Rework Enraged Klaus to get Krampus Sack or at least a 50% chance.

[Riddla]

I think it would be alright if you could gauge current health of the boss by examining them at certain % HP thresholds, so like if they have <50% HP left, the survivor will quote on how injured they look when you inspect them mid-combat.

[skile]

6 minutes ago, Riddla said:

I think it would be alright if you could gauge current health of the boss by examining them at certain % HP thresholds, so like if they have <50% HP left, the survivor will quote on how injured they look when you inspect them mid-combat.

A bit unrelated, but perhaps a similar thing for players could be good too. Like, when you examine a player under 50% health, your character could add a little comment about how they look hurt. Would be especially helpful for Wortox, but could also be handy just in general, especially on pubs. 

[Cruvimaster]

10 hours ago, grm9 said:

enraged klaus sucks because you need to dodge same 2 attacks for an absurd amount of tine, better not to do that

That's why I said a REWORK of it. It would obviously be a more difficult version than Klaus, but with a great reward for it.

The big question is:

Should the only safe way for someone to get several Krampus Sack for the entire group of 6 players in a normal world (2 years of game) be to use Wickerbottom instead of valuing the fight with a giant?

It's just an analysis.

[Cruvimaster]

2 hours ago, Cheggf said:

It's a survival game, not a killing game. HP bars are ugly, unimmersive, and give far too much information for a game with combat as simplistic as this.

I particularly like seeing the boss's life drop by the HP bar. Combat is much cooler/immersive for me.

HP bar is not synonymous with an easy game and Elden Ring (Soulslike) is here to prove it.

I know perfectly well all the stages of the bosses with high HP from the signs the game gives (for example the 4 stages of the Bee Queen), but I love the HP bar.

I'm not saying there's a problem with Klei hiding the bosses' HP bar. It's a creative choice and everything's ok with that. Hollow Knight is also like this and so are many other games.

[Cassielu]

44 minutes ago, Cruvimaster said:

Should the only safe way for someone to get several Krampus Sack for the entire group of 6 players in a normal world (2 years of game) be to use Wickerbottom instead of valuing the fight with a giant?

YES. I don't see any problem here.

Getting the Krampus Sack from Wickerbottom requires that you have knowledge of the Krampus mechanism, of most innocent creatures, of the Bird mechanism, and of all the mechanics necessary to build a farm that kills Krampus. Creatively combine all of them to give a useless item a powerful and unique new use. 

But enraged klaus is just a stupid klaus with higher numbers and lost the unique mechanics of klaus. encourage people to do it is a bad idea.

 

Edited April 7 by Cassielu

[BezKa]

I really wonder how this topic keeps coming up again and again. Because Klaus is probably the best designed boss in the game, and no one actually wants to fight his enraged form. It's always "give me sack".

I think you'll have more luck suggesting some weird mechanic that will make Krampus drop it than arguing for ruining the best boss we currently have

[Cruvimaster]

1 hour ago, Cassielu said:

YES. I don't see any problem here.

Getting the Krampus Sack from Wickerbottom requires that you have knowledge of the Krampus mechanism, of most innocent creatures, of the Bird mechanism, and of all the mechanics necessary to build a farm that kills Krampus.

 

To obtain this rare item, practically all players are encouraged to watch a tutorial on YouTube on how to use the Wickerbottom. Therefore, it is very widespread knowledge in the gaming community. So I don't even think it's something that special because of the huge number of players who know about it.

7 minutes ago, BezKa said:

I really wonder how this topic keeps coming up again and again. Because Klaus is probably the best designed boss in the game, and no one actually wants to fight his enraged form. It's always "give me sack".

I think you'll have more luck suggesting some weird mechanic that will make Krampus drop it than arguing for ruining the best boss we currently have

In fact, it is one of the easiest bosses in the game. It has to be like this to help new players and because it's a recurring boss fight.

The point is that absolutely no one faces the enraged form and there is no problem in wanting to reward those who choose to fight a difficult version of Klaus.

No one is forced to do the misery version of Toadstool, but there is an incentive for anyone who wants to go there.

And remembering that we already have difficult versions of other (possessed) bosses. We are not talking about any new concept in the game.

For the avoidance of doubt: I'm not asking for any changes to Klaus' mechanics. It's an easy boss, but it's fun and serves the purpose of being a recurring combat monster very well.

[grm9]

19 minutes ago, Cruvimaster said:

To obtain this rare item, practically all players are encouraged to watch a tutorial on YouTube on how to use the Wickerbottom. Therefore, it is very widespread knowledge in the gaming community. So I don't even think it's something that special because of the huge number of players who know about it

that's like saying that a puzzle is too easy because everyone found the solution on the internet

[BezKa]

19 minutes ago, Cruvimaster said:

wanting to reward those who choose to fight a difficult version of Klaus.

No, it's not good. The only reason Klaus doesn't literally just despawn with his sack when his deer dies is that it'd be anticlimactic. Avoiding his actual proper fight should not be rewarded. If he's so easy then just keep fighting him and you'll get your sack.

I don't know how many times this has to be explain.

More difficult versions of bosses exist, but Toadstool was made with it in mind, and the new ones are completely revamped. Leave Enraged Klaus alone and actually come up with a difficult, engaging fight that will be the "difficult" version of him that will give you the drops you want. Just don't have this "difficult version" be summoned by killing the deer. That's missing the point.

[Cruvimaster]

15 minutes ago, grm9 said:

that's like saying that a puzzle is too easy because everyone found the solution on the internet

I'm not saying it's a problem to have this farm in the game. May it continue!

But what would be the problem with having a better way to obtain this item by simply fighting Klaus? An improvement would be to simply increase the percentage rate. I'm just making a suggestion for the item to remain rare, but obtaining it through a more difficult fight against Klaus in enraged form.

[Valase]

37 minutes ago, Cruvimaster said:

The point is that absolutely no one faces the enraged form and there is no problem in wanting to reward those who choose to fight a difficult version of Klaus.

Enraged klaus it is not a difficult fight, it is just a stat-check, if you have enough speed, you kill it eventually.

you don't even have to worry about the deer spells.

people just want an easy 40 minutes slog to get a klaus sack.

1 minute ago, Cruvimaster said:

But what would be the problem with having a better way to obtain this item by simply fighting Klaus? An improvement would be to simply increase the percentage rate. I'm just making a suggestion for the item to remain rare, but obtaining it through a more difficult fight against Klaus in enraged form.

there already is a 10% chance to get a krampus sack from his "presents"

[Cruvimaster]

1 minute ago, Valase said:

 

there already is a 10% chance to get a krampus sack from his "presents"

Let's translate this 10%. 3 backpacks in 2600 days.

Is this reasonable for you?

I realize that community members here on the forum are satisfied with the current form. All right then. It was just a QOL suggestion.

[Valase]

58 minutes ago, Cruvimaster said:

Let's translate this 10%. 3 backpacks in 2600 days.

Is this reasonable for you?

I realize that community members here on the forum are satisfied with the current form. All right then. It was just a QOL suggestion.

My brother in christ, this is how any % works, just like you can go a 50 klaus fights without a single sack, you can get two in the same fight.

I'm in a quad-mac tusk world and the only two walking canes that I have are from killing AG.

this is the same for any voltgoat, and the same for your proposed solution. you could literally never get a sack even from fighting your Enraged Klaus (50%) killing his two krampii (1% each) and opening the sack (10%).  You could just make a post asking for a "Bad RNG" protection. But you made one asking for them to turn a punishment for trying to remove 33% of his fight into a grind with a reward on top.

[Well-met]

the problem with this idea is Klaus doesn't get all his hp back, which means you can just enrage it when he's got 1% hp for an easy drop.

otherwise I'd be ok with this.

[Echsrick]

9 hours ago, Cheggf said:

 

 You aren't supposed to kill the deer. 

your not supposed to kill grumple bees, because they keep respawning, and still people do kill some, makes total sense right? imagine beequeen goes rage mode because you killed 1 of those bees

[Cruvimaster]

Interestingly, if I had created a topic in January asking for chests to have infinite storage, many here (I think even the same people) would say that the chest limit is a normal game mechanic and it is easy to create them and I could even use the packages to store them too.

Then Klei makes the changes and they love the changes and are full of praise for the new features.

Who knows if Wortox's future skill tree will have something related to the topic covered. It remains to wait.

Edited April 7 by Cruvimaster

[extremyt]

Make it so using a deconstruction staff on the Loot Stash removes one bundle from it but increases the chances of a Krampus Sack. If you remove all four bundles you're guaranteed to get the sack.

[Szczuku]

7 hours ago, Cruvimaster said:

Let's translate this 10%. 3 backpacks in 2600 days.

Is this reasonable for you?

"Anything that's not 100% or 0% is 50% - either it happens or not"

Just how you could, in theory, get 3 krampus sacks from a single Klaus fight, you could have a bad luck and constantly miss a 99% chance for an item drop.

Enraged Klaus is supposed to be a punishment. Don't turn it into a krampus sack farming method

[grm9]

37 minutes ago, Szczuku said:

"Anything that's not 100% or 0% is 50% - either it happens or not"

so you get as many stingers per 100 bees on average as krampus sacks from krampii?

[Cheggf]

10 hours ago, Echsrick said:

your not supposed to kill grumple bees, because they keep respawning, and still people do kill some, makes total sense right? imagine beequeen goes rage mode because you killed 1 of those bees

You literally just said that the grumble bees respawn. That's how you're prevented from negating their existence. 

5 hours ago, extremyt said:

Make it so using a deconstruction staff on the Loot Stash removes one bundle from it but increases the chances of a Krampus Sack. If you remove all four bundles you're guaranteed to get the sack.

You should make changes to your way of thinking so you no longer feel entitled to a krampus sack. You aren't supposed to get one, it's supposed to be a nice surprise. The entire point of the item is gambling, it's a rare thing that's supposed to be exciting to see. If you could guarantee it you may as well remove it from the game entirely.

You guys already got the ridiculously high 10% chance from Klaus, but that's not enough. It needs to be 100%. You need to get a krampus sack every year for free, so you can hoard infinite of this supposed-to-be-rare item.

Edited April 8 by Cheggf

[extremyt]

1 hour ago, Cheggf said:

You guys already got the ridiculously high 10% chance from Klaus, but that's not enough. It needs to be 100%. You need to get a krampus sack every year for free, so you can hoard infinite of this supposed-to-be-rare item.

Yes.

[Cloakingsumo198]

They should make enraged Klaus also not drop the sack key as an extra middle finger.

It makes as much sense to me as the mobs without drops in Minecraft I would much prefer it be a alternate stronger form like misery toad.

I don't really like misery toad either but getting the sleep bombs for duping and  guaranteed mushlights still makes it an appealing option compared to grinding it out.

Doesn't make the fight any better but who's fighting misery toad for fun?

[Gi-Go]

On 4/7/2024 at 5:56 AM, Echsrick said:

i wonder, WHY is there a punishmend for killing his magic users anyways? like it seems weird to me, like what was ever the point of that design choice? punishing players for killing the helpers? like just try imagine for someone that never dit klaus ever and never heard of it, he probably thinks something like "hmm does deer with there magic sure are annoying, they probably die quickly enought!" and so the unknown player kills the deers, and sees how klaus grows, player may think "oh phase 2 now?!?" unaware that they probably goin to waste time and everything else doin so, and if they beat it they may think something like "wow that was taken soo long, hope the loot is good.....huh? lots of goal? steel wool?!? that was not worth my life time to do" and so that unaware player will NEVER do klaus again and refuses to watch others do it because he dont want to spoiled the game and all that.....

so again, why is there a weird punishmend for killing the other enemies again?

Yeah, totally legit scenario, happens all the time. People keep killing enraged klaus before even trying a regular one. We gotta do something about it. 

[Antynomity]

It's a punishment, also adding a guaranteed way of getting the krampus sack would completely ruin the point of it's existence.

[Echsrick]

9 hours ago, Gi-Go said:

Yeah, totally legit scenario, happens all the time. People keep killing enraged klaus before even trying a regular one. We gotta do something about it. 

yea, because they think its normal for klaus to do this, remember, THEY DONT KNOW ANYTHING