EVERY Winters Feast Dish requires you to yet again quest all over the constant, and gather the required ingredients. 

Time consuming doesn't necessarily equal a challenge... I think you'll find that your idea of a "challenge" is probably very different from most. 

[Mike23Ua]

6 minutes ago, GelatinousCube said:

Time consuming doesn't necessarily equal a challenge... I think you'll find that your idea of a "challenge" is probably very different from most. 

Nah, it just means I’m a veteran from Solo DS who was actually used to NOT committing 50 billion days to the same world seed, who actually enjoys the early game building process of starting with nothing & having to build my base up to sustain.

So very obviously… once I’ve established that base (and built most if not every base structure) I grow bored AF and delete my game save to start over again.

Why does everyone’s idea of “fun” have to magically be the same for you people???

[GelatinousCube]

9 hours ago, Mike23Ua said:

How does that = Survival challenge? Because it’s giving me something to actually do that could potentially take my concentration off my health or my sanity and then in a panic I scramble to try to find food or sanity restoration items.

You like to build a lot of decoration and random fun little projects you make for yourself, maybe you should give "megabasing" a go, it honestly seems like you'd both enjoy and benefit from making a huge base that covers all your needs and allows you to focus on whatever you want. 

Or you can keep finding setting up decoration/shrines/whatever as an actual challenge because it distracts you from finding food or whatever. 

Just seems like you're playing a different game from the rest of us sometimes. You seem to really dislike doing anything efficiently or the "popular" ways and end up struggling because of it. I still remember when you refused to build a wall or use other popular strategies against Dfly and were getting very frustrated.

Basically you make the game way more challenging than it actually is for a myriad of reasons, whether intentional or not. It's just a little baffling sometimes. 

 

35 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

Nah, it just means I’m a veteran from Solo DS who was actually used to NOT committing 50 billion days to the same world seed, who actually enjoys the early game building process of starting with nothing & having to build my base up to sustain.

So very obviously… once I’ve established that base (and built most if not every base structure) I grow bored AF and delete my game save to start over again.

Why does everyone’s idea of “fun” have to magically be the same for you people???

It doesn't and you're twisting my words for your own agenda. 

You seem to enjoy severely handicapping yourself to make the game much harder than it needs to be, but not by necessarily making world settings harder but by doing tasks in an inefficient way. 

Yeah we get it you like the early game and that's totally fine, I've been playing a lot more pubs recently because I enjoy that early gameplay loop as well. This isn't about that though it's about you wanting this game to a) be way more like DS which it never has been it is it's own beast and b) basically be a completely different game. 

Have you played alien dark descent? I think it might be up your alley. Rotwood sounds a lot more rogue like and difficult than DST as well. I've been meaning to check it out myself. 

35 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

Nah, it just means I’m a veteran from Solo DS who was actually used to NOT committing 50 billion days to the same world seed, who actually enjoys the early game building process of starting with nothing & having to build my base up to sustain.

So why don't you play DS and it's DLCs more if you prefer that playstyle to DST??

DST isn't going to ever be DS it just isn't. 

[cropo]

16 hours ago, landromat said:

"oh no my decorations getting destroyed. This is annoying and not challenging, remove it"

Sometimes megabasers are more irritating than webber mains

Yeah it's really irritating when someone points out something is not challenging, and does not do anything productive for the longevity of the game. Wow, how annoying, truly you have shown the megabasers how dumb their opinions are. It is not you, who offers nothing to the conversation and just drops lines like this that is annoying, no, it is the megabasers pointing out a mechanic is not fun and simultaneously fails to deliver any challenge or survival merits whatsoever.

[_zwb]

11 hours ago, Mike23Ua said:

I will however say that to the people asking me to prove how having your walls be targeted and destroyed is a survival challenge, I can equally ask them to prove how it Isn’t.

 

6 hours ago, Mike23Ua said:

Its not necessarily your decorations being destroyed that bring about survival challenges, but rather the Quest you’ll embark on (now with random crap spewing out funky Lunar/Shadow Portals) to restore it.

So you do know it's not a survival challenge? Then why did you say it is in the first comment?

[Mike23Ua]

1 minute ago, _zwb said:

 

So you do know it's not a survival challenge? Then why did you say it is in the first comment?

I honestly can’t believe I have to say this.. but if Klei wanted something to NOT be able to be destroyed… obviously it wouldn’t take damage.

[_zwb]

1 minute ago, Mike23Ua said:

I honestly can’t believe I have to say this.. but if Klei wanted something to NOT be able to be destroyed… obviously it wouldn’t take damage.

Does whether it's intended or not has anything to do with the claim "decorations being destroyed is a survival challenge"?

[Capybara007]

The answer its simple, it is not a survival challenge, you just want it because seeing stuff get destroyed gives the delusion that something challenging is going on

[landromat]

1 hour ago, cropo said:

Yeah it's really irritating when someone points out something is not challenging, and does not do anything productive for the longevity of the game. Wow, how annoying, truly you have shown the megabasers how dumb their opinions are. It is not you, who offers nothing to the conversation and just drops lines like this that is annoying, no, it is the megabasers pointing out a mechanic is not fun and simultaneously fails to deliver any challenge or survival merits whatsoever.

One thing: mechanic is annoying for megabasers only. Regular players literally do not care about these at all. They'll Just figure out ways to play with them like we always do. This is a challenge, to live and to plan around thing like that. And megabasers main point is they spent bazillion hours in one world and too lazy to rebuild their Base according to New mechanic, because its easier to ask devs to disable New mechanics right? Its 'annoying' right? This berry bush and that coalelephant Pen stayed like they are for years and i dont want to rebuild right? My gameplay should not be affected by you, it is for you to adapt, not for me

[Capybara007]

11 minutes ago, landromat said:

One thing: mechanic is annoying for megabasers only. Regular players literally do not care about these at all. They'll Just figure out ways to play with them like we always do. This is a challenge, to live and to plan around thing like that. And megabasers main point is they spent bazillion hours in one world and too lazy to rebuild their Base according to New mechanic, because its easier to ask devs to disable New mechanics right? Its 'annoying' right? This berry bush and that coalelephant Pen stayed like they are for years and i dont want to rebuild right? My gameplay should not be affected by you, it is for you to adapt, not for me

How dumb is that "they are lazy" its just decoration dude, it is boring to farm a lot of materials and then spend 10 hours redoing the thing that got destroyed instead of building something new and fun

The megabasers gameplay should not affect you, you are going too far with **** like "i want boulders for my challenge" when you clearly know you never built anything in the caves so boulders destroying your stuff is impossible, and lunar hail "killing mobs is challenging" follows the same logic

I said it once and ill say it again, yall have not played a single world over day 100, stop playing early game world that dont even last after spring and discover how the endgame loop works

This will help you see what real things would be challenging for endgame, counters to bundle wrap, counters to easy hound waves, counters to star/moon callers, these things would be challenging, not some stupid "destroy decoration that i never placed because it is challenging"

[landromat]

13 minutes ago, Capybara007 said:

I said it once and ill say it again, yall have not played a single world over day 100, stop playing eraly game world that dont even last after spring and discover how the endgame loop works

next please

also had 5k+ days world i lost

 

[Capybara007]

Did you make any decorational builds in those worlds?

[landromat]

8 minutes ago, Capybara007 said:

Did you make any decorational builds in those worlds?

no

[cropo]

1 hour ago, landromat said:

One thing: mechanic is annoying for megabasers only. Regular players literally do not care about these at all. They'll Just figure out ways to play with them like we always do. This is a challenge, to live and to plan around thing like that. And megabasers main point is they spent bazillion hours in one world and too lazy to rebuild their Base according to New mechanic, because its easier to ask devs to disable New mechanics right? Its 'annoying' right? This berry bush and that coalelephant Pen stayed like they are for years and i dont want to rebuild right? My gameplay should not be affected by you, it is for you to adapt, not for me

 

Can you, um...explain to me in detail how making the rain not damage useless mobs penned up in cages is going to compromise the challenge of the game?

 

Like, the things you're saying sound good and noble if we're talking about something like megabasers asking to remove all hazards in the game or like make all bosses do only 1 damage or something crazy. But you're planting your flag on the hill of -checks papers- destroying useless decorative structures. This really isn't the argument you want to make for this in my opinion, can you honestly look me in the eyes and tell me obnoxious falling boulders and trivial lunar rain is a genuine feature and challenge in the game? Content that is so important, that removing it would truly be a detrimental effect on survival?

Can you honestly claim that boulders and lunar rain (Lets focus on this for now) have changed the difficulty, added any interesting challenge or ways to engage with the game? That having them not destroy structures, breaking useless decorations, and interrupting gameplay for a few seconds, is committing an atrocity to the legacy of ultimate survival that this game gives?

 

If these two features were removed or changed to be less targeted towards pointless areas of the game, would you wake up and cry ''Ugh, time to quit, this is no longer the challenging survival game that I have to adapt to!".

 

Can you give me some bigger explanation as to why you need to have the mechanics act this way other than ''Get stuffed, annoying megabasers, you deserve it for making silly little side-projects!" because I just can't fathom how people are treating these features like they are some divine and ultimate example of challenge and fun. 

 

It's just getting so crazy trying to wrap my head around this, this is the content people are defending?  Not something like the overabundance of charcoal when trees are lit on fire, the reduction in costs to turf materials and accessibility to cobblestones? The cobblestone change is actually a HUGE gameplay advantage that actually does trivialize travel and fighting, so I wouldn't be siding with megabasers if I was around for that update and people complained about that because I would agree on it.

 

But...random falling boulders that are not a threat, and just destroy things and litter the map obnoxiously? Nothing else? That's it? That's all they do? And having them not act this way is a blight on the games image? I just can't man...

[Capybara007]

3 hours ago, landromat said:

no

Of course you didnt, why are you implying, then, that megabasers dont want challenge when most have already stated that breaking decoration isnt a challenge

[Theukon-dos]

On 10/17/2023 at 11:06 AM, Mike23Ua said:

From MY Perspective- Having your base get damaged & destroyed where you have to repair it is a core (& honestly quite vital..) part of the Gameplay Loop in any Survival Sandbox game.

Its literally WHY Creepers Exist in Minecraft..

Its Why Flaming Zombies Exist in 7 Days to Die..

Its Why Dinosaurs can attack and damage your structures in Ark Survival Evolved..

Its why Crocodiles Spawn and attempt to eat your Walls in Conan Exiles..

If you remove the survival aspect from a Survival Sandbox, all you have left is the Sandbox.

~~Snip~~

So why people get “up in arms” over people maybe wanting some unavoidable destructive elements, or to have the games content NOT politely try very hard not to spawn in my base I truly don’t understand..

Its literally why walls take damage and show visual damage, and can be repaired.

The problem only comes in when people don’t WANT to spend their time repairing things…

But in the examples I listed above: that’s kinda a core part of the gameplay loop in Survival Sandbox games.

Ok, so- Mike. Mike Mike Mike Mike Mike. How do I even-

 

In the examples you listed, I am admittedly not familiar with 7DTD or Conan. But of the examples I do know, I can say with absolute certainty that they're perfect examples of how base destruction is absolutely not part of survival game's core gameplay.

In Minecraft, Creepers will only blow up if they get close to the player. They don't look for player-built houses to blow up, or blow up whenever they feel like it. As funny as it is to complain about bases being destroyed, it's entirely by the player's own mistakes that such a thing will ever happen.

And in ARK, dinos destroying your base is only ever a concern for lower-tier structures. Once you get to stone tier (which is easy, that's usually what I build my bases with), very; and I do mean VERY few creatures can actually get through it. Really only the strongest creatures on the ARKs can get through it, or a select few outliers , all of which are fairly uncommon or only spawn in specific places. At level 24, you can make a completely Rex-proof base. And don't even get me started on metal tier, where the only things that can break through are bosses and minibosses. I don't think I've had a base get destroyed the my last 3000 hours of ARK. And frankly, I really have to ask what the hell you're doing if it's apparently so common for you.

 

Now again, I haven't played the other two games you listed. But given that I know half your claims are just wrong? I'd wager on those ones being wrong too. Not to mention the metric asston of survival games that you conveniently ignored, such as Subnautica.

 

Moral of the story: You're wrong. And you proved yourself wrong.

 

 

 

[Capybara007]

1 hour ago, Theukon-dos said:

Really only the strongest creatures on the ARKs can get through it, or a select few outliers , all of which are fairly uncommon or only spawn in specific places. At level 24, you can make a completely Rex-proof base. And don't even get me started on metal tier, where the only things that can break through are bosses and minibosses.

No no you dont get it, using that is cheese, and avoiding creepers is also cheese, you must guide the creeper to your chest storage and blow yourself up with it so now you have to grind all of the chest's content for a month, that is the way the devs intended it - Mike

[Mike23Ua]

3 hours ago, Capybara007 said:

Of course you didnt, why are you implying, then, that megabasers dont want challenge when most have already stated that breaking decoration isnt a challenge

I must ask one very obvious question that “MegaBasers” seem to be completely and intentionally avoiding..

For a MegaBaser, their pride and joy is building up their base, so the ONLY way your going to challenge them, is by threatening their base.. right?

Oh wait.. yall want more completely “Optional” Content you can sail out to sea and summon so nothing bad ever happens to your base.

[_zwb]

Just now, Mike23Ua said:

so the ONLY way your going to challenge them, is by threatening their base.. right?

I thought you were advocating specifically for more survival challenge, not just any challenge? Even you were advocating for any new challenges, destroying bases so the player has to rebuild it over and over again is of no challenge.

[Capybara007]

3 hours ago, Mike23Ua said:

For a MegaBaser, their pride and joy is building up their base, so the ONLY way your going to challenge them, is by threatening their base.. right?

No

I already said what makes endgame easy and how threatening those things would make endgame hard, threatening decoration will not make anything difficult

Here:

On 10/17/2023 at 5:44 PM, Capybara007 said:

In the endgame players have no issue with food because you usually put many stacks in a bundle wrap and carry it for 1 or 2 ingame years, players also have no problems with hound waves since they can hide in their arena for hound waves witb houndious shootious they setup, and they have no problem with temperature because of star and moon callers

[MondayNight]

2 hours ago, Theukon-dos said:

...I don't think I've had a base get destroyed the my last 3000 hours of ARK. And frankly, I really have to ask what the hell you're doing if it's apparently so common for you.

He's camping in DST's Mosaic biome, under meteor fields - need I write more?! After so much back and forth with Mike over the years and through countless threads for me is pretty clear he's bad at games in general. Probably because of bad decision making, en large.

 

Mike, out of curiosity: have you ever soloed AFw and/or CC? What am I posting; Mike, have you ever soloed Toad? Regular, not Misery?

There are over 4 years since you mass post on these forums, yet in-game you show little-to-no improvement. Why's that?

Advocating for "harder Survival", even artificial faux one like destruction of decorative elements, won't make experience players go down in performance - will solely cripple yours, Mike, and your DST routine even more.

[lenship2]

what is a "survival challenge"?

[LitulLola]

On 10/17/2023 at 1:57 AM, Capybara007 said:

You are not gonna say anything?

Ive got a lot going on rn, it takes me awhile till i can get back on here. I just lost my dad.

On 10/17/2023 at 1:44 PM, Capybara007 said:

This wouldnt be an issue if the people claiming to want more endgame challenge wouldve actually played an endgame world lol

I just happen to be a long-term world player with large bases. Like I said before, when I want a challenge that makes me try to figure out how to protect my base or have a challenge that I can't just ignore. I want that option! Demanding everything follow Sandbox rules even endgame content doesn't even give us the option for a different style of play! Which is my point!

Small amounts of destruction when added up, for example diff types, one for each season (like hail before nerfed). Would create A challenge that I think could fit well in this game for those that choose to activate it. It isn't something we've had in any real meaningful way before. (Deerclops is way too easy to counter) but I agree boulders were too destructive. Hail was manageable. I'd like to see this aspect developed further. But the player base isn't even allowing it. 

I don't know if this will work, I'm on a tablet and had to take a pic of my TV screen. This is just one of my long-term word's. I have a few 3000+ one's that are more built out, just so you know I do "play endgame worlds" I also lost my favorite world I've ever had 4500+ (literally cried)

On 10/17/2023 at 3:47 PM, MostMerryTomcat said:

Superfluous/useless staff that is just put there to look generally pretty, like:

Nothing in prtscrn above has any functional use, aside the lamps and some of the chests. All rest is for aesthetic soothing. (more stuff from same camp in spoiler below) Just a tiny example; dedicated base builders use a lot more, especially objects placed on ground to make base look interestingly pleasing to the eye and nothing else. Sure, is a bon when said decorations have also functional purpose, but those walls for example wont stop anything (since they aren't in a pathfinder exploit configuration).
 

  Reveal hidden contents

This is really beautiful!!!! How much did the hail destroy? How long did you have to stand there for it to do any real damage?

Just for fun can anyone find me in the first pic of a very small part of my base? I disappeared lol