qda Posted July 9, 2019 Share Posted July 9, 2019 So, in the launch upgrade, Petroleum generators were changed to accept "Combustible liquids", the two known being petroleum itself, and ethanol in its liquid state. But, the Natural Gas generators were also changed to "Combustible gas". AFAIK, there is no in-game element, other than natural gas, that fits the NGGs. However, in debug mode, there is an element "Syngas" (exactly MISSING.STRINGS.ELEMENTS.SYNGAS.NAME) which is the only other gas compound accepted by the NGG. Considering this phrasing change to the NGGs, I believe it is likely that this gas comes into the game. For now, it condenses at -252.2°C and freezes at -259.2°C, which I think is just a temporary copy pasting of hydrogen properties, since there is no other element that fits these properties. So, what could this gas be ? Would "syn" stand for synthetic, as opposed to natural gas. But then what real-life, combustible gas could we possibly synthesize in ONI ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yoma_Nosme Posted July 9, 2019 Share Posted July 9, 2019 Just Google SNG or Look up wikipedia Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nakomaru Posted July 9, 2019 Share Posted July 9, 2019 My headcanon is that it was intended to be ethanol gas, until they realized how much that would break game balance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qda Posted July 9, 2019 Author Share Posted July 9, 2019 14 minutes ago, Yoma_Nosme said: Just Google SNG or Look up wikipedia Thanks ! Then I can see two ways in which it could be implemented : - A methanation machine taking CO2 and H2 as inputs, and outputing water and Syngas - A wood/coal gaseificator producing syngas and waste products The first one, properly balanced, could be a nice new route to cycle ressources. The other one is design-wise identical to distillation->petro gens. Which one seems the most likely ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nakomaru Posted July 9, 2019 Share Posted July 9, 2019 1 minute ago, qda said: A wood/coal gaseificator producing syngas and waste products This is in the game if you know how to heat ethanol by 8 degrees. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coolthulhu Posted July 9, 2019 Share Posted July 9, 2019 1 minute ago, qda said: - A wood/coal gaseificator producing syngas and waste products Internally, wood generator is referred to as a wood gas generator. It's either an idea for the future or a dropped idea for it to produce some sort of combustible gas from wood. Just now, nakomaru said: This is in the game if you know how to heat ethanol by 8 degrees. Gaseous ethanol doesn't have the tag that lets it be burned in natgas generator. If it did, it would be wasteful to burn it in petrol gen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qda Posted July 9, 2019 Author Share Posted July 9, 2019 7 minutes ago, nakomaru said: This is in the game if you know how to heat ethanol by 8 degrees. Except ethanol gas isn't syngas in the game, and is certainly not meant to be used in NGGs. So, what you said isn't wrong, but isn't relevant, there most probably be a building to convert any bio ressource to syngas. 4 minutes ago, Coolthulhu said: Internally, wood generator is referred to as a wood gas generator. It's either an idea for the future or a dropped idea for it to produce some sort of combustible gas from wood. Oh, didn't know that. Could it be that it will ultimately produce syngas instead of CO2 as byproduct, which could make sense since wood burners are quite on the low-side power-wise. I don't feel they will be changed to produce only syngas for NGGs, since their current state fits the forest start as an alternative to coal power. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nakomaru Posted July 9, 2019 Share Posted July 9, 2019 A syngas generator also isn't in the game, so I guess we're even? Clearly, I wasn't saying what you thought I was saying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qda Posted July 9, 2019 Author Share Posted July 9, 2019 2 minutes ago, nakomaru said: A syngas generator also isn't in the game, so I guess we're even? Because NGGs are meant to accept syngas. And we're back to the start, so yeah, looks like we're even Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nakomaru Posted July 9, 2019 Share Posted July 9, 2019 Keep in mind the context you gave: -(q)Let's think of ways synthetic gas could be made. -(q)One way would be to have a building that produces it from wood -(n)That material chain already exists. It is my fault for not saying "essentially exists". What I am saying is all of the work for the material pathway has already been done. It would require reduced output from the NGG with this fuel, obviously. It also made more sense with ethanol's original output temperature of 9C, where you would have to use some effort in heat to reap the rewards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SakuraKoi Posted July 9, 2019 Share Posted July 9, 2019 Propane was once actually implemented in the game. I had it enter once through a void hole (which i still want back even if the event of the asteroid passing a cloud would not exist, it would be a perfect trait right now) and albeit it being useless at that time... it was beautiful, that blue of the liquid I will never forget. I prefer it over some silly synthetic gas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qda Posted July 9, 2019 Author Share Posted July 9, 2019 Propane is so beautiful I could cry over it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nightinggale Posted July 9, 2019 Share Posted July 9, 2019 8 hours ago, Coolthulhu said: Internally, wood generator is referred to as a wood gas generator. It's either an idea for the future or a dropped idea for it to produce some sort of combustible gas from wood. I suspect the idea was to make gas for natural gas generators, but due to game balance, it would be better to make it more like a coal generator to make it an early game power source. The gas approach then became the ethanol approach, which in every way is better. Well better if we ignore the dupes getting stuck picking up tiny amounts of polluted dirt. It really should drop in chunks of 100 kg or something. I also suspect the wood gas was planned for the gas range. That would explain the initial insane amount of gas needed. 8 hours ago, qda said: A wood/coal gaseificator producing syngas and waste products Wood and goal gas is actually primarily carbonmonoxide, though it has other parts, which makes it smell of rotten eggs. It has 70% of the burn value while the remaining 30% stays behind. On top of that, the production isn't free. The common approach is (was) to have two champers with fuel. The bottom one burns hot and heats up the top one. The top one have insufficient air and burns to CO instead of CO2. For producing electricity, burning the wood/coal directly instead of converting to gas will be way more efficient. One interesting twist is the waste product from producing "coal gas" is coke. It can be used like coal except it needs a much higher airflow to burn. It's smoke, soot and odor free because those parts ends up in the gas. This made coke the preferred fuel for heating housing even though it was technically a waste product from the gas works. Wood and coal gas are actually horrible. CO is odorless and deadly, meaning gas leaks have been a killer. This was known when gas works started, but since the gas also contains something, which smells of rotten eggs, it was assumed leaks wouldn't be ignored... well they were wrong. The gas also needs to be cleaned to not deposit solids in the pipes and the solids it deposits during cleaning contains a bunch of toxic stuff. Locations where gas works were once placed are today labeled as highly toxic and can be identified as plots of land where no plants will grow. I'm not recommending wood or coal gas for any purpose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Risu Posted July 9, 2019 Share Posted July 9, 2019 3 hours ago, SakuraKoi said: Propane was once actually implemented in the game. I had it enter once through a void hole (which i still want back even if the event of the asteroid passing a cloud would not exist, it would be a perfect trait right now) and albeit it being useless at that time... it was beautiful, that blue of the liquid I will never forget. I prefer it over some silly synthetic gas. I still kinda miss the old space biome. It was terrifying. Basically the surface was to be filled with void tiles and occasionally the asteroid would enter a gas cloud and all the void tiles in the map would be replaced with spawners for that gas for a period of time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KittenIsAGeek Posted July 9, 2019 Share Posted July 9, 2019 5 hours ago, qda said: So, what could this gas be ? Would "syn" stand for synthetic, as opposed to natural gas. But then what real-life, combustible gas could we possibly synthesize in ONI ? Propane is also a combustible gas that is in the game, though it hasn't shown up in any biomes yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qda Posted July 9, 2019 Author Share Posted July 9, 2019 I tried, but NGGs doesn't accept propane. I feel like propane will be forgotten on release. Sad story Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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