Flooding buildings for cooling - which ones work?

[martosss]

I am thinking of using a Thermoregulator to cool down air coming from my Electrolyzers. I just saw that I can't build them inside a pool of water. So is there anything else that I can cool down in water except the Aquatuner? Hm, I'm just going to test all of them.

Which buildings can be built that way without flooding?

• Aquatuner works - I've done it and seen it.
• Tepidizer works  - it's even written in the tips and you're advised to submerge it
• Algae terarium works? I just tested it and I don't get a flooding message
• Food storage works - fridge and food box - does food spoil under water? It says temperature above 4°C spoils food more quickly, so I guess Either submerge it in ice water or use CO2
• Fish trap and Fish release - what a surprise!
• Plumbing
• Tasteful memorial - a proper burial for your fish
• Conveyor loader and receptacle work
• Duplicant checkpoint - only for Diver lungs dupers
• Ice statue works - I've used it to transfer Ice in my hot clean water source .. not the most efficient way to do it unfortunately. It melts relatively quickly.

And what does NOT work?

• Batteries
• Coal Generators
• H2 Generator
• hamster wheels+ drowning dupes
• Electrolyzer - needs pressure
• CO2 scrubber floods as well, I think?
• Thermoregulator doesn't work - just tested in sandbox mode
• Deoxydizers (Algae eaters for O2)
• Deodorizers - no air under water anyways
• Musher and Grill
• Critter drop-off/feeder
• Planter boxes and farm tiles - apparently even fully submerged in a (hydroponic) farm tile doesn't work, neither does planter box - you still need to pump water and waste time to irrigate them
• All other non-fish items from the food section
• All buildings from the Refinement(7) tab
• All buildings in the Medicine tab except the Tasteful Memorial
• Almost all other advanced buildings(including Auto sweeper)

 

Any ideas of what we can do under water except drown?

• I've seen storage containers submerged to kill slime-lung bacteria - that, I must admit, is a pretty smart solution to the problem.
• Liquid doors can be used to keep gases from mixing, e.g. O2 and Chlorine or CO2 for a farm.
• Algae terrarium will probably produce polluted water and contaminate clean water, so we should probably avoid it?

 

• vents are glitchy and can output regardless of pressure if slightly submerged in water(what's the exact volume that works?)

Hm, here's a funny idea - What if

• We make a conveyor belt that runs through a pool of water and load it with ice - will that melt and make a nice cold pool of water? Or if we load it with Ice-cold granite from the Antarctic ... should have a similar effect on warm water?

 

I'm open to ideas and suggestions.

[AndreyKl]

3 hours ago, martosss said:

• Algae terarium works? I just tested it and I don't get a flooding message

It can suck in water by itself from environment (or at least it could). I remember using it to remove small quantities of water.

[Neotuck]

try drip cooling thermal regulators 

3 hours ago, martosss said:

(Hydroponic) farm tiles work .. can they suck water without a pump that way?

they work but the plant will drown

[martosss]

1 hour ago, Neotuck said:

try drip cooling thermal regulators

too glitchy to fit my universe - the gods of heat deletion will get angry and unleash their wraith upon me if I do it

1 hour ago, Neotuck said:

they work but the plant will drown

Yes, as I said above,

4 hours ago, martosss said:

 

• Can Planter boxes and farm tiles be used partially submerged? Will plants die? OK, just tested it - apparently even fully submerged in a (hydroponic) farm tile doesn't work, neither does planter box - you still need to pump water and waste time to irrigate them.

Hm, I'll just go and edit that to put it in the right place, so people don't get confused.

 

[Neotuck]

1 minute ago, martosss said:

too glitchy to fit my universe - the gods of heat deletion will get angry and unleash their wraith upon me if I do it

You misunderstood me, I wasn't referring to the drip heat deletion bug that was patched some time ago

Drip cooling now means running water over the tiles were a hot machinery (like regulators) sits.  The water functions like a heat sink between the machine and the tiles

As long as there's a place for water to flow off the tiles the water level won't rise high enough to flood the machinery 

[martosss]

3 minutes ago, Neotuck said:

 drip heat deletion bug that was patched some time ago

So it is fixed now?

3 minutes ago, Neotuck said:

Drip cooling now means running water over the tiles were a hot machinery (like regulators) sits.  The water functions like a heat sink between the machine and the tiles

Hm, so you drip cold water from a vent on top of the machinery? and that cold water doesn't delete heat, but just transfers it? and then when it drips further down it doesn't delete more heat?

3 minutes ago, Neotuck said:

As long as there's a place for water to flow off the tiles the water level won't rise high enough to flood the machinery 

So it's basically flooding the building without flooding it to drastically improve the heat exchange with the neighboring tiles? Sounds cool. I still doubt that the heat deletion is fixed, though.

[Neotuck]

It's fixed, the borg cube doesn't work anymore

[Sevio]

@martosss You can cool buildings that are vulnerable to flooding with liquids! You just need to make sure there is less than 350 kg of liquid in their tiles. So give a thermo regulator a layer of 50 kg of petroleum and you'll give it amazing cooling. You could probably boil water with it without damaging it, probably not polluted water though.

[martosss]

On 7/9/2018 at 10:03 PM, Sevio said:

@martosss You can cool buildings that are vulnerable to flooding with liquids! You just need to make sure there is less than 350 kg of liquid in their tiles. So give a thermo regulator a layer of 50 kg of petroleum and you'll give it amazing cooling. You could probably boil water with it without damaging it, probably not polluted water though.

OK, thanks, that's awesome! I saw some setups for liquid O2 with 10-20 consecutive Thermoregulators and running water over them and thought that was the drip cooling bug, but I guess it's just water increasing the Heat exchange rate. I have to try that later.

[BlueLance]

ALL HAIL THE DEATH OF DRIP COOLING!

I also need to look into using thermo regulators, see if I can use it to cool steam geysers instead of using an aquatuner and PH20

[suicide commando]

small amounts of water don't' flood buildings, so letting it flow/drip down onto machinery and then further down etc. is an excellent way of cooling things, I've used it in the past, and it works like a charm, just don't use pH2O in a low pressure environment, or it will begin off gassing that pesky pO2. ( unless you've got things locked down or whatever of course )

@BlueLanceif you mean using a thermos regulator with say some radiant pipes containing H2 gas, that should work, however, be careful NOT to put the radiant pipes through the geyser itself.
 

I've found that geysers at the moment are impossible to cool down from their temperature and trying to leech the heat away just results in everything around it heating up ridiculously high. This killed a base of mine, when I had used temp shift plates around a couple of geysers to disperse the heat from the steam.. instead of just the steam heat, it also dispersed the infinite heat from the geysers themselves around.
 

[BlueLance]

33 minutes ago, suicide commando said:

if you mean using a thermos regulator with say some radiant pipes containing H2 gas, that should work, however, be careful NOT to put the radiant pipes through the geyser itself.

My current build goes through the geyser and instantly condenses the steam, I just want to try using Hydrogen instead of polluted water. Since I am sure the aquatuner is much more power usage than a thermo regulator.

[suicide commando]

Actually, when it comes to power/heat transfer, aquatuners, while requiring more power, are more efficient at extracting heat from their contents, but that's not what I'm hinting at.

If you run your pipes directly through the tiles that are covered by the steam geyser, you will not just cool down the steam, but also pick up a horrid amount of extra heat from the geyser itself, which is scalding hot, and from what I can tell doesn't go down in temperature anymore like it used to be possible to cool down a geyser itself.
As such, you want to avoid heat exchange with the geyser itself as much as possible, because this will only produce more heat for you to get rid of.
 

 

[BlueLance]

24 minutes ago, suicide commando said:

If you run your pipes directly through the tiles that are covered by the steam geyser, you will not just cool down the steam, but also pick up a horrid amount of extra heat from the geyser itself, which is scalding hot, and from what I can tell doesn't go down in temperature anymore like it used to be possible to cool down a geyser itself.

I think this might have been a bug, because even when the geyser is not erupting etc there is no heat transfer, the water just keeps circulating without increasing in temperature, both in a pure vacuum build and a non vacuum build.

[heckubis]

thermal regulators are easy to use without over heating them.. put a valve after the regulator and limit it to less then the intake. if the O2 your cooling is coming in at 1k/s(2 pumps) i would go with 500g/s on the valve.  the regulator will wait longer between actions making it generate heat less. you can run them in series or in paired sets depending on how cool or how much volume your processing. the trick is the valve at the end

Imagine the regulator and a few other things are the motor on your car.... you wouldnt run it at maximum Rpm constantly and expect it not to over heat and break down.

[suicide commando]

7 hours ago, BlueLance said:

I think this might have been a bug, because even when the geyser is not erupting etc there is no heat transfer, the water just keeps circulating without increasing in temperature, both in a pure vacuum build and a non vacuum build.

Possibly, however if it's a bug, it's an active one.. I made the mistake again recently, and I noticed high increase of the coolant's temperature when I ran the pipes through the area where a geyser was located.

[martosss]

19 hours ago, heckubis said:

thermal regulators are easy to use without over heating them.. put a valve after the regulator and limit it to less then the intake. if the O2 your cooling is coming in at 1k/s(2 pumps) i would go with 500g/s on the valve.  the regulator will wait longer between actions making it generate heat less. you can run them in series or in paired sets depending on how cool or how much volume your processing. the trick is the valve at the end

Imagine the regulator and a few other things are the motor on your car.... you wouldnt run it at maximum Rpm constantly and expect it not to over heat and break down.

Or maybe I'll improve cooling instead? After all, If I need to cool that 1kg of water, it won't make a big difference if I have 1 TR running at 1kg/s or 2 at 500g/s. Maybe cooling will be easier since I increase area/space ... but ... then again - you need that area.

[heckubis]

sadly the liquid regulator scales its process with the volume its processing unlike the thermal regulators that have allways worked like this.

i do recommend tho using the regulators in a septic tank so the heat from the regulators heats the water to kill food poisoning. i use this to make my clean cold water for cooling and air and still have a cold water spare tank its feeding. i have a washroom loop and a pwater vent feeding it so no shortage of water  all my radiator lines run about 150g/s-300g/s in granite

[Hanmac]

Reed Fiber works underwater

You still need to pump in polluted water but it works

[martosss]

On 7/11/2018 at 12:45 PM, suicide commando said:

small amounts of water don't' flood buildings, so letting it flow/drip down onto machinery and then further down etc. is an excellent way of cooling things, I've used it in the past, and it works like a charm, just don't use pH2O in a low pressure environment, or it will begin off gassing that pesky pO2. 

Alright, small amounts of water, here's an example ...

I just dug a large well above my sieves and let the water drip in the polluted water well that I use for generating pure water. The pool that poured over them had around 20t of water, so it's normal to flood the buildings. However, After relatively dripping(around 2-3l of water/tile on the left, total 10leters), the Sieve is still flooded ... so I'm curious what's the amount that floods, if even 5l don't work.

 

@heckubis, Why are you using insulated pipes? No Abyssalite? If you do have it, you don't need isolated, just do normal pipes with Abys., they're isolators since abys doesn't transfer heat in a human ilfespan.

Also, right now I don't have much problems with water, since I uncovered 2 ice biomes(1 is hot already, in the picture above) + 2 cool steam vents, and for the 2nd ice biome I melted the ice and polluted water, so now I have a huge well of polluted water @~5°C + 2 containers of ice that I"m waiting to melt(around 30 tons, that should last for a long time).

And there's still a bunch of ice that hasn't melted above the polluted water. I plan to separate it with a row of tiles, so it doesn't mix with Polluted water

So there you have it:

1. ice cold water for berries
2. sieve water for toilets and cooling volcanoes( a gold one! Although I also use the ice for it - but it melts too slowly)
3. hot water from volcano and cool steam vents for electrolyzers

Unfortunately 2) and 3) are basically exploits, since sieve and electrolyzer have fixed output. If they worked properly(heated output relatively or just didn't change its temperature) It would be more challenging, I think, to fight with the heat. Then I suppose the AETN and wheezies would be your main weapons(if you don't use other heat deletion exploits, like boiling hatches and then killing them ).

Spoiler

 

[abud]

6 minutes ago, martosss said:

the Sieve is still flooded ... so I'm curious what's the amount that floods, if even 5l don't work.

It supposed to be around 150kg IIRC (until CU, not sure if it changed recently). But flood detection not instant, your screenshot probably one of that case. Try reloading your game if it low enough but still flooded.

[martosss]

Just now, abud said:

It supposed to be around 150kg IIRC (until CU, not sure if it changed recently). But flood detection not instant, your screenshot probably one of that case. Try reloading your game if it low enough but still flooded.

I just plan to mop everything or wait for it to drip, although waiting doesn't seem to work well. I was just curious if anyone knows the amounts, I've read things about 350 kg/tile, not sure if it's correct though.

[abud]

21 minutes ago, martosss said:

I've read things about 350 kg/tile, not sure if it's correct though.

I never use more than 100 kg, so I cannot confirm which one is correct. They are necessary for heat transfer inside a vacuum, but useful too outside it to accelerate heat transfer.

This thing not flooded, maybe need more liquid?

[AnotherBoris]

Maybe I missed something, but why not:

1) Cool the thermoregulator with a liquid radiator?
2) Cool the air by passing it through a pool of cold oil?

In any case, the received heat needs to be transferred somewhere and I'm pretty sure that it will be given to some liquid.

[martosss]

7 minutes ago, AnotherBoris said:

Maybe I missed something, but why not:
1) Cool the thermoregulator with a liquid radiator?
2) Cool the air by passing it through a pool of cold oil?
In any case, the received heat needs to be transferred somewhere and I'm pretty sure that it will be given to some liquid.

Hydrogen dipped Wheezies are also hungry for heat - I'm deleting 30°C from 1kg O2 packets using 4 wheezies and 5kg of Hydrogen. But water might do a better job, besides, you can always cook it in the sieve or fry it in the electrolyzer .. those fixed input exploits help a lot with heat management.