Nicolews Posted January 30, 2016 Share Posted January 30, 2016 I know some of you will cry havoc on "yet another poison thread", but I still think poison is interesting and should not stand at the "Ruin early game, ignore late game" current state. Easiest solutions are often the best, so I tried to stay simple. To address the early game concern, I think we need a new basic item intended to give enough time to create a Science Machine and find the components for antivenom, at a hefty cost (Sanity loss, no armor/backpacks, has to be remade daily). It must not completely negate the poison damage - character's still dying. Example : Improvised bandage (4 flowers, 1 butterfly wing, 4 grass). Worn on chest, 1 day durability. When worn, it slows poison, lengthening the time between two ticks at the cost of a sanity drain. To address the late game concern, I think the main thing stopping poison from being relevant late game is the fact that antivenoms and glands can be stockpiled. Simple solution would be to add make Antivenoms and venom glands spoil in 3 days and allow them to be stored in a ice box. I think that preventing stockpiles of antivenoms would go a long way to keep poison feared in the late game stages. I don't know if this is feasible, but I think Shell armors should lose durability quicker, but should be fixable with new shells. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/63494-poison-two-ideas-to-balance-poison-at-all-stage-ofthe-game-without-nerfing-it/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hezel Posted January 30, 2016 Share Posted January 30, 2016 Poison is balanced. Seaweed and butterfly wings being such strong healing items make it that it's hard to die from it. The main thing with poison is that it's your fault if you get hit by a venomous mob. The effect being punishing makes sense. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/63494-poison-two-ideas-to-balance-poison-at-all-stage-ofthe-game-without-nerfing-it/#findComment-715431 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nicolews Posted January 30, 2016 Author Share Posted January 30, 2016 12 minutes ago, Hezel said: Poison is balanced. Seaweed and butterfly wings being such strong healing items make it that it's hard to die from it. The main thing with poison is that it's your fault if you get hit by a venomous mob. The effect being punishing makes sense. I respectfully disagree with the "balanced" part. I agree it is easy enough to prevent once you know the basics, but balance would mean that getting poisoned by mistake on Day 5 with no specific preparation, is the same as getting poisoned Day 50, with no specific preparation. I'm not pushing for a nerf. Hell, I'd support buffing poison, provided it comes with modifications that makes it always a significant threat, no matter which stage of the game. I love the tension that strikes when a yellow mob appears, and I hate that it quickly becomes a thing of the past as when you have a dozen glands in a chest. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/63494-poison-two-ideas-to-balance-poison-at-all-stage-ofthe-game-without-nerfing-it/#findComment-715435 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ginosaji Posted January 30, 2016 Share Posted January 30, 2016 it's very balanced early game like @Hezel pointed out, but I really like the idea of keeping poisoning relevant later in the game. it really would help if a antivenom would lose its effect after a while, making it useless for keeping in the camp for longer periods of time. the glands should stay as it is though, because of the poisonous weapons which can be crafted from it. making a new antivenom would require the player to pick new seaweeds which takes a little bit of time and since poison does ramp up, I think it should work by days survived on that world instead of staying poisoned for several days, because poisoning is fixed in less than half a day if the player has a glands and corals at the camp and only needs to go on the boat for 20 sec to pick 3 seaweeds. out of fun i went idle while being poisoned in godmode and it gets very intense after a few days time. the interval is every sec receiving damaged instead of every 3 sec or so what it usually is at the beginning and every damage tick was 4 hp. I'm sure it would ramp up even more but that was already very spooky. give us something like this immediately after we got poisoned and survived for a few seasons. that should keep poisoning relevant for late game survival. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/63494-poison-two-ideas-to-balance-poison-at-all-stage-ofthe-game-without-nerfing-it/#findComment-715436 Share on other sites More sharing options...
grekon Posted January 30, 2016 Share Posted January 30, 2016 4 hours ago, Nicolews said: "Ruin early game, ignore late game" Its a lie some dudes that can't handle poison thought of. The threat of poison is very low. It is slightly increased in monsoon season as poison mosquitos start spawning. You need as much preparation for poison as you need for a night. Anyone who thinks that the antidote is the main way to deal with poison is just bad. That's not how to deal with the mechanic. Seems like you already read the other threads, go back and reread them for ways to avoid poison. As for lategame, you don't want to make it so harsh that it would kill a player just because they played for 300 days and made a small mistake and got poisoned. I never carry anti-venom with me even in monsoon season. If I get poisoned I just go back to my base get the poison gland and other stuff and make the potion then. I have reefs stocked in my cargo boat and venom gland in my base. So expiration date doesn't change anything and may make things annoying. Still if you have interesting ideas I am all for it. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/63494-poison-two-ideas-to-balance-poison-at-all-stage-ofthe-game-without-nerfing-it/#findComment-715478 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swabbleman Posted January 30, 2016 Share Posted January 30, 2016 What if anti-venom was nerfed? If it took about a day to fully cure your poisoning and in the mean time gradually slowed down the rate at which poison kills you getting poisoned wouldn't simply mean having to pop an anti-venom and then forgetting about it, instead it would always be a valid concern. On the other hand it could work as a preventative measure, preventing poisoning for about a day after you use it. This would also mean that if you're still recovering from poisoning you can't just get poisoned again, so there would be some strategy to it. (Also remove WX-78's poison resistance, he was OP without it) Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/63494-poison-two-ideas-to-balance-poison-at-all-stage-ofthe-game-without-nerfing-it/#findComment-715484 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Misaki Posted January 30, 2016 Share Posted January 30, 2016 54 minutes ago, Swabbleman said: (Also remove WX-78's poison resistance, he was OP without it) There is a reason why he needs it, with 100 health and gears being often hell to locate one bad bite combined with the fact that you can lose lots of your health because waves take away so many of it would quickly shut down unfortunate worlds. Also, he's a robot, robots don't exactly... have blood... Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/63494-poison-two-ideas-to-balance-poison-at-all-stage-ofthe-game-without-nerfing-it/#findComment-715495 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThaumicParrot Posted January 31, 2016 Share Posted January 31, 2016 I think poison is pretty balanced at this point. For lategame though, perhaps a kind of sickly sea-hound could come in the hound waves and could poison you. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/63494-poison-two-ideas-to-balance-poison-at-all-stage-ofthe-game-without-nerfing-it/#findComment-715564 Share on other sites More sharing options...
zuriumob Posted January 31, 2016 Share Posted January 31, 2016 Im down with swabbleman´s idea, exept for the WX-78 part, as misaki pointed out. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/63494-poison-two-ideas-to-balance-poison-at-all-stage-ofthe-game-without-nerfing-it/#findComment-715709 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nicolews Posted January 31, 2016 Author Share Posted January 31, 2016 I agree that making antivenom work gradually would work just as well (no opinion towards WX-78 state though) Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/63494-poison-two-ideas-to-balance-poison-at-all-stage-ofthe-game-without-nerfing-it/#findComment-715710 Share on other sites More sharing options...
PanAzej Posted January 31, 2016 Share Posted January 31, 2016 Anything that would force player to go back from his adventure ALL THE TIME just to get an Anti-Venom is a bad idea, imo. It's bad enough that you are swarmed by poisonous mosquitos for a whole season, we don't need more of this annoying crap. What, you'd like more poisonous creatures? Around day 100 you have fair share of poisonous snakes, a lot more of stinkrays appear and you can get poisoned by those holes on swamp, also by spider warriors (spider queens will appear on islands you haven't visited in some time and spawn them, for sure). What else? Do you seriously want for player to look for more ingredients for Anti-Venom at all times? Would that be fun? This would force the player in later stages to use only Shell Armor. That's just... bad. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/63494-poison-two-ideas-to-balance-poison-at-all-stage-ofthe-game-without-nerfing-it/#findComment-715714 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ginosaji Posted January 31, 2016 Share Posted January 31, 2016 2 hours ago, PanAzej said: Anything that would force player to go back from his adventure ALL THE TIME just to get an Anti-Venom is a bad idea, imo. It's bad enough that you are swarmed by poisonous mosquitos for a whole season, we don't need more of this annoying crap. What, you'd like more poisonous creatures? Around day 100 you have fair share of poisonous snakes, a lot more of stinkrays appear and you can get poisoned by those holes on swamp, also by spider warriors (spider queens will appear on islands you haven't visited in some time and spawn them, for sure). What else? Do you seriously want for player to look for more ingredients for Anti-Venom at all times? Would that be fun? This would force the player in later stages to use only Shell Armor. That's just... bad. how are you looking all the time for antivenoms? the mosquitos are part of a season, now don't start controversies here like we had in the past where people said overheating is too strong or rain is too much. you could completely remove puddles on your island with sandbags and remove the spawners or deal all season with mosquitos. it's nothing else but another season where you go with insulated clothings to protect yourself from the elements. the seashell armor is pretty much part of the monsoon season unless you've stockpiled on anti venoms for free hits by mosquitos. you can still avoid all threats that can poison you. don't like spider warriors and queens? okay, then get better at emptying dens and kill tier 3's before they could turn to queens. use box traps if you can't help yourself otherwise. don't like poisonous snakes? fine, then don't keep any near your base by burning jungle trees for charcoal and digging up vine bush spawner. don't like poison holes? well, dig them up. it's not hard especially not when you go seashell armor + gas mask if you want to pick some new reeds. don't like stinkrays? uhm, who said that you have to fight them? the player is always faster than the rays if he uses a sail so just keep going and you're fine. it's so easy to avoid poisoning that it should be a fatal threat to the player. the player already has a easy time with poisoning as it is, if you consider that all creatures get thair movement speed, attack speed and damage reduced while the player keeps all that and only loses 2 hp every 5 sec and a sanity drainage. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/63494-poison-two-ideas-to-balance-poison-at-all-stage-ofthe-game-without-nerfing-it/#findComment-715741 Share on other sites More sharing options...
PanAzej Posted January 31, 2016 Share Posted January 31, 2016 Yes, I didn't say that poison is hard or something. In later game it's just annoying. "Oh crap, I got hit. Well, guess I have to go back to my base soon." I don't want for it to become even more of an annoyance. I don't want poisonous hounds (sit in your base on your toothtrap field or get poisoned) nor I want it to become stronger ("oh I can't even finish what I'm doing, I gotta drop everything and go right away"). It's fine as it is. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/63494-poison-two-ideas-to-balance-poison-at-all-stage-ofthe-game-without-nerfing-it/#findComment-715790 Share on other sites More sharing options...
zzKratoszz Posted February 1, 2016 Share Posted February 1, 2016 On 1/30/2016 at 3:27 PM, Misaki said: There is a reason why he needs it, with 100 health and gears being often hell to locate one bad bite combined with the fact that you can lose lots of your health because waves take away so many of it would quickly shut down unfortunate worlds. Also, he's a robot, robots don't exactly... have blood... I disagree with this. When the dlc was released he got poisoned just like everyone else. It also had a tool tip explaining why which I can't remember right now. Also, water is just as avoidable as poison. Just don't get hit by it. And the health loss from water is very low, only doing significant damage if you stay wet for long periods of time. Also I find more gears (thanks to clock works constantly spawning) than I will ever know what to do with. You can find them randomly by exploring, they spawn around dead whales, and also several set pieces. Of course, they might be hard to find the day you start a new world but not much can go wrong in calm season. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/63494-poison-two-ideas-to-balance-poison-at-all-stage-ofthe-game-without-nerfing-it/#findComment-715850 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swabbleman Posted February 1, 2016 Share Posted February 1, 2016 17 hours ago, zzKratoszz said: When the dlc was released he got poisoned just like everyone else. It also had a tool tip explaining why which I can't remember right now. Also, water is just as avoidable as poison. Just don't get hit by it. And the health loss from water is very low, only doing significant damage if you stay wet for long periods of time. Also I find more gears (thanks to clock works constantly spawning) than I will ever know what to do with. You can find them randomly by exploring, they spawn around dead whales, and also several set pieces. Of course, they might be hard to find the day you start a new world but not much can go wrong in calm season. The line you're looking for is about removing contamination from his system when inspecting antivenom. It's a silly simple excuse, good enough for the realism of Don't Starve. Anyway, couple what Kratos said with an umbrella and a football helmet and during the rainy seasons you'll be pelted with lightning for frequent heals. Sure, you'll be insane, but you'll have a constant light source while moving at breakneck speeds, especially on water. Raw sea weed is an excellent food source since you will constantly be insane anyway while even Terrorbeaks will have trouble keeping up with you. You get CRAZY amounts of exploration done this way. Anyway, this is my case for him not needing poison resistance to be viable. We might not want to dwell on this subject too much longer as it's only tangentially related, so sorry for bringing it up Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/63494-poison-two-ideas-to-balance-poison-at-all-stage-ofthe-game-without-nerfing-it/#findComment-716143 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Misaki Posted February 2, 2016 Share Posted February 2, 2016 13 hours ago, Swabbleman said: Anyway, this is my case for him not needing poison resistance to be viable. We might not want to dwell on this subject too much longer as it's only tangentially related, so sorry for bringing it up Playing as WX-78 in Shipwrecked is like being constantly poisoned anyway, Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/63494-poison-two-ideas-to-balance-poison-at-all-stage-ofthe-game-without-nerfing-it/#findComment-716503 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.
Please be aware that the content of this thread may be outdated and no longer applicable.