Abigail Should Require a Sacrifice

[Wendy C.]

Since the Wendy Rework, Abigail can be summoned immediately, without any cost, at any time, even if it's immediately after her getting defeated. 
As a Wendy main, this doesn't make any sense. 
The original setup was that you had to manually place the flower on the ground after an incubation period where you had to wait for it to bloom. Once it was ready and on the ground, a living entity needed to die nearby. It also would cost 50 sanity. 

I would prefer if these concepts where combined.
My revised interpretation is as follows:

Abigail can still be summoned at any time, but only if a sacrifice is given first. 
A sacrifice must be an innocent creature, Murdered in the inventory. Birds, Rabbits, and Moleworms. 
They must be live, and contained within the inventory with the flower on the ground, then right-clicked to be Murdered. 
In this way, Wendy is very specifically killing the innocent animal and spilling its blood unto the flower to ritually summon-forth Abigail's spirit. 
No, accidental deaths do not count, and having some random weak creature die nearby doesn't count.
It must be a deliberate, premeditated murder of an innocent creature given to the flower. 

Once the sacrifice is given, Abigail can be summoned and unsummoned at will just like right now. 
If she ever is defeated, had her health reduced to Zero, you must then perform the sacrifice again to be allowed to resummon her. 

The ritual sacrifice would not cost sanity because the very specific nature of the process is, itself, the cost.
It cannot be done on accident, you must plan ahead for it. 

In addition to this change, I want Abigail to once again perform the animation where she looks sad when her health is low. 
Yes, adding an Abigail health-bar removes the need for such an animation, but it still is a flavorful addition that adds more expressiveness to the character and can be used to tell OTHER players who are not Wendy that Abigail is getting weak. 
In the end, removing the animation was actually a WASTE of effort and time, because it was fine as it was and didn't need to be removed. 

[Echsrick]

i mean all this just makes way more sense and more balanced then just spawn in and click on the flower to get your ghost out it alsol made actual more sense to soumon a ghost i mean even reviving a ghost cost health so why sould bringin one not cost health?

[Guille6785]

why punish players for managing when it's beneficial to have abigail out or not

[Wendy C.]

5 minutes ago, Guille6785 said:

why punish players for managing when it's beneficial to have abigail out or not

Getting 6 grass for a single rabbit means you can still get Abigail on day one. Just perhaps 30 seconds to 2 minutes later than normal. 
"Normal" being absolutely instantly  with no cost or effort whatsoever. 
And you're the one who has said that Wendy has a very high skill ceiling. Ideally, when using ectoherbology properly, Abigail should NEVER be losing her fights or getting defeated in the first place. So for expert Wendy's, this cost is a ONE time thing. And by the time you get a bird trap (with the silk Abigail generated) the cost becomes absolutely non-existent.
All it adds is 
A, SOME form of cost to one of the best utilities in the entire game, and 
B, adds quite a lot of thematic flavor which is equally as important to getting enjoyment from a game as the gameplay itself. A game is less fun if it has no soul (no pun intended). 

[Terra B Welch]

Ugh... Is this another "Nerf Wendy" thread?

I'm honestly getting sick of these, no I do not want some added tedium just to summon abigail, all this would do is force the player to clutter their inventory with critters like rabbits or birds and not actually add any real difficulty.

No thank you.

[Guille6785]

31 minutes ago, Wendy C. said:

Getting 6 grass for a single rabbit means you can still get Abigail on day one. Just perhaps 30 seconds to 2 minutes later than normal. 
"Normal" being absolutely instantly  with no cost or effort whatsoever. 
And you're the one who has said that Wendy has a very high skill ceiling. Ideally, when using ectoherbology properly, Abigail should NEVER be losing her fights or getting defeated in the first place. So for expert Wendy's, this cost is a ONE time thing. And by the time you get a bird trap (with the silk Abigail generated) the cost becomes absolutely non-existent.
All it adds is 
A, SOME form of cost to one of the best utilities in the entire game, and 
B, adds quite a lot of thematic flavor which is equally as important to getting enjoyment from a game as the gameplay itself. A game is less fun if it has no soul (no pun intended). 

unsummoning abigail when it's not beneficial to have her out is making correct use of the mechanic, having to carry rabbits in your inventory just to summon her back wouldn't increase her skill ceiling at all, it would just make it unnecessarily tedious

ectoherbology is a complete waste of time lol

[Wendy C.]

1 minute ago, Guille6785 said:

unsummoning abigail when it's not beneficial to have her out is making correct use of the mechanic, having to carry rabbits in your inventory just to summon her back wouldn't increase her skill ceiling at all, it would just make it unnecessarily tedious

ectoherbology is a complete waste of time lol

I literally said that you would only have to do the sacrifice again if her HP was sent to Zero. 
I literally said,  that after the first sacrifice, you would be able to summon/unsummon her as normal as you like. 

[Terra B Welch]

am also going to point out, what's stopping the player from just hoarding a stack of bees, and every time abigail needs her "Blood sacrifice" you just seperate a bee from the stack and kill it? Bees are also easy to keep fed.

All this change would do is make her have to hog another inventory slot, Wendy already has to keep one slot occupied by Abigail's flower, why make her have to hog up another?

[Wendy C.]

19 minutes ago, Terra B Welch said:

Ugh... Is this another "Nerf Wendy" thread?

I'm honestly getting sick of these, no I do not want some added tedium just to summon abigail, all this would do is force the player to clutter their inventory with critters like rabbits or birds and not actually add any real difficulty.

No thank you.

It's not about Nerfing her, it's about adding more flavor. 
Also I'm the most die-hard Wendy supporter here, look at my profile. 
I genuinely enjoyed the sacrificing mechanic and want to see it return.

Just now, Terra B Welch said:

am also going to point out, what's stopping the player from just hoarding a stack of bees, and every time abigail needs her "Blood sacrifice" you just seperate a bee from the stack and kill it? Bees are also easy to keep fed.

All this change would do is make me have to hog another inventory slot, Wendy already has to keep one slot occupied by Abigail's flower, why make her have to hog up another?

I specified that it has to be Rabbits, Birds, and Moleworms. 
Bees don't have blood. Not enough, anyway. 
And if you really think you're going to have to lug around a live rabbit every single possible moment of the game, it's possible you may be a bad player. 

[Terra B Welch]

Just now, Wendy C. said:

It's not about Nerfing her, it's about adding more flavor. 
Also I'm the most die-hard Wendy supporter here, look at my profile. 
I genuinely enjoyed the sacrificing mechanic and want to see it return.

Well I don't, I don't like the idea of hogging my inventory with critters in the even abigail dies, and as I said, it's just "catch stack of bees, kill one in the stack every time she dies".

It's literally just waste an inventory slot for some added tedium.

[Guille6785]

6 minutes ago, Wendy C. said:

I literally said that you would only have to do the sacrifice again if her HP was sent to Zero. 
I literally said,  that after the first sacrifice, you would be able to summon/unsummon her as normal as you like. 

mb I missed that part im dumb

[Terra B Welch]

7 minutes ago, Wendy C. said:

I specified that it has to be Rabbits, Birds, and Moleworms.

That's like forcing Wortox to only kill a specific set of mobs for souls, I cannot agree.

[Wendy C.]

1 minute ago, Terra B Welch said:

That's like forcing Wortox to only kill a specific set of mobs for souls, I cannot agree.

It's a magic ritual. What did you expect the requirements to be? 
This is like complaining that you can't make a nightmare amulet using 1 rot. 

[Terra B Welch]

Just now, Wendy C. said:

It's a magic ritual. What did you expect the requirements to be? 
This is like complaining that you can't make a nightmare amulet using 1 rot. 

magic ritual my arse, this has nothing to do with nightmare amulets. I'm literally comparing your suggestion to another character, imagine if Wortox suddenly couldn't kill butterflies for souls, saying bees don't have enough blood is like saying butterflies are soul-less.

Try as you might, I do not want some dumb added tedium, I'm fed up with these "nerf Wendy" threads, please stop beating a dead horse.

[SirToastyToes]

This feels like balancing for the sake of balancing. I don't think it adds anything to the existing mechanics other than some flavor and I don't think Abigail being too easy to summon is really that big of a deal.

I say we go back to pre-Strange New Powers Wendy: no flower, Abigail shows up randomly at night, murders Chester, refuses to elaborate, and leaves in the morning.

[Electroely]

I like Wendy the way she is now. Not having to find or catch some creature to summon Abigail makes using her a lot more enjoyable.

[Wendy C.]

1 minute ago, Terra B Welch said:

magic ritual my arse, this has nothing to do with nightmare amulets. I'm literally comparing your suggestion to another character, imagine if Wortox suddenly couldn't kill butterflies for souls, saying bees don't have enough blood is like saying butterflies are soul-less.

Try as you might, I do not want some dumb added tedium, I'm fed up with these "nerf Wendy" threads, please stop beating a dead horse.

I already said this isn't about Nerfing the character so you just don't like the idea of things not going exactly the way you want them. 
"Waaaah!! i'm not getting exactly what I want the second I want it, waaah!!! I'm being expected to put effort into this game to succeed, waaah!!!" 
That's you. 

[TemporaryMan]

1 minute ago, SirToastyToes said:

I don't think it adds anything to the existing mechanics other than some flavor

Yes, that was stated to be the point.

[Wendy C.]

2 minutes ago, SirToastyToes said:

This feels like balancing for the sake of balancing. I don't think it adds anything to the existing mechanics other than some flavor and I don't think Abigail being too easy to summon is really that big of a deal.

I say we go back to pre-Strange New Powers Wendy: no flower, Abigail shows up randomly at night, murders Chester, refuses to elaborate, and leaves in the morning.

Okay that last part was very funny though. 
 

[Terra B Welch]

Just now, Wendy C. said:

"Waaaah!! i'm not getting exactly what I want the second I want it, waaah!!! I'm being expected to put effort into this game to succeed, waaah!!!"

Wow... Really? Resorting to this now? Just because I do not agree with a pointless change that does nothing but add an extra step of tedium?

[Echsrick]

well it is so that to get your ghost friend out you have to kill 1 only 1 rabbit or what ever then she is there for all time long even if you put her back in the flower you can bring her back out for free the only time you have to kill another rabbit is if abigal actualy losses all hp and only then another sacrifice as to be made so that way first of all it feels more natural to soumon a ghost and second of all its fair to actualy do something to get her out again aand not instand respawn durin a boss if needed yes sometimes balance changes can be hurt full to see for super fans of a character even more so if its an extra balance step to do it even better if it actualy fits lore and the likes

[Frashaw27]

7 minutes ago, Wendy C. said:

It's not about Nerfing her, it's about adding more flavor. 

Adding flavor to the character would be adding small perks like Wormwood not losing sanity from being wet because he is a plant, or Webber being immune to the adverse affects of meats, perks that don't make or break a character but are just nice to have. What you are suggesting is to add a mechanic that, not only seems completely asinine and tedious, is completely changing a mechanic. It isn't a flavor perk, it's a complete rework of a mechanic.

Also this belongs in suggestions and feedback.

[Wendy C.]

1 minute ago, Dr.Medic said:

well it is so that to get your ghost friend out you have to kill 1 only 1 rabbit or what ever then she is there for all time long even if you put her back in the flower you can bring her back out for free the only time you have to kill another rabbit is if abigal actualy losses all hp and only then another sacrifice as to be made so that way first of all it feels more natural to soumon a ghost and second of all its fair to actualy do something to get her out again aand not instand respawn durin a boss if needed yes sometimes balance changes can be hurt full to see for super fans of a character even more so if its an extra balance step to do it even better if it actualy fits lore and the likes

Yes, this is exactly what I'm saying. It doesn't actually change her gameplay because you only need to do the sacrifice when she DIES. 
And summoning her immediately after death is already a waste of time, since she's starting at 1 health point. 
So being forced to wait, what *30 SECONDS* before reviving her isn't a big deal, especially considering you likely would have done that already. 

[Duck986]

1 hour ago, Wendy C. said:

topic start

why not play vanilla ds? it has everything you need except rework and advanced AI, while dst has more powerful and smart Abi without that tiresome mechanic. seriously, killing rabbit every time I want to deal with a tentacle or so and wait 3 days after Abi's death annoyed me (and not only me, I suppose).

[TemporaryMan]

I disagree about the limited selection of animals and must-be-inventory-murder part though.  It never mattered if the sacrifice was innocent before -- or whether it had any literal blood for the blood sacrifice.  A life is a life.