Klei, how long are you going to try to ruin my base? And other suggestions

[Mike23Ua]

11 hours ago, GelatinousCube said:

Wish I could big ups this post like twenty times. 

It’s actually heavily situational, and maybe I’m just highly unlucky but have you just NOT ever had Boulders fall and block the exit to a cave you were attempting to escape from when a horde of depth worms were coming?

My point is that falling boulders actually DO Impact survival skills, maybe not for you if your an expert at the game or whatever.. but when paths get blocked off when I wanted to make a quick exit and I have to instead either face what’s trying to attack me or quickly mine away enough boulders to still escape- that = Survival content.

And if your TOO GOOD at the game (like most of you are and just won’t admit..) you’ll never see this side of the spectrum.

[xhyom]

39 minutes ago, abrocator said:

Has this interaction ever happened:

• Beta is released
• A: I don't like Beta. It destroys too much.
• B: It's an opt-in game mode you don't have to engage with it.
• A: Understandable have a great day.

It's effectively saying that people that don't like this Beta can just opt out of this update as well as all the other post-rift updates that the game will get.

Has this interaction ever happened:

• Beta is released
• A: I don't like Beta, does not fit my playstyle.
• Klei: Understandable, deleting the optional toggleable content, cheers!

It's effectively saying that people that enjoy challenges and survival content can just learn how to code and make a mod.

[_zwb]

40 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

maybe not for you if your an expert at the game or whatever

Mike I think people who can kill fuel weaver and nightmare werepig have proven themselves to be skillful.

36 minutes ago, xhyom said:

--snip--

Nevermind misread it

[xhyom]

17 minutes ago, _zwb said:

 

I'm being ironic about how people find it the hardest thing in the world to disable toggleable options in a menu when creating their server and are being dramatic for being "forced" to do that (Even though they actually have been doing that for AGES as wildfires exists and always have been disabled and no one died doing that) while the option for those who liked the update if it was crippled or removed after release would really just be to create a mod to bring it back, which isn't easy, unlike clicking on an ingame option... Or worse as that update could possibly never even existed and creating a mod for something completely new is even harder.

 

You corrected yourself but I'll keep it that way anyway since the point still stands lol

[Mysterious box]

1 hour ago, abrocator said:

It's not hard to sketch something that people would like or be fine with. How do you implement a new challenge that doesn't pounce on people's bases? You implement it as a new area that didn't exist before. Duh. That by definition cannot ruin existing bases.

Could be a new island or an underground lake or something else.

Hard to implement? I guess. But that's a separate matter.

So we just ignore that even the devs said they want to implement new seasons of sorts and survival content in favor of content most people will visit once or twice and never again that has little to no impact on how they play? Going to new unexplored areas is fine from time to time but some people want a shake up to the status quo in the main areas and I thought the "endgame" was the place for it do we have to wait for don't starve 3 for that to happen? I sure hope not.

I'm not asking for content we can't defend against but also against content without automatic solutions because if you do that what's the point of having the content in the first place?

[_zwb]

Just now, xhyom said:

Wall of Text

I misread can just as can't just, changed the comment before your reply

[Mysterious box]

23 minutes ago, _zwb said:

Mike I think people who can kill fuel weaver and nightmare werepig have proven themselves to be skillful.

I mean not everyone plays alone and the burden of even the hardest fights can be eased by groups that doesn't suddenly mean all the players involved are suddenly more skillful and even then just because someone's good at fighting bosses doesn't mean they're skillful in other areas.

[Mike23Ua]

16 minutes ago, _zwb said:

Mike I think people who can kill fuel weaver and nightmare werepig have proven themselves to be skillful.

Nevermind misread it

I mean no offense when I say this but killing both Nightmare pig AND FuelWeaver would require next to no skill. Both these bosses are tucked away in an obscure corner of the map.. and they’re ONLY ever summoned when you’re ready to fight them. Same can be said for Toadstool, Bee Queen, Crab King, Celestial Champion etc etc..

This type of completely OPTIONAL content is in no way shape or form comparable to content that directly confronts the player as an obstacle.

As much as YOU may not think so… having Nitre clog up ponds and render them unuseable during acid rain actually WOULD effect a players survival skills- IF that player was heavily relying on pond fish for foods.

You don’t need this “Endgame” knowledge about the game to even fight CC, you can easily do that by just gathering up all his Alter parts (a pain in the butt to do with lengthy quest grind).

that’s what baffles me about you people…

You tend to think this content is locked behind a certain skill threshold when it’s not.

Also Boss fighting skill is not = to world exploration skill.

Ive slain many bosses & yet STILL managed to Starve to death many times not being able to escape an empty area of the caves in time to find some food.

[CuteC]

1 hour ago, Mike23Ua said:

It’s actually heavily situational, and maybe I’m just highly unlucky but have you just NOT ever had Boulders fall and block the exit to a cave you were attempting to escape from when a horde of depth worms were coming?

My point is that falling boulders actually DO Impact survival skills, maybe not for you if your an expert at the game or whatever.. but when paths get blocked off when I wanted to make a quick exit and I have to instead either face what’s trying to attack me or quickly mine away enough boulders to still escape- that = Survival content.

And if your TOO GOOD at the game (like most of you are and just won’t admit..) you’ll never see this side of the spectrum.

Boulders fall behind you if you keep on moving, so either you stood still seeing how the ground was shaking or left the rocks blocking a vital path before.

[Mike23Ua]

2 minutes ago, CuteC said:

Boulders fall behind you if you keep on moving, so either you stood still seeing how the ground was shaking or left the rocks blocking a vital path before.

No I was trying to escape a cave tunnel entrance that acid rain had started in and didn’t want it to eat through the durability of my Eyebrella and boulders fell right on top of the entrance.

I don’t know if it would be different playing on PC with it’s wonky Point and Click mouse controls but on Xbox.. you have to actually walk close enough to the Cave Entrance/Exit to get a button prompt to enter/leave the cave, and because boulders had fallen directly on top of the exit.. I had to mine them out of the way until the button prompt to leave the cave system would pop up again.

[_zwb]

23 minutes ago, Mysterious box said:

I mean not everyone plays alone and the burden of even the hardest fights can be eased by groups that doesn't suddenly mean all the players involved are suddenly more skillful and even then just because someone's good at fighting bosses doesn't mean they're skillful in other areas.

That's just the issue with activating rifts, it doesn't need to be agreed by all players on server, you do have a point though.

16 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

This type of completely OPTIONAL content is in no way shape or form comparable to content that directly confronts the player as an obstacle

These optional content requires skills for resource management, kiting mobs properly, exploring the world to find them in the first place and inventory management. Safe to say that once you've beaten fuelweaver you'd be skillful enough and learned to prepare some emergency items beforehand so you don't get into the situation you were talking about.

16 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

that player was heavily relying on pond fish for foods.

...... That's already a massive lack of skills, ponds aren't good food sources in general unless you're doing cave only challenge, plus it'd be usable once the nitre is mined. In no way can this effect survival, don't tell me you can kill fuelweaver but never heard of  meatballs and pierogi(how to spell thid word again?)

16 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

Also Boss fighting skill is not = to world exploration skill.

You just mentioned earlier those bosses require exploration to find(and preparation is part of the fight too, the skills required there are useful in day-to-day survival gameplay as well):

16 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

Both these bosses are tucked away in an obscure corner of the map..

 

[CuteC]

23 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

I mean no offense when I say this but killing both Nightmare pig AND FuelWeaver would require next to no skill. Both these bosses are tucked away in an obscure corner of the map.. and they’re ONLY ever summoned when you’re ready to fight them. Same can be said for Toadstool, Bee Queen, Crab King, Celestial Champion etc etc..

I am sorry did you just say deerclops takes more skill than toadstool?

[Mike23Ua]

2 minutes ago, _zwb said:

That's just the issue with activating rifts, it doesn't need to be agreed by all players on server, you do have a point though.

These optional content requires skills for resource management, kiting mobs properly, exploring the world to find them in the first place and inventory management. Safe to say that once you've beaten fuelweaver you'd be skillful enough to prepare some emergency items on you so you don't get into the situation you were talking about.

...... That's already a massive lack of skills, ponds aren't good food sources in general unless you're doing cave only challenge, plus it'd be usable once the nitre is mined. In no way can this effect survival, don't tell me you can kill fuelweaver but never heard of  meatballs and pierogi(how to spell thid word again?)

You just mentioned earlier those bosses require exploration to find(and preparation is part of the fight too, the skills required there are useful in day-to-day survival gameplay as well):

 

Sigh.. let me put it this way then, a brand new never watched DST streams never looked anything up on Wikipedia completely fresh player to the game decides to pick Willow, maybe they just like her looks or her cute bear she spawns in with.

Anyway… this new player is walking around exploring and learning the game when they inspect something called a “Giant Beehive” and Willows Quote literally dares the player to take a hammer to it.

This player just learned 3 things-

#1 Willow is Evil & considered by many a troll. (Joke)

#2 Giant Beehive gives free (?) Honey when hammered.

#3 OMFG What is that?!!? *Dead* GGWP.

Meanwhile… this same complete noob to the game could use a Pickaxe to bust open a cave hole and then easily waltz right into the Lunar Grotto to encounter new mobs and content without the embarrassingly fast above mentioned death.

To me Brightshades pose more of a survival threat than “insert optional boss here”

Why? Because Brightshades infest the Overworld taking over areas and wiping mobs (like Beefalo) into complete extinction.

3 minutes ago, CuteC said:

I am sorry did you just say deerclops takes more skill than toadstool?

No.. and don’t put words into my mouth,

Navigating the five chapters of solo DS’s adventures mode and successfully rescuing Maxwell would = more skill than Toadstool.

Unlocking Wilba in Hamlet & Woodlegs in Shipwrecked would = More skill than Toadstool.

[CuteC]

3 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

No.. and don’t put words into my mouth,

Navigating the five chapters of solo DS’s adventures mode and successfully rescuing Maxwell would = more skill than Toadstool.

Unlocking Wilba in Hamlet & Woodlegs in Shipwrecked would = More skill than Toadstool.

Saying the "optional bosses" take no skill because they don't "directly confront the player" implies deerclops is in a higher level of skill because she does walk right up to you.

Doing story mode in ds requires you to find the things like 4 or 5 times with only one having higher difficulty although not that much if you know how to deal with darkness, toadstool can still beat you up even with preparation.

[Uedo]

1 hour ago, Mike23Ua said:

It’s actually heavily situational, and maybe I’m just highly unlucky but have you just NOT ever had Boulders fall and block the exit to a cave you were attempting to escape from when a horde of depth worms were coming?

My point is that falling boulders actually DO Impact survival skills, maybe not for you if your an expert at the game or whatever.. but when paths get blocked off when I wanted to make a quick exit and I have to instead either face what’s trying to attack me or quickly mine away enough boulders to still escape- that = Survival content.

And if your TOO GOOD at the game (like most of you are and just won’t admit..) you’ll never see this side of the spectrum.

You could use another exit. 

12 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

Sigh.. let me put it this way then, a brand new never watched DST streams never looked anything up on Wikipedia completely fresh player to the game decides to pick Willow, maybe they just like her looks or her cute bear she spawns in with.

Anyway… this new player is walking around exploring and learning the game when they inspect something called a “Giant Beehive” and Willows Quote literally dares the player to take a hammer to it.

This player just learned 3 things-

#1 Willow is Evil & considered by many a troll. (Joke)

#2 Giant Beehive gives free (?) Honey when hammered.

#3 OMFG What is that?!!? *Dead* GGWP.

Meanwhile… this same complete noob to the game could use a Pickaxe to bust open a cave hole and then easily waltz right into the Lunar Grotto to encounter new mobs and content without the embarrassingly fast above mentioned death.

To me Brightshades pose more of a survival threat than “insert optional boss here”

Why? Because Brightshades infest the Overworld taking over areas and wiping mobs (like Beefalo) into complete extinction.

No.. and don’t put words into my mouth,

Navigating the five chapters of solo DS’s adventures mode and successfully rescuing Maxwell would = more skill than Toadstool.

Unlocking Wilba in Hamlet & Woodlegs in Shipwrecked would = More skill than Toadstool.

If you're struggling Mike, there's a lot of guides online and the wiki can always help on issues you feel confused about. 

How do you beat Fuelweaver dude? Genuinely curious cause doing it solo IS really tedious. I void walk :O

[Green Crystal]

1 hour ago, Mike23Ua said:

I mean no offense when I say this but killing both Nightmare pig AND FuelWeaver would require next to no skill.

1 hour ago, Mike23Ua said:

This type of completely OPTIONAL content is in no way shape or form comparable to content that directly confronts the player as an obstacle.

1 hour ago, Mike23Ua said:

You tend to think this content is locked behind a certain skill threshold when it’s not.

This guy is too cool for this game, it's incomprehensible

 

 

[Mike23Ua]

52 minutes ago, Uedo said:

You could use another exit. 

If you're struggling Mike, there's a lot of guides online and the wiki can always help on issues you feel confused about. 

How do you beat Fuelweaver dude? Genuinely curious cause doing it solo IS really tedious. I void walk :O

Solo? Never.. lol, with 2 other people in the game for a Wendy+Wolfgang+Wigfrid/Wanda it’s actually pretty easy.

The game is intentionally designed this way though. Wendy’s petal Debuff boosts damage of team mates, Wolfgang’s already dishing 2x damage, Wanda can rewind players deaths like they never happened.

even just crafting Warly food dishes and switching to Wolfgang (for solo) would be far far better than attempting to fight them solo the legit way without character switch or exploits.

Ive only ever killed FW or CC in a group of 3 so if your doing it Solo.. more power to ya.

[_zwb]

3 hours ago, Mike23Ua said:

3 hours ago, _zwb said:

 

Sigh.. let me put it this way then, a brand new never watched DST streams never looked anything up on Wikipedia completely fresh player to the game decides to pick Willow, maybe they just like her looks or her cute bear she spawns in with.

Anyway… this new player is walking around exploring and learning the game when they inspect something called a “Giant Beehive” and Willows Quote literally dares the player to take a hammer to it.

This player just learned 3 things-

#1 Willow is Evil & considered by many a troll. (Joke)

#2 Giant Beehive gives free (?) Honey when hammered.

#3 OMFG What is that?!!? *Dead* GGWP.

Meanwhile… this same complete noob to the game could use a Pickaxe to bust open a cave hole and then easily waltz right into the Lunar Grotto to encounter new mobs and content without the embarrassingly fast above mentioned death.

I don't understand what you are trying to say here. Care to elaborate more?

3 hours ago, Mike23Ua said:

To me Brightshades pose more of a survival threat than “insert optional boss here”

1. I wasn't talking about rift content posing survival challenges, I was saying boss fights requires skills that are also helpful in survival gameplay, so defeating boss on your own roughly equals to being skillful enough for survival(of course there'll be different knowledge required for survival).

2. They aren't threatening survival because:

3 hours ago, Mike23Ua said:

Because Brightshades infest the Overworld taking over areas

Which by then you definitely don't have a base set up already, safe from any deadly brightshades shenanigans. They don't even come to you unless you plant things on the surface, I suppose random brightshades in the wild can be annoying, but they're so easily to be dealt with because of how spread out wild plants(and hence the brightshades) are.

3 hours ago, Mike23Ua said:

wiping mobs (like Beefalo) into complete extinction.

I think only beefalos can go extinct here? Doesn't matter though, it's also not threatening survival.

1. There are plenty other food sources, I never rely on wild animals like beefalos.

2. You can simply clear out a plantless field for your beefalos etc.

Brightshade appears to be more inconvenient than threatening, doesn't it?

[Uedo]

1 hour ago, Mike23Ua said:

Solo? Never.. lol, with 2 other people in the game for a Wendy+Wolfgang+Wigfrid/Wanda it’s actually pretty easy.

The game is intentionally designed this way though. Wendy’s petal Debuff boosts damage of team mates, Wolfgang’s already dishing 2x damage, Wanda can rewind players deaths like they never happened.

even just crafting Warly food dishes and switching to Wolfgang (for solo) would be far far better than attempting to fight them solo the legit way without character switch or exploits.

Ive only ever killed FW or CC in a group of 3 so if your doing it Solo.. more power to ya.

That sounds sick tbh, I tried with rock lobsters and just kinda forgot how easily you can just kind of barricade FW in and not hit him XD. 

Don't give me credit  I use two gates and a lureplant haha

[00petar00]

9 hours ago, Mysterious box said:

I'm not forcing anything your upset with players having the option to decide. Your saying that this form of survival content shouldn't be allowed as not to offend your idealized playstyle and this is because you can't control what content people who join your server want to engage with you lack the ability to control them so instead you ask for options that disobey what you want to taken away that is peak selfishness. We have the choice to engage with the endgame true different people can decide to advance the story but different people can build bases, kill bosses, and various other things that might influence how you interact with the world it's something you have to accept in a online multiplayer game everyone has a choice.

So the last update took over 2 months and we had like 2 other rift updates if I remember correctly, its literally nearing 6 months of development time and the rifts on surface and in caves don't even look half complete. That means that we will have 1 year+ of content that you are telling me that I can just not turn on? Do you realize how terrible that sounds? Also you don't even have a choice as an individual but have to talk with everyone playing on the server and I think if anyone wants to turn rifts on it should be done because we are all missing out on a lot of content.

Can you just stop going in circles and tell me that you believe I and everyone else that doesn't want brightshades and hail killing mobs that we should just ignore a year + of content releases?

9 hours ago, Mysterious box said:

No one is forcing you to play with people who want to go into the endgame If you hate survival content so much then just go play on super godmode and turn off all mechanics that can cause destruction.

The point is that everyone has a different view on what should be done in the game and you shouldn't be forced to play with a specific small group of players that don't want the rifts activated as more content gets released you will have less of an argument to stand on if you don't want to activate them.

You are literally saying that I shouldn't be playing multiplayer game as it is intended and specifically choose from a small group of players that don't want to progress and miss out on so much.

9 hours ago, Mysterious box said:

What you seem to want is just boss fights or random biomes placed somewhere far out with no real impact on how we play the game that's not difficulty nor survival and even then it's not like survival content has to be headsmashingly hard to offer challenge or a interesting dynamic.

There is nothing wrong with that and there is real impact as you have to explore the map and you will run into challenges. The difference is that I don't want anything to be forced onto the player.

9 hours ago, Mysterious box said:

And everyone does however if you play in a group you have to accept that EVERYONE has a say in how to experience the game not just you not just me if you don't like the decision players on the server reached become the boss of that server and lay down your own law. You know when people lose their freedom however? When people like you put limits on what content we're allowed to have your not trying to be fair your trying to take away choice while saying see now everyone's happy.

Majority of the people that I know don't like chores and we can literally make another thread on the forums with a poll to see so that you don't think that this are numbers that Im just pulling out of nowhere. You are the one that wants to remove freedom from players that want to experience the new content without being punished for it and it will rifts spilit the players and cause arguments since not everyone wants them on.

9 hours ago, Mysterious box said:

That's fine but if your so keen on going about it by making inaccurate accusations about people disregarding fact or reason don't blame me if I do the same. Maybe I should go on about how you hate anyone who doesn't megabase and how you feel anyone looking for survival content only makes fire pits with default skins for the Raw survival hardcore uncompromising experience sounds silly right? So maybe debate the topic without doing that eh? If you've got to pull up old conversations you don't remember clearly to support your argument it just makes it seem faulty.

For some reason you are so defensive about something that doesn't matter at all, it was my mistake that I misremembered something and it didn't make my argument any stronger.

9 hours ago, Mysterious box said:

Wow I didn't know you personally knew every survival player and questioned them to come up with this arbitrary ruleset for how long people who play for survival content will play the game. Truely your dedication knows no bounds because clearly you wouldn't be basing this off of your own assumptions and biases of how people play the game right? Right?

Maybe because I have literally thousands of hours played that I know and have survival only friends and know how they play? What can you actually tell me about your survival loop that make dreadstone pillars worth building and how often do you quit the game before ever repairing a rock pillar?

It doesn't affect you much at all either way, lets just say hypothetically you as a survival player spend 1000+ days without building a massive base and only use one dreadstone pillar. The time and inconvenience you saved from using dreadstone over rock is so negligent compared to someone that has 20+ of these and as a survival player I don't believe you will ever have a significant number for it to matter.

10 hours ago, Mysterious box said:

If the mobs don't die from it why does it matter? You keep your pet I keep my emersion we all win no? Or is there some hidden consequence I'm unaware of?

So we agree now that hail doesn't need to kill everything on screen? Hail would be fine if it only dealt damage to player but there are still issues like you needing to activate cave rifts first to get umbralla. I thought that we were given a choice and some players may want to roleplay and only activate rifts on one side.

10 hours ago, Mysterious box said:

Simply make it so if they're unloaded when it's night time the game treats them as sleeping. Heck we could even add a mechanic where if a mob is below a certain hp threshold and not aggroed they'll sleep until they feel better regardless of time of day I'm sure that could lead to some interesting and creative new strategies no?

How much of a performance impact will that have when it is much easier to add passive regen? Doesn't seem to be worth doing. Whole map can't be loaded and every mob would need to be checked every night.

10 hours ago, Mysterious box said:

The thing I take issue with is how often people try to bring up unrelated matters to these discussions and by unrelated matters I mean things said in the past or assumptions about each other's character now it's very clear what these sorts of arguments aim to do and it's to discredit the person they're arguing against to completely write off their opinion and when successful it's often used as a weapon against other people to shutdown discussions they have of a similar nature and I'm sure we've all seen examples of this elsewhere. Heck I'm not saying I'm above this either it's hard not to get sucked into the rabbit hole though I am bringing this up because I do find it annoying and kinda hope we all can stop doing this.

What have I brought up that was completely unrelated to the discussion? We have gone a bit off topic if you can even say that as we were discussing rifts that hail is a part of.

If you are still going on about what I said about you with dreadstone pillars it was a simple mistake and it didn't make my argument any better in this situation with hail. It literally doesn't matter and you corrected me so why do you need go on about it? Do you think everyone has a perfect memory and is infallible? Can we just move on from this?

It is obvious that we are going to use past discussions to remember or bring them up in the future, is there a reason this shouldn't be done? For example there are players that think meteors should happen all over the map, this is an extreme opinion that probably only a handful of people have and everyone that says this shouldn't be taken seriously in any future debates unless they change their opinion.

[cropo]

9 hours ago, xhyom said:

I'm being ironic about how people find it the hardest thing in the world to disable toggleable options in a menu when creating their server and are being dramatic for being "forced" to do that (Even though they actually have been doing that for AGES as wildfires exists and always have been disabled and no one died doing that) while the option for those who liked the update if it was crippled or removed after release would really just be to create a mod to bring it back, which isn't easy, unlike clicking on an ingame option... Or worse as that update could possibly never even existed and creating a mod for something completely new is even harder.

 

You corrected yourself but I'll keep it that way anyway since the point still stands lol

if there was a toggle to make it ''happen, but not hurt mobs'' rather than just ''Don't like one part of it, toggle it off, you have options!'' I don't think we'd really be having this heated of a discussion about these mechanics.

 

Before ''toggle it off'' can be a valid rebuttal, we need more complex toggle degrees to be added for certain mechanics.  Most people are fine with the idea of lunar rain from a survival standpoint, the side-effect of it having the potential to ruin animal pens is what's being argued here, not the entire mechanic and idea itself.

 

Until then, arguments about the specific fine-tuning of a mechanic are going to continue.

[Mysterious box]

6 hours ago, 00petar00 said:

So the last update took over 2 months and we had like 2 other rift updates if I remember correctly, its literally nearing 6 months of development time and the rifts on surface and in caves don't even look half complete. That means that we will have 1 year+ of content that you are telling me that I can just not turn on? Do you realize how terrible that sounds? Also you don't even have a choice as an individual but have to talk with everyone playing on the server and I think if anyone wants to turn rifts on it should be done because we are all missing out on a lot of content.

Can you just stop going in circles and tell me that you believe I and everyone else that doesn't want brightshades and hail killing mobs that we should just ignore a year + of content releases?

So losing out on content for several months is unacceptable but losing out on content concepts forever is? Because no matter how you sugar coat it what I'm reading is it's wrong to deprive people like you of your experiences but it's entirely fine to deprive people like me for your sake. Yours is the golden standard by which content is allowed choices be damned because it has the potential to inconvenience you it shouldn't exist and honestly that's not fair.

6 hours ago, 00petar00 said:

The point is that everyone has a different view on what should be done in the game and you shouldn't be forced to play with a specific small group of players that don't want the rifts activated as more content gets released you will have less of an argument to stand on if you don't want to activate them.

You are literally saying that I shouldn't be playing multiplayer game as it is intended and specifically choose from a small group of players that don't want to progress and miss out on so much.

I'm telling you that if you can't accept what random players decide to do in a world then you should make your own. I'm not saying you have to but if you don't you need to accept what happens it's litterally the same advice we give about griefers. It's simple accept the content or don't or alter future settings of whatever the future new content brings to keep a ideal level of impact. It's not like we're going to fight to keep any destructive mechanic regardless of how it's implemented we were on the same page about how the rifts shouldn't have been able to spawn on bases or destroy terrain no?

6 hours ago, 00petar00 said:

Majority of the people that I know don't like chores and we can literally make another thread on the forums with a poll to see so that you don't think that this are numbers that Im just pulling out of nowhere. You are the one that wants to remove freedom from players that want to experience the new content without being punished for it and it will rifts spilit the players and cause arguments since not everyone wants them on.

Coulda sworn there was a poll a while back asking if people wanted new harsher seasons, or bosses, and some other options and people most choose the seasons here. You keep calling survival content as chores but base building is chore heck the very act of playing dst somewhat regularly could be considered a chore depending on who you ask.

6 hours ago, 00petar00 said:

For some reason you are so defensive about something that doesn't matter at all, it was my mistake that I misremembered something and it didn't make my argument any stronger.

I'm not being defensive I'm asking you to fact check yourself before you declare things about other people? Is it that hard to comprehend? But no we'll just have this same conversation as we do every beta where we're at odds where you'll bring up misinformation as per norm and I'll try to correct you. But you could cut out the middleman and just not make claims you don't fully remember or better yet focus on the topic at hand?

6 hours ago, 00petar00 said:

Maybe because I have literally thousands of hours played that I know and have survival only friends and know how they play?

I also have thousands of hours and it sounds like what you are describing is speed runners what is the benefit for a person playing the game around survival to constantly reset the world? How are you surviving if you abandon the world each time you hit a predetermined day count? Do you suddenly scrap your world the moment you finish your megabase? If your only playing in a world for a short amount of time like that it seems more likely the goal is just to kill all the bosses or something.

6 hours ago, 00petar00 said:

Hail would be fine if it only dealt damage to player but there are still issues like you needing to activate cave rifts first to get umbralla.

While we currently don't have one I imagine we're going to get a lunar equivalent also I think the eyebrella stops this as well I can't really remember though.

6 hours ago, 00petar00 said:

How much of a performance impact will that have when it is much easier to add passive regen? Doesn't seem to be worth doing. Whole map can't be loaded and every mob would need to be checked every night.

I'm no expert on programming but I feel like it shouldn't cause any performance issues. If it's night/time they should be asleep their hp starts regenerating they shouldn't have to load in for that right? Take merms for example the game is constantly regenerating their hp when it's below max right? Does it have to load them in to do that?

7 hours ago, 00petar00 said:

What have I brought up that was completely unrelated to the discussion? We have gone a bit off topic if you can even say that as we were discussing rifts that hail is a part of.

If you are still going on about what I said about you with dreadstone pillars it was a simple mistake and it didn't make my argument any better in this situation with hail. It literally doesn't matter and you corrected me so why do you need go on about it? Do you think everyone has a perfect memory and is infallible? Can we just move on from this?

It is obvious that we are going to use past discussions to remember or bring them up in the future, is there a reason this shouldn't be done? For example there are players that think meteors should happen all over the map, this is an extreme opinion that probably only a handful of people have and everyone that says this shouldn't be taken seriously in any future debates unless they change their opinion.

Because it wasn't the first and won't be the last and second that wasn't just aimed at you but the forums in general I said as much there already it's why I gave it more spacing.

7 hours ago, 00petar00 said:

this is an extreme opinion that probably only a handful of people have and everyone that says this shouldn't be taken seriously in any future debates unless they change their opinion.

So in other words I was right the only reason to bring this up is to invalidate the opinion of the person your debating rather than actually addressing the topic at hand how do you not see a problem with this??? How do you see this as staying on topic??? I know which person your talking about and this is the very reason I have a problem with this and why I'm not letting this go you want to bully people out of the discussions by making their previous and potientally current opinions a point of ridicule that is not how you make a proper discussion unless your trying to become a politician. And no your not the only one who does this which is why I made the previous statement at the end of my last post. The fact so much of our posts are dedicated to taking pot shots and accusations rather than the mechanic at hand should speak for itself. Heck half the time people arguing on here don't even know what stance the person they're arguing with has on a topic. But somehow digging up the past to invalid/mock people is somehow contributing to a healthy discussion? I think not.

[Mike23Ua]

7 hours ago, cropo said:

if there was a toggle to make it ''happen, but not hurt mobs'' rather than just ''Don't like one part of it, toggle it off, you have options!'' I don't think we'd really be having this heated of a discussion about these mechanics.

 

Before ''toggle it off'' can be a valid rebuttal, we need more complex toggle degrees to be added for certain mechanics.  Most people are fine with the idea of lunar rain from a survival standpoint, the side-effect of it having the potential to ruin animal pens is what's being argued here, not the entire mechanic and idea itself.

 

Until then, arguments about the specific fine-tuning of a mechanic are going to continue.

From my point of view the mobs of DST offer the player resources (grass geckos grass, Beefalo Wool & fertilizer, Koalephant Food & Puffy Coat, etc)

So when Klei adds a new type of lunar rain that damages and (eventually) kills those things. To ME that is survival content, I now have to find other methods to get my grass, Wool, Fertilzers, etc.. Or I have to learn to survive the games newer threats (that’ll continue to be added as updates release) without access to those previous features/creatures/resources.

For the SANDBOX I want pretty pet den people, they’ll want nerfs to this new mechanic or shelters to protect their animals from taking damage…

But at that point- what is even the purpose of having the game mechanic in the game in the first place?

To be something you’ll deal with ONCE and the craft permanent solutions to?? How does that make dst a survival game?

In contrast when I built a base in Ark, every single day I logged into the game I needed to probably leave my base and go gather resources to repair the walls that were damaged by wild raptors trying to get in and eat my tames.

I had to actually REBUILD & REPAIR something in a survival game.

And if I can add more rocks to a broken wall to partially repair it in DST… then Klei obviously intended for us to be able to rebuild or repair broken/breaking objects or structures.

When mobs don’t get damaged by the new weather, when Brightshades Ignore targeting nearby mobs… that’s when DST stops being a survival game and caters entirely to the builders sandbox.

I actually wouldn’t mind pens to shelter your pets from hail- As long as those pens needed to be repaired every so often.

Some people would find that however to be a “chore” and instead beg Klei to just make the mobs of the constant immune to hail damage.

[cropo]

32 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

So when Klei adds a new type of lunar rain that damages and (eventually) kills those things. To ME that is survival content, I now have to find other methods to get my grass, Wool, Fertilzers, etc.. Or I have to learn to survive the games newer threats (that’ll continue to be added as updates release) without access to those previous features/creatures/resources.

It won't do this, it will only kill penned up critters, it won't hinder actively hunting and gathering the materials you need. You're vastly overrating the effects of this weather. If a few critters dying near you is all it takes to suddenly find yourself at a loss on how to gather trivial and basic resources, then you have no right to even be participating in post-game content.

 

32 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

But at that point- what is even the purpose of having the game mechanic in the game in the first place?

To be something you’ll deal with ONCE and the craft permanent solutions to?? How does that make dst a survival game?

Having it not kill critters, but still be an active threat to the player, will still keep it as an additional hazard to various fights and other tasks the player would do. I don't think most people are against it actually being a threat to deal with, but having the core purpose of it's threat be to grief your base or your silly decorations just to force you to grind materials and spam repairing them all day is being argued as an uninspired and boring gameplay loop.

 

32 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

In contrast when I built a base in Ark, every single day I logged into the game I needed to probably leave my base and go gather resources to repair the walls that were damaged by wild raptors trying to get in and eat my tames.

I wouldn't really consider ARK a survival game, more of a base-building and gameplay progression pseudo RPG slash pokemon game. Games like Conan Exiles as well, they were built more with a big server base raid mentality like Rust where one of the primary focuses of the game is keeping constant upkeep of your base. Basic survival and food gathering take a massive back seat to the rest of the game.

 

32 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

When mobs don’t get damaged by the new weather, when Brightshades Ignore targeting nearby mobs… that’s when DST stops being a survival game and caters entirely to the builders sandbox.

So it basically changes from ''Don't Starve'' to ''Don't let critters die". They can't challenge the player directly, so they have to send threats that they can't control through any form of skill or mastery for ''difficulty''.  We've really come full circle, I don't think the game has a future with this train of logic.

 

Really really seems like you guys want base-management simulators.

[abrocator]

17 hours ago, Mysterious box said:

So we just ignore that even the devs said they want to implement new seasons of sorts and survival content in favor of content most people will visit once or twice and never again that has little to no impact on how they play?

Two words: The Ruins.

They have already made a place which you have a reason to visit more than once. And which is more challenging.

As to why the devs kept making raid-and-leave-forever biomes: You would have to ask them.

18 hours ago, xhyom said:

Has this interaction ever happened:

You're asking if someone has complained that the Beta is so bad that they would rather it not exist at all rather than for the devs to change it closer to their own preference? Not that I recall. I could be wrong though.