NoodlemanNed Posted October 3, 2022 Share Posted October 3, 2022 The new relaxed preset is pretty cool to see honestly. Personally that wont impact me much but allowing the game to be more friendly to newcomers is a nice thing to see. However, I do think that now that we have something for the newest players, there could also be something for the oldest players. Yeah theres lights out and wilderness as "hard modes" but with the new ideas introduced in easy mode, it would be interesting to see them flipped for a new hardest gamemode. Instead of reduced damage from all sources, maybe it would be increased. Instead of disabling wildfires you could make the more destructive. These 2 ideas would make players generally feel less safe and require them to adapt far more often, and hopefully other people can pitch in ideas to make the game even less fair for those who are truly up for it. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/143501-time-for-hardmode/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scrimbles Posted October 3, 2022 Share Posted October 3, 2022 People have been asking for difficulty for YEARS and instead they deliver an easy mode. Nice try but they don't care. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/143501-time-for-hardmode/#findComment-1600298 Share on other sites More sharing options...
HowlVoid Posted October 3, 2022 Share Posted October 3, 2022 Personally I'd like to see more drastic changes than just stat changes. Like, peaceful creatures attacking the player when insane, wet food being permanently altered to a soggy variant, etc for a hard mode. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/143501-time-for-hardmode/#findComment-1600303 Share on other sites More sharing options...
. . . Posted October 3, 2022 Share Posted October 3, 2022 Got a casual mode before hard mode.. :/ I don't think hard mode ever gonna come now and probably nothing difficult is gonna be added into the game anymore since all the stuff just seems to focus on making game easier and easier Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/143501-time-for-hardmode/#findComment-1600304 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike23Ua Posted October 3, 2022 Share Posted October 3, 2022 20 minutes ago, HowlVoid said: Personally I'd like to see more drastic changes than just stat changes. Like, peaceful creatures attacking the player when insane, wet food being permanently altered to a soggy variant, etc for a hard mode. This.. exactly this, Klei’s Animated shorts where pigs/rabbits actually invade and raid your gardens is far far more interesting then some stat changes. Unfortunately I feel like we aren’t ever going to get anything cool like that & the game will continue to become casualized. I hope I’m wrong.. but at this point: I’ve lost a lot of my hope too. A long time ago (around when disease was removed) They teased that if they brought it back they’d rework it to be more destructive, a Disease 2.0 if you will.. I pictured something like- Rabbies Bunnies getting into your Crops and Infecting your food/forest trees etc.. basically: It would explain how the poisonous Gas Mask biome from the Hamlet DLC became so Hazardous by neglecting to keep it healthy and maintained. I won’t hold my breath on Disease 2.0 ever being added though.. because making the game more casual = more players. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/143501-time-for-hardmode/#findComment-1600327 Share on other sites More sharing options...
YouKnowWho Posted October 3, 2022 Share Posted October 3, 2022 We kind of had one already with that Forest Plus preset, but it's hasn't been updated through the years. It'd be nice if they took another look at it. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/143501-time-for-hardmode/#findComment-1600371 Share on other sites More sharing options...
loopuleasa Posted October 3, 2022 Share Posted October 3, 2022 Give it time guys, there is a lot more to be added. The celestian champion content we got was great hard content. Making the game hard artifically is not as fun as making the game hard with new content. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/143501-time-for-hardmode/#findComment-1600373 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sanitar Posted October 3, 2022 Share Posted October 3, 2022 7 minutes ago, loopuleasa said: Give it time guys, there is a lot more to be added. The celestian champion content we got was great hard content. Making the game hard artifically is not as fun as making the game hard with new content. Raid bosses do not complicate the game, but simply turn it into an MMORPG Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/143501-time-for-hardmode/#findComment-1600379 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mysterious box Posted October 3, 2022 Share Posted October 3, 2022 42 minutes ago, loopuleasa said: Give it time guys, there is a lot more to be added. The celestian champion content we got was great hard content. Making the game hard artifically is not as fun as making the game hard with new content. Problem being that it's optional content locked behind a huge grind my problem is what I've been saying for awhile with the direction content is going I can't see the world ever becoming more than a wasteland with small sprinkles of things to interact with and some bosses the all areas of the game are mostly empty space mobs are scarce and most are friendly or neutral and the ocean is more or less a safe haven you visit when you need a break from waves and such personally I don't have hope that the world is going to fill out more than it is for fear of scaring new players away but I'd love to be proven wrong... Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/143501-time-for-hardmode/#findComment-1600403 Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxwell_winters Posted October 3, 2022 Share Posted October 3, 2022 Hard mode would require longer time to balance compared to relaxed mode which is basically just nerfing everything. I wish Klei had taken this year to add more basic enemies (snakes and whatnot) and raid types (that pig raid from WX short seemed like an interesting idea) and then continued with optional quest lines in 2023. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/143501-time-for-hardmode/#findComment-1600410 Share on other sites More sharing options...
sudoku Posted October 3, 2022 Share Posted October 3, 2022 Hardmode would be cool, but the crux of the issue is not the difficulty of new content but that there should be more gameplay centered on survival. These 2 things are seperate issues, survival content doesnt mean hard content - it means more gameplay revolving around dealing with threats that thrown at the player forcing them to adapt. One of the biggest problems with this community is that survival gameplay is lumped in with talk about difficulty or a hardmode. Overcoming survival challenges is a major gameplay pillar in a survival game and has been on the backburner for too long when it comes to DST. If you enjoy managing your hunger/health/sanity meter, the time of day in which attempt activities/your temperature or wetness or preparing for a deerclops attack then you are a fan of survival gameplay and should be asking klei for more of it since we havent really seen any additions to this area of the game since OG Reign of Giants Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/143501-time-for-hardmode/#findComment-1600416 Share on other sites More sharing options...
abrocator Posted October 3, 2022 Share Posted October 3, 2022 What would anyone gain with a Hard Mode? Two hours into the update the most vocal veterans would just be trying to out-nonchalant each other about how ez the new Hard Mode is. Just like the median discourse on this forum. (Why would you have a problem with doing X when you have Y? Why would you struggle with food/freezing/overheating when you have carrots/thermal stone/thermal stone? Why is being a vegetarian a problem when you have stone fruits? Why are you struggling with a 20 hound wave when you can just build more tooth traps? Why is five lazer+ice trap Deerclops per winter a problem for you when you can just heal from those eyeballs that they drop? Why is 50,000 HP Antlion (Hard Mode) a problem when you can just switch to Wolfgang? Why is 25HP Maxwell is a problem when you can just kite attacks? Why is the new random land pirate raids that attack you right in the middle of a boss fight a problem when you can just either use a pan flute or telelocate them? Why is the new ink attack that disables your mouse and WASD a problem when SPACE and F still work? Why is your screen being broken a problem when the game is full of audio cues?) Leave it to mods. People are going to complain about vanilla DST being too easy no matter what. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/143501-time-for-hardmode/#findComment-1600420 Share on other sites More sharing options...
-Variant Posted October 3, 2022 Share Posted October 3, 2022 Personally now that there is an easy mode I hope they turn around and start introducing more difficult mechanics in the up coming updates. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/143501-time-for-hardmode/#findComment-1600430 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mysterious box Posted October 3, 2022 Share Posted October 3, 2022 12 minutes ago, abrocator said: What would anyone gain with a Hard Mode? Two hours into the update the most vocal veterans would just be trying to out-nonchalant each other about how ez the new Hard Mode is. Just like the median discourse on this forum. (Why would you have a problem with doing X when you have Y? Why would you struggle with food/freezing/overheating when you have carrots/thermal stone/thermal stone? Why is being a vegetarian a problem when you have stone fruits? Why are you struggling with a 20 hound wave when you can just build more tooth traps? Why is five lazer+ice trap Deerclops per winter a problem for you when you can just heal from those eyeballs that they drop? Why is 50,000 HP Antlion (Hard Mode) a problem when you can just switch to Wolfgang? Why is 25HP Maxwell is a problem when you can just kite attacks? Why is the new random land pirate raids that attack you right in the middle of a boss fight a problem when you can just either use a pan flute or telelocate them? Why is the new ink attack that disables your mouse and WASD a problem when SPACE and F still work? Why is your screen being broken a problem when the game is full of audio cues?) Leave it to mods. People are going to complain about vanilla DST being too easy no matter what. Hard mode doesn't just need to be number tweaks it can have more engaging a.i. new mobs, more content on the main island basically it could be a way for the game to evolve without scaring away beginners. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/143501-time-for-hardmode/#findComment-1600431 Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxwell_winters Posted October 3, 2022 Share Posted October 3, 2022 16 minutes ago, abrocator said: 50,000 HP Antlion 25HP Maxwell Both those ideas are so cursed and exaggerated. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/143501-time-for-hardmode/#findComment-1600432 Share on other sites More sharing options...
MadMatt Posted October 3, 2022 Share Posted October 3, 2022 3 minutes ago, Mysterious box said: Hard mode doesn't just need to be number tweaks it can have more engaging a.i. new mobs, more content on the main island basically it could be a way for the game to evolve without scaring away beginners. Why would hard mode have more content? Easy mode is just number tweaking so I don't see why hard mode should be any different. Isn't there also mods that add plenty of new "difficult" content that could be used? I get that people want to also play on pubs but if you're locking content behind a hard mode then why not just befriend people who also want to play something harder with more content and do a modded server with them. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/143501-time-for-hardmode/#findComment-1600443 Share on other sites More sharing options...
abrocator Posted October 3, 2022 Share Posted October 3, 2022 9 minutes ago, Mysterious box said: [snip] Deerclops with lazers + ice trap is not a number tweak. (Land pirate raids and ink attack + input disabling are also not number tweaks.) Doesn’t matter if it would be a number tweak or something more involved (of course it would be something more involved)—the outcome would be same. Quote Both those ideas are so cursed and exaggerated. Hyperbole : extravagant exaggeration (Merriam Webster) Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/143501-time-for-hardmode/#findComment-1600444 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cr4zyFl4mes Posted October 3, 2022 Share Posted October 3, 2022 I want the game to throw at me as many things as possible. You find insanity easy to deal with? How about being insane, poisoned, sick, in the dark night, with frog rain, strong winds, cold temperature and a hound wave, while the birds that are normally peacefull get mutated and peck at you. Combos similar to this can already happen. What I personally imagine behind the word "uncompromising" is that there would be 2x as much things that can happen to you and it would happen more frequently (doesn't need to last super long though, to not be annyoing). Another thing would be more dangerous biomes (example being the the Lunar Grotto when the war between nightmares and gestalts is raging and you need to avoid the blowing spores and naked mole bats) Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/143501-time-for-hardmode/#findComment-1600450 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capybara007 Posted October 3, 2022 Share Posted October 3, 2022 a hardmode would take way more time to code than a casual mode if the devs made a hard mode that has exactly the same changes as the new no sweat mode but flipped, people would complain its extremely simple and not fun just give them time, i know the community has asked this for years but maybe now there is more incentivation to do this because of the recent no sweat mode addition Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/143501-time-for-hardmode/#findComment-1600461 Share on other sites More sharing options...
abrocator Posted October 3, 2022 Share Posted October 3, 2022 7 minutes ago, Capybara007 said: if the devs made a hard mode that has exactly the same changes as the new no sweat mode but flipped, people would complain its extremely simple and not fun As a veteran player I have to agree. If they reduce my health: I never take damage so w/e If they halve hunger values: Good! Less worrying about food wastage If they double boss HP: just takes more materials is all. I can already execute the mechanics of the fights perfectly so w/e If they double the amount of insanity creatures: did someone say more free nightmare fuel?? If they make freezing or overheating more punishing: thermal stone lmao gg If they nerf thermal stone: ... I’ll just get the temperature fishies and wear something on my head no biggie If they halve the healing of pierogies: I use jelly beans exclusively for healing from day six onwards so w/e (not that I, uh, need them since I never take damage I just eat them for style) Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/143501-time-for-hardmode/#findComment-1600470 Share on other sites More sharing options...
loopuleasa Posted October 3, 2022 Share Posted October 3, 2022 19 minutes ago, Capybara007 said: Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/143501-time-for-hardmode/#findComment-1600473 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mysterious box Posted October 3, 2022 Share Posted October 3, 2022 27 minutes ago, MadMatt said: Why would hard mode have more content? Easy mode is just number tweaking so I don't see why hard mode should be any different. Isn't there also mods that add plenty of new "difficult" content that could be used? I get that people want to also play on pubs but if you're locking content behind a hard mode then why not just befriend people who also want to play something harder with more content and do a modded server with them. Well everyone isn't on pc I even have friends who only play on console who were considering playing and the reason for the divide would be ability to freely update the main island at least in my head I believe the main reason content is only isolated loot hubs you only visit afew times is to keep the game accessible hard mode is a chance to add more in your face content it doesn't need to be a major or sole focus but adding little bits every so often would amazing similar to how they this wasn't the only update to add casual content honestly I don't understand why there's so much resistance to the whole idea of a hard mode it's not like anyone's saying make it the standard mode. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/143501-time-for-hardmode/#findComment-1600476 Share on other sites More sharing options...
MadMatt Posted October 3, 2022 Share Posted October 3, 2022 1 minute ago, Mysterious box said: Well everyone isn't on pc I even have friends who only play on console who were considering playing and the reason for the divide would be ability to freely update the main island at least in my head I believe the main reason content is only isolated loot hubs you only visit afew times is to keep the game accessible hard mode is a chance to add more in your face content it doesn't need to be a major or sole focus but adding little bits every so often would amazing similar to how they this wasn't the only update to add casual content honestly I don't understand why there's so much resistance to the whole idea of a hard mode it's not like anyone's saying make it the standard mode. PC point is fair, but I disagree with the idea of making a hard mode to add content since it caters to a specific portion of the players who are virtually impossible to please, at the expense of adding more general content that everyone can use and enjoy. I'm not opposed to more difficulty but it should be done more eloquently than shoving it into a gated off section. If this idea were to be implemented then having more options for specific events and behaviors in worldgen strikes me as a much better solution, since people who want a harder game will put more effort into customizing their experience for enjoyment compared to people who picked it up 2 minutes ago, which is why easy mode was made. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/143501-time-for-hardmode/#findComment-1600485 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capybara007 Posted October 3, 2022 Share Posted October 3, 2022 i think more hardmode content doesnt refer to literally adding a new biome or character that is hardmode only Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/143501-time-for-hardmode/#findComment-1600489 Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoodlemanNed Posted October 3, 2022 Author Share Posted October 3, 2022 I think i should probably clarify what i initially wanted with this hard mode suggestion. Having an inverse to the new casual settings is my idea of a "good enough" difficulty modifier, like increased damage taken or wildfires being year round. It might be way too simple and boring for most players but thats to be expected, most people probably know by now that you cant please everyone. There will also be players saying that the modifiers are too easy because you can just not get hit, or just build around a flingomatic. These complaints are fine because i know my suggestion isnt a perfect solution but i do think it would be an improvement to the game, and if its very easy for the devs to implement then it would probably be a great idea to do so. Also having a harder difficulty with unique challenges sounds good on paper, but it does have 2 pretty major flaws in dst. First of all it can be difficult for the devs to not only code a bunch of unique stuff, but properly balancing it so that it isnt too easy, too unfair, or just outright not enjoyable. The second and biggest issue is that challenge in dst was only really well executed when the player didnt know what hazards the game had. If youre looking through info about new content in these forums, then youre going to know exactly what kind of threats any update brings. Once you know what threats there are it doesnt take long for people to discover a method to trivialize any challenge, and at that point youre exactly where you started. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/143501-time-for-hardmode/#findComment-1600521 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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