Concept idea: Shields

[Superwolfkid]

I made this idea a few months ago and thought it was a really stupid idea... then modern me now decided to give it a chance to see how the community thinks about it and sort of rework it so, here we go! (I'll be using images from my old drawing of the concept and maybe remake them later.)

purpose:

Alot of new and a small handful of experienced players either might be bad at kiting, might lag too badly to be able to fight, or even just doesnt like the combat in total. Even I have a friend who sometimes finds it difficult, getting him killed in some situations.( "Don't tell him I said that, he would kill me!" XD) The purpose of this is to find a way to make learning the combat system easier and time your attacks. And to sort of add something new to combat system instead of the classic hit and run or Tank.

how it works:

A shield can be equipped In the hand slot of your character. when equipped, If you push a certain key/buttom (haven't thought of it yet) your character shifts into a blocking animation for about perhaps a second long.( Similar to the block animation using the blacksmith's edge from the forge)

Spoiler

Credit goes to @watermelen671 for sending me the gif of this image. Thank you!

If anything attacks you during this animation, your character would be pushed back a tiny bit and the shield would absorb the damage! (maybe 80 or 85% say-ish percent) however, if you are not in blocking animation when you WILL be taking damage WITHOUT the shield's armor absorption meaning you will take full damage if you are not wearing Armor! And maybe I'm thinking you would also take damage if you are either facing the wrong way or if the attack is from above or below you, but that might be a little too harsh and specific... I made it designed like this to Help teach someone the attack pattern and make it based on knowledge and timing rather then how fast you can quickly move the opposite direction to avoid the hit. You can hit with a normal weapon and when your opponents about to attack. Quickly equip your shield, guard the attack and get right back to hitting. After you block though you will have a cool down of probably a second so you cant just spam block.

Design:

I tried to make it look, something from Don't starve based on how other things man made items would look made by the survivors, a wooden plank shield with a gold nugget in the middle of it with metal outline covering the outer layer. The shield will be held by an arm strapped around the character's arm. When dropped on the floor, maybe it makes a clunking sound and play a short animation of it spinning like a quarter before laying down as a cute little detail! images (4).mp4

Crafting:

Something a little bit pricey for constructing and stocking up on early game, but effective enough to use mid game! For now I would say 2 boards and 2 gold. And maybe its can be prototyped with a science machine, but it would fit just right in the Fight tab.

Projectile and lunge Block:

If a projectile such as a blow dart, spitters's shots, or a bishop's range attack as Example. Blocking it would fully negate all damage from blocked projectiles. Though maybe if the attack does more then 100damage (assuming  your probably not going to safely block a giant laser or something your way)then it will still hurt you, but you will still get damage absorption. 

If a small or medium creature like a spider or Clockwork Rook lunges at you while you are shielding, you can negate the attack and stun the attacker. However lunges from creatures like Klaus or ancient guardian, will not work and instead act like blocking a normal attack.

 Guarding other players:

If a creature intends an attack for another player or maybe an Aoe attack, and you use your shield while you are standing directly in front of the player and the attack, you will absorb some of the damage the player would take and share it with them (as an example the player blocking could take away probably 80% of the damage and give it to them instead while the protected player receives only 20% of the damage.) 

Things not decided yet or seeing what people think about these :

-Damage absorption

-Durability

- absorption % for protecting other friends

-should attacks below (ex: ant lion pillars) or attacks above (coconuts from shpwrecked) be blocked and absorbed from shields?

-projectiles negating all damage from shields

Conclusion:

I know I say this alot but, let me know on your thoughts I really like making concepts and stuff for the game, and I try my best to make the idea something that could actually work in the game and give it a purpose to make an object useful and fun, just like my last concept with the banana duck thing.if you guys think this is good or not, I will try to add more to this (Images and ect) thank you for listening!

 

[Well-met]

I think everyone can appreciate the effort you put into this, however this is essentially an extremely affordable and early double bone armor on demand.

See all the giants and bosses are balanced around very slow but deadly hits. In many cases they already don't even provide the necessary damage to pose a threat against multiple armored players. Dedicating a single player to tanks all of their attempts would make them even more laughable.

Your shield idea is pretty much designed for solo play and it would definitely just spiral out of control with many players each sporting a shield of their own.

[Desblat]

There is a mod already that adds shields.

[Superwolfkid]

1 hour ago, Well-met said:

I think everyone can appreciate the effort you put into this, however this is essentially an extremely affordable and early double bone armor on demand.

See all the giants and bosses are balanced around very slow but deadly hits. In many cases they already don't even provide the necessary damage to pose a threat against multiple armored players. Dedicating a single player to tanks all of their attempts would make them even more laughable.

Your shield idea is pretty much designed for solo play and it would definitely just spiral out of control with many players each sporting a shield of their own.

Thanks you for what you said earlier @Well-met! However, the whole concept for the shield was not for making the seasonal giants/ other creatures easier, but as a way to teach and help beginner players that have trouble with combat,It acts as a cheap early armor type besides the grass suit and to change the way combat is for some people want a different taste for combat besides range, I even put in idea letting you sponge up attacks meant for other players to share their damage with yours giving it a use for multiplayer.

27 minutes ago, Desblat said:

There is a mod already that adds shields.

 And as for @Desblat, I recently just checked out a video that showed a mod looking at shields (I'm a console player) but that mod is entirely different then the concept I'm showing on this topic, It looks severely over powered and broken.

[Brago-sama]

If blocking for people was limited to one person and shield defence didn't stack with anything, including other shields, ide say this would fit perfectly ingame. I like it. 

[Superwolfkid]

9 minutes ago, Brago-sama said:

If blocking for people was limited to one person and shield defence didn't stack with anything, including other shields, ide say this would fit perfectly ingame. I like it. 

I actually kind of like the idea of making it to where it you can only protect one person at a time with a shield, it really adds more tension and decision making towards who you would want to protect and how much damage your willing to take for that one person!

[minespatch]

Would work early game for those who can't take the time to make a logsuit.

[ChainyTheCloud]

Your mechanic about positioning to guard other players is interesting and I agree with the system of being pushed back after blocking melee attacks and completely negating enemy ranged damage. Shields would be great because quite frankly, the current kiting system of hitting mob x times exactly before stepping away is lame. Veteran players have grown far too comfortable with it, enough that they'd never want it changed nor can they see the problem with it. I'd go a step further with adding a proper dodging mechanic in addition to blocking. We can see the beginnings of these in Wheeler and Blacksmith's Edge.

Though Wheeler in Hamlet has a dodge it's broken in the current state. A proper dodging mechanic must have a pause at the end of the action to keep it from becoming a speed meta. In other words instead of being used to evade an attack it is used constantly by players as the preferred method of travel. You can see this in many different games as players idiotically roll to cover ground faster than running or sprinting.

As for blocking the forge block mechanic was better done, though in my opinion the right click and then left click in a direction was too clunky to use and should've just been right click in a direction to activate block stance. It also doesn't simulate a shield either.

To clarify on the above; blocking with a weapon is different than blocking with a shield. Holding up a weapon in front of you hoping the attack crosses its field means your blocking is predictable like a stationary object and not likely to work. When it does work it's closer to a parry which is intercepting the attack with your own. That's the only reason the defensive stance is up for only a moment. Blocking with a shield is a more effective defense. Holding it up covers much of your body and so you are able to hold it up in front of you bracing for the blow wherever it may come from. Therefore I think the shield block should last as long as the person wants it to. Holding rmb raises your shield, releasing rmb lowers it. Though it serves no purpose to do so indefinitely as you'd damage your equipment for nothing and likely to lose agro to someone else who becomes more of a threat. Let players decide when the time is to raise and lower the shield.

I think it should be in an offhand slot as well. Swapping gear to block and attack sounds like what a mod would do and not a polished game.

[Superwolfkid]

28 minutes ago, ChainyTheCloud said:

Your mechanic about positioning to guard other players is interesting and I agree with the system of being pushed back after blocking melee attacks and completely negating enemy ranged damage. Shields would be great because quite frankly, the current kiting system of hitting mob x times exactly before stepping away is lame. Veteran players have grown far too comfortable with it, enough that they'd never want it changed nor can they see the problem with it. I'd go a step further with adding a proper dodging mechanic in addition to blocking. We can see the beginnings of these in Wheeler and Blacksmith's Edge.

Though Wheeler in Hamlet has a dodge it's broken in the current state. A proper dodging mechanic must have a pause at the end of the action to keep it from becoming a speed meta. In other words instead of being used to evade an attack it is used constantly by players as the preferred method of travel. You can see this in many different games as players idiotically roll to cover ground faster than running or sprinting.

As for blocking the forge block mechanic was better done, though in my opinion the right click and then left click in a direction was too clunky to use and should've just been right click in a direction to activate block stance. It also doesn't simulate a shield either.

To clarify on the above; blocking with a weapon is different than blocking with a shield. Holding up a weapon in front of you hoping the attack crosses its field means your blocking is predictable like a stationary object and not likely to work. When it does work it's closer to a parry which is intercepting the attack with your own. That's the only reason the defensive stance is up for only a moment. Blocking with a shield is a more effective defense. Holding it up covers much of your body and so you are able to hold it up in front of you bracing for the blow wherever it may come from. Therefore I think the shield block should last as long as the person wants it to. Holding rmb raises your shield, releasing rmb lowers it. Though it serves no purpose to do so indefinitely as you'd damage your equipment for nothing and likely to lose agro to someone else who becomes more of a threat. Let players decide when the time is to raise and lower the shield.

I think it should be in an offhand slot as well. Swapping gear to block and attack sounds like what a mod would do and not a polished game.

Thanks for actually teaching me  alot about shields and parrying I've haven't played the forge since I'm a console player, ... I thought halfway of giving the shield 100% damage resistance before since you wouldn't really get hurt if someone hit you with a shield, the only twist is you had to block at exact timing of the hit, but... that would be pretty overpowered and over complicated for new players also  means giving it probably a really low durability since it sounds like a cheap early game  bone armor. ;-;  I'd like for the idea of a shield is a way to get closer  into the enemies face since mobs like bishops and spitters usually cause a lot of suffering for someone not willing to tank them down. And it might be a way to have people not cheat the Rook's attack AI when it's far away from its spawn.

[ChainyTheCloud]

3 minutes ago, Superwolfkid said:

 

Other games had different ways of going about it. Spiral knights for instance shields blocked 100% of the attack but had their own bar. So you could block all damage... of a few attacks. A barrage could break your guard leaving you defenseless until recovering. Worked for them but DST monsters can have long periods of time between their attacks. I'd love to see shields in some form or a combat tune-up in general.