Make structures non flammable by peoples own hands?

[Vanderer]

I know i'm not posting in the suggestions thread, but not many people read that.

 

Just came out of a doomed game of DST. A particular person, trolling as Willow ironically, burned a camp down and there was nothing anyone could do about it. I was passing by and tried to help, but alas, most of it went up in flames.

If they were dead, at least it would be harder to troll setting things alight, but it still can happen. Not to mention that they could just stay on as a ghost and troll anyway.

 

Perhaps for the sake of making multiplayer less annoying, any man made structures, from farms to dry racks to crock pots and so forth cannot be burned down by people. Burning such as overheating in the summer and being set aflame by lighting do not apply, as that is caused by natural game mechanics, and not some random jackass. Trees and berry bushes, grass and twigs can still be set alight, and whatever other natural thing there is in the game, but structures are a no go. 

 

(Edit, since now we have some good replies)

 

To go more in depth, if not an outright no choice implemented mechanic, it could be turned on or off by a host or selected at the create world screen.

 

If an implemented mechanic, it could purely just be for modes that aren't pvp.

In pvp you try and murder people. Heck, being a jerk here would actually make sense.

 

As for the whole leaving a trail behind to set structures alight which several users have mentioned, since the trail of items is a unnatural occurrence as in done by a player, when it gets to the last bit of grass or such and starts to smolder, if it detects a structure right afterwards, it will cancel itself out. Thanks XirmiX for the suggestion.

 

User GiddyGuy suggested when a user logs out, their structures are for the taking for being burned or destroyed. 

 

User Malk mentioned owner ground. It would permit people to have made structures which cannot be burned/hammered without permission. They raised the point of it being misused, but it would have an auto detect if said thing was placed near rare items, and would not be allowed. 

 

As rude as their comment was, User TrueAlphaOmega suggested an alarm and traps. I like this idea, but the rudeness was not needed. For everyone else commenting, please try to be respectful. A variety of ideas is good.

 

ThaumicParrot suggested a common sense meter. Structures could not be burned down if they are in vicinity of another player made structure.

 

Keep those comments coming. We have some new ideas now and they are pretty neat.

 

[Asparagus]

Or just ban them... or vote kick...

[Vanderer]

Or just ban them... or vote kick...

 

Many games are done by a hosted computer, without an actual person host on there.

Trying to votekick them is rather... Futile.... As that requires the, I suppose leader of the server on there.

[Asparagus]

Many games are done by a hosted computer, without an actual person host on there. Trying to votekick them is rather... Futile.... As that requires the, I suppose leader of the server on there.

 

 

"Vote" but without the moderator... I usually just help other people when trolling happens but if it's too irreversible, I just leave... so sad...

 

And that's why I seek out PVPs just so I can hunt trolls down... that's kind of a thing with me now... Grab your torches and pitchforks (well not in-game pitchforks since they're not good weapons)

 

With a simple torch you can burn trolls at the cost of accidental burning... but killing them makes them stronger trolls... incapacitate them and seal them around moon rock walls... but it's too labor intensive...

 

Remote Console stuff!! 

[jbeetle]

That'd be inconsistent game mechanics and would lead to confusion. However, if it was done in a way that made any sense at all,  then sure.

[GiddyGuy]

Couldn't they also make a hammer and hammer it down? I think ownership of the structures would be better who ever made the structures can hammer them down or burn them how ever they like.

 

Edit: ALMOST FORGOT if said player logs out then other players can hammer it down and set it on fire it's fair at least to me >:3

[Vanderer]

Couldn't they also make a hammer and hammer it down? I think ownership of the structures would be better who ever made the structures can hammer them down or burn them how ever they like.

 

Edit: ALMOST FORGOT if said player logs out then other players can hammer it down and set it on fire it's fair at least to me >:3

 

Yes, they could as easily just hammer it down, but at least this way it solves one problem. One less way to annoy people is always a good thing.

 

Ownership is a neat idea, though chests would need to be considered on different grounds. Also, if someone owns a farm, could someone else take the crops? This is where things start to get a little sketchy.

[XirmiX]

I agree with @Vanderer, and honestly, this would prevent a lot of bases burning down! While in winter someone might need to burn a single tree to keep warm, or burn one in order to get charcoal, the structures are not typically burnt down by players willing to participate in the gameplay!

 

Question: Well what if someone burns a Berry bush, which would cause a chain reaction for burning down the whole base?

Suggestion: What if you were only able to burn down tree, bushes, grass, twigs and such if they did not cause chain reaction, so for example, you would only be able to light a tree on fire when it's distanced away from anything else burnable to an extent that the fire won't spread anywhere else. This would also prevent forest fires made by players from occurring while still allowing anyone to get charcoal at a decent amount.

[TemporaryMan]

Sounds like a lot of calculations going on behind the scenes in order to determine if a tree can be burned or not.  Finding all objects physically close to another tends to be an expensive task for computers.  And what's to stop a griefer from lighting a tree a safe distance away, and then dropping a trail of grass to the base afterward?

 

Plus, I like to plant burn yards -- small copses of trees safely away from anything of value that I can burn for charcoal.  Forbidding chain reactions would force me to find lone, isolated trees which takes a lot more time.

[Bahlsen]

I feel you my friend, I just had 7 hours of coworking ruined in seconds...Then again, you can't do anything against that on dedicated servers. Among all the things which could be done to prevent this, let me post my suggestion again http://forums.kleientertainment.com/topic/51926-anti-griefing-idea/#entry620644

[Isosurface]

Then again, you can't do anything against that on dedicated servers.

 

It's certainly preventable, with mods: http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=404161345

The mod works against hammer, torch, lighter, explosive, ghost and fire propagation. It does not prevent natural mobs, natural events, or server admin from destroying your buildings.

 

There are other ways to destroy player buildings such as using The End is Nigh, but griefers normally won't hang around long enough to plan and carry out those more sophisticated attacks.

[XirmiX]

Sounds like a lot of calculations going on behind the scenes in order to determine if a tree can be burned or not.  Finding all objects physically close to another tends to be an expensive task for computers.  And what's to stop a griefer from lighting a tree a safe distance away, and then dropping a trail of grass to the base afterward?

 

Plus, I like to plant burn yards -- small copses of trees safely away from anything of value that I can burn for charcoal.  Forbidding chain reactions would force me to find lone, isolated trees which takes a lot more time.

Ahh! This is what I was gonna talk about before, but forgot to mention it!

 

If someone puts pieces of grass or pieces of something inbetween an object before burning, the burning process won't happen; it would be impossible and ergo the griefer would be kicked.

 

Question: What if the griefer lights something on fire and then puts something to trail the fire to burn other things?

Suggestion (reasonably an answer if this kind of mechanic gets implemented): If this happens, remember that things will be smouldering first. Say a griefer burns a tree and then puts a grass in-between to burn the rest of the base, the grass might quickly take on fire, but say the next thing in line is the alchemy engine. If this is dicovered, then grass could be extinguished, or if not then the alchemy engine could be extinguished in time and that won't be too much of a fuss as grass will burn down quickly, so further smouldering won't happen. The system might not be perfect, but it would potentially save a lot of bases. Merely because it is not perfect, does not mean that the system could not be useful at least most of the time. It would also reveal griefers, which when witnessed, could be kicked or banned before any more damage is done (if any).

 

See how this would help out? Less forest fires and less base burn-downs!

[Vanderer]

Ahh! This is what I was gonna talk about before, but forgot to mention it!

 

If someone puts pieces of grass or pieces of something inbetween an object before burning, the burning process won't happen; it would be impossible and ergo the griefer would be kicked.

 

Question: What if the griefer lights something on fire and then puts something to trail the fire to burn other things?

Suggestion (reasonably an answer if this kind of mechanic gets implemented): If this happens, remember that things will be smouldering first. Say a griefer burns a tree and then puts a grass in-between to burn the rest of the base, the grass might quickly take on fire, but say the next thing in line is the alchemy engine. If this is dicovered, then grass could be extinguished, or if not then the alchemy engine could be extinguished in time and that won't be too much of a fuss as grass will burn down quickly, so further smouldering won't happen. The system might not be perfect, but it would potentially save a lot of bases. Merely because it is not perfect, does not mean that the system could not be useful at least most of the time. It would also reveal griefers, which when witnessed, could be kicked or banned before any more damage is done (if any).

 

See how this would help out? Less forest fires and less base burn-downs!

 

I agree with the idea.

 

While grass is a natural substance that can burn, or just about anything natural that can burn, you don't often see people leaving cut grass or picked up twigs in between something like trees and a science machine, do you? An automated process to cancel the unnatural fire would be good when it gets to the last bit of grass/twig.whatever trail.

[Malk]

Or how about "owner ground" where it would blend in with the rest of the ground but if someone tried to hammer/burn it down a chat message would pop up saying "something about the ground doesnt allow you todo that here. Thr owner can give people perrmission to do things on it but others cant do anything on owner ground. Although it us a double edged sword (people can use it to block special items or areas from being internated with) we can implement where like vanderer said: have it check for nearby items and if it finds a rare item on the ground, it cant be placed

[TrueAlphaOmega]

Instead of being a whining ***ch
trying to ban or vote ban people, why don't you ask to have traps that damage players to protect your base?
  How about alarms to tell you when someone's at your base?

 

People that ask for everything to be handed to them without any effort are annoying.  Just because you have not practiced to get better does not mean the game is broken.

[RalphKastro]

Perhaps for the sake of making multiplayer less annoying, any man made structures, from farms to dry racks to crock pots and so forth cannot be burned down by people.

*places grass on the ground besides structure* *lights grass on fire*
You were saying?

Instead of being a whining ***ch

Language. 

[TrueAlphaOmega]

Hey, I filtered myself so the mods would not have to.  So I DID watch my language

[bountygiver]

what's stopping people from planting trees near it and burn the trees?

[Vanderer]

what's stopping people from planting trees near it and burn the trees?

 

 

I replied to this problem a few posts up, but essentially when cut or planted items are placed near a structure and it is lit by a person, the game would auto detect that as a unnatural occurrence, since the fire was started by a person. It would cancel the smoldering object next to the alchemy dry blah blah whatever structure and not set it alight.

 

Also, now it is on my first post. Thanks for the comment, however. You're not the first person to ask about this.

[Vanderer]

Instead of being a whining ***ch

trying to ban or vote ban people, why don't you ask to have traps that damage players to protect your base?

  How about alarms to tell you when someone's at your base?

 

People that ask for everything to be handed to them without any effort are annoying.  Just because you have not practiced to get better does not mean the game is broken.

 

 

Congratulations.

You have somehow failed to grasp what I was saying, and instead turned it into your own interpretation.

I'm terribly sorry that I don't get joy from seeing my or others bases burned down because some jerk decided to to destroy things for giggles in a game that should be about trying to survive together, not against each other. Also, when did I ever say the game was broken? If anything I think the game is easy now after so long playing it.

 

Some game mechanics need to be different from one game mode to another. We should be trying to get co-operation in a survival game, not idiocy. If this mechanic was choice implemented, or varied by the two modes we have, then fine. PVP could be full out burn everything down, since you are trying to kill one another anyway.

[ThaumicParrot]

Maybe a "common sense" meter/system could be added, in which one could not burn down player-made structures if they're in close vicinity of each other. It could also be used so that one could not burn down trees that could start a forest fire. I think this system could be applied to many bad situations in DST to prevent them from happening.

[Vanderer]

Maybe a "common sense" meter/system could be added, in which one could not burn down player-made structures if they're in close vicinity of each other. It could also be used so that one could not burn down trees that could start a forest fire. I think this system could be applied to many bad situations in DST to prevent them from happening.

 

I love the name.

Common sense is not very common, i'm afraid.

Back to that, though, how would it work with trees? 

Say if I needed charcoal... Do I have to burn one tree far away at a time, or would it be a cluster of trees that are away from a huge pack of them?

Also, what other situations would/could it be applied to?

[ThaumicParrot]

Say if I needed charcoal... Do I have to burn one tree far away at a time, or would it be a cluster of trees that are away from a huge pack of them? Also, what other situations would/could it be applied to?

I think a group of up to 4 trees should be burnable if far enough away from other trees. Some other scenarios where the "common sense" system could be used are:

1. Prevent people stealing from others' crock pots

2. Prevent people stealing from others' chests/chester

3. Prevent people from killing pigs/glommer/bunnymen

4. Prevent people from hammering others' structures

5. Prevent people from planting spider nests near bases

6. Prevent people from stealing birds from birdcages

The list goes on. However, I think the problems above that relate to player-made things would only be prevented if the base they're in was built by 2 or more people. For instance, if a base was built by one person, a troll would be able to destroy it. But if a base was built by multiple people, the common sense would kick in and stop the troll from destroying it.

[Vanderer]

I think a group of up to 4 trees should be burnable if far enough away from other trees. Some other scenarios where the "common sense" system could be used are:

1. Prevent people stealing from others' crock pots

2. Prevent people stealing from others' chests/chester

3. Prevent people from killing pigs/glommer/bunnymen

4. Prevent people from hammering others' structures

5. Prevent people from planting spider nests near bases

6. Prevent people from stealing birds from birdcages

The list goes on. However, I think the problems above that relate to player-made things would only be prevented if the base they're in was built by 2 or more people. For instance, if a base was built by one person, a troll would be able to destroy it. But if a base was built by multiple people, the common sense would kick in and stop the troll from destroying it.

I'm not so sure on the pigs/bunnymen one, since you need to murder them for more skins/tails, but other then that, all sounds good.

 

I suppose the common sense meter would be able to detect objects in close proximity to each other if they are made by different people somehow. what range this extends to would be important.

 

I could see this encouraging co-operation more.

 

I suggest for the people who go solo however to have access to some kind of trap or traps to deter would be fire starters/hammer happy people if for whatever reason they can't or won't play co-operative.

[BeastNips]

I think most of these changes would end up disrupting people who play together peacefully.

I think a simpler and more elegant solution would simply be to allow the host to freeze the game, and allow them to reset the day in game.

If the troll alarm is sounded, the host can freeze the game, investigate and possibly kick. If it's too late, the day can be rolled back in game and you've only lost a day. If the server host isn't there then players can vote to roll the day back.