Deflation of flint and Golden Tools

[Bossanova]

Hi everyone,

So here's the situation I'm in: my first play-through lasted about 60 in-game days. In that time, I was able to unlock every item through research points and accumulate enough extra points to unlock any newly released recipes. I've made several new worlds to play around with the new content, and flint is basically useless to me now. Gold tools are fairly low-cost once you've researched them, and their durability is great enough that I'm always able to find more gold. This leaves me with a lot of extra flint that either clutters up my inventory or gets left on the ground.

Here are a few suggestions on how to fix this problem:

1) Make gold harder to find

Gold is too easy to get in the current build of the game. I don't know if this is still the case,

but you can give the pig king any of the items you dig up from graves in exchange for about 6 gold nuggets. You can also find gold nuggets lying on the ground in graveyards.

If gold only dropped from 1 out of every 4 boulders, as an example, it would be much harder to get a full set of gold tools. This causes the player use of more basic tools, which require flint as a component. This would also make acquiring research points harder, which the developers may not want to do.

2) Make flint harder to find

Currently, flint is very easy to find just lying on the ground. As an experiment, I've started a new game, and i can already see 2 pieces immediately after starting. If the number of flints that spawned on creation was decreased, the player would have a lot less unused flint. I can see running into problems with this change during early game if the player gets an unlucky starting point and during late game when finite resources begin dwindling.

3) Add more uses for flint

Flint could be used to start fires by itself, or combine with sticks to make "flint and tinder". Flint and tinder could be another tool with durability which you can use to set wood and trees on fire. This is just an example, any new item will do, or even adding it as a component to an already existing recipe would work

4) More research points to unlock recipes/ More new recipes

If unlocking recipes required more research points to unlock, the player would have the trade-off of building gold tools or getting new recipes quicker. This may make basic tools more appealing to use. From what I've been reading about the newest patch, the tier 2 science machines is being added to the game, which may fix this problem.

Thanks for taking our feedback and concerns into consideration. I hope we can help improve this already fantastic game.

[Jov]

I haven't gotten so far in the game as to experience this yet, but that doesn't sound so bad. It's not much different than in other games where you become rich enough that you stop bothering with selling minor loot, for instance. I actually think this experience might by a good thing, as it indicates that you've advanced past the need for a common item, however adding more uses for flint would always be welcome.

[LadyD]

There is promise of a tier two research machine that I believe will change things.

They are always tweaking durability of things as well.

[KonradosHut]

Well, in my honest opinion, I say againw aht I've said before: all these problems would be solved if golden tools were nerfed. I think they are way to powerful. Making them weaker, will force the player to use flint when they can't get any gold, and will spend gold much more quicker.

[cptCalavera]

Well, just nerfing the power of golden tools wouldnt help. As long as they are better you would still use them. And as it is, gold is so easy to find so it isnt really a problem. I think its more important to make them harder to craft. i.e. Make gold harder to come by.

In combination with nerfing the durability ofcourse.

Or even better. make so you still need flint in a golden tool recepie.

[Ravt]

Personally, I agree with the rarity of gold.

Gold is only so valuable because of the pig-king and unique items, and the fact that it doesn't have an opportunity cost--there's nothing else really to spend it on other than the gold tools (Science machines, yeah, I know, but you only build two).

So, it's actually the unique items that are EXTREMELY overvalued. They keep coming back in graves, and they are worth so many research points and gold that they practically devalue both resources.

Try playing through the game without using the pig-king.

THEN try to play the game through without using unique items from graves for research points.

I played that way, and gold tools were no longer overpowered, it took forever to get them and by the time i did, they were just conveniences. It felt MUCH more like I was trying to survive, instead of simply finding valuable items to trade for research and gold.

[Ravt]

I guess my point is that unique items need to be worth a LOT less, and possibly even have alternate uses (then the question is whether to use the unique item for a recipe or use it for points).

[501105]

I have to disagree. At a certain point in the game the supply of flint runs out and the golden tools are the only thing left to continue with as far as I know. Gold tools should stay very powerful for that reason, especially seeing how much research they cost.

Edited November 3, 2012 by 501105

[LadyD]

Besides you can now EAT flint.

[Shadoweangel]

It's been my opinion for a little while now that the whole golden tool thing is kind of weird. Of course, we're talking about a pretty weird game I suppose... That said, as Calavera mentioned, if golden tools required a piece or two of flint as a base (implying that the weapon is just gold coated) it makes it more difficult to create them, and makes them that much more valuable. I feel that flint should have an availability similar to the aforementioned pig kings ability, that way you don't simply run out of the ability to survive. Of course, you could always farm for the rest of your life! =D

[joe78man]

I don't know you, guys, but I didn't find anything that gives me as much points as tallbirds eggs, 80 points. I have a route where I collect 6 of them. They are the best hunger/healing and the best for research. I just used gold for the machines and tools, I don't care for rocks and gold any more.

With so much ahead of us, so much to come, I think is premature to talk about the availability of gold an use as a matter to be taken care of right now

[mobius187]

I don't know you, guys, but I didn't find anything that gives me as much points as tallbirds eggs, 80 points. I have a route where I collect 6 of them. They are the best hunger/healing and the best for research. I just used gold for the machines and tools, I don't care for rocks and gold any more.

With so much ahead of us, so much to come, I think is premature to talk about the availability of gold an use as a matter to be taken care of right now

As I recall anything you dig up from a grave, except a ghost, will give you just as many research points. Right now a bug allows you to re-dig graves every time you load-up the game, so a graveyard of 5-7 tombstones can really let you cash-in on RP. However once the bug is fixed then the tall bird eggs, which are renewable, would be the next best option. Now if only tall birds were faster then stealing their eggs would be so laughably easy.

I also agree that gold should be rare, say 1-in-20 boulders (or a 5% chance) of having gold appear when a boulder is cracked open. That would lead to a lot more mining.

I would still leave the Boss pig man trade in place, once the grave respawn bug is fixed that will make abusing such trades a non-issue. After all the items from graves are worth a lot of RP. As I recall gold is worth 10 RP, while a grave items is worth 80 RP, so if you get fewer than 8 gold then you're not going to gain as much RP even if you do decide to feed it into the science machine later.

Maybe they could even create unique and inventive ways to get more gold... like a ruined temple island filled with traps and a gold idol at its heart. Then if you include an invention that breaks-down items into base parts, the gold idol could be converted into gold ore. Just a thought.

[cptCalavera]

Honey gives 80 as well. By far the easieast way to farm points if you build a few bee boxes.

[Toaster Fu]

I just tried honey the other day and it was nerfed to 5 science points.

[joe78man]

Last time I checked gold gives you 15rp

[Excess]

Honey gives 80 as well. By far the easieast way to farm points if you build a few bee boxes.

But in order to to that, you have to build TONS of bugnets to catch enough honey from bees to make said bee boxes. And those bugnets take LOADS of silk to make, which ain't easy to come by early on (you'll probably need to unlock first the log suit (200RP) and the spear (another 200RP).

I think honey is worth a lot of points because by that point you've accomplished a lot and already unlocked the most vital things.

EDIT

I just tried honey the other day and it was nerfed to 5 science points.

Really? that sucks

Edited November 4, 2012 by Excess
It really does.

[Toaster Fu]

They also nerfed how quickly the bee boxs make honey.

[Shadoweangel]

I'm mostly okay with the research point nerf, as honey was a little overpowered in that respect. Not too happy about the bee box rate, but hey. Either way, Kevin was recently talking about doing away with research points as we know them, as the intended effects wasn't achieved. You can read more about it in Suggestion: Research Points.

[mobius187]

I'm mostly okay with the research point nerf, as honey was a little overpowered in that respect. Not too happy about the bee box rate, but hey. Either way, Kevin was recently talking about doing away with research points as we know them, as the intended effects wasn't achieved. You can read more about it in Suggestion: Research Points.

Well in all honesty how much scientific advancement can be gained from honey? So I agree with this update (i.e. nerfing honey). Also, I'm curious as to how Research Points will be changed. I mean, in some ways it makes sense that a core level change needs to be made, because while RPs make perfect sense for Wilson, the other characters aren't scientists... so it just seems odd. Also I'm against unlockables carrying over between games. I mean, if you have the Meat Effigy and respawn that way, fine, but otherwise death should force you to start from the beginning (IMHO). I'll check the thread...