Med Bay Bonuses

[crypticorb]

I was doing some experimentation with room sizes, designs, and efficient layouts, and noticed that I almost never build a med bay. Having survived the outbreak update epidemics, I never really needed to explore the room bonus with any urgency, as preventative measures are FAR more powerful than curative. I usually only use med beds for healing dupes or hypothermia from early game exploration.

After some experimentation in debug and intentionally infecting dupes with diseases, I can't really tell what the bonus does. It's one of a few things:

1. Med Bay bonus suppresses all diseases in the air/surfaces inside the room, keeping them from multiplying as fast?
2. Dupes in med bay that are sick get a recovery bonus while sick. This one seems ineffective on any disease or hypothermia, or it's an invisible bonus.
3. Nothing. The "bonus" is just a side effect of having the room arranged such that sick dupes always wash hands and don't leave.

Med Bay bonus seems pointless and broken, or I'm not seeing where it actually applies. I'd also like to point out that the Pharma Chamber is largely useless, ranked right up there with hydrofan and aerial lure for uselessness. Only time I can see it being useful is for someone playing a hardcore game and screws up really bad.

[Neotuck]

It's been mentioned before the Pharma Chamber is useless

as for the room bonuses don't forget not all rooms provide one

look at:

Power Plant

Greenhouse

Stable

guess the only thing to test is if the "quarantine" is necessary.

Lock up a sick dupe with a healthy dupe to see if the disease spreads (make sure you have low immunity settings on)

[Fischer_L]

Hmm... i'm not 100% sure, but they heal and recover from diseases faster in med bay, you can see that in dupes stats screen. Or i'm just imagining it.

[Neotuck]

1 minute ago, Fischer_L said:

Hmm... i'm not 100% sure, but they heal and recover from diseases faster in med bay, you can see that in dupes stats screen. Or i'm just imagining it.

those bonuses come from the med-beds themselves, not the med bay

[Fischer_L]

Well

11 minutes ago, Neotuck said:

those bonuses come from the med-beds themselves, not the med bay

Yeap, just tested, no recovery bonus, at least for sunburn.

[Sasza22]

Wait isn`t the med bay supposed to make the dupe stay in the room so if he let`s say has slimelung he won`t sneeze all over the base infecting other dupes? The med bay has tables and a toilet so if you add a fridge as well the dupe won`t leave the room (or shouldn`t) and will just stay there giving you more control over the germs he might produce. For food poisoning you can make sure he won`t vomit into your water tank at least.

I guess for stuff like sunburn or hypothermia it`s a useless thing.

As for pharma chambers they are just supposed to speed up the healing. Came in handy my last game when i didn`t notice a vacuum slimelung bomb and got half my colony sick.

[WanderingKid]

Right now the only time you should really care about med bay is if you're playing on higher difficulties.  If that's the case, the absolutely LAST thing you want to have happen until you've got huge décor bombs is to let your dupe stay in the medbay. You lose 6 morale for the main hall alone, which can set off a spiral in the medbay a puker or a destructor.

Medbay itself doesn't lock in dupes.  No food?  They go for a walk.  Bathroom issues? Oh a-hiking-we-will-goooo…  One nice part about medbay is they'll stack six deep if it's time to eat, that 'one table' thing is quite literal.

Slimelung and Hypothermia are your 'sneezing' diseases.  Even on Miserable/Fatal/VH Stress a sneeze in fresh O2 does *nothing*.  A little clever arrangement for your mesh tiles and even food poisoning isn't too big a deal.  Pharma Chamber will get dupes out of slimelung faster, and as far as I've been able to see they act like exosuits for lavatories... I should probably confirm that.

[blash365]

12 hours ago, Neotuck said:

as for the room bonuses don't forget not all rooms provide one

look at:

Power Plant

Greenhouse

Stable

Are you saying those bonuses are just part of the description and not effective in game?

In my book the power plant should increase energy generation, the greenhouse accelerates growth speed and the stable improves the taming time.

[crypticorb]

4 minutes ago, blash365 said:

Are you saying those bonuses are just part of the description and not effective in game?

In my book the power plant should increase energy generation, the greenhouse accelerates growth speed and the stable improves the taming time.

The bonuses of those 3 rooms are applied by the dupes using specific structures. Without the room type and specific structure, the bonus cannot be applied to machines, plants, or critters.

[Sasza22]

32 minutes ago, WanderingKid said:

You lose 6 morale for the main hall alone,

I think they added a passive bonus for sick dupes to counteract that.

 

33 minutes ago, WanderingKid said:

Medbay itself doesn't lock in dupes.  No food?  They go for a walk.

Get a fridge in the medbay and they won`t.

[SakuraKoi]

Pretty sure there is a bonus for Med Bay rest and Pharma Chamber sure heals faster than Beds, brb testing (with my new shiny blank world template/save~)

[Neotuck]

Space is another issue most players have with med-bays.

64 tiles isn't much room to work.  3x21 is the best option that gives 21 tile space to work with

A tolet and mess table is necessary for 3 tiles.  Sink and refrigerator are recommended for another 3 tiles.  That leaves 15 tiles for a good 5 med-beds

3 minutes ago, SakuraKoi said:

Pharma Chamber sure heals faster than Beds,

Only for germ based desieses.  They don't work on physical injuries

[crypticorb]

2 minutes ago, Neotuck said:

Space is another issue most players have with med-bays.

64 tiles isn't much room to work.  3x21 is the best option that gives 21 tile space to work with

Medbays are 96 tiles, I just checked it.

[SakuraKoi]

1 minute ago, Neotuck said:

Only for germ based desieses.  They don't work on physical injuries

And I suppose with Physical you mean only Sunburn and Hit Point loss? Yes, sunburn is only a stress debuff (making them also not go to medbeds themselves) but otherwise it also helps with Hypothermia and Heatstrokes... if I recall correctly, *currently setting all up*

[Neotuck]

1 minute ago, crypticorb said:

Medbays are 96 tiles, I just checked it.

They changed it?  I must have missed that

Just now, SakuraKoi said:

And I suppose with Physical you mean only Sunburn and Hit Point loss? Yes, sunburn is only a stress debuff (making them also not go to medbeds themselves) but otherwise it also helps with Hypothermia and Heatstrokes... if I recall correctly, *currently setting all up*

I'm having to second guess myself as I realized most of my knowledge on med-bays are outdated.

Feel free to run some tests and see if I'm right

[Fischer_L]

1 minute ago, SakuraKoi said:

And I suppose with Physical you mean only Sunburn and Hit Point loss? Yes, sunburn is only a stress debuff (making them also not go to medbeds themselves) but otherwise it also helps with Hypothermia and Heatstrokes... if I recall correctly, *currently setting all up*

My sunburn dupes automaticly go to med bay.

[WanderingKid]

1 hour ago, Sasza22 said:

I think they added a passive bonus for sick dupes to counteract that.

 

Get a fridge in the medbay and they won`t.

The passive bonus is not enough on Fatalistic/VH Stress.  Yes, I know, hard mode.  It's still not enough.  The fact that I'm better off getting them out of med bay and into the great hall occasionally is counter-intuitive.  I'm familiar with the fridge, but you want to try to keep only so many kg in there, otherwise your dupes raid med bay when they want to have lunch at the great hall.

If you're looking to keep your med bay morale above the 6+ from great hall, I recommend you go whole hog on it.  Here are two designs I use depending on need.  They should both have 120+ Décor at all times, but there might be minor gaps in the first one. 

 

[SakuraKoi]

So... first off, it is a PITA to make dupes sick in the first place (well,it takes time), so here is my first batch

Slimelung, Med-Bed Rest, no Bay:

• Health +50/Cycle
• Disease Recovery Speed +15%
• -10% Stress per Cycle
• Breath Change +1%/s

Slimelung, Med-Bed Rest, no Bay, Receiving Care:

• Health +75/Cycle
• Disease Recovery Speed +30%
• -20% Stress per Cycle
• Breath Change +1%/s
• Time Remaining 0.5 Cycles

Slimelung, Pharma Chamber Recover, no Bay:

• Disease Recovery Speed +25%
• -15% Stress per Cycle
• Breath Change +1%/s

Slimelung, Pharma Chamber Recover, no Bay, Receiving Care

• Disease Recovery Speed +50%
• -25% Stress per Cycle
• Breath Change +1%/s
• Time Remaining 0.8 Cycles

in Med-Bay, no change but I have something else to note:

Time Remaining for the Disease varies greatly, no med bay gave me 1.1 to 1.3 Cycles, with it however the disease time was between 3 and 4! Reason is not: In the test without I used clean oxygen, in the med bay test, it was polluted oxygen. The actual Reason eludes me, might be the difference between the difficulty I selected (since my template-save was running slow...)

 

But welp, this test already shows that the advantage of the PC is +10-+20% faster Recovery Speed, longer lasting care and -5% to -10% less Stress per cycle in comparison. The room desc apparently is also merely flavor then. Sunburn and Hypothermia I might do later.

 

[fifty_ducks]

I think its safe to assume diseases and medical are going to get a revisit. It's the last truly 'broken' mechanic in the game, with chlorine, ore scrubbers, balm lilies, pharmachambers, sneezing, hand sanitizers being almost useless. The only marginal thing here is the use of vitamins in harder germ modes. Making calculations about current medbay functions seems a little pointless.

[crypticorb]

12 minutes ago, fifty_ducks said:

I think its safe to assume diseases and medical are going to get a revisit. It's the last truly 'broken' mechanic in the game, with chlorine, ore scrubbers, balm lilies, pharmachambers, sneezing, hand sanitizers being almost useless. The only marginal thing here is the use of vitamins in harder germ modes. Making calculations about current medbay functions seems a little pointless.

Correct on all counts, except for the hand sanitizers part. They're exceptionally useful if you don't want to bother piping water everywhere, and they clean hands far faster than a sink will.

Chlorine can be used with squeaky pufts to make more bleach stone, or liquified and fed to gas grass for natural gas, so it has uses. Chlorine is also a fantastic insulator, for when you don't want to make a vacuum.

[fifty_ducks]

It would be interesting if duskcaps inherited slimelung from the slime, and if bristle blossoms inherited food poisoning from recycled water. Ore Scrubbers could accept food (maybe even be renamed to Food Sterilizer) and it would instantly crank Chlorine up in importance. I can't really say the current uses you listed for Chlorine are useful, per se, except the hand sanitizers.

You could alternatively maybe take vitamins that counteracted the diseased food, or just use the scrubbers, or clean the slime/water first. Choices that ONI is liked for.

[goboking]

On 10/22/2018 at 4:40 AM, Sasza22 said:

Wait isn`t the med bay supposed to make the dupe stay in the room so if he let`s say has slimelung he won`t sneeze all over the base infecting other dupes?

That's what I've always assumed.  I thought the med bay quarantined sick dupes, keeping them from spreading food poisoning on everything they touch or coughing slimelung into the air, and any actual healing bonuses gained are from Care given by other dupes.

23 hours ago, fifty_ducks said:

It would be interesting if duskcaps inherited slimelung from the slime, and if bristle blossoms inherited food poisoning from recycled water. Ore Scrubbers could accept food (maybe even be renamed to Food Sterilizer) and it would instantly crank Chlorine up in importance. I can't really say the current uses you listed for Chlorine are useful, per se, except the hand sanitizers

Using an ore scrubber for food shouldn't be necessary since cooking food (something everyone should be doing anyway) already kills germs.

[Neotuck]

1 minute ago, goboking said:

Using an ore scrubber for food shouldn't be necessary since cooking food (something everyone should be doing anyway) already kills germs.

That only applies to electric grill