What happened/is happening with resource swapping?

[Otaara]

In the beta, as of some recent point, there was a system where worlds started with either saplings or twiggy trees, either regular or juicy bushes, and I think either grass tufts or grass gekkos, although I never had one come up with the gekkos dominant initially.  If you're on the beta, you know the deal -- over time, the dominant resource type would gradually die off and be replaced by the alternate one, and then back the other way.  I liked that a lot!  It made the seasonal cycle feel a full step more real, integrated into the behavior of the world, and once I figured out what was going on, it caused me to change up my harvesting strategy in what's probably an overall improvement.  (I went from transplanting grass, saplings, and berry bushes to making a habit of gathering them as I ran around doing other things.  It eliminated the grindy process of bringing those plants back to my base, made travel over distances a little more interesting, and made me feel a little more like I was living in the wilderness vs. taming it.  10/10, will keep doing.)  Last night, I explained this whole system to a friend, and about twenty minutes later, discovered that it had been discontinued.  Why?  Is it likely to come back?  I was, clearly, a big fan, and I can't have been the only one.

I did generate one world where I seemed only to have twiggy trees and juicy berry bushes that never got replaced by their original counterparts, and it looks like that was reported here, so I'm hoping it's just an implementation thing that will be worked out.  

[CaptainChaotica]

5 hours ago, Otaara said:

If you're on the beta, you know the deal -- over time, the dominant resource type would gradually die off and be replaced by the alternate one, and then back the other way.  I liked that a lot!  It made the seasonal cycle feel a full step more real, integrated into the behavior of the world, and once I figured out what was going on, it caused me to change up my harvesting strategy in what's probably an overall improvement.  (I went from transplanting grass, saplings, and berry bushes to making a habit of gathering them as I ran around doing other things.  It eliminated the grindy process of bringing those plants back to my base, made travel over distances a little more interesting, and made me feel a little more like I was living in the wilderness vs. taming it.  10/10, will keep doing.)

Ah, so you've basically started playing the way I always have?  : P  (Partly out of boredom/wanting to travel around, partly out of being a hippie, and partly out of let's not put ALL the berry bushes on the map in one place, 'kay?) 

But seriously, yeah. I'd kinda like to actually SEE some resource changing happen on one of my worlds, finally.  I understand disease is supposed to kickstart the process as well but I've only ever had something _get_ diseased like, once...

...Notorious

[Otaara]

The wiki now says swapping isn't happening at all -- that's what sent me over here trying to find out why. It seemed to be working for me, minus the one "stuck" world, but... no more. 

[AnonymousKoala]

Ever since the first ANR update Disease has been changed. It still has no purpose to exist, but the lack of resource swapping is all around better. The new resources function so nicely alongside their normal versions, but relying on them is annoying rather than fun. New disease is also much rarer. 

Most people disliked old disease because it added grind and made it so megabasing is even worse than usual. Given how Megabasing or just building more are what's keeping so many DST players playing...They've made the right choice(well right one would've been to scrap disease as it grants nothing to the game but oh well).

[Asparagus]

31 minutes ago, AnonymousKoala said:

They've made the right choice(well right one would've been to scrap disease as it grants nothing to the game but oh well).

A challenge... it provides a minor challenge as I see it... cuz you don't really maintain your base that much aside from minor wall breaches, and re-fertilizing crops and plants, disease makes it that you have to keep constant watch on your food source as well as keeping yourself from dying from things that want to kill you...

(But like if there was a way to employ pigs to do minor farming tasks like pooping on crops or harvesting stuff for you for a limited time by giving them a hat of sorts, that would be nice)

[AnonymousKoala]

5 hours ago, Asparagus said:

A challenge... it provides a minor challenge as I see it... cuz you don't really maintain your base that much aside from minor wall breaches, and re-fertilizing crops and plants, disease makes it that you have to keep constant watch on your food source as well as keeping yourself from dying from things that want to kill you...

(But like if there was a way to employ pigs to do minor farming tasks like pooping on crops or harvesting stuff for you for a limited time by giving them a hat of sorts, that would be nice)

A challange, yes, had it been more interesting. It litearly began and ended with "dig things, plant them, wait until they die, repeat"

[EuedeAdodooedoe]

I honestly like both systems, so, things diseasing if you don't watch out for them and diseasing in a sense that they change types. Not sure how they could co-exist though.

6 hours ago, AnonymousKoala said:

Most people disliked old disease because it added grind and made it so megabasing is even worse than usual. Given how Megabasing or just building more are what's keeping so many DST players playing...

Wat? Most servers are survival servers that constantly get reset for one and for two... what is it with people and their megabases? Why is it that so many people are deviated towards that? You don't need to have a mega-base in order to thrive. If anything, a mega base is just more annoying maintenance and harder-to-keep-giants-away-from-your-base thing. Proving the game that you can conquer it via this method specifically, well... to me it just defeats the game's initial purpose, which was surviving as long as you can and things getting harder over time (which would be the drive for thriving). With the right tools and done right, I think it would be a better way of game-play, if the "beating the game" gained a whole another objective, be it getting out of the world sooner or later or the multiplayer adventure mode.

[Arlesienne]

28 minutes ago, AnonymousKoala said:

A challange, yes, had it been more interesting. It litearly began and ended with "dig things, plant them, wait until they die, repeat"

You could also do like Aunt Arles does and avoid digging anything but stumps and an occasional molehill ;). I believe that's what the trick of diseases and variants is about: forcing you to forage and hunt rather than mostly farm. Naturally it's a personal preference.

[EuedeAdodooedoe]

53 minutes ago, AnonymousKoala said:

A challange, yes, had it been more interesting. It litearly began and ended with "dig things, plant them, wait until they die, repeat"

Oh, but don't mention that! We don't want things to get "too complex", remember

22 minutes ago, Arlesienne said:

You could also do like Aunt Arles does and avoid digging anything but stumps and an occasional molehill ;). I believe that's what the trick of diseases and variants is about: forcing you to forage and hunt rather than mostly farm. Naturally it's a personal preference.

Well, this doesn't become a thing too often if you're simply harvesting and digging and replanting all the "soon-to-disease" crops, does it?

If you needed to get out of your base to keep things from diseasing, a better way, imho would be to have phlegm as a way to prevent it (so, perhaps you being able to craft snot bombs with phlegm and mosquito sacks, which would work kind of like water balloons, but instead of wetness, spreading phlegm upon plants it splashes on). This would mean players would be going hunting by following tracks more, which in other words would be players getting out of the base more to keep stuff at base (crops) sustained. This imho would work very well with not only game design in general, but a multiplayer one at that, as... well, you know what it takes to kill Ewecus, right? This might require either disease to happen slower in general or the cured plants to take longer to disease (perhaps 60 or so days?).

On top of that, phlegm gets a use, and an important one at that!

[Arlesienne]

6 minutes ago, EuedeAdodooedoe said:

Oh, but don't mention that! We don't want things to get "too complex", remember

Well, this doesn't become a thing too often if you're simply harvesting and digging and replanting all the "soon-to-disease" crops, does it?

If you needed to get out of your base to keep things from diseasing, a bette way, imho would be to have phlegm as a way to prevent it (so, perhaps you being able to craft snot bombs with phlegm and mosquito sacks, which would work kind of like water balloons, but instead of wetness, spreading phlegm upon plants it splashes on). This would mean players would be going hunting by following tracks more, which in other words would be players getting out of the base more to keep stuff at base (crops) sustained. This imho would work very well with not only game design in general, but a multiplayer one at that, as... well, you know what it takes to kill Ewecus, right? This might require either disease to happen slower in general or the cured plants to take longer to disease (perhaps 60 or so days?).

M-maybe? I hunt as I am easily bored around farms and generally live lagless, off bacon and eggs and jerky.

What do you mean if I know what it takes to kill an ewecus? I was alone on the server last night and with hunt surprises to lots, I couldn't get a single koala to spawn. I had no pigs with me as it was on the brink of night, so I was forced to solo the spitfire. 8 blowdarts. Sure, I got glued, but I was fine. Are the mechanics going to change soon?

[AnonymousKoala]

40 minutes ago, Arlesienne said:

You could also do like Aunt Arles does and avoid digging anything but stumps and an occasional molehill ;). I believe that's what the trick of diseases and variants is about: forcing you to forage and hunt rather than mostly farm. Naturally it's a personal preference.

Old disease though. Old disease was affecting everything from the variant group, iirc.

[Arlesienne]

4 minutes ago, AnonymousKoala said:

Old disease though. Old disease was affecting everything from the variant group, iirc.

Yep, it was, while offering little in return (unless you count tumbleweeds and thorny bushes as alternatives to obtaining grass and twigs, and switching to hunting rather than using berries). Hence it was repurposed. I hope we'll see more of it - new mechanics.

[EuedeAdodooedoe]

27 minutes ago, Arlesienne said:

M-maybe? I hunt as I am easily bored around farms and generally live lagless, off bacon and eggs and jerky.

What do you mean if I know what it takes to kill an ewecus? I was alone on the server last night and with hunt surprises to lots, I couldn't get a single koala to spawn. I had no pigs with me as it was on the brink of night, so I was forced to solo the spitfire. 8 blowdarts. Sure, I got glued, but I was fine. Are the mechanics going to change soon?

I always feel obligated to clean the world up and it annoys me, but no-one else can be bothered to do so/place stuff in the right place in the first place, even though I'm playing with people I know, so I wouldn't know.

Considering you can get one melee hit on Ewecus before it spits phlegm at you again, it's pretty tough on your own in that sense, while pretty easy with other players. Darts and pigs might require some bit of prep, while with a bunch of other players nearly none, so. As for the mechanics and their change... what? I have no idea and I doubt it.

Although now that I remember, lighting ewecus on fire keeps it from spitting phlegm at you. Regardless, even if there are ways to do this easily on your own without much prep, the disease with what I described in the last post would necessitate players to go out of base in order to take care of plants or simply get out and gather more plants, so it's a win-win regardless.

11 minutes ago, Arlesienne said:

Yep, it was, while offering little in return (unless you count tumbleweeds and thorny bushes as alternatives to obtaining grass and twigs, and switching to hunting rather than using berries). Hence it was repurposed. I hope we'll see more of it - new mechanics.

I honestly would love it if there was some way to have disease work both in the new way and the old way as to me they both seemed pretty cool in concept.

[Arlesienne]

8 minutes ago, EuedeAdodooedoe said:

I always feel obligated to clean the world up and it annoys me, but no-one else can be bothered to do so/place stuff in the right place in the first place, even though I'm playing with people I know, so I wouldn't know.

Considering you can get one melee hit on Ewecus before it spits phlegm at you again, it's pretty tough on your own in that sense, while pretty easy with other players. Darts and pigs might require some bit of prep, while with a bunch of other players nearly none, so. As for the mechanics and their change... what? I have no idea and I doubt it.

Although now that I remember, lighting ewecus on fire keeps it from spitting phlegm at you. Regardless, even if there are ways to do this easily on your own without much prep, the disease with what I described in the last post would necessitate players to go out of base in order to take care of plants or simply get out and gather more plants, so it's a win-win regardless.

I honestly would love it if there was some way to have disease work both in the new way and the old way as to me they both seemed pretty cool in concept.

Ah, that. Never tried fire, just traps and darts. 800 HP is not that much. Given how ewelets require steel wool, same with war saddles, there is incentive to kill an ewecus. Though I would like some use for phlegm apart from mods (the toughest recipe for Freki is 1 phlegm, 1 deerclops's eyeball and 6 bone shards).

Both disease mods? If it could be turned on or off in the worldgen, why not, though it seems it would require much tinkering with.

[Otaara]

On 11/20/2016 at 7:49 AM, Arlesienne said:

You could also do like Aunt Arles does and avoid digging anything but stumps and an occasional molehill ;). I believe that's what the trick of diseases and variants is about: forcing you to forage and hunt rather than mostly farm. Naturally it's a personal preference.

That's exactly what I started doing, not because of disease per se, because I stopped making plantations basically as soon as I realized things were going to die because of the seasonal resource swapping.  And that made my whole game faster and lighter and more pleasant.  So resource swapping, total win for me.

I like building bases, but for up to a year, year and a half of game time at most.  When I get to where I can start putting out fireflies in useful places, I feel pretty accomplished, and by the time I get up to building substantial walls and enclosures, when I do, I'm past done with that world.  Definitely not a megabaser, never will be.  So, definitely a personal preference, but I'd like to see seasonal change in resource sources (say that 5x fast) as an option, at least.  Seems like a shame to junk the whole system.

Which brings us to --

On 11/20/2016 at 8:30 AM, AnonymousKoala said:

Old disease though. Old disease was affecting everything from the variant group, iirc.

Yeah, that.  That seems like a reason to fix the disease mechanics, but not a reason to take away resource swapping entirely, since it made the world more dynamic and interesting for (not all, sure, but) a lot of people.

[Electroely]

On ‎11‎/‎20‎/‎2016 at 8:15 AM, Arlesienne said:

I had no pigs with me as it was on the brink of night, so I was forced to solo the spitfire. 8 blowdarts. Sure, I got glued, but I was fine. Are the mechanics going to change soon?

You know how the game's multiplayer and Klei seems to (for some reason) like promoting teamwork, they added enemies like Ewecus, Toadstool and Bee Queen. In my opinion, these 3 mobs are perfect examples as of why you NEED to play TOGETHER in Don't Starve TOGETHER. So I have my reasons to believe the mechanics for the Ewecus aren't going to change anytime soon, if not ever.

[Arlesienne]

8 hours ago, Otaara said:

That's exactly what I started doing, not because of disease per se, because I stopped making plantations basically as soon as I realized things were going to die because of the seasonal resource swapping.  And that made my whole game faster and lighter and more pleasant.  So resource swapping, total win for me.

I like building bases, but for up to a year, year and a half of game time at most.  When I get to where I can start putting out fireflies in useful places, I feel pretty accomplished, and by the time I get up to building substantial walls and enclosures, when I do, I'm past done with that world.  Definitely not a megabaser, never will be.  So, definitely a personal preference, but I'd like to see seasonal change in resource sources (say that 5x fast) as an option, at least.  Seems like a shame to junk the whole system.

Which brings us to --

Yeah, that.  That seems like a reason to fix the disease mechanics, but not a reason to take away resource swapping entirely, since it made the world more dynamic and interesting for (not all, sure, but) a lot of people.

Oh, yes. See the point.

6 hours ago, Electroely said:

You know how the game's multiplayer and Klei seems to (for some reason) like promoting teamwork, they added enemies like Ewecus, Toadstool and Bee Queen. In my opinion, these 3 mobs are perfect examples as of why you NEED to play TOGETHER in Don't Starve TOGETHER. So I have my reasons to believe the mechanics for the Ewecus aren't going to change anytime soon, if not ever.

Pardon, but your sarcasm is unnecessary. The fact the ewecus is meant to be taken out with pigs or people doesn't mean a solo player cannot handle it. You can solo any enemy in it. This doesn't mean mechanics are likely to change. I've never asked for them either, yet your post sounds like you think I purposefully set the game to alone and suddenly it's immoral. This is really odd. Was this your aim or you just phrased it in an ambiguous way?

 

[AnonymousKoala]

1 hour ago, Arlesienne said:

Oh, yes. See the point.

Pardon, but your sarcasm is unnecessary. The fact the ewecus is meant to be taken out with pigs or people doesn't mean a solo player cannot handle it. You can solo any enemy in it. This doesn't mean mechanics are likely to change. I've never asked for them either, yet your post sounds like you think I purposefully set the game to alone and suddenly it's immoral. This is really odd. Was this your aim or you just phrased it in an ambiguous way?

 

Yup. Even the raid bosses are soloable. And it's not as ludicrous as "place this much gunpowder" in case anyone thinks that.

[Arlesienne]

1 minute ago, AnonymousKoala said:

Yup. Even the raid bosses are soloable. And it's not as ludicrous as "place this much gunpowder" in case anyone thinks that.

Exactly. I'm testing how Wes can solo the toad now. I'm running out of time at the moment, but with a strategy I developed, he's bringing its health down noticeably. I disagree with statements like You Cannot Fight This Boss Without Friends.

I had 22 slots opened - I don't get it why this @Electroely sounds like I'm a knave shutting the server to people. I wasn't visited - are we vilifying players who end up soloing, like @CaptainChaotica, due to reasons beyond their control? I hope not.

[TheKingofSquirrels]

Am I the only person who hate twiggy trees and juicy berries? 

They just look odd to me. 

[RetRunt]

16 minutes ago, TheKingofSquirrels said:

Am I the only person who hate twiggy trees and juicy berries? 

 

I'd add the geckos to that list. They look out of place to me.

[Electroely]

10 hours ago, Arlesienne said:

Pardon, but your sarcasm is unnecessary.

I didn't really mean to be sarcastic...

 

10 hours ago, Arlesienne said:

The fact the ewecus is meant to be taken out with pigs or people doesn't mean a solo player cannot handle it. You can solo any enemy in it. This doesn't mean mechanics are likely to change. I've never asked for them either, yet your post sounds like you think I purposefully set the game to alone and suddenly it's immoral. This is really odd. Was this your aim or you just phrased it in an ambiguous way?

What I meant to say is that the game was designed for people to play Together. Experienced players, of course, would be able to handle these enemies alone. I was just saying that the mechanics for the Ewecus aren't really going to change since they're working the way they're supposed to work. It's just harder alone, but still possible.

Sorry about my horrible English it's not my main language ;-;

[TheKingofSquirrels]

6 hours ago, RetRunt said:

I'd add the geckos to that list. They look out of place to me.

I'm all for more wildlife, so it doesn't bother me that much.

What I will say tho, is that the art style of new mobs and structures really clash with the old stuff. The ewecus especially. 

[Otaara]

Artwise. . . I like the twiggy trees just fine, and the geckos.  Actually, I love the geckos & I'm sad that I can't find them all the time in every world.  They feel like they fit, to me.  The juicy berry bushes, I agree on those, they're pretty bizarre, and not the usual DS/T bizarre.  They're on some incomprehensible spectrum between Tolkein and Hallmark.

I don't think the ewecus art ever bothered me, but the concept is so gross that I'm not sure I've even stopped to think about whether or not it looks like the rest of the game.  I'm too busy smh at the whole raging snotting sheep thing in the first place.

The current patch seems to have put twigs back to swapping between saplings and twiggy trees, but I haven't seen berry bushes or grass/geckos trading out yet.  I've only gone from autumn to late spring since that update, so maybe those will start changing in summer, or maybe they will in another patch or two.

[mochilo]

3 hours ago, Otaara said:

Artwise. . . I like the twiggy trees just fine, and the geckos.  Actually, I love the geckos & I'm sad that I can't find them all the time in every world.  They feel like they fit, to me.

They born from grass in summer