The Game is Way Too Easy for More Than 3 Players

[Rinkusan]

17 hours ago, ResidentBeaver said:

I think the game is way too easy if there are more than 3 players on the server. 

It's really challenging for 1 player, it's most balanced for 2 players, it's okay for 3 players but it's getting way too easy if there are 4 players and more on the server. I think the game should encourage players' cooperation so they would have to make groups when fighting stronger mobs.

Do you think the game difficulty should scale based on the player's count? Do you think server admins should be allowed to increase the difficulty or make the difficulty auto-scalable? What other ideas do you have to make the game more difficult for multiple players?

 

For some players, it's actually a much easier game the less people there are. Less people means less competition for resources after all, which is why the fun of a populated game is cooperating with others to make the most out of your limited resources.

Try playing on a server with 19 other people; I can guarantee that it's much harder than a duo or trio.

[Mike23Ua]

42 minutes ago, 00petar00 said:

That's just complicating the system where it doesn't need to be so complicated.

Public servers are not possible to ever be in a good shape because the game is made to be hard, If you don't get any griefers, on the first summer you'd lose everything if you didn't use mods while you had public server. There are many new players that don't know what to do and stuff burns fast, whole forests will be gone.

Game can't differentiate between a griefer and a bad player ultimately.

I don't think klei will opt in to simplify the game even more then it currently is for DST, if you have never played DS give it a try and see how different it is.

There are just so many things klei would have to change that it just isn't viable for them to grief-proof the game.

I already mentioned it above, if you want a serious run, you find teammates and put a password on a server.

The rollback feature exists for when bases are burned down, but that however does not stop a player from joining a server, killing all the clockworks eating gears as WX and leaving the game with the gems.

i know that there is a small chance to get gears from tumbleweeds so that’s not much of an issue, and I know that Purple Gems can be crafted by combining Blue and Red, again not much of an Issue.. but the problem is that players intentionally take all your belongings out of your fridges and chests, At the start of for example Day 1, and then they hold onto said Items till Day 5.

The game only saves 1-5 days... and a Grief player who knows this will make sure your world saves with something bad (and completely obscure to you at that time) is happening during each of those 5 rollback points.

The suggestion to have players Drop inventory upon leaving the server that can only be accessed by the host or the player who’s inventory box was dropped is only to minimize this particular form of grieving.

I am fully aware that Summer turns everything into a blazing inferno With or Without Willows help from her lighter- That’s why I always leave my Base area and pretty much stay underground in caves until that season ends, If your Base is out of render distance it simply won’t catch fire, or for that matter be randomly struck by meteors if you choose to base in the Mosaic.

But to tell someone to go play single player DS defeats the entire purpose of playing DST, I do not earn cool cosmetic items based on time survived by playing single player DS.. I Play DST to earn cool cosmetic items based on time survived.

[Mrklli]

Please don't make every topic to be about how unfairly xbox players get treated or how different xbox version is from pc version. It was not the original topic and if you want to talk abot it you should make a new thread for it. Please stay on topic.

That aside, I personally don't really see how the game is too easy for bigger groups of players. The game is easy, yes, but as many have said before it's really more upto experience than numbers. There are already a bunch of good mods that make the game harder but imo a method for scaling the difficulty belongs in the content that should already be in the game -category and using mods for it feels a bit meh to me. The best solution I see is that hard mode some people here really wish would get added. If it's an optional thing you could toggle on in the world settings there shouldn't be any problems for newer players or those who just don't want to use it? You can already make the world harsher when you're generating it but there could be more options for things like how much extreme temperatures or mobs damage you and how easily you can recover. Also more difficult attack patterns for the hard mode would be neat, even though it might be lots of work. Anyway, even though I think it would be a good idea I currently just wish to see more new content rather than a new hc game mode.

[00petar00]

18 hours ago, Mike23Ua said:

The rollback feature exists for when bases are burned down, but that however does not stop a player from joining a server, killing all the clockworks eating gears as WX and leaving the game with the gems.

i know that there is a small chance to get gears from tumbleweeds so that’s not much of an issue, and I know that Purple Gems can be crafted by combining Blue and Red, again not much of an Issue.. but the problem is that players intentionally take all your belongings out of your fridges and chests, At the start of for example Day 1, and then they hold onto said Items till Day 5.

The game only saves 1-5 days... and a Grief player who knows this will make sure your world saves with something bad (and completely obscure to you at that time) is happening during each of those 5 rollback points.

The suggestion to have players Drop inventory upon leaving the server that can only be accessed by the host or the player who’s inventory box was dropped is only to minimize this particular form of grieving.

I am fully aware that Summer turns everything into a blazing inferno With or Without Willows help from her lighter- That’s why I always leave my Base area and pretty much stay underground in caves until that season ends, If your Base is out of render distance it simply won’t catch fire, or for that matter be randomly struck by meteors if you choose to base in the Mosaic.

But to tell someone to go play single player DS defeats the entire purpose of playing DST, I do not earn cool cosmetic items based on time survived by playing single player DS.. I Play DST to earn cool cosmetic items based on time survived.

Dude you are basically ignoring what i am saying.

They can't balance it around the griefers as if they did do that, you'd have unlimited gears as there's no other way to do it. How would the game figure out if gears were efficiently used or wasted? The difficulty in the game is to efficiently use items that are not renewable or hard to obtain after they are used.

I played on servers where there is a mod called regrowth that respawns everything. For example clockworks and pig houses  and you know what players did? Just killed the clockworks for purple gems and hammered pig houses for resources to build just because they respawn in the next few days and you're able to gather unlimited cut stone,boards,pig skin,gears,purple gems. That isn't fun to play at all.

There are just so many things griefers can do to ruin your game and there's no way to stop them unless the game is completely changed.

Players dropping inventory or not doesn't matter, if someone wants to grief he'll go to caves and drop it in a corner where you'll never find it or  feed lure plant.. There are so many ways to get rid of items if you actually want to do it.

You being in caves during summer doesn't mean that other players will be in caves and most players that join public/servers without a password, they don't care if your stuff burns or not, they are not invested in your world so they will not really put that much effort.

I never said to you to play DS instead of DST just  because of other players, i just told you to compare the games and see how different DS and DST are and how they balanced DST around multiplayer. I play DST even when i play solo just because there is so much more content in the game.

What i was saying is XBOX and PC griefers are the same, public servers will never be playable and there will always be griefers on them. Just find a group of players either here on forums or in the game and put a password on a server and you'll have a great time.Playing alone with a password is really fun and much better then playing on public servers.

 

Anyway im not going to reply about this anymore, as Mrklli said, this thread wasn't made to discuss this, make another thread if you still feel that there is more that we can say about this, i think i explained it pretty well.

[Sweaper]

How to protect your stuff 101:

 

1- Go caves

2- ???

3- Profit

 

But ff you're THAT paranoid, build pig houses in cave and give them your items or give your stones type items to moles in the caves. Also you can be a Webber/Wurt with an empire to protect your treasures and kick any other Webbers or Wurts joining your server.

[Mike23Ua]

12 hours ago, Rinkusan said:

For some players, it's actually a much easier game the less people there are. Less people means less competition for resources after all, which is why the fun of a populated game is cooperating with others to make the most out of your limited resources.

Try playing on a server with 19 other people; I can guarantee that it's much harder than a duo or trio.

How.. 19?? I can’t even imagine that!! Xbox caps at 6 Max player limit, and that’s still enough that players fight over who gets world resources lol- 19.. sounds like a Last Man Standing Deathmatch winner take all.

[Rinkusan]

51 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

How.. 19?? I can’t even imagine that!! Xbox caps at 6 Max player limit, and that’s still enough that players fight over who gets world resources lol- 19.. sounds like a Last Man Standing Deathmatch winner take all.

On PC public servers, you can go well past 6. I don't know much about the Xbox version, and the OP never specified what version of the game he played in the first post :/

20-man isn't all that bad if you know the game in and out. I personally play as Wickerbottom because she has the power to keep that many people alive and well-fed assuming she's partnered up with another food-support character like Wormwood or Woodie and the other players at least know the game's basics.

[mistrbushido]

Just now, Rinkusan said:

On PC public servers, you can go well past 6. I don't know much about the Xbox version, and the OP never specified what version of the game he played in the first post :/

20-man isn't all that bad if you know the game in and out. I personally play as Wickerbottom because she has the power to keep that many people alive and well-fed assuming she's partnered up with another food-support character like Wormwood or Woodie and the other players at least know the game's basics.

I remember this one player that would try desperately to set up multiple shadow pieces for day 21. You'd think a 20 player server could handle it, but nope. It was always chaos. In a way, more players actually makes the game harder, not easier.

[-Animaster-]

Another option to make the game more interesting and challenging without scaling all the small mobs health ( spiders, pigs etc ) would be to add strong mobs that only the group of players could beat. For example, the lunar island could be a dangerous place where only the group of players should enter. Stronger monsters would drop greater rewards.

[AnitaCoffee]

Over Christmas, I bought my husband a computer & some of my favorite games. I was super excited because I'd always wanted him to game with me, since we already have a healthy love of board & card games offline. Weirdly, he gravitates more towards DST than anything else. Our first round, he died like 20 times, and we played alone. This meant I could barely walk a map away without turning on my heels to revive him. I died from mismanagement because I was stressed managing him & everything else. Second round, about the same. Third round, I told him to go play alone for a bit so he could get a feel of what he was doing & the consequences of messing up.

Now, on the fourth & fifth round, he wanted to go play some pub servers with me. Fourth round, I was stuck with him & three other people who were new. One other person had played longer. By mid-Winter I felt like raging, which is not normal for me, but managing everyone was a pain in the tuchus. He did marginally better though! And on our fifth round, thankfully we were in a server with a few other people who knew what they were doing, and the hubs even remarked happily "I've not died as much!" 

I think when we've poured hundreds or thousands of hours into a game like many of us on the forums, we forget how friendly this game is not. It is ten times easier for me to solo a world than manage four newbies. 

[Lennard]

I only have like 337 hours in DST. And probably some more from offline hours.

So, This isn't an expert view or anything but I feel like this game isn't easy at all. If you were to go out of your way to find a coordinated group of people to play with you that know the game pretty well and has a strategy to survive well. Then the game is obviously going to be easy. 

This game's difficulty comes from knowledge. The more you know the game, the easier it becomes. A guy that has read the wiki for like 50 hours but played 5 hours probably does better than the guy that played the game for 250 hours but didn't learn anything. This game isn't focused on things like "Aim" or "Recoil" or "Dodging" or some kind of skill that you practice simply by playing and as something that you keep on improving even if you have 5000 hours or whatever. Sure there are things like kiting. But that's easy to learn.

Try playing with some randoms that don't really know how to coordinate, how to survive or what to expect, and you'll see how insanely difficult the whole thing is. Most people in this forum are probably way experienced and knowledgable in this game that it seems kind of easy for them when they play with their friends that are just like them. This is why I usually play on public servers because it's definitely kind of hard. But when I once did a walkthrough with my friends that very good. The game pretty became a walk in the park after like day 100.

[Yuuko]

2 hours ago, ResidentBeaver said:

Another option to make the game more interesting and challenging without scaling all the small mobs health ( spiders, pigs etc ) would be to add strong mobs that only the group of players could beat. For example, the lunar island could be a dangerous place that only the group of players should enter. Stronger monsters would drop greater rewards.

This exists.  Dfly, Bee Queen, Toadstool, and  Ancient Fuelweaver are designed to be multiplayer bosses.  The fact that they can be soloed is more a fluke of either convenient exploits, or overstacking OP items on an OP character combined with insane amounts of inventory management.

That is kinda the problem being spoken to here.  We have content that is fine solo, and content that is fine in a group - but its too binary.  The content doesn't scale so that it is all equally accessible solo yet challenging for groups.

I don't mind how the game is currently provided they don't go on a crusade against exploits.  Klei already broke wall / pathing for Bee Queen, eliminating one of more accessible ways to complete the fight.  If they do this much more I'm just going to quit.  I play solo, the more multiplayer ONLY content they put out the less reason there is to play.  I don't want to be required to pick a certain character, or have friends in my game just to access content.

[HoovyDeHolyBirb]

On 12/27/2019 at 12:10 PM, ResidentBeaver said:

I think the game is way too easy if there are more than 3 players on the server. 

It's really challenging for 1 player, it's most balanced for 2 players, it's okay for 3 players but it's getting way too easy if there are 4 players and more on the server. I think the game should encourage players' cooperation so they would have to make groups when fighting stronger mobs.

Do you think the game difficulty should scale based on the player's count? Do you think server admins should be allowed to increase the difficulty or make the difficulty auto-scalable? What other ideas do you have to make the game more difficult for multiple players?

 

Have you actually have to deal with about 6+ starving people in spring while trying to find a sustainable for these people and nearly half of them are dead?

[Mike23Ua]

57 minutes ago, Shosuko said:

This exists.  Dfly, Bee Queen, Toadstool, and  Ancient Fuelweaver are designed to be multiplayer bosses.  The fact that they can be soloed is more a fluke of either convenient exploits, or overstacking OP items on an OP character combined with insane amounts of inventory management.

That is kinda the problem being spoken to here.  We have content that is fine solo, and content that is fine in a group - but its too binary.  The content doesn't scale so that it is all equally accessible solo yet challenging for groups.

I don't mind how the game is currently provided they don't go on a crusade against exploits.  Klei already broke wall / pathing for Bee Queen, eliminating one of more accessible ways to complete the fight.  If they do this much more I'm just going to quit.  I play solo, the more multiplayer ONLY content they put out the less reason there is to play.  I don't want to be required to pick a certain character, or have friends in my game just to access content.

I agree with all of what your saying... Even though the game is designed as a Multiplayer Version Of Solo DS it shouldn’t suddenly become impossible to play alone- So Scaling should defiantly become a thing.. & Hey dude do you play on the Xbox by any chance?? Feel free to join my worlds if you’d like (I can DM you my Gamertag) I don’t like to post stuff like that directly on the forums for everyone to see because then I have a hundred random people messaging me and spamming game invites when I’ve probably got something more important I have to be doing-

I play a lot of different games and managing each one in a timely manner to unlock limited time content such as Holiday Cosmetics or Entire Battle Passes worth of content can sometimes become a huge hassle.

Just be fully aware that I do not use a Headset & any communication I make will be through the built in-game chat system or through XBL messages.

[Yuuko]

@Mike23Ua Sorry bud, I play on pc.  I just play alone most of the time.  I don't like repeating the first 30 days on open pub servers every time I play, I don't belong to any DS groups, and my friends have mostly moved on from the game. 

So I'm just a lonely wes still here, still not starvin.

[SinancoTheBest]

On 12/28/2019 at 7:36 AM, Shosuko said:

I've never built a lazy deserter because it requires multiple people to use it.

If you are a dedicated solo player, why not use the Solo Deserter mod to tweak it towards your gaming style. I mean I prefer not to play with mods but if I was hosting my own server playing alone, that would surely be the first thing I would do.

[Yuuko]

1 hour ago, SinancoTheBest said:

If you are a dedicated solo player, why not use the Solo Deserter mod to tweak it towards your gaming style. I mean I prefer not to play with mods but if I was hosting my own server playing alone, that would surely be the first thing I would do.

console doesn't have mods, and some pc prefer to play without them.  Feedback is feedback.

[ArubaroBeefalo]

23 hours ago, AnitaCoffee said:

Over Christmas, I bought my husband a computer & some of my favorite games. I was super excited because I'd always wanted him to game with me, since we already have a healthy love of board & card games offline. Weirdly, he gravitates more towards DST than anything else. Our first round, he died like 20 times, and we played alone. This meant I could barely walk a map away without turning on my heels to revive him. I died from mismanagement because I was stressed managing him & everything else. Second round, about the same. Third round, I told him to go play alone for a bit so he could get a feel of what he was doing & the consequences of messing up.

Now, on the fourth & fifth round, he wanted to go play some pub servers with me. Fourth round, I was stuck with him & three other people who were new. One other person had played longer. By mid-Winter I felt like raging, which is not normal for me, but managing everyone was a pain in the tuchus. He did marginally better though! And on our fifth round, thankfully we were in a server with a few other people who knew what they were doing, and the hubs even remarked happily "I've not died as much!" 

I think when we've poured hundreds or thousands of hours into a game like many of us on the forums, we forget how friendly this game is not. It is ten times easier for me to solo a world than manage four newbies. 

but its fun to die because you are noob and forgot to pick up grass or food, i had die a lot of times before i pass my 1st winter in DS beta and when DST was release me and my friends die a lot of times for silly things. Its funny and turns so cool when you start learning mechanics and improving the gathering and start to dont run for deerclops but face him. Makes this game sooo long and enjonable

On 28/12/2019 at 1:16 PM, 00petar00 said:

Dude you are basically ignoring what i am saying.

They can't balance it around the griefers as if they did do that, you'd have unlimited gears as there's no other way to do it. How would the game figure out if gears were efficiently used or wasted? The difficulty in the game is to efficiently use items that are not renewable or hard to obtain after they are used.

I played on servers where there is a mod called regrowth that respawns everything. For example clockworks and pig houses  and you know what players did? Just killed the clockworks for purple gems and hammered pig houses for resources to build just because they respawn in the next few days and you're able to gather unlimited cut stone,boards,pig skin,gears,purple gems. That isn't fun to play at all.

There are just so many things griefers can do to ruin your game and there's no way to stop them unless the game is completely changed.

Players dropping inventory or not doesn't matter, if someone wants to grief he'll go to caves and drop it in a corner where you'll never find it or  feed lure plant.. There are so many ways to get rid of items if you actually want to do it.

You being in caves during summer doesn't mean that other players will be in caves and most players that join public/servers without a password, they don't care if your stuff burns or not, they are not invested in your world so they will not really put that much effort.

I never said to you to play DS instead of DST just  because of other players, i just told you to compare the games and see how different DS and DST are and how they balanced DST around multiplayer. I play DST even when i play solo just because there is so much more content in the game.

What i was saying is XBOX and PC griefers are the same, public servers will never be playable and there will always be griefers on them. Just find a group of players either here on forums or in the game and put a password on a server and you'll have a great time.Playing alone with a password is really fun and much better then playing on public servers.

 

Anyway im not going to reply about this anymore, as Mrklli said, this thread wasn't made to discuss this, make another thread if you still feel that there is more that we can say about this, i think i explained it pretty well.

maybe dont play with random people ? 

[00petar00]

13 minutes ago, thetricker1 said:

maybe dont play with random people ? 

I was explaining it to someone who was actually playing on public servers, i don't do that, maybe read the thread.

[-Animaster-]

I'm sure the game is difficult enough for new players, but I'm talking about more experienced players who seek a greater challenge.