Does Warly need a touch-up?

[Mysterious box]

20 minutes ago, Wonz said:

Same as switching is someone being a first choice. You see lots of wendys wolfgangs and more maxwells

Gonna be honest I almost never see wolfgang on pubs.

3 hours ago, Cookie95 said:

Don't know if it makes sense but I would prefer for the food buffs  to be stackable. For example by eating 5 spiced foods at once you get the buff for 2.5 days instead of having to eat every 4 minutes to keep the buff going

Honestly this would be a really cool feature but the more I think about it the more gamebreaking it would be because you could stack the dishes to insanely high durations like old overcharged wx for near infinite seasonal resistances, light, boosted work speed, damage, and defense which is alot more overpowered than the old wx overcharged state in my opinion.

[Cloakingsumo198]

1 hour ago, Cheggf said:

I see more Warlys than Maxwells and Wolfgangs

Spoiler

I can't remember the last time I saw a wild "warly"

 

[Wonz]

1 hour ago, Cheggf said:

I see more Warlys than Maxwells and Wolfgangs.

Ha ha now way

[Teoretycznie]

2 hours ago, Cheggf said:

You are asking for Gazlowe to be the best damage dealer and the best tank and also a really good jungler and healer without even needing to level up to get his perks. 

I mean, it's weird that plant character doesn't care more about farming than Warly.

Edit: What about combining Portable Grinding Mill and Portable Seasoning Station into one item? You'r standing next to it, you have a new craft tab, you click on it you can season your dish. Just make it simple.

Additionaly make it so you can put your kitchenwares all at once, one click and you put 3 crock pots and a two in one seasoning station. It would be so cool tbh.

There's always room for improvement we can brainstorm together and think something up, it's all about having fun.

[Cheggf]

12 minutes ago, Teoretycznie said:

I mean, it's weird that plant characters doesn't care more about farming than Warly.

What? 

[ArubaroBeefalo]

32 minutes ago, Teoretycznie said:

I mean, it's weird that plant character doesn't care more about farming than Warly

there are no supermarkets in the constant

[Teoretycznie]

7 minutes ago, ArubaroBeefalo said:

there are no supermarkets in the constant

Hard to disagree. I would be more interested about your insight on my [Edit] part tho.

[ArubaroBeefalo]

7 minutes ago, Teoretycznie said:

Hard to disagree. I would be more interested about your insight on my [Edit] part tho.

qol is always good, will save time and clicks

[Mysterious box]

1 hour ago, Cloakingsumo198 said:

  Hide contents

I can't remember the last time I saw a wild "warly"

 

I'm starting to think more and more that this is a timezone thing because I rarely see maxwell's but I do see them, however seeing a Wolfgang is quite rare usually people seem to go for Wanda over him in my experiences and I usually see at bare min 1 sometimes 2 or more Warly in servers with 5 players or more.

[Cloakingsumo198]

22 minutes ago, Mysterious box said:

I'm starting to think more and more that this is a timezone thing because I rarely see maxwell's but I do see them, however seeing a Wolfgang is quite rare usually people seem to go for Wanda over him in my experiences and I usually see at bare min 1 sometimes 2 or more Warly in servers with 5 players or more.

Could also be a platform difference console vs PC.  I haven't been on PC in awhile but even then I didn't really see warly's either but back then he was far more underappreciated.

I see wendies and Webbers the most.

[Cheggf]

3 hours ago, Teoretycznie said:

What about combining Portable Grinding Mill and Portable Seasoning Station into one item? You'r standing next to it, you have a new craft tab, you click on it you can season your dish. Just make it simple.

Yes, exactly. Warly is already a great character so anything he gets should be small, unimpactful, and not really change much. Combining the seasoning station and grinding mill, giving him 2x duration on food effects, giving him a chef's specialty spice which is just pepper and garlic combined, making his chef's pouch a useful item. Any of those would be good additions. Even adding more seasonings would be fine as long as they aren't bonkers.

But Warly doesn't NEED any of that and he certainly doesn't need it because technically if you're on day 10 billion with nothing to do you can mass produce his stuff for no reason. His downside shouldn't be messed with, he shouldn't get a big spike in power, he shouldn't get changes because of the portal, he shouldn't get nerfed, his upside shouldn't be easier to access. Either nothing should happen or he should get little things. 

[Mrloxi]

7 hours ago, Cheggf said:

Yes, exactly. Warly is already a great character so anything he gets should be small, unimpactful, and not really change much. Combining the seasoning station and grinding mill, giving him 2x duration on food effects, giving him a chef's specialty spice which is just pepper and garlic combined, making his chef's pouch a useful item. Any of those would be good additions. Even adding more seasonings would be fine as long as they aren't bonkers.

But Warly doesn't NEED any of that and he certainly doesn't need it because technically if you're on day 10 billion with nothing to do you can mass produce his stuff for no reason. His downside shouldn't be messed with, he shouldn't get a big spike in power, he shouldn't get changes because of the portal, he shouldn't get nerfed, his upside shouldn't be easier to access. Either nothing should happen or he should get little things. 

I disagree.Warly is definitely a cool character; not the worst off right now, but he's still got some issues:

• His remembered dish penalty just isn't strong enough to get players to eat a varied diet
• His upsides don't really contribute to the playstyle that the remembered dish penalty creates. They feel more like a reward for putting up with his downside for long enough. This sucks because:
• His downside (the dish penalty) is by far his most interesting feature and everything else about him just feels like stuff other players have but they don't have to farm for it

When people are playing as a character purely for the unique and interesting playstyle that their downside creates (I know I am), it indicates two things:

1. You've struck gold with the downside and should reinforce the playstyle that the downside creates
2. That character needs more interesting upsides (ideally upsides that reinforce the playstyle mentioned in the first point)

Lastly, regarding the changes you proposed/agreed with:

• combination portable mill and seasoning station is a good idea, idk why klei even made them 2 separate items in the first place
• 2x duration of food effects is cool but for a lot of dishes it doesn't really make much of a difference. Still a good idea though
• I don't really see a need for a combination pepper and garlic spice since you can just spice one dish with pepper and one with garlic to get the same effect
• Chef's puch definitely needs to be made an actually useful item
• More seasonings would be nice. It'd be cool if klei could add a bit more warly exclusive stuff whenever they add more general content (like what they did with seasoniing salt) so that he doesn't get left behind as more content comes out

[Cheggf]

9 minutes ago, Mrloxi said:

His remembered dish penalty just isn't strong enough to get players to eat a varied diet

I eat a varied diet. If you don't that's up to you. Honestly I think being able to cheese it a little is good thing since it makes him a bit more accessible while still remaining a harsh downside since you can't cheese the healing and even when cheesed it's still a bit of effort.

I find it fun so I engage with it a lot. Someone else might not find it as fun but find the rest of Warly fun so they don't engage with it as much. We both have the choice. It's not like you can ever get rid of the penalty, just mitigate the part that was always the easiest to deal with anyways. 

14 minutes ago, Mrloxi said:

His upsides don't really contribute to the playstyle that the remembered dish penalty creates.

Does Wolfgang's might contribute to the sanity penalty? Do WX's circuits contribute to him dying to water? Does BERNIE! contribute to Willow freezing faster? You guys keep making up weird reasons Warly is bad. There's like 2 characters who's downside plays into their upside.

20 minutes ago, Mrloxi said:

I don't really see a need for a combination pepper and garlic spice since you can just spice one dish with pepper and one with garlic to get the same effect

Why do you see making two structures you don't carry around into one as a good change but don't see how doing it to stuff you need to actually carry around on your person is good?

If the stations were combined nothing would really change. If the spices were combined anyone who currently uses garlic would get 1 more inventory slot and anyone who doesn't use garlic could start using it. 

22 minutes ago, Mrloxi said:

When people are playing as a character purely for the unique and interesting playstyle that their downside creates (I know I am), it indicates two things:

1. You've struck gold with the downside and should reinforce the playstyle that the downside creates
2. That character needs more interesting upsides (ideally upsides that reinforce the playstyle mentioned in the first point)

How does that show that they need more upsides? Or that he needs upsides to "reinforce the playstyle" (whatever that means, I can't imagine anything other than things that do the opposite and just get rid of it)? He already has the most in the game. 

[Teoretycznie]

1 hour ago, Mrloxi said:

• His remembered dish penalty just isn't strong enough to get players to eat a varied diet
• His upsides don't really contribute to the playstyle that the remembered dish penalty creates. They feel more like a reward for putting up with his downside for long enough. This sucks because:
• His downside (the dish penalty) is by far his most interesting feature and everything else about him just feels like stuff other players have but they don't have to farm for it

I think you hit the spot with this 3 points, this is what should be tweaked in the first place.

But I have to refute point number 1: This game incentivize using same dish over and over again, because it's simple, cheap, people play without mods, and don't want to remember everything, on top of that, Warly's penalty doesn't show up anywhere, there's no way of knowing if it's gone already. I don't think you should hard force different dishes, it should be more natural.

Maybe add immersive "are you sure?" function, For example, you order Warly to eat first meatball, he eats it no problem, but for second time he's like -Na-ah, I already eat that. with animation like you would want to give him unprepared meal, but! If you try again he's like -Fine... my stomach is grumbling.

[Edit]: Maybe even this would be his downside, at 3rd try there dice roll between 5-10 as how many attemps you'll need to force him to eat his meatballs, at 4h time he pukes losing sanity, health and hunger, he also becomes drowsy. Idk, I'm just thinking out of the box.

Maybe if you saved new recipe in cookbook and you have it in hand, it should function like in a crockpot mod.

The other thing.. it's rough.. but I think all cooking recipes should be revisited, and possibly tweaked. You can't add character like Warly to the game without a proper foundation.

[Mrloxi]

1 hour ago, Cheggf said:

I eat a varied diet. If you don't that's up to you. Honestly I think being able to cheese it a little is good thing since it makes him a bit more accessible while still remaining a harsh downside since you can't cheese the healing and even when cheesed it's still a bit of effort.

Just because a player can consciously choose to handicap themselves doesn't mean that a downside is strong enough. A weak downside certainly makes him more accesible to newer players, but warly doesn't really seem like he's designed to be played by newer players: he rewards knowledge of all of the recipes and most of his specialty dishes and spices require hard-to-get ingredients that players need to gather

1 hour ago, Cheggf said:

Does Wolfgang's might contribute to the sanity penalty? Do WX's circuits contribute to him dying to water? Does BERNIE! contribute to Willow freezing faster? You guys keep making up weird reasons Warly is bad. There's like 2 characters who's downside plays into their upside.

1. Wolfgang's sanity penalty is not what makes his playstyle (and imo is pretty pointless when it comes to gameplay and only exists to fit his characterisation of being cowardly). The more accurate comparison would be wimpy form, which does contribute to his might
2. WX's penalty is also not what makes his playstyle, but it does synergise quite well with his circuits by forcing him to wear waterproof clothing unless he wants to lose charge. This means that in order to make use of his circuits whilst in the rain, he has to give up valuable armour slots for waterproof clothing, or carry items like a torch or campfire that can help dry him off quickly
3. Willow loses more health and sanity when cold. Bernie grants cold resistance and sanity whilst held, and once you're insane enough, he acts as a last ditch defense against the nightmare creatures that are now attackiing you. Willow freezing faster is just one part of willow's playstyle: making it harder to not get cold, whilst rewarding the player for succesfully doing so. BERNIE! is the safety cushion that makes willow a bit less of a doom spiral if you do become insane

I'm not making up reasons why warly is bad. I love warly and most of my playtime is as warly. I think warly is already more interesting than most other characters purely because of the playstyle of variety his downside provides. What i'm doing is describing why i think he could be better if his perks and downsides leaned more into that playstyle

1 hour ago, Cheggf said:

Why do you see making two structures you don't carry around into one as a good change but don't see how doing it to stuff you need to actually carry around on your person is good?

If the stations were combined nothing would really change. If the spices were combined anyone who currently uses garlic would get 1 more inventory slot and anyone who doesn't use garlic could start using it.

Making two structures instead of one is unnecessary crafting (does anyone really carry those structures about?), since you need both structures to be able to get any benefit out of either of them, whereas garlic powder and chilli flakes are both useful on their own. The freed inventory slot is a good point though, i can see now why it would reduce hassle when setting up a fight. You've changed my mind on that one, the seasoning tab looks a little anaemic as it is

1 hour ago, Cheggf said:

How does that show that they need more upsides? Or that he needs upsides to "reinforce the playstyle" (whatever that means, I can't imagine anything other than things that do the opposite and just get rid of it)? He already has the most in the game. 

It shows that he needs an interesting upside that isn't just something another character does but worse, and a good place to start is by giving it synergy with his downside which has already been demonstrated to be interesting. Upsides that get rid of his downside are the exact opposite of what i want, what i want is upsides that reward the player for having a varied diet and not just eating the same foods over and over again. My idea is a speed boost that differs depending on how many dishes he remembers eating (rewarding a varied diet), along with an increase to dish memory time to 3 or 4 days (punishment for just binge eating meatballs, and also a hidden buff to the proposed upside) Wormwood's a pretty good example of this: his downside means that players hae to look into alternative healing methods or kiting, and his bloom ability (often activated by those healing items) helps players kite by giving them a speed boost (as well as a couple of other non combat related abilities)

 

1 hour ago, Teoretycznie said:

But I have to refute point number 1: This game incentivize using same dish over and over again, because it's simple, cheap, people play without mods, and don't want to remember everything, on top of that, Warly's penalty doesn't show up anywhere, there's no way of knowing if it's gone already. I don't think you should hard force different dishes, it should be more natural.

Maybe add immersive "are you sure?" function, For example, you order Warly to eat first meatball, he eats it no problem, but for second time he's like -Na-ah, I already eat that. with animation like you would want to give him unprepared meal, but! If you try again he's like -Fine... my stomach is grumbling.

Maybe if you saved new recipe in cookbook and you have it in hand, it should function like in a crockpot mod.

The other thing.. it's rough.. but I think all cooking recipes should be revisited, and possibly tweaked. You can't add character like Warly to the game without a proper foundation.

Maybe it's a bit harsh, but i don't really think warly is for players who don't want to remember recipes. He is the chef character afterall. I agree that there should be some way of checking what dishes he remembers, but him refusing to eat food the first time could screw with healing during combat

I feel my proposed solution does make dish diversification more natural, by both rewarding the player for having a varied diet whilst also ensuring that players have to eat at least 2 different dish types to get rid of the penalty. It's a carrot and stick design

I agree with the idea of a recipe tweak, but unfortunately i don't think it's likely to happen. At the very least warly players beeing rewarded for eating different foods would give recipes like kabobs a reason to exist

[Teoretycznie]

10 minutes ago, Mrloxi said:

I feel my proposed solution does make dish diversification more natural, by both rewarding the player for having a varied diet whilst also ensuring that players have to eat at least 2 different dish types to get rid of the penalty. It's a carrot and stick design.

 

I'm totally on board with that, It makes so much sense tbh, I would be making different meals like crazy for that 20% movement speed.

[Mysterious box]

7 hours ago, Teoretycznie said:

Maybe add immersive "are you sure?" function, For example, you order Warly to eat first meatball, he eats it no problem, but for second time he's like -Na-ah, I already eat that. with animation like you would want to give him unprepared meal, but! If you try again he's like -Fine... my stomach is grumbling.

[Edit]: Maybe even this would be his downside, at 3rd try there dice roll between 5-10 as how many attemps you'll need to force him to eat his meatballs, at 4h time he pukes losing sanity, health and hunger, he also becomes drowsy. Idk, I'm just thinking out of the box.

Are you sure your not just trying to delete Warly from the character selection screen? Be honest now noone would enjoy this.

 

6 hours ago, Mrloxi said:

but warly doesn't really seem like he's designed to be played by newer players: he rewards knowledge of all of the recipes and most of his specialty dishes and spices require hard-to-get ingredients that players need to gather

Does farming and fishing really count as hard to get or are you talking about glow berries and goats? Either way you only need to know a fraction of crockpot recipes and it's not Warly's fault it's that most crockpot recipes are bad and that has never really been addressed.

6 hours ago, Mrloxi said:

1. Wolfgang's sanity penalty is not what makes his playstyle (and imo is pretty pointless when it comes to gameplay and only exists to fit his characterisation of being cowardly). The more accurate comparison would be wimpy form, which does contribute to his might
2. WX's penalty is also not what makes his playstyle, but it does synergise quite well with his circuits by forcing him to wear waterproof clothing unless he wants to lose charge. This means that in order to make use of his circuits whilst in the rain, he has to give up valuable armour slots for waterproof clothing, or carry items like a torch or campfire that can help dry him off quickly
3. Willow loses more health and sanity when cold. Bernie grants cold resistance and sanity whilst held, and once you're insane enough, he acts as a last ditch defense against the nightmare creatures that are now attackiing you. Willow freezing faster is just one part of willow's playstyle: making it harder to not get cold, whilst rewarding the player for succesfully doing so. BERNIE! is the safety cushion that makes willow a bit less of a doom spiral if you do become insane

I'm not making up reasons why warly is bad. I love warly and most of my playtime is as warly. I think warly is already more interesting than most other characters purely because of the playstyle of variety his downside provides. What i'm doing is describing why i think he could be better if his perks and downsides leaned more into that playstyle

So Warly's refusal to not eat non crock foods eliminating a entire food choice doesn't lean into his playstyle?

Wx's and Willow's downside do not impact their playstyle anymore than the rest of the cast unless your saying you just don't use seasonal protection on other characters infact I'm willing to bet most players don't even know about Willow's freezing downside also from most experience most Willow's use bernie as bossing support as his tank status helps with dealing damage and removes sanity management from the the fight.

6 hours ago, Mrloxi said:

It shows that he needs an interesting upside that isn't just something another character does but worse, and a good place to start is by giving it synergy with his downside which has already been demonstrated to be interesting

No it shows the portal is a issue nothing more and where has that second part been demonstrated exactly?

 

6 hours ago, Mrloxi said:

My idea is a speed boost that differs depending on how many dishes he remembers eating (rewarding a varied diet), along with an increase to dish memory time to 3 or 4 days (punishment for just binge eating meatballs, and also a hidden buff to the proposed upside) Wormwood's a pretty good example of this: his downside means that players hae to look into alternative healing methods or kiting, and his bloom ability (often activated by those healing items) helps players kite by giving them a speed boost (as well as a couple of other non combat related abilities)

I swear this feels like you both are actively trying to sabotage Warly so he's too tedious to consider playing not only does a speed boost make no real sense but if people want speed they'll go to Walter, Wx, or Wormwood if anything your making him a worse character pick

[Teoretycznie]

3 hours ago, Mysterious box said:

I swear this feels like you both are actively trying to sabotage Warly so he's too tedious to consider playing not only does a speed boost make no real sense but if people want speed they'll go to Walter, Wx, or Wormwood if anything your making him a worse character pick

Man, we're just talking, we like the game, and we like to come up with stuff, doesn't matter if it stupid, or else.

What do you think the process of changing anything in the game looks like at any studio? They talk, they throw ideas, and maybe something sticks.
Meanwhile, you'r just here to diss everything without providing any meanigfull insight. If I propose like 20 paragraphs of ideas, it's not because I want everything I said to be implemented, not at all. I do so because maybe someone will get a better idea, or expand upon it, or maybe I'll just inspire him to think about the possibilities.

As I said before, Warly's different dish gameplay, should be natural, not forced. I think speedboost is good proposal, because if you want to stay at base, you can just eat your damn meatballs and it would be enough, and if you want to be more creative and explore the world, you'r rewarded for it with small stacking speed boost. And It's not like it doesn't make sense for Warly to get a rush after eating many tasty dishes.

Edit:

Quote

No it shows the portal is a issue nothing more

Portal is an issue only because Warly provide almost no value early in the game, because he doesn't have enough veggies for his recipes, so there's no point playing him. I'll switch to him after I have all the crops I need, and at this point there's no way I don't have purple gems.. That's why speed boost is not that bad of an idea, maybe it will make people stick to him more, other than switching for dishes.

[ArubaroBeefalo]

10 minutes ago, Teoretycznie said:

Portal is an issue only because Warly provide almost no value early in the game, because he doesn't have enough veggies for his recipes, so there's no point playing him

totally your problem not warly's

not every character needs to have 452342 perks at day 1

[Teoretycznie]

20 minutes ago, ArubaroBeefalo said:

totally your problem not warly's

not every character needs to have 452342 perks at day 1

I just said it's even more of a reason he's consider a switch character for many people.

Edit: And saying something like it's your problem is just ********.

It's like saying it's my problem that my country is robbing his citizens, and not people that run it. Because not every country have to honest. Yea, It's my problem, for sure, but it doesn't mean I should be ok with that.

[Cheggf]

10 hours ago, Mrloxi said:

Just because a player can consciously choose to handicap themselves doesn't mean that a downside is strong enough. A weak downside certainly makes him more accesible to newer players, but warly doesn't really seem like he's designed to be played by newer players: he rewards knowledge of all of the recipes and most of his specialty dishes and spices require hard-to-get ingredients that players need to gather

You are literally quoting me saying that the health part is the hard part and can't be cheesed. 

57 minutes ago, Teoretycznie said:

Portal is an issue only because Warly provide almost no value early in the game, because he doesn't have enough veggies for his recipes, so there's no point playing him. I'll switch to him after I have all the crops I need, and at this point there's no way I don't have purple gems.. That's why speed boost is not that bad of an idea, maybe it will make people stick to him more, other than switching for dishes.

I see people pick Warly all the time on Klei servers as their first choice. Just because you want to be super OP all the time and won't settle for a few perks doesn't mean Warly has any issues. That's an issue with your perspective. 

44 minutes ago, Teoretycznie said:

It's like saying it's my problem that my country is robbing his citizens, and not people that run it. Because not every country have to honest

No. It's like going to Japan then getting pissed that they're speaking Japanese instead of English. People getting robbed has the negative outcome of being dangerous and having them lose money. What is the negative outcome of Warly being a really strong and fun character? It's not like someone can get robbed and be like "well actually I like being robbed", that doesn't make any sense. What you're complaining about isn't a robbery, it is that a very powerful and interesting character can theoretically by basically only you be used without playing him for no reason.

If Warly's perks aren't worth picking him over then they certainly aren't worth swapping over, so why are you? It's just a big waste of time to farm all that stuff. 

[Mysterious box]

52 minutes ago, Teoretycznie said:

Portal is an issue only because Warly provide almost no value early in the game, because he doesn't have enough veggies for his recipes, so there's no point playing him. I'll switch to him after I have all the crops I need, and at this point there's no way I don't have purple gems.. That's why speed boost is not that bad of an idea, maybe it will make people stick to him more, other than switching for dishes

Ok now explain why it's also sited for Winona. That aside your suggestion is to punish Warly far beyond reasonable levels but hey guys atleast he has a speed boost now right noone else you could go to has that...right? The very reason I dislike your idea is because 1 it doesn't fit Warly and 2 it does legit makes it a worse play experience but that being said you can't post a idea without the chance of it being criticized even I'm not immune to having my ideas shot down.

[Mrloxi]

4 hours ago, Mysterious box said:

Does farming and fishing really count as hard to get or are you talking about glow berries and goats? Either way you only need to know a fraction of crockpot recipes and it's not Warly's fault it's that most crockpot recipes are bad and that has never really been addressed.

For newbie players pretty much everythiing other than berries and small meats are difficult to get, but i was mostly referring to pepper spice and volt goat jelly. One requires rushing farms before winter comes and the other requires killing a bunch of a pretty rare mob that only spawns in a certain area to get a 25% drop

 

4 hours ago, Mysterious box said:

So Warly's refusal to not eat non crock foods eliminating a entire food choice doesn't lean into his playstyle?

Wx's and Willow's downside do not impact their playstyle anymore than the rest of the cast unless your saying you just don't use seasonal protection on other characters infact I'm willing to bet most players don't even know about Willow's freezing downside also from most experience most Willow's use bernie as bossing support as his tank status helps with dealing damage and removes sanity management from the the fight.

There's 2 things that i think you could be referring to in that first scentence so i'll reply to both meanings: Warly's refusal to eat crock pot foods leans into his playstyle by forcing you to know how to make a lot of different meals with the same/similar ingredients if you want variety and don't want to have to spend a ton of extra time farming different ingredients. If it didn't exist then it'd be way too easy to have variety and there'd be no challenge. To address the second possible meaning: it's still another downside that makes warly's playstyle rather than an upside, and it's one that i mentally lump in with his repeat dish penalty (i should have been more clear about that fact)

 

4 hours ago, Mysterious box said:

No it shows the portal is a issue nothing more and where has that second part been demonstrated exactly?

Why is it fine to suggest completely removing the celestial portal, but a small tweak for warly is somehow an unthinkable evil?

It's been demonstrated by the fact that people will still play singleplayer warly despite the fact that his upsides are just stuff that other people can do better and without having to spend time getting the resources for it, and because warly's upsides don't really affect his playstyle in any way, except for making the player prepare more than average

4 hours ago, Mysterious box said:

I swear this feels like you both are actively trying to sabotage Warly so he's too tedious to consider playing not only does a speed boost make no real sense but if people want speed they'll go to Walter, Wx, or Wormwood if anything your making him a worse character pick

1. Where is the sabotage? How would what i proposed make him worse? Does not being able to live off meatballs make a character tedious? If so, then why on earth are you playing warly in the first place?
2. The speed boost makes sense because it boost his ability to gather ingredients, boosts his kiting ability to make up for his healing difficulties, and most importantly it provides a reward for not just binge eating meatballs whenever your hunger goes to 20
3. If players play other characters for their better speed boost, that's fine. I don't want to make warly a meta speedrun character. My ultimate goal with those proposed changes is to give warly a perk that strengthens what i consider to be the most unique and interesting aspect of his playstyle, whilst also making the original driving force behind that playstyle stronger

19 minutes ago, Cheggf said:

You are literally quoting me saying that the health part is the hard part and can't be cheesed.

I don't think that any part of warly's downside should be able to be cheesed. Also, i don't think the health part is very interesting, as in practice it just means having to use more slots for healing than you would normally. EDIT: i'm pretty sure healing is only even the hard part because klei made eating for nourishment so cheeseable

[Cloakingsumo198]

7 minutes ago, Mysterious box said:

Ok now explain why it's also sited for Winona

Winona also doesn't have much early game value since her QoL perks aren't that great and her contraptions need a decent amount of resources and also a good setup just to prove "useful" she's probably an even worse switch character since her "buildings" are static and don't decay and as long as they aren't destroyed they're reusable by everyone.

Unlike warly who's dishes are likely to eventually spoil or be consumed inevitably needing to swap back to him.

She's probably more of a "swap character" than warly and the worst example to choose.

[Teoretycznie]

8 minutes ago, Mysterious box said:

That aside your suggestion is to punish Warly far beyond reasonable levels but hey guys atleast he has a speed boost now right noone else you could go to has that...right? The very reason I dislike your idea is because 1 it doesn't fit Warly and 2 it does legit makes it a worse play experience

What Idea? because I spit them like a mad man, and I don't know to which one you'r referring to. And I don't want you to agree with me, it would be even better if you dissagree and provide any reasoning, not just say it's bad.

For Winona, she's switch character because she builds permament structures that anyone can refuel, and she has limited value beside that.

Edit: What gentelman above me says.