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What are your initial impressions of the wilson rework?


What are your initial impressions of the wilson rework?  

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  1. 1. What are your initial impressions of the wilson rework?

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My initial impressions of the wilson rework is that it's nifty but not very exciting.

With the new skill tree, you can make a torch last longer, brighter or the ability to throw it but most people never use torches after they get a lantern. The beard skills are cool too but not very exciting at all. You can grow your beard faster and it will provide more warmth and you can store 3 foods in it. I just find these pretty dull changes.

The useful thing about this rework is definitely the alchemy that wilson can do. you can make opals out of every gem to skip going to ruins and full moon quest which may be a good or bad change depending on what kind of style you like playing. You can make flint out of 3 rocks which is the craft that will probably be used the most because flint is hard to find late game (they should make one for nitre because that is hard to come by late game also)

The boss is a giant werepig with basic attacks and not a very exciting fight at all with very mediocre loot. A new armor that is just a night armor with more durability.

 

Overall the rework just feels very underwhelming to me. Maybe I should manage my expectations more when it comes to reworks which hopefully this is the last rework like they said. I feel like DST has been missing some new content for a looong time.

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38 minutes ago, nimzowitsch10 said:

With the new skill tree, you can make a torch last longer, brighter or the ability to throw it but most people never use torches after they get a lantern.

I'm not sure how many people are going to actually use it but when fully upgraded it feels like it makes the torch a upgrade to the lantern in my opinion as it more or less gives you similar benefits but with non perishable fuel.

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I don't care about Wilson (mainly because I just don't get the changes to him) but I really like the Werepig boss because the Moose has unique strengths against it, and it's viable to actually use him. Just disappointed that it requires ruins loot to even fight, kinda defeating the purpose of using Moose since you can just bring a thul crown and magi for better results. Oh well.

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2 hours ago, Mysterious box said:

I'm not sure how many people are going to actually use it but when fully upgraded it feels like it makes the torch a upgrade to the lantern in my opinion as it more or less gives you similar benefits but with non perishable fuel.

For me torch is worse because of chance of setting base on fire if I want to interact with Bookshelf or Portable Crock Pot (I know I won't be using them as Wilson, but for other stuff possibility exists).

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3 hours ago, Mysterious box said:

I'm not sure how many people are going to actually use it but when fully upgraded it feels like it makes the torch a upgrade to the lantern in my opinion as it more or less gives you similar benefits but with non perishable fuel.

Takes 3 slots + prevents you from doing anything except walk and set things on fire + litters low % torches everywhere + has a much longer craft animation instead of refuel animation + lantern skins are better than torch skins.

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47 minutes ago, Losparkeros said:

For me torch is worse because of chance of setting base on fire if I want to interact with Bookshelf or Portable Crock Pot (I know I won't be using them as Wilson, but for other stuff possibility exists).

I've always wished that potentially destructive actions (shovelling plants, hammering, and igniting) required Ctrl to be held in the same way that Ctrl needs to be held to attack non-hostile creatures. That way if you have a full inventory and a shovel equipped, you can still pick plants without having to drop the shovel, and more importantly, you can pick up the portable crockpot with a torch equipped.

 

15 minutes ago, Cheggf said:

Takes 3 slots + prevents you from doing anything except walk and set things on fire + litters low % torches everywhere

I'm not sure what you mean by torches taking 3 slots. Do you mean that torches have a very short duration so you're encouraged to carry multiple at once to avoid having to craft a new one every minute?

I haven't messed with it yet, but I believe the torch tossing allows you to place torches on the ground similarly to lanterns to allow you to perform other actions. I don't know if placed torches can spread fire; that could be another thing that makes lanterns better.

I'd definitely like to see a use for low durability torches, such as being able to combine them with other torches so you can make use of the tiny amount of durability left without sacrificing an extra slot, or using them as fuel in firepits so they don't just litter the floor.

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The more I look at the skill tree the more I dislike it. At first I was excited and loved it but as I keep testing and playing around with it the more I want really anything else. Alchemy seems neat but I feel they could implement this as a workstation similar to the Bookshelf that only Wilson can use. I don't even like the Alchemy transmutation stuffs, it feels like something the lore character Wilson would do but not something he mechanically should do. It's this weird duality that Wilson "should" be simple and accessible to everyone just starting out, but... idk. I suck at communication and have always struggled with it. The non Wilson refresh portion is really promising, but as far as our original beloved Wilson is concerned, it feels misplaced.

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not a fan of the rework.

The skill trees chosen are kinda weird except for the alchemy.

Having 6 points just for torches is kinda bad when it could be 1 or 2 points so there are space for other stuff. Or even how he crafts torches in general so it has a coop component rather than a passive ability that you have to develop. Throwing the torches feels out of the character but i guess he learned some tricks after that many time and help newbies that dont know about lanterns and miner hats 

The beard tree could be a passive thing instead of another bunch of points and the growing speed acceleration could have been a potion which fits wilson. I also dont see how getting inspiration makes your bear warmer or grow faster. Is funny that you can store food tho

im disappointed that he didnt got any chemical potion or new toy. The only "science" thing he got is having the philosopher's stone which needs ajustments and, why not, more variety. He could get chemicals to grow his beard, to produce fire and ice hound aoe effect, to help plants and wormwood growing, etc they can even be unlockeable via the skill tree. The transmutation makes him a default character that is good to get certain resources for mega basing so is a weird mix when there are funnier options for long terms worlds

being able to manipulate the new nightmere stuff could be useful in a future but right now and with the current boss drop and amount of recipes is basically ignorable

the boss looks dope and you can see how klei have improve at animating their sprites, eventually it could be used to build arround a cool setpiece when you wont farm more materials but the fight is very repetitive, drops a small ammount of materials, the armor set is very basic and not worth. If in future updates they add other ways of getting the armor materials you wont even repeat the fight.

I think that the set piece fits more in the caves because seeing that pillars with that monstruosity contrast a lot with the day light. In the caves would be more imposing and the caves really needs an incentive for exploration

Im disappointed that the armors have no special effects, maybe i was expecting more because we got original items with cool mechanics to make you think how to combine them like the CC crown, bone armor, BQ hat, terraria's bosses armor set, etc. Suddenly getting a night armor v2.0 and a thulecite crown v0.1 feels underwhelming and more when the fight requires you ruins gear (giving pick/axe and unique use  is cool) so you dont have any incentive to waste durability of thulecite gear to get a piece or two of a worse armor. I want it to be unique because what i like about ds and dst is that there are no RPG progression with the gear like in other sand boxes, i dont want a better night armor but an armor that makes me think in which scenarios i can get the most of their perks like bone armor or shield of terror

to say something positive i think that the way you free the werepig is really cool and i love needing to help him with the leeches. Also i like that is a boss that you can easily rush in the early days like EoT

edit. oh, and the boss should have an indicator for their healing

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51 minutes ago, Cheggf said:

Takes 3 slots + prevents you from doing anything except walk and set things on fire + litters low % torches everywhere + has a much longer craft animation instead of refuel animation + lantern skins are better than torch skins.

I mean you can throw the torch to do things aside from set things on fire and not really sure how it litters since the torches still burn while they're on the ground. The crafting animation can definitely be a deal breaker for some but the skin one is just preference.

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49 minutes ago, bjanmanjs said:

I'm not sure what you mean by torches taking 3 slots.

Torch + grass + twigs. Lantern is only 1 or 2 slots.

49 minutes ago, bjanmanjs said:

I believe the torch tossing allows you to place torches on the ground similarly to lanterns to allow you to perform other actions.

My bad. Remove that one from the list of downsides.

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I like the idea of the tree skill I like but the torch section seems pointless why I need to pump it when there is alchemy much more useful I would like to add something related to shadow wilson and alchemy some potions or personal science station if you remember wilson likes to do experiments on animals why not add his ability to improve pigs and hares with zels
they didn't add crafts that use hair but they did add making hair from bifalo hair for some reason. why would i need that when i have hair of my own?
conclusion - so far rework is very crude i hope they redo a lot of things

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1 hour ago, DimaH20 said:


they didn't add crafts that use hair but they did add making hair from bifalo hair for some reason. why would i need that when i have hair of my own?
conclusion - so far rework is very crude i hope they redo a lot of things

Because Wilson is still a poor source of beard hair.

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It's a bit disappointing, honestly. It doesn't feel up to par with the other reworks. I like the skill tree idea but the skills in question are so subpar it feels like it's not worth spending the time playing to get in the first place. I'm not sure what I'd have them be, but they're just... so boring?? The entire torch line I do not like at all. The beard line is fine, could be better but the torch line is so pointless. As for the alchemy line, it needs to be completely re-balanced, with equivalent returns or something, I don't know. I've seen some suggestions for the transmutations, so I trust others opinions to be better than mine on those.

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I'm not sure how to feel about the skill tree as a concept, at first it was really weird to see progression outside of a world, now I'm more or less indifferent, after all the player learning things is technically also progression, just not tracked by the game. Most people will max out the points very quickly (it only takes about 160 days from all worlds combined, and you can cheat to get it faster), so from then it will feel more like WX's plugin system where you choose a build that suits your playstyle the most.

That said, the skills themselves are very underwhelming. The torch ones feel like minor perks, like Willow's more efficient fueling, or several characters' faster cooking over a fire (how many players even remember about those perks, not to mention choose those characters for them?). And contrary to what others said, I don't think extending it to lanterns and miner hats will make a big difference, light bulbs are already so abundant that they rot before you use them all. Same with the beard perks, at best they will only be relevant during winter, 1 season out of 4, being an alternative to thermal stone meta. The beard inventory seems an ok perk on the surface, but it can't be used in summer (as you would have issues with overheating). Also the idea of storing food in the beard is weird, seems entirely based on a joke and out of place. Now the alchemy perks... they can be useful as an alternative way to get some resources and counter rng, but they don't bring anything new to the game, not even a crafting station where you would perform those crafts. The shadow alchemy tree doesn't seem to do a lot for now, as the new resources are only used in 2 recipies, maybe it will become more relevant with future updates. Overall, I don't see anything fun in the new Wilson, it's all just quality of life perks and no new mechanics. I expected him to get something like potions or gadgets with interesting effects, but I guess him being the last character to be reworked means there are very little things that have not been given to someone else already. I hope they make him more fun to play before release, it would be a shame if he stayed like this, being the main character of the series.

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I don't think it was a good idea to give him a skill tree. Now most people expect every character to have something similar. I just don't think it fits the game.

The new boss seems dope, the new armor is not bad (I expected the new armor set to have something special but now that I see they're not that difficult to get; it's fine as it is)

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3 hours ago, ThymeSpirit said:

The beard inventory seems an ok perk on the surface, but it can't be used in summer (as you would have issues with overheating).

as far as i know winter isolation only works to keep your temperature high for longer so it doesnt affect you to cool down or to keep your cool

i might be wrong

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19 hours ago, nimzowitsch10 said:

My initial impressions of the wilson rework is that it's nifty but not very exciting.

With the new skill tree, you can make a torch last longer, brighter or the ability to throw it but most people never use torches after they get a lantern. The beard skills are cool too but not very exciting at all. You can grow your beard faster and it will provide more warmth and you can store 3 foods in it. I just find these pretty dull changes.

The useful thing about this rework is definitely the alchemy that wilson can do. you can make opals out of every gem to skip going to ruins and full moon quest which may be a good or bad change depending on what kind of style you like playing. You can make flint out of 3 rocks which is the craft that will probably be used the most because flint is hard to find late game (they should make one for nitre because that is hard to come by late game also)

The boss is a giant werepig with basic attacks and not a very exciting fight at all with very mediocre loot. A new armor that is just a night armor with more durability.

 

Overall the rework just feels very underwhelming to me. Maybe I should manage my expectations more when it comes to reworks which hopefully this is the last rework like they said. I feel like DST has been missing some new content for a looong time.

Yea but the torch throw ability is like a lantern you can throw a torch on the ground and mine a rock or throw 2 or 3 torches on the ground and fight some pigs at night and with the other torch upgrades it makes the torch a lantern but a tiny bit worse but it so cheap it's amazing just throw a torch on the ground or 2 or 3 and you now can fight a hole tree garden or some pigs at night

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51 minutes ago, ArubaroBeefalo said:

as far as i know winter isolation only works to keep your temperature high for longer so it doesnt affect you to cool down or to keep your cool

i might be wrong

I'm pretty sure the beards are different in that from clothing, so they affect you in summer as well, but I can't find the source of that information now.

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21 hours ago, ThymeSpirit said:

I'm pretty sure the beards are different in that from clothing, so they affect you in summer as well, but I can't find the source of that information now.

Lines 248-252 of components/temperature.lua:

    if self.inst.components.beard ~= nil then
        --Beards help winterInsulation but hurt summerInsulation
        winterInsulation = winterInsulation + self.inst.components.beard:GetInsulation()
        summerInsulation = summerInsulation - self.inst.components.beard:GetInsulation()
    end

So if you have an eyebrella (240), a floral shirt (240), and an umbrella (120), you'd normally have 600 summer insulation, but with Wilson's stage 3 beard (-135), you only have 465.

Line 264 prevents you from having negative insulation (math.max takes the highest value, so if summerInsulation would be lower than 0, it'll instead be exactly 0.), so having a beard will never make you heat up faster than the 1 temperature unit per second that you do without any summer insulation.

    return math.max(0, winterInsulation), math.max(0, summerInsulation)

That said however, you can use a thermal stone or ice bream without penalty since they work by cooling you rather than by increasing your summer insulation.

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