[Poll] Assessing the DST community opinion about the state of DST

[Wumpair]

Hello everyone! 

This is a poll to support a recent post:

https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/164810-dont-starve-together-state/

The discussion revolves around this video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=4&v=_nK96BX5pi4&embeds_referring_euri=https%3A%2F%2Fforums.kleientertainment.com%2F

Taking into consideration that we aren't getting a full DST roadmap for 2025, and just an overall plan of 2 more From Beyond updates that finish in September, I wanted to see what the consensus of the community is (at least in the forums, which of course is a particular subset of DST players).
 

In the above post, I've seen a considerable proportion of people agreeing, as well as disagreeing, on some points that Beard makes in his video. So this is an attempt to quantify the overall community opinion. I tried to be neutral and objective on this.

For those who didn't watch the video, here is a TL;DR

 

Spoiler

Beard makes 5 points about the state of DST (In no particular order, except it is ordered xD).

Unfortunately, the limit on forum polls is 5 questions, and I wanted to focus on point number 2 a little bit more, so I left out point number 5 outside of this poll.

1. The health of DST is in a poor state (gameplay loop, community reaction, content creation…). Keep in mind Beard defines the popularity ≠ health of the game.
   My comment: As many have pointed out, the community is more active (both in playing & forums) when the update is about a character getting updated rather than general content. And Klei sure has their own metrics; since they keep doing refreshes, I believe this data to be true). So there is no arguing that the game is popular and doing ok on that front (at least in my opinion)

2. Skill trees are a development hell for Klei and their implementation is poor.
   My comment: I know some people will just say skill trees = bad, others will say that it gives new playstiles to old characters... But to be more constructive, I also ask question 2.ii. to see to what extent are you truly satisfied with the skill trees.

3. Beard says that the game has become too combat focus and it has lost its survival niche aspect, as well as its morbid atmosphere.
   My comment: Some people may consider this to be true, yet perhaps they see it as a positive. This is why I specify in the poll that in this context it is taken as something negative. If the poll had more questions, I would add a question to clarify whether people see this as something more negative or positive.

4. The lore/development/gameplay of the last arc (From Beyond) has been too long, without leading anywhere significant.

   My own comment: If I could add another question to the poll, I would also like to ask people if they feel like with two more updates in this arc it is enough to satisfyingly conclude and tie everything up Klei has been building.

5. Communication from Klei to the community should be improved (Beard does acknowledge that lately it has been better than usual, but thinks it still should be improved on).
   My own comment: As I said, I left this point out of the poll because the number of questions is limited, and also I think people will be biased with how the recent skill spotlight went where the forums for a lack of better word were ‘on fire’; honestly I think Klei did great to manage the backlash and get out of the 3+ months development hiatus.

Remember to be respectful to others, make the job of JoeW easier to moderate the forums; we all love this silly game, so let's keep our criticism constructive! 

 

Edit: The last question was missing some answers, I fixed it now. Sorry for any inconvinience

[Chewabacca]

25 minutes ago, Wumpair said:

4. 3. To what extent do you agree with the sentence: 'DST has become too combat-focused and lost its niche survival aspect'? [In this context 'combat-focused' is considered as something negative]

Originally, I was going to vote "agree" on this, but then I actually looked back on the update history of the past two years and there's really not as much combat as I thought, or at least not the kind that feels out of place for DST. It's fine IMO when the Constant is stocked with plenty of things that want to kill us, I just don't like focus on boss fights. But the From Beyond updates really haven't added that many new bosses: we have Scrappy Werepig (who I don't like), the Wrathful Rabbit King (who is a neat idea as a punishment boss, just needs to be tweaked to have a solution that isn't "beat him to death"), and the Great Depths Worm (who I very much like now that it actually spawns, it feels like a natural upgrade to the normal depths worm waves instead of a raid boss that you beat up for loot). There are also the mutated versions of the seasonal bosses, which I don't count as entirely new bosses because that's more just the consequences of adding rifts that mutate stuff to the world. It would be weirder if Deerclops didn't get zombified. Meanwhile, we've got plenty of new environmental threats (marotters, brightshades, acid rain, lunar hail) and items that are useful for things outside of combat. I think I'm just being influenced by the number of people who talk like nothing else matters but the boss fights.

[Mike23Ua]

DST is not a combat focused game, it never has been and unless Klei decides to copy the Lego Fortnite formula (aka wild rifts opening up and spitting enemies out at you) DST will not likely be a combat focused game. And what’s really important to understand here is that even the combat itself is optional…

you can for example kite Deerclops to a overgrown nest of spider queens and Ta-Dah, problem takes care of itself!

Wild Rifts don’t really give the same vibe as Lego Fortnite rifts, because in DST the rifts spawning locations can be manipulated “opps there’s a base here? Well I’ll just politely move this rift over here in this designated area the player didn’t build a base within so rift content can spawn” 

I love how with Lego Fortnite I can be fighting a random mob and all of a sudden that mob gets boosted by storm to become an elite variants. 
I think that’s something DST should explore more of outside of Boss Fights.

Like for example: Mutating cute and passive Catcoon into hostile Catmando creatures if your near them during Lunar Hail storms.

But for the most part: you can play the game and never actually participate in combat by using the mobs, or placing traps etc to deal with it.

Spoiler

Did you know that you can now easily deal with killing huge nests of spiders by building grass traps letting them get caught inside them and then “murdering” the spider you picked up in your inventory? Killing them this way doesn’t aggro every other spider in the area onto you.

 

[AwkwardPerson]

10 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

 

Like for example: Mutating cute and passive Catcoon into hostile Catmando creatures if your near them during Lunar Hail storms.

But for the most part: you can play the game and never actually participate in combat by using the mobs, or placing traps etc to deal with it.

 

c'mon Mike, how are you getting the Lunar hail storm without combat. The majority of game progression and nice items in the game are locked behind boss fights. 

The real issue is that this game is too easy as far as survival goes. It is true that you can avoid combat and survive until day 1000 without much effort (hello beefalo/rock lobster). For the people who understand how to play the game, you literally can't starve since there's food everywhere you look. 

[Walrusst]

47 minutes ago, Chewabacca said:

Originally, I was going to vote "agree" on this, but then I actually looked back on the update history of the past two years and there's really not as much combat as I thought, or at least not the kind that feels out of place for DST. It's fine IMO when the Constant is stocked with plenty of things that want to kill us, I just don't like focus on boss fights. But the From Beyond updates really haven't added that many new bosses: we have Scrappy Werepig (who I don't like), the Wrathful Rabbit King (who is a neat idea as a punishment boss, just needs to be tweaked to have a solution that isn't "beat him to death"), and the Great Depths Worm (who I very much like now that it actually spawns, it feels like a natural upgrade to the normal depths worm waves instead of a raid boss that you beat up for loot). There are also the mutated versions of the seasonal bosses, which I don't count as entirely new bosses because that's more just the consequences of adding rifts that mutate stuff to the world. It would be weirder if Deerclops didn't get zombified. Meanwhile, we've got plenty of new environmental threats (marotters, brightshades, acid rain, lunar hail) and items that are useful for things outside of combat. I think I'm just being influenced by the number of people who talk like nothing else matters but the boss fights.

If the rabbit king could be appeased by freeing bunnies (Like a treeguard,) and generally had the goal of beating you within and inch of your life rather than outright killing you I would probably not be bothered by it. After all, the bunnymen hate you for being a murderer. Their king couldn't be. Hell if it warned you after beating you senseless that would make it even better.
This him an active warning to naive players to learn to have nuanced and varied food sources.

In general, it is a really weird mechanic because we would be insane just add a butterfly queen, a frog director, a marotter magician, and a catcoon commander. The gobbler lord.
Since bossfights being your punishment for using farmable foods in the end looks like survival gameplay, but the people I know who are upset with the combat focus hate the bosses as a punishment for food sources as it to them, makes the game more combat oriented.

But yeah, a lot of kleis recent direction is on the rifts survival, but we've got some early game content thats focused on making survival more nuanced, but the skill trees being the thing that is the star of the show but it serves a few purposes as far as I see.
 

• Onboarding: I've seen new people try the game who realize mechanics exist because the skill trees tell them it exists. New players learning the desert life to farm volt goats, learning the sea for bottles, etc etc.
• Objective creation: Ok getting to whats been the active area of development in the rifts puts undue focus on people completing objectives, which on your own means you always have a lot to do, but in a group sometimes you will see people off doing what needs to be done and its like "Well what do I do?" Well, you can base, but skill trees giving you unique means of progression like the soul lanterns and elding spear makes these downtimes where the objectives are covered very nice and easy.
• Objective reaching: A lot of survival players weren't interested in the boss rushing getting to rifts entails, so having powers that add intrigue to this style of gameplay in theory makes finding and killing these bosses less of a chore for them.
• General excitement: People (Not all, but a large contingent) actually want to try characters that aren't their mains in my experience, and each character being radically different does one thing to me. It makes me rabidly excited to try something new once I get too good at one characters gameplan.

I think partial refreshes between full skill trees probably won't be as much of a disaster as people think.

On a normal update, it seems like klei does about 70 skills of work, artwork, items, and all. Last one was like 90 but we went extremely overtime in rework fever and had a vacation in the middle.

Refreshes that need 2-5 skills of thought shouldn't be that much of an opportunity cost to klei so long as they don't throw their work out on the ground and start from scratch.

The elephant in the room for me will just be the fact that the servers like to die, so the focus on harsher environments you earn has a critical flaw: "The lag got too bad now we need to abandon ship."

[Frosty_Mentos]

Survival is still as is and compared to singleplayer it didn't change. But that's also kinda a problem, for a game like survival game not having more world generation options, having some food resources way beyond easier to gain than other as well as adding easier gameplay through just having skillpoints instead of earning them properly (assuming as of now it's still more of a bandaid solution till they finish skilltrees) puts the game stretched into all the weird directions in a single Constant's map.

Hamlet and shipwrecked introduced well of different resource gathering spaces to vary survival and it's tactics, they wanted to do something like that in Through the Ages thing they planned but scrapped for a New Reign expansion, which pushed the story and I was generally happy for it but sad for not seeing the world evolve as I see it as a loss of an interesting concept.

Combat was often very simple and always existed, recent updates expands the combat for us and that is fine, it just took a much longer time than needed to get this stuff in the first place.

Like, I enjoy what DST is but I also wish for the world itself to feel... a lot more unique everytime I regenerate? It felt in singleplayer like that cause I either restarted or died, in DST I enjoyed it a lot more as progression started to exist, but the world generally still feels the same. I don't like exploring caves anything more than ruins, much of the surface map is pretty complete and generally is the same every time...

Either Klei is too afraid to mess around and tinker with world gen more after years of working on it to the state it is or DST development team is too strained in doing anything more than one thing at the time. Yea, we been dripfed lore and updates over the years, and their boldest thing was Forge and Gorge which to this day I respect the effort put into those modes, but they seem to only choose the safe route for years now after those were almost a flop to their budget. I don't know how well they're selling skins and how well are their profits but either they are building up to something bigger ever so often or they're just keeping it as sustainable without over committing on the more bolder ideas.

Remember the time Tencent took over their ownership? That was during end time of covid shutdowns I believe. I don't believe DST is much of a cashcow from anyone's mouths as it is just their most sustainable game to get money from these days.

[YouKnowWho142]

9 minutes ago, Frosty_Mentos said:

Survival is still as is and compared to singleplayer it didn't change. But that's also kinda a problem, for a game like survival game not having more world generation options, having some food resources way beyond easier to gain than other as well as adding easier gameplay through just having skillpoints instead of earning them properly (assuming as of now it's still more of a bandaid solution till they finish skilltrees) puts the game stretched into all the weird directions in a single Constant's map.

Hamlet and shipwrecked introduced well of different resource gathering spaces to vary survival and it's tactics, they wanted to do something like that in Through the Ages thing they planned but scrapped for a New Reign expansion, which pushed the story and I was generally happy for it but sad for not seeing the world evolve as I see it as a loss of an interesting concept.

Combat was often very simple and always existed, recent updates expands the combat for us and that is fine, it just took a much longer time than needed to get this stuff in the first place.

Like, I enjoy what DST is but I also wish for the world itself to feel... a lot more unique everytime I regenerate? It felt in singleplayer like that cause I either restarted or died, in DST I enjoyed it a lot more as progression started to exist, but the world generally still feels the same. I don't like exploring caves anything more than ruins, much of the surface map is pretty complete and generally is the same every time...

Either Klei is too afraid to mess around and tinker with world gen more after years of working on it to the state it is or DST development team is too strained in doing anything more than one thing at the time. Yea, we been dripfed lore and updates over the years, and their boldest thing was Forge and Gorge which to this day I respect the effort put into those modes, but they seem to only choose the safe route for years now after those were almost a flop to their budget. I don't know how well they're selling skins and how well are their profits but either they are building up to something bigger ever so often or they're just keeping it as sustainable without over committing on the more bolder ideas.

Remember the time Tencent took over their ownership? That was during end time of covid shutdowns I believe. I don't believe DST is much of a cashcow from anyone's mouths as it is just their most sustainable game to get money from these days.

I think comparing DST and DS is the big thing that's causing DST to be considered in a poor state. I think they should separate their identities, keeping DS as the uncompromising survival experience and DST in its own direction. The fact that DST is multiplayer inherently removes the uncompromising survival aspect and is the entire reason why DST is not only a separate game in the first place but the fact that it exists at all also goes against the vision of Don't Starve as a whole (something that they seemed adamant about before the game came out even), so I would prefer if they doubled down on the fact that DST was never the intended Don't Starve experience, since surviving in DST is never going to feel the same as surviving in Don't Starve no matter what they do

[Walrusst]

4 minutes ago, YouKnowWho142 said:

I think comparing DST and DS is the big thing that's causing DST to be considered in a poor state. I think they should separate their identities, keeping DS as the uncompromising survival experience and DST in its own direction. The fact that DST is multiplayer inherently removes the uncompromising survival aspect and is the entire reason why DST is not only a separate game in the first place but the fact that it exists at all also goes against the vision of Don't Starve as a whole (something that they seemed adamant about before the game came out even), so I would prefer if they doubled down on the fact that DST was never the intended Don't Starve experience, since surviving in DST is never going to feel the same as surviving in Don't Starve no matter what they do

How desperate of a survival situation you can have in DST can actually get pretty wild/despirate when you have large newbie to veteran ratios.
When you have a farm that should feed 8 going into just trying to heal 9 people who have no clue what they are doing and now you desperately need to find time to hunt alternative resource sources to just barely stay afloat.

[Uedo]

39 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

Like for example: Mutating cute and passive Catcoon into hostile Catmando creatures if your near them during Lunar Hail storms.

I don't know what a Catmando is, but you've opened multiple threads in the past over this. You want catmando, that's it, it has nothing to do with the actual development of the game.

[YouKnowWho142]

2 minutes ago, Walrusst said:

How desperate of a survival situation you can have in DST can actually get pretty wild/despirate when you have large newbie to veteran ratios.
When you have a farm that should feed 8 going into just trying to heal 9 people who have no clue what they are doing and now you desperately need to find time to hunt alternative resource sources to just barely stay afloat.

i mean, i dont disagree, the game is still uncompromising to newer players, but I appreciate that DST has something for more experienced players once you cross the difficulty of survival, in DS the moment you start to understand everything is when you have pretty much won the game since there aren't a lot of challenges outside of survival and nothing can really stop you

[Walrusst]

20 minutes ago, YouKnowWho142 said:

i mean, i dont disagree, the game is still uncompromising to newer players, but I appreciate that DST has something for more experienced players once you cross the difficulty of survival, in DS the moment you start to understand everything is when you have pretty much won the game since there aren't a lot of challenges outside of survival and nothing can really stop you

I mean solo still has butterflies and bees so while thermal stones being weak is cool, some of our strongest farms here that break the uncompromising aspects are still there.

Its just that 6 monkeys jumping on the bed trying to destroy the frame can break it a lot faster than one.

Edit:
Also there has been 10 years of research on how to break creature brains in our favor that we didn't have in DS.
The amount of content in the last 2-3 years on how to make the game work for us is staggering compared to any previous years.

[Mike23Ua]

22 minutes ago, Uedo said:

I don't know what a Catmando is, but you've opened multiple threads in the past over this. You want catmando, that's it, it has nothing to do with the actual development of the game.

Ah but see, that’s where your wrong.. it DOES actually help to develop the game, it replaces Catcoon with a Varg-like Variant (im just going to guess it would cough up hairballs that slow or stick you in place like Ewecus) But if Catcoon are now Catmando’s then obtaining the Cattail Resource becomes more of a task then just hitting a harmless Catcoon 3 times before it even has time to react.

Cat Tails are being used in a odd number of character skill tree crafts (in fact Walter needs them for the most extended range upgrades on his slingshot)

This is how you make a game harder for Day to Day Survival challenges outside of optional boss fights you can ignore if you don’t desire the bosses specific loot drops.

[Frosty_Mentos]

5 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

Ah but see, that’s where your wrong.. it DOES actually help to develop the game, it replaces Catcoon with a Varg-like Variant (im just going to guess it would cough up hairballs that slow or stick you in place like Ewecus) But if Catcoon are now Catmando’s then obtaining the Cattail Resource becomes more of a task then just hitting a harmless Catcoon 3 times before it even has time to react.

Cat Tails are being used in a odd number of character skill tree crafts (in fact Walter needs them for the most extended range upgrades on his slingshot)

This is how you make a game harder for Day to Day Survival challenges outside of optional boss fights you can ignore if you don’t desire the bosses specific loot drops.

I don't really see how they'd fit in. Catmandoos feel like they deserve to a DLC world to fit into.n.

[Harrowick]

My only piece in this conversation is I adore the skill trees for opening up new ways to play the characters, but I sorely miss the survival focus of the game.

I would have loved to see what Klei could have done with enhancing the core Don't Starve formula, take for example the seasons, I would have loved to see an expansion to Reign of Giant's four seasons, whether it be new season exclusive things to do, more weather events, or they could've taken advantage of the open ocean by introducing four seasonal landmasses that all require their respective gear to travel, giving an all year round purpose to winter, spring, or summer gear!

but I suppose i'll sit and enjoy the show, I love this game, but I haven't been too captivated by this end-gamey terraria-like hard mode.

 

[Ridley]

That video rant in particular seems to stem from burnout. I get to play a bunch, take a long break, and come back to updates I missed. People who try to play/cover DST all the time are more likely to feel like things are stale/unhealthy/forgotten.

As for Wagstaff becoming the lunar representative over time, I don't see the problem. He is discovering on his own that his ambitions are better suited for the lunar magic rather than shadow magic. While his plans remain a mystery, I believe his past comments about wanting to show the world his discoveries and his construction of portals means he wants a stable bridge between worlds.The shadows are known to hunt down those who take their power outside of the constant, so I wonder if the lunar side feels the opposite. Maybe Altar wants to spread its "enlightenment".

[xDarkSoul18x]

I think a lot of it falls under what I sort of call "Veteran complex". It's like when I see people on the general forums make certain complaints or assumptions, failing to understand that MOST people don't use the forums, most people don't wiki an update or watch a guide day 1 (Or maybe they're just burnt out after playing for a decade, the veterans). They just play the game. I've been playing WoW for over 20 years for example and this game since a few months after launch (DS). Nothing shocks me too much anymore. Meanwhile there are people that play casual and are loving every minute of the game and trying to crack the code via in-game inspects and world storytelling.

I fail to see how there is no "Survival" aspect to the game, I think people are just failing to see they have improved, that the game was never as hard as they made it out to be, just unforgiving. Forget to bring a light in the cave or prep before winter? RIP. That would be like me saying when I first started playing "This game is too hard!". Any game played with time will increase your survival rates and even now you can still get tripped up if not on your toes. What "Survival" are we talking about because we've had hambats, log suits and pigskin armor for a VERY long time now and all the end game stuff is well. .end game. I'd hope if you can conquer the game and all it's bosses you'd have a convenient reward to show for it. Even more so the game does no hand holding still, it just plops you in the game.

Art and music great, gameplay is pretty much the same as always, bait and hit. I like that they are trying to change the combat and make it a bit more interesting, but I can agree with the trees. They are cool to me but poorly implemented, just add them as QOL updates or bake them into the game, maybe even unlock via character specific blueprints, something idk. I just feel they need to get back into the identity of the game and really flush out the world not just drip feed little here and there. The game needs a serious refresh for all the biomes, and I hope they focus on 1 thing not just throw 20 things and try to sort it out later. It just seems like they are trying to do a million things at once. Just FOCUS! If you are doing the Lunar stuff do the Lunar stuff don't just randomly throw in a bunny king and giant worm. 

[Guille6785]

1 hour ago, Walrusst said:

I mean solo still has butterflies and bees so while thermal stones being weak is cool, some of our strongest farms here that break the uncompromising aspects are still there.

fyi thermal stones weren't any weaker in DS relative to other insulation options (they work very similarly with a few slight differences that aren't necessarily unique to thermal stones), not disagreeing with your post but idk why this is such a common myth

[Walrusst]

5 minutes ago, Guille6785 said:

fyi thermal stones weren't any weaker in DS (they work very similarly with a few slight differences that aren't necessarily unique to thermal stones), not disagreeing with your post but idk why this is such a common myth

It might be the temperatures being stronger or rose colored glasses. IDK man.
I just remember freezing while I had a hot stone.

[Jakepeng99]

Ive seen a few people who have left the game mainly all together. Describing it because of "game-ruining updates". It seems these updates have effect on some people behind the scenes.

[Well-met]

Somehow I don't think this forum really represents the "dst community" anymore, we're just a very small sample.

[WilsonHiggs]

I only like Walter's skill tree and would like willow's if wasnt because i think it can be improved by a lot

The rest of the skill trees are really bad implemented.  Some has great ideas but if only a 1/3 or less of skill points are decent or good...

[WilsonHiggs]

29 minutes ago, Insaginary said:

I'd love to hear your suggestions, and I could include it in my thread if I didn't do so already; it's probably best you share over there so you wouldn't be off-topic here.

You don't have to worry about being the annoying guy who brings up the same suggestion thread, for I don't mind taking that burden if it eventually leads to changes.

I simply think that enemies set on fire not dropping ashes and torches burning enemies at a 100% should be removed from her skill tree and add these changes as base game features for everybody. 2 skill points for higher light radius and more speed in bernie feels too much. I also think that the ember mechanic being locked behind the skill tree is really weird, it should be a base feature for willow.

And a 25% damage boost against burning enemies isnt not only weak, by the time you do everything to get trigger the buff you could have been hitting to reach a similar dps, but isnt fitting. Why she is hitting harder? Seeing someone on fire makes her get stronger muscles? She should do something more pirokinetic/fire mage (sadly she works more like a fire mage than the original idea of being the Firestarter) like setting herself on fire to deal damage arround

With the skills removed there is room for other stuff, doesnt need to be powerful but fun stuff like fueling campfires at max with her power (similar to how she can make her weak fire strong when burning a tree) or adding new utility perks to bernie

[Mike23Ua]

1 hour ago, Jakepeng99 said:

Ive seen a few people who have left the game mainly all together. Describing it because of "game-ruining updates". It seems these updates have effect on some people behind the scenes.

From my point of view Dont Starve the single player game introduced me to the world of RogueLites, I mean even before buying the game the product description reads you’d get to explore randomly generated worlds full of hostile things that want to kill you. Want a new world? No problem die and a new one will be generated for you! So to cut it short: Solo DS always felt fresh and new because when you died 10-15 day into a world, a brand new one to explore and try to survive within replaced it. Even the games campaign mode forced you to abandon all progress in one world, to move on towards the next one.

DST is designed with the intent you’ll exist in the same world indefinitely and forever.. you’ll become overly familiar with what spawns and where, you’ll (sometimes) extinct entire species over prolonged periods of play (such as bee hives or tentacles in swamp) It doesn’t carry the same kind of “explore randomly generated worlds vibe” The franchise once proudly touted. We traded in Permadeath and worlds that constantly get erased (either by you dying or progressing elsewhere) for lengthy RPG quests to help hermit granny find her long lost lover at sea.

And I think the thing that probably pisses me off the most is that for years (first with silly moon quay portal then later, rift stuff) Klei has been teasing this unique mechanic that actually COULD bring back some of that unfamiliarity by ploping randomly generated islands that exist for a time before vanishing from rifts formed over the ocean or in caves etc..

[xhyom]

5 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

From my point of view Dont Starve the single player game introduced me to the world of RogueLites, I mean even before buying the game the product description reads you’d get to explore randomly generated worlds full of hostile things that want to kill you. Want a new world? No problem die and a new one will be generated for you! So to cut it short: Solo DS always felt fresh and new because when you died 10-15 day into a world, a brand new one to explore and try to survive within replaced it. Even the games campaign mode forced you to abandon all progress in one world, to move on towards the next one.

DST is designed with the intent you’ll exist in the same world indefinitely and forever.. you’ll become overly familiar with what spawns and where, you’ll (sometimes) extinct entire species over prolonged periods of play (such as bee hives or tentacles in swamp) It doesn’t carry the same kind of “explore randomly generated worlds vibe” The franchise once proudly touted. We traded in Permadeath and worlds that constantly get erased (either by you dying or progressing elsewhere) for lengthy RPG quests to help hermit granny find her long lost lover at sea.

And I think the thing that probably pisses me off the most is that for years (first with silly moon quay portal then later, rift stuff) Klei has been teasing this unique mechanic that actually COULD bring back some of that unfamiliarity by ploping randomly generated islands that exist for a time before vanishing from rifts formed over the ocean or in caves etc..

What you're describing only exists in the Solo version if you don't have any information about anything in the game, if you start playing the game now you can get infinite days in the same way without any problem... It doesn't make any sense to keep evoking this mystical past that doesn't exist, you just died because you didn't knew you could just get food from Y and ignore X and get W item to survive, there's no way Klei could've released updates that are totally unknown, catch you by surprise and make you start over until you get the hang of it, it would have to be a complete DLC for that... The game is already 11 years old and it's obvious that everything there is to know about this game is already known, obviously Klei will follow another path, there's no way a game that you've been playing for years can surprise you and be mysterious, things spawning in random places IS ALREADY how it happens, that won't make anything "fresh" if you already experienced everything there is.

[Cheggf]

The only decent skill tree is Walter's. Every other skill tree ranges from garbage (e.g. Wolfgang) to bad (e.g. Wormwood). Walter's is the only skill tree that has every single option be a very good choice where you choose things because you want to, with the typical skill tree only having a handful of decisions to make because most of the tree is just linear repetition of the same few upgrades, and of those few decisions you make most are made for you because there are clearly correct & incorrect choices. Every single time I inspect Walter the skill tree looks extremely different. Every time I inspect Wormwood the tree is practically identical, with maybe 1 skill changed, 2 if they're feeling extra unique.